Are Low Staffing Levels Part of Celebrity’s Plan to Cut Costs and Increase Profitably?

[prmssk]

Just now, canderson said:

Granted, some crew may have been pulled to Beyond or whatever after the fact, but our November Constellation cruises were fully staffed, and included many that had been with X for some years.  Was nice to see familiar faces behind the masks.  It was, in fact, the best service we've had on X cruised.  Go figure.

I agree.  We were on the first Constellation sailing in November and it was full staff and the service was amazing even with the passenger capacity being a surprising 75% (one of the few sailings with that high of capacity around that time) and it being that crew's first sailing as a team together (no matter how experienced the crew are, the first time being thrown together doesn't always go smoothly).

[Cruising89143]

I also think part of the issue with crew shortage is coming from those testing positive and being held in quarantine. Last week our favorite bartender went missing after Tuesday. I asked the next evening where he was and I could tell from the bartenders answer and his reaction that the person must have tested positive. Our room steward was handling more staterooms than usual and told us he was moved back to our area at the last minute to cover an area. None of us have any idea of how many crew members are in quarantine at one time. Edit to add that we were on the same ship the first week of March. We were the first week of cruises on RCI with no masks required. Service was outstanding in all areas. We were told that the ship was fully staffed. Move ahead to last week and there was a slight difference in the overall service. Especially in dining. 

[Ipeeinthepools]

23 minutes ago, WestLakeGirl said:

OP, are you implying that they are cutting back on staff deliberately, with the follow on as lowered customer satisfaction as a corporate cost-cutting strategy?  That doesn’t make any sense

Yes, I am suggesting that Celebrity is deliberately not staffing at previous levels and they are hoping to reset the bar on customer expectations.

[chrismo]

The Infinity is scheduled to go back into service June 25th -  do you think this will actually happen based on current staffing constraints?

 

Not to mention RCCL will lose it as the quarantine ship for the fleet 

 

I anticipate it will be postponed, with  staffing concerns sited as the reason why.

[OysterD]

1 hour ago, mfs2k said:

 

It's not just a cruise industry problem.  It's an everywhere problem, and the hospitality industry is being especially hit hard with labor shortages.  I don't know about international staffing, but in the US there is a huge shortage of workers in the food and beverage service industry.  I'm not sure where all the workers went, but they definitely left restaurants, hotels, bars, resorts, and evidently cruise ships. 

Exactly this. Companies/organisations everywhere are suffering from staff shortages. Hospitality industry in particular is struggling to recruit and keep staff, so I dont blame celebrity one bit for some ships having slight delays in the dining room. 

 

What I don't understand is where all the workers went?! Has half the population just retired or decided not to work anymore?! I was just at a very busy garden centre, apologies were offered for slow service because they were short staffed. Friends flight a few days ago was delayed for several hours because of staff shortages. Staff shortages at the airport caused other delays. Try finding a contractor to do some work at your house any time in the next x number of months, they're all booked up and short staffed. I know owners of several bars/restaurants, they cannot get staff for love nor money. 

 

So going back to the OP's question, are celebrity deliberately reducing staffing numbers to save money? I very much doubt that, they are probably just struggling recruiting new staff like so many other businesses. 

[Cruise Raider]

5 hours ago, Jim_Iain said:

May be caused by a perfect storm of events.    Talking to staff I was told it is related to a number of issues.

 

1.  Activating Beyond and Eclipse pulling staff from all ships.  On Beyond they took the best of the fleet leaving other ships struggling to train new staff

 

2. Covid and Crew in Isolation

 

3.  Some staff in countries like India are having a hard time getting a visa because of low staffing at the U.S. Embassy.

So true!  We’ve been on cruises in which the entire production cast and the cruise director we’re in quarantine … they really had to struggle to fill the entertainment gaps and on a drop of a dime.  The same is also probably true for crew members that have been exposed or infected with CoVid.  
 

Add that to heavily fluctuating passenger capacity rates and they experience the perfect storm.  It wasn’t all that long ago that there were only a couple hundred passengers on these ships and now at full capacity.  I’m sure they are struggling with getting an adequate number of staff, keeping them all from contracting CoVid, supply chain issues and the fluctuating passenger capacity.  I’m sure they would all be very happy if everything was back to before CoVid, when they were profitable instead of trying to pay off massive debt.  
 

We’ve been on an average of a cruise a month since the restart last July and been on these sailings with as few as 800 passengers to well over 3400 passengers … in a few short weeks.  I’d hate to be the one that had to plan for those huge swings.  But, I can honestly say, even with the cruise that was at capacity, the crew handled things so well.  We couldn’t get any specialty dining reservations and oftentimes were unable to find a seat at the shows or events but we realized that cruising as we knew it is making its way back.  We knew we were pretty spoiled during those low capacity sailings!  

[Megabear2]

I'm rapidly approaching my first ever Celebrity cruise and it is sailing out of Rime.  My friend chose this cruise based on her one previous experience of a cruise which was her honeymoon a number of years back.  This cruise has cost a premium due to being on the Edge and I willingly paid this due to the cruise with confidence and expected far superior service.

 

Since our booking in February we have seen the former end, a massive increase in the number of passengers onboard with the resultant increase in covid onboard,  difficult testing implemented with no assistance from Celebrity with arrangements, quarantine fears, increased prices on restaurants and drinks packages and now I'm reading that the one saving grace, the expected brilliant service is also now in doubt.

 

I have cruised for very many years, mainly on Cunard, Princess and P&O with the odd MSC and RCI cruise sprinkled in.  The anticipation for this Celebrity cruise is rapidly diminishing! Perhaps Celebrity should consider cutting the numbers onboard to a level where the staff they do currently have will be able to offer the expected service level.  I have cruises currently booked on Cunard, P&O and Princess.  These lines are not sailing at anywhere near full capacity by choice and both Cunard and P&O have admitted they have staffing issues and although regrettable for those affected have chosen to either cancel voyages (P&O Arcadia) or cancel passengers (Cunard) to at least be able to offer a reasonable service and as near normal as possible.

 

This reports of two hour waits for mains etc are extremely alarming to me as a first time Celebrity cruiser and if these types of events occur on my June sailing I cannot see myself ever wanting to sail with them again.

 

I remain upbeat for now and hope beyond hope things are improving.

 

 

[Ipeeinthepools]

3 hours ago, wrk2cruise said:

 

 

My other observation is there seems to be an excess of middle management on Celebrity ships.   There are all kinds of stripes walking around.  I always ask myself "what are they doing to make the passengers trip more enjoyable?"   I worked in the IT industry and whenever things were tight those middle management layers were hit hard to preserve the customer facing and R&D jobs.

 

I saw a perfect example of that this morning.  As I was walking the track early this morning there were several people arranging deck chairs and squeegeeing the deck and there was 1 white shirt guy with stripes standing against the wall drinking a coffee.  The white shirt guy wasn’t doing anything to help me.  I’d rather have another waiter.

[Bo1953]

1 hour ago, RTShaker said:

To the OPs point about the long wait at the MDR for a table, it has always annoyed me that there are reservations taken for Select dining. In my opinion there should not be any, and the seating should all be on a first come first served basis. My understanding is that this is what the original intent was. You didn't have to commit to a certain time,  you just show up at the time you want to eat on any given day.

I think it is great to have the option, which we take advantage of by making reservations ahead of time and cancel 24 hours in advance and no less than four (4) hours when something comes up or we change our minds.

 

Many land based restaurants we eat in here in the US have similar setups as X, either make a reservation or walk in, walk ins have lower priority for sure... and none if it is a popular establishment.

 

bon appetit and bon voyage

[Mark_K]

1 hour ago, RTShaker said:

To the OPs point about the long wait at the MDR for a table, it has always annoyed me that there are reservations taken for Select dining. In my opinion there should not be any, and the seating should all be on a first come first served basis. My understanding is that this is what the original intent was. You didn't have to commit to a certain time,  you just show up at the time you want to eat on any given day.

My recollection is that it was originally intended to offer cruisers three options.  Early/Late dining, make reservations for any available time, or show up and hope for the best.

[WestLakeGirl]

ipeeinthepool, You wanted the Guy to help you walk the track?   I must be missing something

Edited May 15, 2022 by WestLakeGirl

[Ipeeinthepools]

I’m also less sympathetic to the excuse it’s hard get foreign crew into the US.   All of those reasons were unexpected last year and I understood the problems.  However they have had a year to deal with the new problems and they should be allocating more time to get crew to the ship.  If I told my boss that I haven’t done anything to solve the problems I had last year, I would have been fired.

[Cruising89143]

7 minutes ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

I’m also less sympathetic to the excuse it’s hard get foreign crew into the US.   All of those reasons were unexpected last year and I understood the problems.  However they have had a year to deal with the new problems and they should be allocating more time to get crew to the ship.  If I told my boss that I haven’t done anything to solve the problems I had last year, I would have been fired.

Same thing can be said about restaurants, grocery stores, department stores, airlines, hotels and the list goes on. If positions was easy to fill then we would not be seeing this as widespread as it is. 
 

 

[Cruising89143]

25 minutes ago, OysterD said:

What I don't understand is where all the workers went?! Has half the population just retired or decided not to work anymore?

Part snipped for space…..

 

I can give you an example. My husband retired from his job at the age of 57 about three and a half years ago. Plan was to take some time off and relax before finding a PT job with less pressure. I decided at the last minute to retire at age of 59 in February of 2020 right before all hell broke loose. Again, my plan was to take some time off and find a PT job working around 24 hours a week. 
 

Fast forward to now. Like just about everyone else we have spent two plus years hunkering down and dealing with this pandemic. We were lucky that financially we could stay at home. We still think about getting some time of PT to help fill time but Covid has made us think twice. I think many people who maybe were going to a little longer changed their plans. No, this does not answer for the younger age group but I do think many in my age group just decided it wasn’t worth it right now or to not go back to work period. 

[NutsAboutGolf]

3 minutes ago, cruisingator2 said:

Same thing can be said about restaurants, grocery stores, department stores, airlines, hotels and the list goes on. If positions was easy to fill then we would not be seeing this as widespread as it is. 

 

There's a huge pool of experienced crew members awaiting contracts but cruise lines are passing on them in favor of paying less for brand new crew members.  Many examples of this include in this thread where Jim stated they hire a brand new Retreat manager who's never been on a ship.  Why not offer a contract to an existing X manager or reward their existing top staff with a promotion?  The answer is because it's cheaper to hire new.

[Cruising89143]

6 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

 

There's a huge pool of experienced crew members awaiting contracts but cruise lines are passing on them in favor of paying less for brand new crew members.  Many examples of this include in this thread where Jim stated they hire a brand new Retreat manager who's never been on a ship.  Why not offer a contract to an existing X manager or reward their existing top staff with a promotion?  The answer is because it's cheaper to hire new.

You seem to know this as a fact so I would like to see proof please. There is a difference between giving an opinion and stating something as fact. 

[NutsAboutGolf]

4 minutes ago, cruisingator2 said:

You seem to know this as a fact so I would like to see proof please. There is a difference between giving an opinion and stating something as fact. 

 

As stated there is an example in this thread and my personal experience of meeting many first time contract crew.  Good luck on your search to locate "proof" to prove or disprove this.

[Cruising89143]

Just now, NutsAboutGolf said:

 

As stated there is an example in this thread and my personal experience of meeting many first time contract crew.  Good luck on your search to locate "proof" to prove or disprove this.

So this just your “opinion” and nothing else. Thought so.

[NutsAboutGolf]

Just now, cruisingator2 said:

So this just your “opinion” and nothing else. Thought so.

 

You're welcome to think whatever your heart desires.  One should think about why a Retreat manager who's never been on a ship was offered a contract.

[prmssk]

45 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

I'm rapidly approaching my first ever Celebrity cruise and it is sailing out of Rime.  My friend chose this cruise based on her one previous experience of a cruise which was her honeymoon a number of years back.  This cruise has cost a premium due to being on the Edge and I willingly paid this due to the cruise with confidence and expected far superior service.

 

Since our booking in February we have seen the former end, a massive increase in the number of passengers onboard with the resultant increase in covid onboard,  difficult testing implemented with no assistance from Celebrity with arrangements, quarantine fears, increased prices on restaurants and drinks packages and now I'm reading that the one saving grace, the expected brilliant service is also now in doubt.

 

I have cruised for very many years, mainly on Cunard, Princess and P&O with the odd MSC and RCI cruise sprinkled in.  The anticipation for this Celebrity cruise is rapidly diminishing! Perhaps Celebrity should consider cutting the numbers onboard to a level where the staff they do currently have will be able to offer the expected service level.  I have cruises currently booked on Cunard, P&O and Princess.  These lines are not sailing at anywhere near full capacity by choice and both Cunard and P&O have admitted they have staffing issues and although regrettable for those affected have chosen to either cancel voyages (P&O Arcadia) or cancel passengers (Cunard) to at least be able to offer a reasonable service and as near normal as possible.

 

This reports of two hour waits for mains etc are extremely alarming to me as a first time Celebrity cruiser and if these types of events occur on my June sailing I cannot see myself ever wanting to sail with them again.

 

I remain upbeat for now and hope beyond hope things are improving.

 

 

Princess is sailing at similar capacity to Celebrity and is no longer limiting capacity (beyond a few isolation cabins). The Caribbean Princess is at about full double occupancy this week and sold out into June, just as one example. And the service issues I’m hearing on Princess boards are worse and more consistent than anything I am seeing on Celebrity boards. 

[jelayne]

Our experience over 5 cruises on 3 ships has been very good sometimes not to pre pandemic level other times better.  There have been times the wait for a drink or a espresso has been longer.  Some times pool attendants were sparse or our favorite wine wasn’t available & with out a doubt the cabin attendants are handling far more cabin than pre pandemic.  
 

We have had our drink order taken and delivered by stripes,  have seen them busing tables in the Grand Plaza,  Cafe Al Bacio, Oceanview & Eden to name a few

Our wash & fold laundry was delivered by a housekeeping Supervisor on 1 sailing .

Last cruise some shore excursions we cancelled and the DYI excursion booking terminals weren’t working so a fatherly lengthy line developed for the 1 person working the desk, within 10 minutes a 2nd person arrived but lined continued to grow then about 10.minutes later a 3rd, followed by a 3 stripe who also pitched in. 

So our experience is that there are crew shortages and everyone is doing their best to provide the service their guests expect.  

[prmssk]

23 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

 

There's a huge pool of experienced crew members awaiting contracts but cruise lines are passing on them in favor of paying less for brand new crew members.  Many examples of this include in this thread where Jim stated they hire a brand new Retreat manager who's never been on a ship.  Why not offer a contract to an existing X manager or reward their existing top staff with a promotion?  The answer is because it's cheaper to hire new.

Do you have insider information that there actually are more experienced crew wanting to come back that have been able to meet the medical and visa requirements?

[Megabear2]

Just now, prmssk said:

Princess is sailing at similar capacity to Celebrity and is no longer limiting capacity (beyond a few isolation cabins). The Caribbean Princess is at about full double occupancy this week and sold out into June, just as one example. And the service issues I’m hearing on Princess boards are worse and more consistent than anything I am seeing on Celebrity boards. 

I cannot speak for what's happening out of Europe. I personally am not sailing Princess until end September but my aunt is sailing in June on Regal from Barcelona and notified it should be 75%.

 

It is easy to check figures for P&O and Cunard as the companies themselves have made the cuts and published their reasons.

[Arizona Wildcat]

1 hour ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

Yes, I am suggesting that Celebrity is deliberately not staffing at previous levels and they are hoping to reset the bar on customer expectations.

Interesting and would love to hear of anything that backs up your opinion.  Others have provided details about experienced staff finding jobs in other industries, vaccination issues or a myriad of types, and travel difficulties.

All I personally relate is three friends who live in Goa.  They have worked on cruise ships for many years.  All three tried to get the required travel documents for months.  They finally gave up.

If companies are cutting back on employees to reset the bar on expectations then every restaurant in the US and Canada must be doing so.  In Victoria BC, many restaurants have shorter hours and are closed at least one day because of lack of staff despite offered $$ incentives.   

 

[Bo1953]

18 minutes ago, prmssk said:

Princess is sailing at similar capacity to Celebrity and is no longer limiting capacity (beyond a few isolation cabins). The Caribbean Princess is at about full double occupancy this week and sold out into June, just as one example. And the service issues I’m hearing on Princess boards are worse and more consistent than anything I am seeing on Celebrity boards. 

p - thank you for this, as many of us will not read other boards and as such believe the cited situation is only localized or specific to X....

 

I Am sure that a few of us do not know passengers on other lines, at this time in order to compare notes or readings... LOL I wish I could as most of my friends only sailed Crystal and we know about their current service status...

 

Many of us can be ostriches around here, to be sure.... LOL

 

bon voyage