Things to change on Beyond….

[Spif Barwunkel]

The "E class ships" will thrive because they do appeal to a wide range of cruisers. Pick 'em apart as much as you like but what detractors consider vagaries are inconsequential, perhaps even trivial, to the adaptable cruiser who accepts change for what it is. For cruising change is a move forward, an attempt to remain current and beyond while at the same keeping the tried and true cruising experiences already successful.

 

I like tried and true. I also like change. I am not going to allow one to get in the way of the other. For me, everything about every ship is not perfect, but every ship has some things, actually most things, that I thoroughly enjoy. Don't sweat the small stuff. If change bothers you that much, be a "non-passenger." Nothing right or wrong or rude about that. I prefer to be adaptable rather than a misanthrope.   

 

 

[Ipeeinthepools]

2 minutes ago, Spif Barwunkel said:

The "E class ships" will thrive because they do appeal to a wide range of cruisers. Pick 'em apart as much as you like but what detractors consider vagaries are inconsequential, perhaps even trivial, to the adaptable cruiser who accepts change for what it is. For cruising change is a move forward, an attempt to remain current and beyond while at the same keeping the tried and true cruising experiences already successful....

 

 

 

I think you must be wearing rose colored glasses.  Lot's of cruise lines have introduced plenty of new ships and I never seen another new class of ship generate so many negative reviews.  I've never seen another new class of ship have so many people say that they will never sail on them because of the ships design. 

[TeeRick]

36 minutes ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

 

I think you must be wearing rose colored glasses.  Lot's of cruise lines have introduced plenty of new ships and I never seen another new class of ship generate so many negative reviews.  I've never seen another new class of ship have so many people say that they will never sail on them because of the ships design. 

Well somebody is sailing on them!  Yes both negative and positive CC reviews.  Lots of both.  The usual stuff.  The new ships introduced by other cruise lines were just bigger, more technologically advanced versions of their current ships.  But E-Class was a very different design.  Being so different, it is (was) more controversial.  But you question the success of the E-Class ships.  EDGE was always full and generating strong revenue pre-pandemic.  Since cruising restarted, both EDGE and APEX have strong bookings and people are lined up for BEYOND.  The reviews here on CC that are negative seem to come from a lot of long time traditional Celebrity customers - as Spif said many resistant to change.   Celebrity judges success on its $revenue and future $revenue.  Not about what we old guys think or say.  Personally I would be ecstatic if they renovate Reflection and complete the S-class upgrades.  But guess what- some of us have a problem with that too (Hoppenization) so it is a no win for some.

[kwokpot]

8 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

Personally I would be ecstatic if they renovate Reflection and complete the S-class upgrades.  But guess what- some of us have a problem with that too (Hoppenization) so it is a no win for some.

I find it most irritating when people describe the design aesthetic using the pejorative 'Ikea' as opposed to just saying they don't like the contemporary aesthetics. Current contemporary furniture design is indeed low to the ground but that has nothing to do with Ikea. Open any interior design magazine and you'll see thousands of rooms with the same design aesthetics with furniture for one room that costs more than most people's entire house. I'm not implying you have to like it, but to use the term Ikea is reductive and actually belies the whole concept of Ikea. 

[Virginia100]

I’ve cruised on Celrbtity on most of their ships over the years. Our last cruise right before the shutdown in February 2020 was on the Edge. It was our best cruise ever and we loved everything about it, three MDR, speciality restaurants, large area around the Martini bar, music, our room. I booked in August in Europe on the Beyond (Sunset Veranda) specifically due to bring an E class ship.

[TeeRick]

1 hour ago, kwokpot said:

I find it most irritating when people describe the design aesthetic using the pejorative 'Ikea' as opposed to just saying they don't like the contemporary aesthetics. Current contemporary furniture design is indeed low to the ground but that has nothing to do with Ikea. Open any interior design magazine and you'll see thousands of rooms with the same design aesthetics with furniture for one room that costs more than most people's entire house. I'm not implying you have to like it, but to use the term Ikea is reductive and actually belies the whole concept of Ikea. 

So exactly where did I use the term "Ikea" in my post that you are responding to or that you are irritated about?  Sorry for my confusion but where are you coming from here?  Trying to understand.    I used the term "Hoppenization" in my post.  Many Celebrity CC members like the modern design but are otherwise unhappy about the comfort and function.  So some members do not like the Hoppenization of S-Class ships following after the E-Class ships.  Lots of posts on this topic.  Probably thousands!

Edited January 31, 2022 by TeeRick

[kwokpot]

1 minute ago, TeeRick said:

So exactly where did I use the term "Ikea" in my post that you are responding to or that you are irritated about?  Sorry for my confusion but where are you coming from here?  Trying to understand.    I used the term "Hoppenization" in my post.  Many Celebrity CC members like the modern design but are otherwise unhappy about the comfort and function.  So some members do not like the Hoppenization of S-Class ships following after the E-Class ships.  Lots of posts on this topic.  Probably thousands!

My comment wasn't directed at you but towards the other myriad of posts about the design and furniture on E-Class ships.  

[TeeRick]

Just now, kwokpot said:

My comment wasn't directed at you but towards the other myriad of posts about the design and furniture on E-Class ships.  

OK no problem.  Thank you.

[verizon]

Wonder how much people know about KELLY HOPPEN ?

Seen in upscale hotels, restaurants and offices all over the world,Kelly Hoppen's boldly modern aesthetic has also graced the homes of the celebrities.In 2009, Hoppen was made an MBE by Queen Elizabeth 2 for her services to interior design.

She is also involved in the projects of  Kempinski Residences hotels.

One of her project now is the 8 Conlay residences hotel in Kuala Lumpur.

 

Edited January 31, 2022 by verizon

[LGW59]

12 minutes ago, verizon said:

Wonder how much people know about KELLY HOPPEN ?

Seen in upscale hotels, restaurants and offices all over the world,Kelly Hoppen's boldly modern aesthetic has also graced the homes of the celebrities.In 2009, Hoppen was made an MBE by Queen Elizabeth 2 for her services to interior design.

She is also involved in the projects of  Kempinski Residences hotels.

One of her project now is the 8 Conlay residences hotel in Kuala Lumpur.

 

She is an incredibly talented and accomplished woman, regardless if one likes her design style or not. She was hired by Celebrity and any and all of her designs were approved of course by the Celebrity team.  I think what many folks don't like about her designs on E-class ships is because it ain't your nana's living room anymore.  To each their own of course, but is not going to change anytime in the near future, the EDGE was filled before the pandemic and now both she and the APEX are as filled as they can be, BEYOND is selling like lemonade on a hot summer day.

[kwokpot]

24 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

I think what many folks don't like about her designs on E-class ships is because it ain't your nana's living room anymore.

EXACTLY!

[Oceansaway17]

4 hours ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

 

I think you must be wearing rose colored glasses.  Lot's of cruise lines have introduced plenty of new ships and I never seen another new class of ship generate so many negative reviews.  I've never seen another new class of ship have so many people say that they will never sail on them because of the ships design. 

 

Well at first a lot of folks were negative on the Royal class Princess ships.  Why, because they put all balconies up the sides and back and had less places for folks to look at the sea. Just

compare the Caribbean Princess aft area with the Royal or Regal Princess.

 

Also, the new HAL Koningsdam had a much smaller promenade around the sides with less area to walk.  Lots of people had lots to say about that.

 

In the end, everyone eventually adjusts as each cruise line makes changes.   One of the cruise lines that gets negative comment because of their name and past history(Carnaval) now has some of the best ships with Ocean walk area, skytrain biking, Bolt, and a few with IMAX theatre.   They and NCL have brought more restaurants and seating areas down along the side of the ships and RCI is following too.

[Ipeeinthepools]

9 minutes ago, Oceansaway17 said:

 

Well at first a lot of folks were negative on the Royal class Princess ships.  Why, because they put all balconies up the sides and back and had less places for folks to look at the sea. Just

compare the Caribbean Princess aft area with the Royal or Regal Princess.

 

Also, the new HAL Koningsdam had a much smaller promenade around the sides with less area to walk.  Lots of people had lots to say about that.

 

In the end, everyone eventually adjusts as each cruise line makes changes.   One of the cruise lines that gets negative comment because of their name and past history(Carnaval) now has some of the best ships with Ocean walk area, skytrain biking, Bolt, and a few with IMAX theatre.   They and NCL have brought more restaurants and seating areas down along the side of the ships and RCI is following too.

 

You may be correct.  MSC is building new ships with real balconies and an IV-like room that they categorize as an ocean view room.  Maybe Celebrity will follow their lead with the next class of ships.

[Oceansaway17]

1 minute ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

 

You may be correct.  MSC is building new ships with real balconies and an IV-like room that they categorize as an ocean view room.  Maybe Celebrity will follow their lead with the next class of ships.

 

 

yup over the next 10 years cruising will be more exciting for the ship being the destination.

MSC, NCL and Disney leading the charge with indoor decor, shows and restaurants.

and do not forget Virgin Scarlett Lady.  They have RED night and light the aft's wake in red colors.

Oh and Carnival Mardi Gras has a rollercoaster called BOLT.

 

I will go on the EDGE in November and am looking forward to seeing the new so called balcony within the room concept.  I have heard issues with a/c when the windows are down, but I like the concept of looking out without the wind and the feeling of the inside cabin being larger now.

 

But I do think Celebrity has decided to try and remain a bit traditional and that is a good thing too.

afterall, I like quiet ships just a bit sometimes with nice places to sit.   No need to blast music everywhere.  

[LGW59]

1 hour ago, kwokpot said:

EXACTLY!

do you miss those oversized plush purple velvet wing back chairs as much as I don't!  🙂

[PTC DAWG]

My Wife and I are booked on Apex this March because we were looking for something a little different. We know exactly what the S class offers..

 

 

[Spif Barwunkel]

6 hours ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

 

I think you must be wearing rose colored glasses.  Lot's of cruise lines have introduced plenty of new ships and I never seen another new class of ship generate so many negative reviews.  I've never seen another new class of ship have so many people say that they will never sail on them because of the ships design. 

Better rose-colored glasses than blinders, an eye patch, cataracts or tinted lenses showing 50 shades of grey. I tell you what, ipee, if X's E-Boats flounder and sink it won't be because of IV cabins, bathroom stall locks, vanity lighting, disgruntled wannabe cruise ship designers etc., etc., etc. It will be because of something much more important...and serious. Also, there will be many, many ships struggling to stay afloat. 

 

No rose-colored glasses for me, ipee. However, I have a wonderful Optometrist if you need one. Your depth perception seems a bit off.  

[rmalbers]

"Also, there will be many, many ships struggling to stay afloat." 

 

It will be interesting to see: also it is sort of amazing how many huge (not X) ships are coming online and at a  strange time.  It will be interesting to see how the ports handle the volume when we start moving out of these 'strange times' and back into regular cruising with all the new capacity coming online, especially in the Carrib.

[TeeRick]

3 hours ago, LGW59 said:

She is an incredibly talented and accomplished woman, regardless if one likes her design style or not. She was hired by Celebrity and any and all of her designs were approved of course by the Celebrity team.  I think what many folks don't like about her designs on E-class ships is because it ain't your nana's living room anymore.  To each their own of course, but is not going to change anytime in the near future, the EDGE was filled before the pandemic and now both she and the APEX are as filled as they can be, BEYOND is selling like lemonade on a hot summer day.

I don't want to recreate the whole Kelly Hoppen discussion again.  Truly sorry for bringing that up.  Personally I like the modern style she has introduced to Celebrity.  It is actually not the style that some object to here.  It is the comfort and utility of some of the furniture for a ship environment.  That is mostly what seems to be the discussion anyway.  Not questioning her talent or her designs.  

[BigAl94]

10 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

I don't want to recreate the whole Kelly Hoppen discussion again.  Truly sorry for bringing that up.  Personally I like the modern style she has introduced to Celebrity.  It is actually not the style that some object to here.  It is the comfort and utility of some of the furniture for a ship environment.  That is mostly what seems to be the discussion anyway.  Not questioning her talent or her designs.  

Suited to hotels or apartment blocks but not ships.

[Ipeeinthepools]

23 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

I don't want to recreate the whole Kelly Hoppen discussion again.  Truly sorry for bringing that up.  Personally I like the modern style she has introduced to Celebrity.  It is actually not the style that some object to here.  It is the comfort and utility of some of the furniture for a ship environment.  That is mostly what seems to be the discussion anyway.  Not questioning her talent or her designs.  

 

Bingo.  However I will take exception with your last sentence about the talent on the designs.   If a design isn't functional and stylish, the design isn't a success.

[Spif Barwunkel]

1 hour ago, BigAl94 said:

Suited to hotels or apartment blocks but not ships.

Re: Kelly Hoppen - Not sure I understand the above statement, but a valid comment, and an educated one, I am sure. Several multi-million dollar yacht owners and a good size cruise line might feel otherwise. As I see it, if you do not like a particular style or presentation somewhere, you won't like that particular style or presentation elsewhere. Unless, of course, your statement is intended as derisive commentary rather than aesthetic disapproval.  

[LGW59]

1 hour ago, BigAl94 said:

Suited to hotels or apartment blocks but not ships.

Perhaps suited to your castles.

[canderson]

3 hours ago, TeeRick said:

I don't want to recreate the whole Kelly Hoppen discussion again.  Truly sorry for bringing that up.  Personally I like the modern style she has introduced to Celebrity.  It is actually not the style that some object to here.  It is the comfort and utility of some of the furniture for a ship environment.  That is mostly what seems to be the discussion anyway.  Not questioning her talent or her designs.  

Putting aside the aesthetic, one could make some strong arguments about her total lack of appreciation for the importance of best use of space in cabins, and for many, that's an important part of the experience.

 

We've spent time in quite a variety of maritime vessels, and intelligent and sometimes very creative use of space has always been appreciated.  Our opinion of the Hoppen use of space was confirmed when she said she'd never taken a cruise before embarking on her Celebrity designs.  That explains how chair arms are too tall to park them under desk space, causing pax to work around them to pass the bed.  It explains bedside tables without any useful storage.  It explains loading useful horizontal space full of tchotchkes that some sweep to one side or ask to have removed.

 

Instead of seeming to brag about her total lack of experience in a cabin, she might have done better to spend a few weeks in one to understand the basics. 

[TeeRick]

14 hours ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

 

Bingo.  However I will take exception with your last sentence about the talent on the designs.   If a design isn't functional and stylish, the design isn't a success.

LOL there you go defining success again!😀