Be Careful What You Buy on Board

[Ret MP]

10 minutes ago, nolimits said:

Ret MP

 This is Royal regular way of handling all large$ purchases on ship. 

 

No one was flagged for anything but there purchase How do you know that?

I can enjoy your knowledge but at no time did Buyer of a watch do anything wrong How do you know that?

And didn’t need to be observed all they needed was opportunity to pay which is at customs window once off ship A point made earlier by somebody was that it's not a mystery.  I respectfully disagree.  It's totally a mystery, and it should be, as to why this one person was taken aside.  I don't know, you don't know, nobody but CBP knows.  Yes, Royal probably reported the sale to CBP, no doubt.  But, every large sale was.  Why was this person, apparently, singled out?  I don't know, that's the point.

 

Not everybody is a criminal True.  But, we don't know that in this case and we don't know what went on behind the scenes in this event!  I know I don't!  

 

 

 

[Ret MP]

2 minutes ago, nolimits said:

So buying a watch makes you a suspected criminal?

Process sucks  and it’s on Royal not customs and not purchaser 

Okay, you obviously have nothing to do with Law Enforcement or Criminal Law.  We're just going around and around in circles.  Last word, unless you or anybody else comes up with something that is worthy of further discussion, IT IS EVERYBODY'S RESPONSIBILITY TO OBEY THE LAW, "ignorance of the law is no excuse".  

[RedIguana]

24 minutes ago, Ret MP said:

You can be detained and you can be handcuffed while being detained.  You are not under arrest while they search your belongings either

You are under arrest if you are being detained by definition. The second those cuffs go on, there is no longer any doubt you are under arrest. Customs/Border patrol do have the legal authority to search you and your belongings within reason. They have no LEGAL DUTY to do so, but it is an expected part of the job.

[nolimits]

Please remember customs  isn’t even involved till you take long walk off ship to office 

You are paraded by RCI past everybody to office.  IF RCI  not responsible for collecting tax at Sale why are they involved while disembarking before you get chance to pay

[CruisingHogFan]

Since you have Diamond + in your tag line you should know the laws/rules….

Cruise line has always handled it this way. You didn’t follow the instructions 

[Ret MP]

1 minute ago, RedIguana said:

You are under arrest if you are being detained by definition. The second those cuffs go on, there is no longer any doubt you are under arrest. Customs/Border patrol do have the legal authority to search you and your belongings within reason. They have no LEGAL DUTY to do so, but it is an expected part of the job.

You had better notify about 99% of the Law Enforcement agencies in this country of that!  

[nolimits]

You are wrong about instructions and I did absolutely nothing illegal or wrong if you read my first post I stated it was more like a fast pass for me 

I had my form and declaration and pymnt ready 

Process is not Good 

 

 

 

[not-enough-cruising]

7 minutes ago, nolimits said:

Please remember customs  isn’t even involved till you take long walk off ship to office 

You are paraded by RCI past everybody to office.  IF RCI  not responsible for collecting tax at Sale why are they involved while disembarking before you get chance to pay

Because CBP says they are.....................period

[not-enough-cruising]

1 hour ago, nolimits said:

You seem to be missing it at no time did anyone who purchased a watch do anything Wrong ( but was treated wrong )

Whats Wrong is how the collection of the tax starts on ship at gangway 

either do it at purchase on ship or at customs window. You could  be flagged and then escorted into office  if you didn’t declare your purchase ( then a crime)

 

you bought 

ship knows they sold 

customs knows because ship told them 

Some of the retailed on Islands that have offices in states also report

Absolutely not, retailers on the islands do not report anything about the sale to the states.  IF you give the island retailer your room number, they may report it to the ship, that is the extent of their reporting obligation.

[Charles4515]

16 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said:

 

People have been complaining for years about all the flyers and notices the cruise line has left in their cabins and the cruise line has listened and reduced the paper.  You can stick with your paper and abacus, I chose to move on with the times.

So all the advertising flyers that went staight into the trash can are a thing of the past?

[Ret MP]

2 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Because CBP says they are.....................period

Yep.  I was going to address that.  You did a better job than I would have.  Other than to say, Law Enforcement can request assistance from anybody they want.  

[PWP-001]

21 hours ago, nelblu said:

Just off Oasis out of Bayonne.  The cruise was simply fantastic other than a minor weather blip of a day.  While on board my son bought a Tag Heur men's watch.  When we disembarked in Bayonne, my son was prevented from leaving with a big warning sign indicating on the screen.  No explanation given even after we asked security multiple times as to the reason.

 

Some 10 minutes later, the D lounge concierge came and asked my son to follow him.  He was so serious and cold that we could not understand what the issue(s) was.  By the way, all of the adults have Global Pass and have fingerprints on file.  I asked the D Concierge for an explanation, but he wasn't too glib with his answers.  It seemed like one big damn secret.  We began to get worried especially, my granddaughter as she could not understand as to what was happening.  We followed them and went thru Customs/facial recognition process and no problems. Finally, he was leading us to the Customs offices.

 

A Custom officer came to greet us and asked my son for the receipt of the purchased watch.  They were so upset and frazzled that they could not readily find the receipt.  He told them to calm down and took my son to an enclosed area of the Customs Office away from us.  My granddaughter was upset as she did not understand what was going on.

 

My son told us that the Officer asked him some questions and was very kind and asked him the cost of the watch.  My son told him, and he was led to a cubicle where a cashier filled some paperwork and charged some $50+ and I guess it was for federal excise tax.

 

My conclusion, since Customs has done away with the "Custom Declaration Form", it seems that the cruise line is communicating/coordinating with Customs on any large purchases made on ship.

 

Our gripe is the secrecy and convoluted way that the way it was handled.  It was a bit embarrassing to say the least.   Why not explain why he was prevented from leaving and better yet why not charge for any federal excise tax at point of purchase rather than being treated like he did something wrong.

 

By the way if one says, "why should Royal get involved with collecting taxes", well Royal charged Nassau VAT taxes of 10% for the Beach bed that I rented on Coco Cay Chill Island.

 

Last famous words form my son and DIL--we will never buy anything of value on the ship, other than minor items.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, RedIguana said:

Any purchases over a certain amount onboard are reported to customs. The reason that person was directed to Customs is not a mystery.

I quoted the OP since we've seemed to jump the shark.

 

Yes, indeed, it was a mystery to the OP.

 

In the Fantasy World where everyone is a responsible citizen and cognizant of every law and regulation, the OP would have seen her son her son taken off in handcuffs as all the onlookers wagged their finger yelling "Shame, shame! How irresponsible!"

 

But in today's realistic world, the reasonable person taking a cruise for a vacation is most likely UNAWARE of CBP Duties and Regulations.  The reasonable person may expect some notification from a responsible party:  the cruise line.

 

As an example, let's look at the Internal Revenue Service which assesses a 50% penalty on the amount of any Required Minimum Distribution not taken annually, as generally required from certain retirement accounts after the account holder reaches a certain age.  This has been in place for decades.  And decades ago, MANY individuals learned of this requirement the hard way, when they got the penalty notice from the IRS-- because they simply did not know.

 

Oh yes, I can see those in Fantasy World stepping up on their soap box to wag their finger of responsibility as they shout "excuses, sad excuses"

 

Now the reality is that first time offenders --and most were-- had the 50% penalty waived when they took their RMD.  

 

What a sad world it would have been had the IRS simply said:  "You need to be more a more responsible taxpayer!"

 

Instead, the IRS realized that the custodian of those retirement assets was in the best position to INFORM their account holders of the RMD.  And that's why every financial custodian of assets subject to RMD -- in our realistic society -- is required to send notification annually, reminding the account holder about the RMD.

 

Again, perhaps if the cruise lines would do that simple flyer, there would be no mystery.

 

 

Footnote:  There are certain caveats to Required Minimum Distributions:  do your own research and do not rely upon these words here as advice.  I write the above in general terms which are believed to be accurate and are for illustrative purposes only.  The illustration I provide is factual in its general terms.  Please don't split hairs by elaborating on RMD's as that's simply an example tied back to the point of this thread as opened by the OP.   

[IRMO12HD]

8 hours ago, PWP-001 said:

I was on a Panama Canal cruise where I won four taxable jackpots, meaning each was more than $1,200.  In fact, the total was over $24,000.  I used some to pay down my on board account, but walked off the ship with over $20,000 in my pocket.  I answered YES to the question about having more than $10K and I was taken to an office by the agent reviewing my form in the line.  In the office, I pulled out my W-2G to show the agent that completed a form, and I was on my way in about 5 to 10 minutes total time.  

If we're ever on the same cruise, I'd love a lesson on how to win jackpots!  Congratulations!

[nelblu]

1 hour ago, not-enough-cruising said:

A sign would be of absolutely ZERO benefit.  There are multiple nationalities on board with multiple reporting standards and expectations. This is VERY simply a matter of personal responsibility.

 

With respect to your lawsuit comment, i think one would be hard pressed to find a successful one that fits the bill here.

I disagree with you, but I don't want to get into a pissing contest.  With the absence of the Custom Declarations Form which we used to hand to the Custom's Officer, do you or anyone happen to know what are the current protocols while on board from declaring to paying any excise tax.  Or do you simply get pulled out and escorted to Customs. 

 

With the technology, I don't understand why this is not handled when one goes thru facial recognition which is close to the Custom's location, at least in Bayonne.

[reallyitsmema]

3 minutes ago, nelblu said:

I disagree with you, but I don't want to get into a pissing contest.  With the absence of the Custom Declarations Form which we used to hand to the Custom's Officer, do you or anyone happen to know what are the current protocols while on board from declaring to paying any excise tax.  Or do you simply get pulled out and escorted to Customs. 

 

With the technology, I don't understand why this is not handled when one goes thru facial recognition which is close to the Custom's location, at least in Bayonne.

 

In the link I posted before, there is actually an app.  I have not looked into it yet as we are not travelling soon, but I wonder if you actually could have filled out the form in the app and submitted it prior to departure.  That would be ideal.

[PWP-001]

3 minutes ago, IRMO12HD said:

If we're ever on the same cruise, I'd love a lesson on how to win jackpots!  Congratulations!

Actually....  truth be told.... my brother's girlfriend is an expert at winning in the casino:

 

Every time we decide to hit the casino for a couple of hours after dinner, my brother slips her a $100 so she has money to play.  She promptly slips that C-note in her purse and snaps it shut, going home a winner every time!

 

When you're tired of hearing someone brag about their casino winnings and wanna shut them up, ask:  "So does that mean that you're ahead for the year?"

 

Oh, and thank you for the congrats!

 

 

[nelblu]

7 minutes ago, PWP-001 said:

 

I quoted the OP since we've seemed to jump the shark.

 

Yes, indeed, it was a mystery to the OP.

 

In the Fantasy World where everyone is a responsible citizen and cognizant of every law and regulation, the OP would have seen her son her son taken off in handcuffs as all the onlookers wagged their finger yelling "Shame, shame! How irresponsible!"

 

But in today's realistic world, the reasonable person taking a cruise for a vacation is most likely UNAWARE of CBP Duties and Regulations.  The reasonable person may expect some notification from a responsible party:  the cruise line.

 

As an example, let's look at the Internal Revenue Service which assesses a 50% penalty on the amount of any Required Minimum Distribution not taken annually, as generally required from certain retirement accounts after the account holder reaches a certain age.  This has been in place for decades.  And decades ago, MANY individuals learned of this requirement the hard way, when they got the penalty notice from the IRS-- because they simply did not know.

 

Oh yes, I can see those in Fantasy World stepping up on their soap box to wag their finger of responsibility as they shout "excuses, sad excuses"

 

Now the reality is that first time offenders --and most were-- had the 50% penalty waived when they took their RMD.  

 

What a sad world it would have been had the IRS simply said:  "You need to be more a more responsible taxpayer!"

 

Instead, the IRS realized that the custodian of those retirement assets was in the best position to INFORM their account holders of the RMD.  And that's why every financial custodian of assets subject to RMD -- in our realistic society -- is required to send notification annually, reminding the account holder about the RMD.

 

Again, perhaps if the cruise lines would do that simple flyer, there would be no mystery.

 

 

Footnote:  There are certain caveats to Required Minimum Distributions:  do your own research and do not rely upon these words here as advice.  I write the above in general terms which are believed to be accurate and are for illustrative purposes only.  The illustration I provide is factual in its general terms.  Please don't split hairs by elaborating on RMD's as that's simply an example tied back to the point of this thread as opened by the OP.   

Couldn't have said it better myself.  The only place that I saw any mention of the Custom's allowance was a little blurb on the debarkation departure time schedule.  And this is left in the cabin by the attendant.  

 

Ps.  Not to change the subject, but RMD on inherited IRA's both the financial institutions and the IRS are/were on different pages regarding when the initial distribution to begin.

[RedIguana]

4 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said:

In the link I posted before, there is actually an app.  I have not looked into it yet as we are not travelling soon, but I wonder if you actually could have filled out the form in the app and submitted it prior to departure.  That would be ideal.

I have used the app in the past. There is a current one on the apple/playstore.

[IRMO12HD]

4 minutes ago, PWP-001 said:

Actually....  truth be told.... my brother's girlfriend is an expert at winning in the casino:

 

Every time we decide to hit the casino for a couple of hours after dinner, my brother slips her a $100 so she has money to play.  She promptly slips that C-note in her purse and snaps it shut, going home a winner every time!

 

When you're tired of hearing someone brag about their casino winnings and wanna shut them up, ask:  "So does that mean that you're ahead for the year?"

 

Oh, and thank you for the congrats!

 

 

:-)  Okay, looks like I need lessons from your brother's girlfriend -- how to train my hubby to slip me the $100!

 

 

[nelblu]

6 minutes ago, reallyitsmema said:

 

In the link I posted before, there is actually an app.  I have not looked into it yet as we are not travelling soon, but I wonder if you actually could have filled out the form in the app and submitted it prior to departure.  That would be ideal.

Again, not everyone is as knowledgeable as you are.  It would be nice to get some directions from Royal, especially for newbies.  They have Royal personnel presenting and discussing upcoming ports of call.  They should have ones dealing with Customs requirements prior to arriving.

[PWP-001]

Just now, nelblu said:

Couldn't have said it better myself. 

 

Ps.  Not to change the subject, but RMD on inherited IRA's both the financial institutions and the IRS are/were on different pages regarding when the initial distribution to begin.

Thank you.  And please read the fine print of my footnote about comments on RMD's.  My use was in general terms and I specifically chose my words to remain factual while "dumbing it down" to not get into the details and start a discussion about RMD's and their many nuances.

 

Afterall, this thread has already drifted into an episode of Law & Order with contraband, criminal intent, search and seizure, handcuffs, arrests.... Whew!  

[Ret MP]

4 minutes ago, PWP-001 said:

 

I quoted the OP since we've seemed to jump the shark.

 

Yes, indeed, it was a mystery to the OP.

 

In the Fantasy World where everyone is a responsible citizen and cognizant of every law and regulation, the OP would have seen her son her son taken off in handcuffs as all the onlookers wagged their finger yelling "Shame, shame! How irresponsible!"

 

But in today's realistic world, the reasonable person taking a cruise for a vacation is most likely UNAWARE of CBP Duties and Regulations.  The reasonable person may expect some notification from a responsible party:  the cruise line.

 

As an example, let's look at the Internal Revenue Service which assesses a 50% penalty on the amount of any Required Minimum Distribution not taken annually, as generally required from certain retirement accounts after the account holder reaches a certain age.  This has been in place for decades.  And decades ago, MANY individuals learned of this requirement the hard way, when they got the penalty notice from the IRS-- because they simply did not know.

 

Oh yes, I can see those in Fantasy World stepping up on their soap box to wag their finger of responsibility as they shout "excuses, sad excuses"

 

Now the reality is that first time offenders --and most were-- had the 50% penalty waived when they took their RMD.  

 

What a sad world it would have been had the IRS simply said:  "You need to be more a more responsible taxpayer!"

 

Instead, the IRS realized that the custodian of those retirement assets was in the best position to INFORM their account holders of the RMD.  And that's why every financial custodian of assets subject to RMD -- in our realistic society -- is required to send notification annually, reminding the account holder about the RMD.

 

Again, perhaps if the cruise lines would do that simple flyer, there would be no mystery.

 

 

Footnote:  There are certain caveats to Required Minimum Distributions:  do your own research and do not rely upon these words here as advice.  I write the above in general terms which are believed to be accurate and are for illustrative purposes only.  The illustration I provide is factual in its general terms.  Please don't split hairs by elaborating on RMD's as that's simply an example tied back to the point of this thread as opened by the OP.   

You are right in premise.  No doubt.  However, there are many millions of people out there that never, throughout their entire life, find themselves afoul of the law and live complicated lives.  

I'm 71 (yesterday), I've lived a somewhat complicated life dealing with a career in Law Enforcement, U.S. Military (retired), responsible for missile sites,........ will I could go on and on.  But, for example, I've always known that I have to pay income taxes on my 401K when I turn 72 (maybe 72 1/2, I don't remember the specifics but will when I turn 72 next year).  No, my 401K administrator didn't notify me of it.  My job that I retired from didn't notify me, no one notified me.  I just researched it in the irs.gov and DHS.gov sites, et al, years ago, there has been some changes.  Just like I researched before I ever set foot on a Cruise line about how much liquor, cash, valuables, and such I can bring back to the U.S.  

 

As stated, and it's not a holier than thou statement, IT'S EVERYBODY'S RESPONSIBLITY TO OBEY THE LAW.  Ignorance is not an excuse.  

 

A little research goes a long way.  I did and apparently the vast majority of folks do.  Hence, the jails aren't full of cruiser.  And yes, the system is, can be, and should be forgiving. I'm sure that thousands of people go through basically the same thing, as the OP, year after year.  But, there are those that go through it and don't go into public forums and complain, make accusations about it, whatever.  Some or many may contact the agency and complain, others may write or call their U.S. Congress person and complain.  But, all the complaining in the world in a Social Media will accomplish NOTHING!  Well, I guess venting has some benefit.  

[nelblu]

4 minutes ago, PWP-001 said:

Thank you.  And please read the fine print of my footnote about comments on RMD's.  My use was in general terms and I specifically chose my words to remain factual while "dumbing it down" to not get into the details and start a discussion about RMD's and their many nuances.

 

Afterall, this thread has already drifted into an episode of Law & Order with contraband, criminal intent, search and seizure, handcuffs, arrests.... Whew!  

🤣

[Airbear232]

21 hours ago, Charles4515 said:

The shops onboard have always been reporting large purchases to customs. Even when they had the form. I think they are required too. A member of our group had that happen about six years ago. She was very embarrassed.  She had purchased a TAG watch. In her case they told her it was duty free and implied that meant there was no tax. Duty free only means that the store paid no tax. They gave her no warning there would be tax due. They have to comply with the law but they should not be underhanded about it.

If you’ve never travelled in your life, I can understand the confusion.  For anyone else - seriously!  Purchase limits are well communicated by the government.  Don’t blame the cruise line.  Yes, it would be great if they explain process.  And, they probably should.  But, didn’t  anyone think to ask in the shop how it would be handled coming home?  Same goes for OP who is at least diamond.  

[nelblu]

50 minutes ago, CruisingHogFan said:

Since you have Diamond + in your tag line you should know the laws/rules….

Cruise line has always handled it this way. You didn’t follow the instructions 

What instructions.  Do you know the current process.  I was in the Casino and not with them when they bought the watch as it was an anniversary present and had no idea until we were in Customs Office.

 

Years ago, it was easier.  Fill out the declaration and present to Custom's and pay the necessary amount(s).