Anyone else concerned about the violence in Mexico?

[greenie082756]

Not scared at all. We have done many cruises to Mexico or had stops in Mexico through cruising.

 

Like anytime you take a vacation to somewhere you are not familiar with caution and awareness of your surroundings is important.

 

We are cruising for the first time on Carnival Panorama to Mexican Riveria in 10 days and I am actually more concerned about the incidents that can happen on the cruise ship. 🥳

 

We may or may not get off the ship because of the many times we have stopped in those cities.

[ShakyBeef]

18 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

 

You have completely missed the point of the Baltimore comparison. In 2021, Cancun had as many murders as Baltimore. Throwing out travel advisories while "I avoid the bad parts of Baltimore and don't vacation there" is some sort of special, different, circumstance. 

 

The point remains that crime is all over. If you aren't messing around with drugs or dangerous neighborhoods, you'll likely be just fine. A resort strip near the beach is generally a safe spot. There is also much context to "scary place bad" or "American dead" that we don't get. While we should still exercise caution, it is worth looking objectively vs fear.

 

I did the Panorama cruise last year. I would absolutely do it again.  

 

No, I have not missed the point, completely or otherwise.  But perhaps you missed mine?  I am talking about where I choose to spend my vacation dollars.  I am quite aware, as we all should be, that crime is everywhere.  Seriously, does this fact even need to be pointed out?🙄  This whole argument reeks of a particular logic fallacy. 

 

I do not choose to vacation where crime is, in my perception, unreasonably high for the vacation benefit gained from any particular locale.  This is my choice, based on my assessment.  I am happy for Mexico to get others' dollars, and happy for others to have enjoyable, safe vacations in Mexico.  I wish you all the best.

 

Baltimore is a city with a high crime rate.  And it happens to be 2 1/2 hours from my home.  So what?  I will not spend my tourist dollars there.  Nor will I spend them in Mexico.

[john91498]

*sigh*   seems like every thread turns into a weird argument...

[cruisingguy007]

2 minutes ago, john91498 said:

*sigh*   seems like every thread turns into a weird argument...

 

I kind of dig that about this place, gotta have a bit of thick skin round these parts and folks aren't afraid to call you out on BS. Everything isn't always rainbows and unicorns, telling it like it is and calling it how it's seen is kinda how it's done in the Carnival forum lol. If you haven't caught at least one timeout, you ain't doing it right. 😁

[john91498]

I think I've had too many time outs...lol...and had a bunch of posts removed...😆

[Drazil65]

"I don't visit the more dangerous places in U.S. as a tourist, either.  Your point is pointless."

 

Well geeze...here in USA its the churches, grocery stores, Walmart and federal bldgs that constitute dangerous places these days, so how do you know???        

Edited October 5, 2022 by Drazil65

[ShakyBeef]

40 minutes ago, Drazil65 said:

"I don't visit the more dangerous places in U.S. as a tourist, either.  Your point is pointless."

 

Well geeze...here in USA its the churches, grocery stores, Walmart and federal bldgs that constitute dangerous places these days, so how do you know???        

 

*sigh*  As I said,

• Crime is everywhere (duh!🙄).
• The OP's question wasn't about areas where we may live having high crime.  It was about our concern about the crime in Mexico having any effect on our choice to cruise there.
• Where one lives and has to go about one's life - errands, duties, job, appointments, etc. is an entirely different situation to where one chooses to go on vacation.  Some risks we have to live with as part of daily life.  But vacation and location of vacation is completely a choice, up to the individual, at the individual's discretion.

 

Just to be as perfectly clear as I can be, even though, I feel that y'all should understand what I'm saying by now and some of you are just arguing for argument's sake at this point:

 

I am not trying to talk anyone else out of vacationing in Mexico.  I answered the OP's question directly, from my point of view, as I would expect everyone else would from their own.  Enjoy Mexico!  Yay for you and Mexico!  I will not choose to go there for vacation.  Period.

Edited October 5, 2022 by ShakyBeef
dropped bullet

[lennythenose]

I am not concerned about cruising to Mexico but I do understand why some people are. I will makes myself aware of current situation in any place I visit and make decisions based on information at the time. I have not been to PV but definitely want to go there. But there are plenty of other places to go if you are worried. Each of us makes the best choice for our own families and there is no shame in any of the choices. 

[tonit964]

7 hours ago, john91498 said:

We're looking at summer cruises next year to Mexico. A seven day on the Panorama to the Mexican Rivera.

We did this cruise a few years ago and thoroughly enjoyed it. But this time around, the reports of the violence is scaring my wife. Especially Puerta Vallarta, one of the cruise stops, is supposedly the 3rd most dangerous city in Mexico.

Having second thoughts and might just do a week in Vegas...

No point in going if your wife is going to be scared. That's not any fun. I understand people's hesitation about Mexico. One thing to keep in mind, the ships won't call on any port where the danger is really high.

Quite a few years ago, they stopped going to Mazatlan & Acapulco for a while for that very reason.

 

With that being said, I just got back yesterday from a 10 day cruise to Mexico, walked around Cabo without worry. I walked around Loreto by myself for a few hours and everyone was so warm & welcoming. We missed the call to Puerto Vallarta due to hurricane Orlene and went to San Diego instead. Took the train to Old Town and I was scared the whole 10 minute ride. Very sketchy people on the train, I really thought I was going to get robbed.

 

Everyone has to do or not do with what they are comfortable with. Have fun with whatever you decide.

[icft]

Concerned about the violence in Mexico? It depends.

 

We feel that Cozumel is pretty safe. Being a somewhat small island where people know each other, know when strangers are around, and quick escape from the area is not readily available tends make it less desirable for criminals. There are better places for criminals to operate, like just across the way on the mainland. But we try to avoid most of Mexico.

 

One of our sons lived in the Tampico area for a year with little problem. But he had a bodyguard, driver and designated go and no-go zones. He told us our major risk in Mexico is kidnapping. Apparently it is a major industry, but they have it down to a science and things usually go smoothly.

 

[redsox1584]

I just did the Panorama a few weeks ago and stopped in Cabo, PV & Mazatlan. I did not feel unsafe in any of those places. 

[momof3cruisers]

2 hours ago, ShakyBeef said:

 

*sigh*  As I said,

• Crime is everywhere (duh!🙄).
• The OP's question wasn't about areas where we may live having high crime.  It was about our concern about the crime in Mexico having any effect on our choice to cruise there.
• Where one lives and has to go about one's life - errands, duties, job, appointments, etc. is an entirely different situation to where one chooses to go on vacation.  Some risks we have to live with as part of daily life.  But vacation and location of vacation is completely a choice, up to the individual, at the individual's discretion.

 

Just to be as perfectly clear as I can be, even though, I feel that y'all should understand what I'm saying by now and some of you are just arguing for argument's sake at this point:

 

I am not trying to talk anyone else out of vacationing in Mexico.  I answered the OP's question directly, from my point of view, as I would expect everyone else would from their own.  Enjoy Mexico!  Yay for you and Mexico!  I will not choose to go there for vacation.  Period.

I totally get what you’re saying. I won’t go on a cruise that stops in Jamaica. Been there twice. Both times people were pushy and rude, in your face with their hands out for a tip for any reason they could think of. Poor area, yeah,I get it. But the Dominican Republic has possibly more poverty yet the people are warm and friendly. This is MY experience and therefore, I don’t choose to spend MY money there . Other people love Jamaica. Yippee skippy for them! Have at it! 
 

OP, as for Mexico, I would suggest just staying on the ship if it makes any of you uncomfortable. Perhaps your wife would be more relaxed if you only do ship sponsored excursions. (I used to not like Ensenada at all but after doing the winery tour one trip, now I get off the ship there and leave the city.) Only you can decide what’s best for your family. Have fun whatever you decide. 

[Lane Hog]

Mexico, like the US, is a big country with areas you want to avoid... 

People get themselves into trouble by not knowing where they should and shouldn't go.  Fortunately, the tour operators are smarter than the tourists.

And no, I wouldn't avoid cruising there, although I probably might think twice about venturing beyond the port and doing an inland tour in Ensenada or Mazatlan...

Edited October 6, 2022 by Lane Hog

[Joebucks]

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/murder-rate-by-country

 

 

Murder rate by country per 100k people

 

Top 10 Countries with the Highest Murder Rates (per 100k people) in 2017:*

1. El Salvador (61.7)
2. Honduras (41.0)
3. Venezuela (49.9)
4. United States Virgin Islands (49.3 [2012 data])
5. Jamaica (56.4)
6. Lesotho (43.6 [[2016 data]] per 100k people)
7. Belize (37.8)
8. Saint Vincent And The Grenadines (36.5 [2016 data])
9. Saint Kitts And Nevis (36.1 [2012 data])
10. South Africa (35.7)

 

Mexico doesn't even crack the top 10. Larger countries have larger numbers of murders. News at 11. I've cruised to Jamaica and that place is far worse. Honduras is a terrible place, but a cruising destination. It is far different going to the private port and in the poor city.

 

5 hours ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

I kind of dig that about this place, gotta have a bit of thick skin round these parts and folks aren't afraid to call you out on BS. Everything isn't always rainbows and unicorns, telling it like it is and calling it how it's seen is kinda how it's done in the Carnival forum lol. If you haven't caught at least one timeout, you ain't doing it right. 😁

 

Just doing the lord's work.

[The Greater Fool]

5 hours ago, john91498 said:

*sigh*   seems like every thread turns into a weird argument...

You say that as if it were a bad thing.

 

So, you are saying that what's happening to this thread is a crime?

[john91498]

8 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/murder-rate-by-country

 

 

Murder rate by country per 100k people

 

Top 10 Countries with the Highest Murder Rates (per 100k people) in 2017:*

1. El Salvador (61.7)
2. Honduras (41.0)
3. Venezuela (49.9)
4. United States Virgin Islands (49.3 [2012 data])
5. Jamaica (56.4)
6. Lesotho (43.6 [[2016 data]] per 100k people)
7. Belize (37.8)
8. Saint Vincent And The Grenadines (36.5 [2016 data])
9. Saint Kitts And Nevis (36.1 [2012 data])
10. South Africa (35.7)

 

Mexico doesn't even crack the top 10. Larger countries have larger numbers of murders. News at 11. I've cruised to Jamaica and that place is far worse. Honduras is a terrible place, but a cruising destination. It is far different going to the private port and in the poor city.

 

 

Just doing the lord's work.

 

Those are 2017 numbers. Look up mid 2022, the rankings are vastly different.

[Joebucks]

3 minutes ago, john91498 said:

 

Those are 2017 numbers. Look up mid 2022, the rankings are vastly different.

 

Thanks for the clarification. Jamaica, Honduras, Belize, St Vincent, St Kitts, Tobago, and the Bahamas are still all cruise destinations with higher murder rates than Mexico in 2022.

[Guest BasicSailor]

26 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/murder-rate-by-country

 

 

Murder rate by country per 100k people

 

Top 10 Countries with the Highest Murder Rates (per 100k people) in 2017:*

1. El Salvador (61.7)
2. Honduras (41.0)
3. Venezuela (49.9)
4. United States Virgin Islands (49.3 [2012 data])
5. Jamaica (56.4)
6. Lesotho (43.6 [[2016 data]] per 100k people)
7. Belize (37.8)
8. Saint Vincent And The Grenadines (36.5 [2016 data])
9. Saint Kitts And Nevis (36.1 [2012 data])
10. South Africa (35.7)

 

Mexico doesn't even crack the top 10. Larger countries have larger numbers of murders. News at 11. I've cruised to Jamaica and that place is far worse. Honduras is a terrible place, but a cruising destination. It is far different going to the private port and in the poor city.

 

 

Just doing the lord's work.

Murphy's law, cruise destinations with higher murder rates. Perhaps the lord will not choose mild mannered cruisers. But then again 😲

[sanmarcosman]

7 hours ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

I kind of dig that about this place, gotta have a bit of thick skin round these parts and folks aren't afraid to call you out on BS. 

Very true. some eggheads here learn that not even in Mexico are soft boiled eggs peeled 🙂 

[CruizinSusan70]

9 hours ago, bguppies said:

If the location of a vacation is going to stress you out, then clearly it won't be much of a vacation.

Stress is avoided totally by visiting a "questionable" port by just staying on board

[CruizinSusan70]

4 hours ago, momof3cruisers said:

I totally get what you’re saying. I won’t go on a cruise that stops in Jamaica. Been there twice. Both times people were pushy and rude, in your face with their hands out for a tip for any reason they could think of. Poor area, yeah,I get it. But the Dominican Republic has possibly more poverty yet the people are warm and friendly. This is MY experience and therefore, I don’t choose to spend MY money there . Other people love Jamaica. Yippee skippy for them! Have at it! 
 

OP, as for Mexico, I would suggest just staying on the ship if it makes any of you uncomfortable. Perhaps your wife would be more relaxed if you only do ship sponsored excursions. (I used to not like Ensenada at all but after doing the winery tour one trip, now I get off the ship there and leave the city.) Only you can decide what’s best for your family. Have fun whatever you decide. 

You suggest staying on the ship if people are uncomfortable about Mexico, yet you won't visit Jamaica again because of pushy and rude people.  Couldn't you just go on a cruise that visits Jamaica and just take your own advice and stay on the ship?

[ilovesparky13]

15 hours ago, john91498 said:

We're looking at summer cruises next year to Mexico. A seven day on the Panorama to the Mexican Rivera.

We did this cruise a few years ago and thoroughly enjoyed it. But this time around, the reports of the violence is scaring my wife. Especially Puerta Vallarta, one of the cruise stops, is supposedly the 3rd most dangerous city in Mexico.

Having second thoughts and might just do a week in Vegas...

The US is more dangerous than those touristy ports. 

[Mike45LC]

I wonder how many of the murder victims in PV were tourists from cruise ships.  After all,, the passengers are in town only from mid-morning to early evening (if that late).  We are not in town when the Mexican thugs are getting drunk and disorderly in the wee hours.

 

I have been to Cabo/Mazat/PV roughly 17 times on cruises, and have not observed or been the victim of any crime other than high priced tours and goods (and counterfeit goods).  But I don't seek out illegal drugs or prostitutes and I don't drink.  

 

I have no concerns for our safety on out 18th Mex Rix cruise coming up later this month.

 

[cruisingguy007]

On 10/5/2022 at 11:05 PM, ilovesparky13 said:

The US is more dangerous than those touristy ports. 

 

This post aged well with Vegas making headlines yesterday. Guess OP's going cruising. 😁

[SelectSys]

On 10/5/2022 at 2:36 PM, tonit964 said:

I walked around Loreto by myself for a few hours and everyone was so warm & welcoming.

Loreto, as a small town, is about as laid back as it gets anywhere.