Ruby Princess police investigation

[rickays]

Interesting information on Ruby Princess Doctor's evidence https://twitter.com/tauerbach

[Pushka]

17 minutes ago, rickays said:

Interesting information on Ruby Princess Doctor's evidence https://twitter.com/tauerbach

Thanks.  The tweet made an hour ago about missing details of a fever in a crew member is unfortunate for the Dr but earlier tweets suggest that errors were also made by Health, sounds like it may be a general cluster!

[BRANDEE]

12 hours ago, rickays said:

Interesting information on Ruby Princess Doctor's evidence https://twitter.com/tauerbach

Yep..she expected the health officials to board, the captain expected the health officials to board, passenger services expected the health officials to board and most passengers expected them to board..just like they did on Mar 8th.   But they did not.  So who did not do their job?  That is the investigation to be done.  The health officials thought a call for ambulances was bogus..what does that mean?  So sad and disappointing to see a one sided, convoluted investigation going on by a government department.  Coverup comes to mind.  Accept that it happened, put on your big girls pants..grow a set of balls..now deal with it properly, instead of trying to shift the blame.  Blame does not bring anyone back from the dead, unfortunately.

[Porky55]

This sounds all very unprofessional, though emails that Aus Traveller had posted from the Medical on board between Ruby and NSW Health had detailed cases of ‘influenza’. The Dr had no way of testing for Covid19 so couldn’t say they definitely had it  on board.

It looks like this may be a sacrifice by Princess??

Agree, it doesn’t help with cases or loss of life, all just so tragic.

Edited April 22, 2020 by Porky55

[mackley1956]

 My wife and I were on the Ruby Princess on the trip just before the one that is now being investigated (Feb 24 - Mar 8), and we were also on the Sea Princess for the Round Australia trip when it got cut short when Princess suspended operations. I have read news reports that the police investigation into the Ruby Princess will now include the trip we were on, and that we would be receiving a survey from the police about our experience. We have not yet received it -- has anyone else gotten it yet?

 

I haven't spent the time to go through all 18 pages of comments on this topic, but I've read through some of the comments and I get the sense that most commenters feel like the media are trying to sensationalize this unfortunate incident and find someone to blame. I would have to agree -- although there appear to be mistakes made all around, I just don't see where there was any malicious intent by either Princess or the NSW authorities. I'm sure a lot of people wish they had done something different in hindsight.

 

I can't speak to what happened on the Ruby Princess on the trip after ours, but I feel like the captain and crew were being pretty transparent about what was going on during our time on Ruby. There were multiple announcements made, especially toward the end of our cruise, encouraging anyone who was feeling ill to report to the medical unit for examination. We didn't know how many actually showed up, but we were made aware that there were a number of people who had reported, and as a result our disembarkation was delayed for at least a couple of hours while testing was conducted. While we were waiting to get off the ship, we were out on our balcony and noticed that there was no activity on the dock relating to resupply, removing our bags, etc., so I can only assume that no one was being allowed on or off the ship until the test results were known. When we did disembark, we weren't told of any cases of COVID-19, and we never received any follow-up communication concerning any positive tests, so we can only assume that none were discovered. I suppose Princess could have done a little better by stating as much to ease everyone's minds, but overall I don't feel like we were being deliberately kept in the dark.

 

Our experience on the Sea Princess was very similar. We were a little surprised that there weren't any delays to speak of when we disembarked on Mar 18 -- we expected that it would have been similar to what happened when we got off Ruby Princess. We did receive an e-mail from Princess on Mar 28 stating that a single passenger from Sea Princess had tested positive days after leaving the ship and advising us that we needed to be in home isolation until April 1. Fortunately, we had decided to do that on our own when we arrived back in the U.S., so we hadn't been walking around potentially unknowingly infecting people. We are obviously well past April 1 and have had no symptoms, so we are pretty sure we did not get infected.

[Porky55]

24 minutes ago, mackley1956 said:

We didn't know how many actually showed up, but we were made aware that there were a number of people who had reported, and as a result our disembarkation was delayed for at least a couple of hours while testing was conducted

mackley1956 - we were on this cruise too and actually attended the medical check, thanks to the old ‘kennel cough’ - no temperature or any other symptom, but the paperwork you and I received from NSW Health on the 7th said - “tick if you have: cough, runny nose, temperature”. So we attended (at 5:30am) on the 8th along with what looked like 600 others (could have been more or less) both passengers and crew - to be checked and lectured by NSW Health. We held you up until just after 11:00am before all got clearance from NSW HEALTH & BORDER CONTROL to leave.

You are correct - definitely NO CASES OF COVID19 on our cruise - or we would have been notified, just as those on the following cruise WERE notified.

Finally - how can findings be made and conclusions drawn about BOTH CRUISES if we haven’t been asked to at least complete their ridiculous questionnaires?? 

What changed for NSW Health and Border Control between the 8th March and the 19th March that they didn’t check this cruise and the Sea Princess too?? 

Edited April 22, 2020 by Porky55

[Aus Traveller]

Mackley, thanks for your comments. I agree with your thoughts that there was no malicious intent by either Princess or local authorities in the events around the disembarkation.

 

I feel it was a 'stuff-up' - I don't usually use that term. This could be partly from miscommunication - the senior doctor on board said she wasn't asked if any of the ill people on board has symptoms that could indicate COVID. If she had been, she would have answered "yes". From what we have read, it seems the local authorities simply sent the usual questions to the ship and when the medico answered that there were X cases of illness on board, the Health Department decided they were low risk. They did not take into account the escalating issue world-wide around COVID.

 

You mention that you received an email on 28th March advising that one person who had been on board the Sea Princess had tested positive for COVID. I seem to recall later advice that it was believed the person did not had COVID while they were on the ship.

[mackley1956]

3 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

You mention that you received an email on 28th March advising that one person who had been on board the Sea Princess had tested positive for COVID. I seem to recall later advice that it was believed the person did not had COVID while they were on the ship.

 

The exact quote from the e-mail was: "Late on 28 March 2020, we were advised by the New South Wales, Australia Ministry of Health (NSW Health) of a confirmed case of COVID-19 in a guest that travelled on Sea Princess's voyage that arrived in Sydney on 18 March 2020. The guest was infectious only on the day of disembarkation. There does not appear to have been an outbreak of COVID-19 on this ship, however as an abundance of caution, as a passenger on this ship, you are considered a close contact and will need to be in home isolation up to and including 01 April 2020."  I'm not sure how they knew for sure that this passenger was infectious only on the day of disembarkation, but I believe you are correct -- they did not have COVID while they were on the ship.

[Porky55]

5 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

I feel it was a 'stuff-up' - I don't usually use that term. This could be partly from miscommunication - the senior doctor on board said she wasn't asked if any of the ill people on board has symptoms that could indicate COVID. If she had been, she would have answered "yes".

Just watched the Twitter feed again from Channel 7 - the Dr actually handled herself very well and this investigation should by no means be over. The “other parties” involved need to be questioned as intently as she was - IMHO or it truly will be a ‘stuff-up’

[mackley1956]

13 minutes ago, Porky55 said:

Finally - how can findings be made and conclusions drawn about BOTH CRUISES if we haven’t been asked to at least complete their ridiculous questionnaires?? 

What changed for NSW Health and Border Control between the 8th March and the 19th March that they didn’t check this cruise and the Sea Princess too?? 

 

Agreed -- wonder what changed between 8th March and 19th March? We were not surprised, and frankly happy that they took the time to check people before we got off of Ruby Princess. I know there were some passengers complaining about having to wait, but I for one was happy that they were being cautious and doing some testing.

[BRANDEE]

15 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

Mackley, thanks for your comments. I agree with your thoughts that there was no malicious intent by either Princess or local authorities in the events around the disembarkation.

 

I feel it was a 'stuff-up' - I don't usually use that term. This could be partly from miscommunication - the senior doctor on board said she wasn't asked if any of the ill people on board has symptoms that could indicate COVID. If she had been, she would have answered "yes". From what we have read, it seems the local authorities simply sent the usual questions to the ship and when the medico answered that there were X cases of illness on board, the Health Department decided they were low risk. They did not take into account the escalating issue world-wide around COVID.

 

You mention that you received an email on 28th March advising that one person who had been on board the Sea Princess had tested positive for COVID. I seem to recall later advice that it was believed the person did not had COVID while they were on the ship.

Stuff up means?..mistake..screwup..overlook...accident..coverup?  Thanks!

[Aus Traveller]

3 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

Stuff up means?..mistake..screwup..overlook...accident..coverup?  Thanks!

I take 'Stuff up' to mean screwup (possibly a mistake but that term isn't strong enough). Stuff up is also much stronger than overlook, accident and coverup.🙂

[christodan]

So where is Commissioner Fuller this morning? I see they've sent out a replacement for the news conference. I wonder why.

[Cruisegroover]

Here is the link to Special Commission of Inquiry into the Ruby Princess

https://www.rubyprincessinquiry.nsw.gov.au/

 

[DiamondFour]

2 hours ago, christodan said:

So where is Commissioner Fuller this morning? I see they've sent out a replacement for the news conference. I wonder why.

I would imagine he would be attempting to get all the traces of the egg off his face before he makes another media appearance.

 

People are starting to see it for what it is and I am glad the special commission of inquiry will be public. I have always had no faith in the police investigation at all as very early on they made it 100% clear that they would only be targeting the Ruby Princess.

 

As a seasoned traveller who knows a thing or two about the world I know that is very unfair and extremely biased. What upsets me the most in general is the attempt to lay blame on the cruise ships for spreading the virus. It frustrates me so much that I just want to scream out that it is the virus that came from china that is the problem, not cruise ships.

[Aus Traveller]

Several people I have spoken to have the opinion that it was a mistake by government authorities that allowed the passengers to disembark too soon. (Obviously I agree with this.) One of these people (a retired senior NSW cop) scoffed and said "What evidence" when I referred to the Commissioner's theory, but he didn't want to discuss it.

 

The people I mentioned who have cruised before, will be happy to cruise again some time in the future.

[christodan]

Personally, I think cruise ships are cleaner than planes and hotels. I trust the food served to me on a cruise ship far more in terms of hygiene than anywhere else.

 

 

[mackley1956]

43 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

 

The people I mentioned who have cruised before, will be happy to cruise again some time in the future.

 

My wife and I hope to cruise again some day, but the circumstances are going to have to be different.

 

In hindsight, we probably shouldn't have gone on the Ruby Princess cruise because we both have underlying medical conditions that make us vulnerable to infections. Under "normal" circumstances, these conditions pose no threat to us, but the threat posed by this virus is one that we probably shouldn't have taken a chance on. In our defense, when we left the U.S. on Feb 19, there were only about a dozen cases in the U.S., maybe a dozen in Australia, and none in New Zealand. Things had not yet blown up anywhere outside of China, and all countries were preventing anyone from China from entering, so we felt reasonably safe in going. This was a bucket list type of trip for us that we had been planning for a couple of years.

 

Obviously, things changed rapidly while we were on the Ruby Princess, and then while we were on the Sea Princess all hell broke loose in the world. We came to find out that our family was extremely concerned about us, and we don't want to ever put them through that again. While we made it through the whole ordeal just fine, we did have a feeling of helplessness while we were on the ship watching all of this unfold around the world. We worried that we might get stuck on the ship in quarantine or in Australia (not necessarily a bad place to get stuck) once we disembarked because the rules were changing by the day.

 

I guess what I'm saying is that we'd like to cruise again, but until the cruise lines and governments around the world can demonstrate that they have put what they learned from this into practice, we probably won't be going anywhere soon. Just like 9/11, the world will be a different place after this, and we'll wait until everyone has this sorted out.

[DiamondFour]

2 hours ago, Aus Traveller said:

Several people I have spoken to have the opinion that it was a mistake by government authorities that allowed the passengers to disembark too soon. (Obviously I agree with this.) One of these people (a retired senior NSW cop) scoffed and said "What evidence" when I referred to the Commissioner's theory, but he didn't want to discuss it.

 

The people I mentioned who have cruised before, will be happy to cruise again some time in the future.

I think he is torn between his loyalty for his life long career and his loyalty to Princess. One will have to give in to the other eventually but he will have to soon accept the sad realisation that the police investigation is biased and a cover up that will not do any good whatsoever.

 

The special commission of inquiry on the other hand is what we need as it will come back with a report and recommendations for it to never happen again. From there the groundwork will be laid for the return of cruise ships which is what we want.

 

If it went the way the police wanted then it will be harder for ships to return. I guess the police force would not mind a few budget cuts in the coming financial years. The way they were trying to order the Ruby Princess to leave is astounding given our obligations under international law.

[Pushka]

I heard today that 300 crew members resident in The Philippines will be on their way to Manila later tonight on a chartered flight. There are 500 crew left, none of whom are positive. Those positive people have been taken to the mainland for observation. Ruby is due to head off this afternoon. 
 

At least that's what the media said at lunchtime. 

[sewgood]

I heard on the news that Princess has given $50 000 to a local (Wollongong/Ilawarra?) charity that sent care packages to the crew onboard.

Earlier in the week someboby posted a link to a story that stated the Rev John Kewa was delivering boxes of goodies to the ship that the people of the Ilawarra had donated.

The ship also had a huge banner hung on the back of it thanking the Ilawarra region.

Well done of Princess to thank the people/region who remembered that this was not just a big corperation but the Ruby was a ship with actual people left on board.

Thank you to the people of the Ilawarra region for their kindness and humanity shown to the crew.

[By The Bay]

1 hour ago, sewgood said:

I heard on the news that Princess has given $50 000 to a local (Wollongong/Ilawarra?) charity that sent care packages to the crew onboard.

Earlier in the week someboby posted a link to a story that stated the Rev John Kewa was delivering boxes of goodies to the ship that the people of the Ilawarra had donated.

The ship also had a huge banner hung on the back of it thanking the Ilawarra region.

Well done of Princess to thank the people/region who remembered that this was not just a big corperation but the Ruby was a ship with actual people left on board.

Thank you to the people of the Ilawarra region for their kindness and humanity shown to the crew.

From the Illawarra Mercury

 

"Princess Cruises made a $50,000 donation to the Mission to Seafarers in Port Kembla who support seafarers from all over the world, every day of the week."

[Kiwi Kruzer]

3 hours ago, Pushka said:

I heard today that 300 crew members resident in The Philippines will be on their way to Manila later tonight on a chartered flight. There are 500 crew left, none of whom are positive. Those positive people have been taken to the mainland for observation. Ruby is due to head off this afternoon. 
 

At least that's what the media said at lunchtime. 

Just checked Marine Traffic and 2 tugs are coming alongside as I post 

local time at Port Kemble 4.45 pm

[Cruisegroover]

Ruby's departure is being live streamed on ABC online. Lots of thank you banners, water cannon salutes, people onshore to wave goodbye, horns going etc.

[Kiwi Kruzer]

Route forecast showing MNL

Edited April 23, 2020 by Kiwi Kruzer