Queen Elizabeth 54 days of cruising on her this year. My views

[lissie]

1 hour ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

The ship is air conditioned even in hot countries - so the temperature on board is pleasant and allows dressing up irrespective of whether you are in Iceland or Australia. So no reason to dilute the formal attire as far as I can see.

Sorry but almost all of our time was in hot areas - the air con struggles in places. And yes it could be cold in areas and uncomfortably cold in others all at the same time. The issues cut in over 30C 

[lissie]

6 minutes ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

The only time I have been aware of any issue with the internal air temperature on board is when staying an extended period and overnight in places such as northern Norway in winter, when the gangway doors remain open - and the outside air comes into the ship for an extended period. In this example it can get quite cold in areas near where the exit door is open to the outside.  However most of the time it is not an issue and certainly not an 'excuse' to dilute the dress code.  Anyone who wishes to not adhere to the dress code does so for other reasons.

You are looking at this from a UK point of view. The reality is that its rare for a man to wear  formal jacket in Australia - many, many of them don't own one.  Even in NZ where the weather is a lot milder - my partner would never wear a suite jacket except at a funeral 

[exlondoner]

14 minutes ago, lissie said:

You are looking at this from a UK point of view. The reality is that its rare for a man to wear  formal jacket in Australia - many, many of them don't own one.  Even in NZ where the weather is a lot milder - my partner would never wear a suite jacket except at a funeral 

To be fair, Cunard does purport vaguely to be a UK line. I know this is only up to a point, as it talks about tuxedos and uses US dollars, but nonetheless it does have its HQ in Southampton.

[exlondoner]

34 minutes ago, lissie said:

You are looking at this from a UK point of view. The reality is that its rare for a man to wear  formal jacket in Australia - many, many of them don't own one.  Even in NZ where the weather is a lot milder - my partner would never wear a suite jacket except at a funeral 

Another thing is in 2019, I was on a Med cruise with 400 Australians, who were doing a very lengthy Three Queens jaunt. This was the final stage, I think, before they flew back. As far as I could tell, those in the Grills, at any rate, but probably throughout the ship, were zealous adherents of the dress codes. 

Edited November 5, 2022 by exlondoner

[ballroom-cruisers]

Having cultural dress customs that are from other parts of the world does not mean people should abandon the nice smart dress codes that have been customary on Cunard voyages. After all if someone came from a tribal area where feathered headgear and spears was normal, coming on a Cunard voyage dressed in that style would not fit with the way most people dress up for the evening on board ship.  If you lose the customary dress code on the Cunard voyages, then you will also lose what makes Cunard special and what many Cunarders are attracted to and enjoy about being specifically on Cunard cruises.

[ballroom-cruisers]

29 minutes ago, lissie said:

You are looking at this from a UK point of view. The reality is that its rare for a man to wear  formal jacket in Australia - many, many of them don't own one.  Even in NZ where the weather is a lot milder - my partner would never wear a suite jacket except at a funeral 

 

So a couple will spend several thousand US dollars on a cruise, and the lady will undoubtedly spend a good bit of cash on lovely new dresses, but the man does not want to spend around $40 or %50 on a jacket to be part of the nice smart dressed community on board!  It doesn't add up.

[Victoria2]

2 hours ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

The only time I have been aware of any issue with the internal air temperature on board is when staying an extended period and overnight in places such as northern Norway in winter, when the gangway doors remain open - and the outside air comes into the ship for an extended period. In this example it can get quite cold in areas near where the exit door is open to the outside.  However most of the time it is not an issue and certainly not an 'excuse' to dilute the dress code.  Anyone who wishes to not adhere to the dress code does so for other reasons.

If you had been sailing with us on the occasions the aircon didn't deliver sufficiently, you would be aware of the need to remove jackets for some chaps. That's not a dilution of any dress code, that is a practical, almost medical, necessity for some and if you weren't on our trips, you cannot dispute my comment.

 

Luckily, as jackets are no longer expected every night, it will only be the Gala evenings where the aircon or lack of efficiency, might affect those in danger of heat problems.

 

Again, luckily, there's a simple solution for those who feel 'standards have dropped' and it's no longer the Cunard of yore. Find another cruise line or a different  mode of travel.

 

 

[Victoria2]

1 hour ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

 

So a couple will spend several thousand US dollars on a cruise, and the lady will undoubtedly spend a good bit of cash on lovely new dresses, but the man does not want to spend around $40 or %50 on a jacket to be part of the nice smart dressed community on board!  It doesn't add up.

It might not for you, but it does for many.  In fact, the change of requirements might mean more passengers decide to travel with Cunard. 

We will be jacketed every evening and even 'tie'd occasionally. What others wear will have no effect on us whatsoever and I think that will apply to the majority of passengers.

Those who don't like it, well...

[Bedruthen]

I am in agreement with a number of the detailed omissions that you have mentioned, which were similar to our recent QM2 experience.
With regard to ballroom dancing,  Carnival have serious debt issues and they will have to look at every possible source of onboard revenue to squeeze the last dollar out of passengers. Inevitably this will include a review of the use of the large public areas. If the Queens room doesn’t pay its way ( I have no idea) when used for ballroom dancing, then they are going to seek out other options. An alternative inclusive evening venue where entertainment can be staged for those people who don’t go to the shows might be one alternative. A bit of karaoke here, dancing girls there and people propping up the bar might just be their idea of a good money spinner. Who knows
 

 

[LittleFish1976]

3 hours ago, lissie said:

You are looking at this from a UK point of view. The reality is that its rare for a man to wear  formal jacket in Australia - many, many of them don't own one.  Even in NZ where the weather is a lot milder - my partner would never wear a suite jacket except at a funeral 

 

I live in Australia and this is not entirely correct. Many men wear suits to work daily. Even young men wear suits for social occasions. Australia is a lot more formal than New Zealand, especially Melbourne.

 

[ballroom-cruisers]

1 hour ago, Bedruthen said:

I am in agreement with a number of the detailed omissions that you have mentioned, which were similar to our recent QM2 experience.
With regard to ballroom dancing,  Carnival have serious debt issues and they will have to look at every possible source of onboard revenue to squeeze the last dollar out of passengers. Inevitably this will include a review of the use of the large public areas. If the Queens room doesn’t pay its way ( I have no idea) when used for ballroom dancing, then they are going to seek out other options. An alternative inclusive evening venue where entertainment can be staged for those people who don’t go to the shows might be one alternative. A bit of karaoke here, dancing girls there and people propping up the bar might just be their idea of a good money spinner. Who knows
 

 

 

I have no doubt Cunard will be looking to balance their books and continue to operate with profit as any business must do.  Nevertheless, currently they may well be able to ignore the traditional Cunarder's desire to keep some things sacred, such as the dress code and the ballroom dancing, by attracting in a new and different kind of passenger.  But tougher times are coming over the next couple of years in many countries, and those who are now flocking in for the cheap deals, may be less in number in a year or two as belts become necessarily tightened for quite a lot of people. So it might just be the case that there will be a time that Cunard may wish they had not alienated their loyal traditional customers, and would like to lure them back.  By then it may be too late though. No doubt we will see how things have changed, and what cruises are like in a couple of years, and no doubt passengers will be discussing such things on this forum then too. We are planning cruises next year, and we will make our own judgement about whether they continue to give us the pleasure of a holiday we are happy to pay for, or not. There are friends, who do not frequent this forum, and who do not express public opinion, and who don't bother with feedback questionnaires after a voyage, and who have decided not to book next year, and see what reports they hear from friends in private after coming back from their voyages in the coming year. Of course it would be lovely if everyone can continue to enjoy the sea life, the good meals, the entertainment and come back feeling it was purely fabulous. It is the people on board, as well as the facilities, and the activities available, that make a voyage. If the people and activities change, then so does how a holiday feels, and we all have to make our own decisions. There may be less choice in the coming years for cruise lines, and for voyages, and it is not certain that as many will be making the decision to book cruises in a few years compared to now.  Tough decisions for the managers for sure, but passengers will vote with their feet irrespective of threads on this forum. Time will tell how the cruise industry changes into the future.

[daisybel]

Just about to embark on 28 days round Australia Husband will continue as usual and just packed his formal clothes which include a couple of bow ties ,also 3 or 4 ties as well as a nice jacket He is retired and most days still wears a tie. I also intend to dress up on formal nights and for the other nights dress as though going somewhere special for dinner - which we are and will be enjoying  our “ nights out” after not cruising for 3 years . Choose another Line if the code does not fit in with your requirements !

[Jacqueline]

Driving versus flying into port makes a huge difference in what I pack for formal wear. My husband can bring his tux and two other sport jackets, I can bring several dresses and two ball gowns as we are driving to Brooklyn. Otherwise, I would take very packable dresses and he would take a sports jacket that he would wear on the plane. Maybe pack the tux.

 

on the Heritage Cruiseline, I have been looking at their new ship which is the old Hapaag Lloyd Hanseatic which I have sailed. What Heritage like?

[techteach]

We’re all in for the formal nights. I have bought 3 formals, only need 2, and they are in the hands of alterations. I have 2 short fancy dresses and lots of black velvet ready to pack. DH had a final fitting for his new tux. 2 shirts, 2 cummerbunds, 2 ties. He will be taking a suit and several ties. We are in QG and will dress nicely every night. We decided this is an important part of the TA for us, so we will be using luggage forwarding. (DH was a little surprised at the cost but knows I can’t cart heavy luggage due to shoulder arthritis). While we live 5 minutes from the cruise ship piers, the ships only sail to Alaska. 😞 Been there done that several times. So, we will always be looking at fly to sail cruises. 

[david,Mississauga]

13 hours ago, Victoria2 said:

...

 

Again, luckily, there's a simple solution for those who feel 'standards have dropped' and it's no longer the Cunard of yore. Find another cruise line or a different  mode of travel.

 

 

 

Or people can do what I do: pay no attention to this dumbing down and dress traditionally. I wear a jacket and tie on all non-gala nights (as was required  on the QE2) and a dinner jacket on the gala nights. If Cunard goes the way of Holland America with T-shirts and backward baseball caps I will not let this bother me and dress as I always have. 

[daisybel]

Won’t bother me either unless bare feet in the theatre ?? I will then move 🤯

[lissie]

17 hours ago, ballroom-cruisers said:

 

So a couple will spend several thousand US dollars on a cruise, and the lady will undoubtedly spend a good bit of cash on lovely new dresses, but the man does not want to spend around $40 or %50 on a jacket to be part of the nice smart dressed community on board!  It doesn't add up.

Where on earth can you get a jacket for $40 - please provide the link! We looked hard in Barcelona - up to 300 euros - nothing anywhere near his size.   And  op shops which would be around that price at home - don't really work because again they are all smaller sizes 

 

We also spend considerably more than a few thousand dollars for a cruise!  And this lady  does not spend a good bit of cash on a new dress. I got lots of comments on my lovely formal night outfits - one was a $15 top from a chain store the other included a shrug I made myself from a cheapo sari. 

Edited November 6, 2022 by lissie

[Mareblu]

16 hours ago, LittleFish1976 said:

 

I live in Australia and this is not entirely correct. Many men wear suits to work daily. Even young men wear suits for social occasions. Australia is a lot more formal than New Zealand, especially Melbourne.

 

Absolutely, and thank you for defending us from sweeping general (and incorrect) statements.  I live in rather formal Canberra, where formal attire is required for many functions in a calendar year, and suits and ties abound on a daily basis.  Sydney, with its beautiful beaches and stunning harbour, naturally enjoys a relaxed lifestyle and culture, but tailored day attire is standard in its cbd and suburban offices, and this and often formal evening attire can be found in restaurants and too end bars throughout this vibrant city.  We’re retirees, but our formal wear gets a thorough and regular workout.  
We’ve just completed another Oceania cruise, where we met many fellow Australians.  Like us, the ones we knew dressed for dinner every evening.  Of course, Oceania does not have gala evenings, so no formal jackets for gentlemen, but jackets and ties were in abundance, with ladies in elegant cocktail dresses and evening pants with beautiful tops.  The standard was enforced, too.  Pax who did not wish to dine in the GDR or other specialty restaurants were free to dine at the more casual Terrace.  Twice we witnessed guests being politely and diplomatically turned away from the GDR.  This was evening, of course.

 

 

[Victoria2]

5 hours ago, david,Mississauga said:

 

Or people can do what I do: pay no attention to this dumbing down and dress traditionally. I wear a jacket and tie on all non-gala nights (as was required  on the QE2) and a dinner jacket on the gala nights. If Cunard goes the way of Holland America with T-shirts and backward baseball caps I will not let this bother me and dress as I always have. 

Which is what we and  most of those who choose to sail with Cunard will do, and those who continually moan about droppings standards can do the same or find another mode of cruise line/ mode of holiday.

[Victoria2]

43 minutes ago, Victoria2 said:

Which is what we and  most of those who choose to sail with Cunard will do, and those who continually moan about droppings standards can do the same or find another mode of cruise line/ mode of holiday.

Meant to say

'is what we, and many of those who choose to continue sailing with Cunard will do'

Edited November 6, 2022 by Victoria2

[ballroom-cruisers]

3 hours ago, lissie said:

Where on earth can you get a jacket for $40 - please provide the link! We looked hard in Barcelona - up to 300 euros - nothing anywhere near his size.   And  op shops which would be around that price at home - don't really work because again they are all smaller sizes 

 

We also spend considerably more than a few thousand dollars for a cruise!  And this lady  does not spend a good bit of cash on a new dress. I got lots of comments on my lovely formal night outfits - one was a $15 top from a chain store the other included a shrug I made myself from a cheapo sari. 

 

Just like you found a source of cheaper clothes for yourself, there are shops, at least in the UK, where you can get men's jackets at low cost too. The last evening jacket I bought, which I have used at formal functions, and looks smart and nice and quiet lightweight making it ideal when dancing so as not to get too hot, only cost me £15. Of course it is also possible to find shops where similar jackets cost twenty times that price! Maybe where you live only the latter kind of men's clothes shops are available.

[lissie]

On 11/6/2022 at 9:04 AM, Jacqueline said:

 

on the Heritage Cruiseline, I have been looking at their new ship which is the old Hapaag Lloyd Hanseatic which I have sailed. What Heritage like?

Certainly, no tuxes required!  I saw that they had upgraded the ships, the ship we went on only took around 60 pax . Its expedition style not traditional cruising. So no angst about what you wear except for us they provided gum boots (you had to provide shoe size) and for colder trips they provide warm jackets.  Meals are provided are good but I don't recall what they were LOL!   They are pretty physical - you need to get on and off the boat and into zodiacs most days. 

 

I found them more structured than traditional cruising - because you had one shot to get on the boat and go (for us the whole group could be accommodated at the same time in the zodiacs - not sure how that works with larger boats).  6am call for the penguins for example.  

 

The bar was a self-serve honour system (write your name in the book) . 

 

The company is a small-family owned company - who I had to talk to a fair bit because of the uncertainities of getting insurance in the middle of a pandemic (we cruised in 2021) - very helpful and responsive- just remember the time zone if you are outside NZ 

Edited November 6, 2022 by lissie

[cruiseny4life]

On 11/5/2022 at 11:37 AM, ballroom-cruisers said:

 

I have no doubt Cunard will be looking to balance their books and continue to operate with profit as any business must do.  Nevertheless, currently they may well be able to ignore the traditional Cunarder's desire to keep some things sacred, such as the dress code and the ballroom dancing, by attracting in a new and different kind of passenger.  But tougher times are coming over the next couple of years in many countries, and those who are now flocking in for the cheap deals, may be less in number in a year or two as belts become necessarily tightened for quite a lot of people. So it might just be the case that there will be a time that Cunard may wish they had not alienated their loyal traditional customers, and would like to lure them back.  By then it may be too late though. No doubt we will see how things have changed, and what cruises are like in a couple of years, and no doubt passengers will be discussing such things on this forum then too. We are planning cruises next year, and we will make our own judgement about whether they continue to give us the pleasure of a holiday we are happy to pay for, or not. There are friends, who do not frequent this forum, and who do not express public opinion, and who don't bother with feedback questionnaires after a voyage, and who have decided not to book next year, and see what reports they hear from friends in private after coming back from their voyages in the coming year. Of course it would be lovely if everyone can continue to enjoy the sea life, the good meals, the entertainment and come back feeling it was purely fabulous. It is the people on board, as well as the facilities, and the activities available, that make a voyage. If the people and activities change, then so does how a holiday feels, and we all have to make our own decisions. There may be less choice in the coming years for cruise lines, and for voyages, and it is not certain that as many will be making the decision to book cruises in a few years compared to now.  Tough decisions for the managers for sure, but passengers will vote with their feet irrespective of threads on this forum. Time will tell how the cruise industry changes into the future.

I am interested in knowing where one that enjoys the Cunard experience (dressing up, dancing, lectures, etc.) would go. I know a different type of dancing and lecture can occur on other ships, but I'm not aware of another line that require one to dress in such a fancy manner. Based on comments here, this seems to be an expected part of the Cunard experience. Am I missing a line? Or, by people "[voting] with their feet," do you mean individuals will choose land-based vacations rather than cruises? 

[lissie]

2 hours ago, cruiseny4life said:

I am interested in knowing where one that enjoys the Cunard experience (dressing up, dancing, lectures, etc.) would go. I know a different type of dancing and lecture can occur on other ships, but I'm not aware of another line that require one to dress in such a fancy manner. Based on comments here, this seems to be an expected part of the Cunard experience. Am I missing a line? Or, by people "[voting] with their feet," do you mean individuals will choose land-based vacations rather than cruises? 

Haha - I've thought the same thing! Basically, I think its people being keyboard warriors. You can certainly pay more and get a more exclusive experience - but none of those lines e.g. Oceania, Windstar do formal as far as I know. And smaller ships don't have dance floors and orchestras/bands.  

 

I don't really understand the argument - if you want to dress up above and beyond the dress code you'll not going to get told off!  

[alibabacruisers]

I would love to see pictures of your formal wear!  I am not great at fashion so love examples of what to look for visually.  What I like usually does not suit me, so I always like to see what others ideas are.