Do the "premium" wines suck in Yacht Club?...

[Stockjock]

Just watched a video from Parodeejay, and they're a husband and wife vlogging team that focuses on cruises.  I think they booked a Bella veranda on Divina and Shazam, MSC upgraded them to Yacht Club, which I presume was an attempt to influence the influencers.

They showed some of the Yacht Club menus with wine selections and they seemed like generally mediocre wines that you might find in a supermarket for around $9-$11 per bottle.  As I recall, there was a Mondavi Private Selection cab, a Clos du Bois Chardonnay, I think another Mondavi Blush.  These aren't necessarily bad wines, although the ratings were not amazing (or close).  But somehow, if one is paying thousands more for Yacht Club, I expected a selection that was a bit more special.

Am I missing something, or are they doing YC wines on the cheap?

Also, the food looked better than the MDR but not as "special" as I expected.  The breakfasts seemed very similar to what I was served for breakfast in the MDR (we love the MSC Express breakfast).  The jellies seemed fancier, but I can't eat those anyway.

I do have a bid in on a YC cabin, but am considering pulling it, as I'm not sure I'd get my money's worth.

Thoughts?

Edited October 22, 2022 by Stockjock

[perakcruiser]

3 hours ago, Stockjock said:

Am I missing something, or are they doing YC wines on the cheap?

You are only writing about US wines that anyway are only available on MSC ships for this market. 

 

Surely the US wine market is not the main wine source for MSC for obvious reasons. What I know from MSC in Europe their wine selection in the YC is great.

 

And you should not look only at the price. In Europe the average selling price of a bottle of wine is somewhat around 3€. Prices above 15€ have nothing to do with quality or production costs, that is just storytelling, marketing, demand and shortage. 

[RudiRatlos]

When it comes to drink prices, one has to distinguish between producer price, wholesale, retail and gastronomy. In germany restaurants often calculate their drink price with a factor of 3-5 on the wholesale price (on a cruise ship, I would expect this factor to be on the higher side).

I just compared the YC bar list with the "normal" MSC bar list: wines included in YC are sold for about 25-35 EUR per bottle in other bars on the ship, so I would expect a wholesale price of 5-8 EUR. I also found some of these in online wine shops for about 8-10 EUR (so supermarket price may be 10-15 EUR). Seems like a fair calculation to me, and these are in no way bad wines (in supermarkets here, the really bad ones are sold for 2-3 EUR, "drinkable" ones starting at about 5 EUR)

 

That being said, I found most of the wines in YC enjoyable and much better than the wines included in easy plus and easy package, so I am fine with that.

After all, for me the main point in YC is the YC itself (atmosphere, people, service) and not only food and drinks. These are good, but of course you cannot expect them to be on the level of michelin-guide-awarded restaurants (you may pay the same there for one menu including wine than for a whole all-inclusive cruise day in YC).

Edited October 22, 2022 by RudiRatlos
typo

[9876]

Be sure to look at the wine/drink menu.  I requested the Oberon Cabernet Sauvignon.  I am not a connoisseur but I know what I like and I enjoyed it.  They will offer the others but if you ask they will be happy to provide anything on the menu at the fifteen dollar range or lower.  I believe you can also purchase other wines at a discounted rate.  

 

Edited October 22, 2022 by 9876

[Eglesbrech]

The YC wines have been just fine. Nice selection of European and Us wines.

 

Some of the better wines we were offered on the last cruise have not appeared this time eg Chablis but still a decent choice to compliment the food.

[lcpagejr]

Yacht Club is alot more than food and wine.... IMO I would never sail on MSC outrside of Yacht Club. If you are going to be so narrow minded and not realize all the benefits, space, solitude and amazing service....perhaps you should stay with the rest of the herd on the ship.

[Hlitner]

Just off the Seashore (Yacht Club) where we thought the included wines were so-so and drinkable!  At most meals we were offered a small wine list and there were usually 2 or 3 reds, 2 or 3 whites, and a Rose.  There were mediocre US offereings (such as Robert Mondavi Private Selection), the mediocre Clos de Bois, some mediocre Malbecs from Argentina, etc.  Ironically, we were never offered a decent Italian Red on a line with its roots in Italy!    There were some decent wines for sale (at very inflated prices) for the few folks that preferred to spend their money (or OBC) on some better offerings.

 

DW and I have cruised on many lines including a few of the luxury (or ultra luxury) lines that also include wines.  The included offerings on those lines was really not much better than the stuff on MSC although they did have a more diverse selection.  On Seabourn, we could (and did) order excellent wines from the expansive wine list, but the cost of those items would often be in the $100 - $300 (bottle) range.  

 

By the way, we agree with another poster in that we would not consider cruising on MSC outside the YC.  We enjoy the entire YC Experience and still think it offers one of the best values in the cruise world.  If folks think they can pay about $400 per person day, and be served $100 wines, they are very naive about cost controls.  Even on lines where you might pay $1000 per person/day, the wines are generally not exciting.  

 

Hank

[HipHipOnAShip]

8 hours ago, Stockjock said:

Just watched a video from Parodeejay, and they're a husband and wife vlogging team that focuses on cruises.  I think they booked a Bella veranda on Divina and Shazam, MSC upgraded them to Yacht Club, which I presume was an attempt to influence the influencers.

They showed some of the Yacht Club menus with wine selections and they seemed like generally mediocre wines that you might find in a supermarket for around $9-$11 per bottle.  As I recall, there was a Mondavi Private Selection cab, a Clos du Bois Chardonnay, I think another Mondavi Blush.  These aren't necessarily bad wines, although the ratings were not amazing (or close).  But somehow, if one is paying thousands more for Yacht Club, I expected a selection that was a bit more special.
 

(I was on that cruise with the vgloggers; didn't realize they got the upgrade for free 😡).

You are NOT missing anything.  The YC wines are generally very poor IMO on the US based sailings.  They will try to push the cheapest wines possible on you and hope that you accept them.  You really have to work hard to get a glass of what is included (wines at $15 a glass or less) with the Premium package when they really want you to drink what's on the Easy Plus package ($9 or less).  

 

The current Somm on the Meraviglia is notorious for this, unfortunately, and he tries to present very borning, flabby, mainstream wines with "a flair". (Think, "oh, look at this lovely La Terre White Zinfandel...")  Unfortunately we will have to deal with him again later this year as he is still onboard.  

[Georgia_Peaches]

24 minutes ago, lcpagejr said:

 If you are going to be so narrow minded and not realize all the benefits, space, solitude and amazing service....perhaps you should stay with the rest of the herd on the ship.

A little harsh, I think.  I agree with your assertion that YC is much more than food or drink but for many travelers, this is not the case.  Cost is a factor in cruising and fully understanding the upcharge associated with YC (or not) really has nothing to do with being narrow minded.  We cruise in suites regardless of the cruise line so for us it's about which one will give us the best suite life for the buck.  There is a huge price difference on MSC between YC and the other categories so asking about the value compared to the cost is quite legitimate....especially for the foodies out there who sail because of food and drink.  JMO

[lcpagejr]

22 minutes ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

A little harsh, I think.  I agree with your assertion that YC is much more than food or drink but for many travelers, this is not the case.  Cost is a factor in cruising and fully understanding the upcharge associated with YC (or not) really has nothing to do with being narrow minded.  We cruise in suites regardless of the cruise line so for us it's about which one will give us the best suite life for the buck.  There is a huge price difference on MSC between YC and the other categories so asking about the value compared to the cost is quite legitimate....especially for the foodies out there who sail because of food and drink.  JMO

Point Taken...Since they said they placed a "bid" for YC ...I'm assuming they are trying to get at a lower than normal price so just for them to experience the huge difference in YC vs other categories would be a huge experience. I have cruised MSC twice in YC...and after walking around the ship and dealing with the crowds and watching the lines and chaos at the customer service desks and the way they organize tender returns.... YC was the only way I would ever cruise MSC.  Having a concierge, a butler who takes you around the crowds and to shows, special tender access to skip the lines, superior service for food and drink on the Pool deck/Top Sail Lounge/Restaurant, our own embarkation and disembarkation by our Butler, etc was very relaxing, worry free  and made our cruise truly memorable. 

Edited October 22, 2022 by lcpagejr

[Jupt]

5 hours ago, RudiRatlos said:

That being said, I found most of the wines in YC enjoyable and much better than the wines included in easy plus and easy package, so I am fine with that.

After all, for me the main point in YC is the YC itself (atmosphere, people, service) and not only food and drinks. These are good, but of course you cannot expect them to be on the level of michelin-guide-awarded restaurants (you may pay the same there for one menu including wine than for a whole all-inclusive cruise day in YC).

I fully agree with this and that's not because I'm also a german too.

The wine was always good, but we choose the YC more like, because the other features, like atmospher, space, quiteness, cabines, ...

 

[Georgia_Peaches]

1 minute ago, lcpagejr said:

I have cruised MSC twice in YC...and after walking around the ship and dealing with the crowds and watching the lines and chaos at the customer service desks and the way they organize tender returns.... YC was the only way I would ever cruise MSC.  Having a concierge, a butler who takes you around the crowds and to shows, special tender access to skip the lines, superior service for food and drink on the Pool deck, our own embarkation and disembarkation by our Butler, etc was very relaxing, worry free  and made our cruise truly enjoyable. ..... 

Couldn't agree more!  It's the only way to go!  On our cruise on Seashore I remember thinking that if we had to wait in the holding area on embarkation day like the masses did just to get on the ship, I'd want to turn around a leave.  It was a mass of humanity sprawled around on the floor waiting to embark.  Literally nowhere to sit or stand.  That alone, makes YC worth it!

[RudiRatlos]

22 minutes ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

There is a huge price difference on MSC between YC and the other categories so asking about the value compared to the cost is quite legitimate....

I´d say the "real" price difference between YC and Aurea is smaller nowadays than it used to be some years ago, taking into account that aurea does not include even a basic drink package anymore and no free massage (actually the reason for our first YC cruise last year was the reasonable small price difference between YC and aurea + drink package + massage.)

 

Regarding the wines, I see from some answers here that there are differences between european und US cruises.

[travelberlin]

2 hours ago, lcpagejr said:

Yacht Club is alot more than food and wine.... IMO I would never sail on MSC outrside of Yacht Club. If you are going to be so narrow minded and not realize all the benefits, space, solitude and amazing service....perhaps you should stay with the rest of the herd on the ship.

As someone who sails MSC quite often and not just on Yacht Club, I am curious how come you call non Yacht Club guests a “herd”. This is quite narrow minded in my opinion.

Ivi 

[Hlitner]

Regarding the YC, we think it is so much more than the food/wine (which are certainly decent).  On our recent Seashore cruise we went out an about (outside the YC) to check-out all the entertainment and quickly realized that, for our taste, the best entertainment were all rotating through the YC's Top Sail Lounge.  We found ourselves spending much of the evening time in Top Sail enjoying the music along with amazing service.  When we went to the other lounges (outside the YC) the service was not nearly as good.  What has surprised us on our YC cruises is that the Top Sail is never crowded.  Obviously, a majority of the YC patrons are either in their cabins or elsewhere on the ship.   For us, relaxing in the laid-back YC atmosphere, not having to deal with queues, interacting with the friendly YC staff, etc. is all part of the overall experience.  We thought the food, on the Seashore, was the best we have had on our several MSC YC cruises.  We did think that the meats were decent quality, but were not overly impressed with the fish.  On the other hand, the lobster tail in the YC was perfectly prepared (broiled) which is unusual on cruise ships where the oft undersized warm water (i.e. tasteless) tails are overcooked in oversalted water.  I am not a fan of tails (I prefer eating a whole Maine lobster) but the one I had on the Seashore was among the best I have had on any cruise ship.  One interesting tidbit is that they served the tails without any drawn butter on the side.  When we asked our waiter to please bring us some butter he quickly responded that butter had already been added (but he did fulfill our wish and quickly returned with a small bowl of melted butter).

 

Hank

[lcpagejr]

48 minutes ago, travelberlin said:

As someone who sails MSC quite often and not just on Yacht Club, I am curious how come you call non Yacht Club guests a “herd”. This is quite narrow minded in my opinion.

Ivi 

Very crowded...people bumping in to you...Dare I say a "Carnival" feel. Gorgeouus ship....poor organization...different answers from different crew.....I've cruised 20+ times, on numerous cruise lines, from interiors and up to Yacht Club.... Once you do it..there is no turning back (atleast on MSC)

Edited October 22, 2022 by lcpagejr

[rkacruiser]

5 hours ago, Hlitner said:

When we asked our waiter to please bring us some butter he quickly responded that butter had already been added (but he did fulfill our wish and quickly returned with a small bowl of melted butter).

 

On some cruise lines, after the lobster has been removed from its shell, some butter is poured on the tail.  Not the same as having a bowl of melted butter to dip each morsel into it before into one's mouth.

 

5 hours ago, Hlitner said:

When we went to the other lounges (outside the YC) the service was not nearly as good.

 

That's a surprise to me because when I sailed on Meraviglia and the bartender or stewards recognized me as a YC guest, the service and the pours were great!  

 

6 hours ago, Jupt said:

The wine was always good, but we choose the YC more like, because the other features, like atmospher, space, quiteness, cabines, ...

 

And, service as well as the cuisine.  I found no fault with the wine list except my favorite New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc was not available.  

 

To our new CC member:  Willkommen!  

 

7 hours ago, Hlitner said:

Ironically, we were never offered a decent Italian Red on a line with its roots in Italy!    There were some decent wines for sale (at very inflated prices) for the few folks that preferred to spend their money (or OBC) on some better offerings.

 

That was my experience.  I see no point in paying inflated prices for a wine that  may or may not be to my taste.  Trying Opus One taught me a lesson that I have not forgotten!  

[Georgia_Peaches]

22 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

Trying Opus One taught me a lesson that I have not forgotten!  

OMG I learned that lesson as well.  I thought for sure it was just me and my unsophisticated palate.  

[Hlitner]

32 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

On some cruise lines, after the lobster has been removed from its shell, some butter is poured on the tail.  Not the same as having a bowl of melted butter to dip each morsel into it before into one's mouth.

 

 

That's a surprise to me because when I sailed on Meraviglia and the bartender or stewards recognized me as a YC guest, the service and the pours were great!  

 

 

And, service as well as the cuisine.  I found no fault with the wine list except my favorite New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc was not available.  

 

To our new CC member:  Willkommen!  

 

 

That was my experience.  I see no point in paying inflated prices for a wine that  may or may not be to my taste.  Trying Opus One taught me a lesson that I have not forgotten!  

Opus One was a decent buy when you could get if for about $100.  At current prices we think it is vastly overpriced.  There are numerous CA wines that many would rate superior (especially if doing a blind tasting) such as some of the Caymus and Jordon offerings.  But much of the wine game is perception and brand name.  So much of the fun for oenophiles is arguing about wines :).

 

Hank   

[rkacruiser]

2 hours ago, Hlitner said:

Opus One was a decent buy when you could get if for about $100. 

 

I did not care for it whatever the retail price was.  Compared to other Reds, it was most disappointing!

 

2 hours ago, Hlitner said:

But much of the wine game is perception and brand name.  So much of the fun for oenophiles is arguing about wines :).

 

I agree.  But, during the arguing, I keep learning thanks to those discussions.  

Edited October 23, 2022 by rkacruiser

[rkacruiser]

2 hours ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

OMG I learned that lesson as well.  I thought for sure it was just me and my unsophisticated palate.  

 

Hype and "expert opinions" are unknown to my palate.  As they are to yours, I think.  

 

The best "recommendations" have come from the bartenders on the ships on which I have sailed.  

 

My favorite New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc--Villa Maria--has been rated as the "best of the lot"--by every bartender with whom I have discussed this type of wine.  Yet, while once available by the bottle on HAL ships, the distributor was changed by the Company, and I have to drink an acceptable Sauvignon Blanc while I would be willing to pay for the superior wine that I prefer.  

 

And, MSC didn't have it either.   Arthur in the YC Restaurant agreed that Villa Maria would be a better wine of that type than what was available.  

[Hlitner]

So we could have fun talking about Opus One.  It is a fine wine (originally a collaboration betcannween Robert Mondavi and the Rothchilds).  I think it is sae to say that Robert Mondavi (a great wine maker) wanted to produce an American wine in the Bordeaux tradition.  The fine bordeaux's are great wines, but many Americans have cultivated a taste for lots of fruit whereas the Bordeaux style has lots of style without the fruitiness that we expect from most California Cabs.  I have friends that truly dislike the French style of dry wines, but we think that is because their palate is so used to the fruitier US style that they cannot adjust.  

 

My problem with Opus One is that if I want to drink a French Bordeaux and I can get many excellent bordeaux's for a fraction of the cost of Opus One.  And if want a California style red, there are many excellent California (not to mention Oregon and Washington) wines for a fraction of the cost.  To me that leaves Opus One as a novelty.  If somebody wants to buy me a glass (or bottle) I will be very happy, but you will not see me buying Opus One.

 

Hank

[no1talks]

6 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

"Trying Opus One taught me a lesson that I have not forgotten!"

Opus from the 80s, perchance?

The two problems with Opus:

• The hype, which raises the bar too much.
• The inconsistency across vintages.
  
  If one who is into Bordeaux blends (heavy on the Cabernet) had a glass of the stuff and didn't know it was Opus, one would probably say, "Hmm, pretty damn good."
  
  But, if it is known to be Opus? "What the hell is this?!? I can't believe they bothered to even bottle this!!"
  (Unless they want to be cool. Then they'll go on and on about "black currant" and "rose petals." 🤣)

[no1talks]

5 hours ago, Hlitner said:

"So much of the fun for oenophiles is arguing about wines :)."

Which is why I'll drink pretty much any wine in a setting I find apropos. 

I won't drink Sutter Home White Zin with a $100 steak dinner, but I'll happily drink it if that is what my friend is serving at his burgers & brats cookout.

[styles27]

If I may put my 2 cents in. 
 

It’s so hard to answer any question concerning food or drink because we all have different opinions on how something taste.  
 

We’ve travelled to many wine regions over the years and tasted wines at just about every price point. 
 

I have spit out just as many very expensive wines as affordable everyday wines.  
 

My favorite wines are less than $50 a bottle. We have a couple of favorite central CA region wines that are less than $20 a bottle. 
 

I was in YC on Divina in Mediterranean and only had one or two glasses of wine that stand out as something I would purchase for home consumption. 
 

We also did some vineyard tours in Italy, Spain and France and didn’t think anything we tasted was any better than what we get here in the states. 
 

Taste is subjective. 🤷🏻‍♀️