Missed Cruise due to AA Flight Delay from PHX 9/22/22

[dolfan1980]

3 hours ago, New2cruise2022 said:

The flight out of PHX was the night before the cruise. OP and NCL didn’t take a risky, last minute cruise. OP explained efforts made over and over to mitigate risk and overcome major efforts in a good faith effort to board the ship on time. There is really not a lesson-learned life experience for the OP to draw from this. 

A red eye from the west coast with the time difference is leaving day of.  There's really no other options to make it if the one flight is canceled.  A ten day vacation at risk is just not worth it.  I certainly do sympathize with the OP, but at same time people can hopefully learn from this to have back up options.  

[Babr]

1 minute ago, graphicguy said:

Plus, the OP gets 90% of the cruise fare payable as a FCC.  So, all is not lost.

Don’t think so. The CFAR applies up until departure. The OP decided to go home long after that.

 

The claim has already been paid under Trip Delay.

[RocketMan275]

23 minutes ago, SeaShark said:

 

Right...but instead of deflecting to "what are they", why don't you just explain what they are instead? IOW...provide answers instead of new questions.

that has been explained multiple times.

 

i'm asking what do posters think those obligations are.

[graphicguy]

10 minutes ago, Babr said:

Don’t think so. The CFAR applies up until departure. The OP decided to go home long after that.

 

The claim has already been paid under Trip Delay.

I'd go to battle with the insurance company on that one.  OP was on the phone with NCL up until it was clear that ship was sailing without them.  I would keep all those phone call times in my mobile phone for proof.

 

Insurance companies are notorious for trying to weasel out of coverage.  Push comes to shove, I'd file a small claims suit against the insurance company.

 

That $500 paid out is only for delay incidentals, meals and hotels.  It does not cover missing the cruise or cancelling it "for any reason".

Edited December 2, 2022 by graphicguy

[mjkacmom]

1 hour ago, Karaboudjan said:

 

According to the OP's description they spoke in person with the shuttle driver so apparently they had not stopped.  I'm sure that NCL can and does bend the 2-hour rule as needed, but I'd like my chances a lot better if I'm on an NCL-organized shuttle.

But the shuttle wouldn’t have arrived at the port much before the OP, if at all.

[Babr]

3 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

I'd go to battle with the insurance company on that one.  OP was on the phone with NCL up until it was clear that ship was sailing without them.  I would keep all those phone call times in my mobile phone for proof.

 

Insurance companies are notorious for trying to weasel out of coverage.  Push comes to shove, I'd file a small claims suit against the insurance company.

On what grounds?
 

NCL offered to get them to the next port. Even third-party policies that cover Missed Connection to catch up to your cruise have stipulations such as arriving within X hours or missing X% of cruise before they will reimburse the unused portion of the trip.

 

Nobody pays if you just turn around and go home.

[zzdoug]

11 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

FWIW, I think this person may be talking about the part where the OP stated that the insurance company was trying to make them jump through every hoop in an effort to avoid paying him what he was due. I think it was less about reaching the insurance company and more about getting them to pay. But that being said, he was paid the maximum benefit of $500 in the end.

No, I was trying to communicate that if you are going to try to solve the problem yourself and you want to make a claim, it's a good idea to get in touch with the insurance company to see if they will cover whatever it is you plan to do.  And then, it would be helpful to know whether the OP (Dave) was able to reach a claims agent to ask about these things. 

 

I perhaps miscommunicated to make it sound like he said that he had a hard time reaching the insurance company; whereas I only meant to say that if it were the case that he tried and was unable to, that would be useful to know.

[don't-use-real-name]

This appears to be a text book example for Elliott and his organization to have a field day with:

 

About the Elliott Report - Elliott Report

[Karaboudjan]

16 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

I'd go to battle with the insurance company on that one.  OP was on the phone with NCL up until it was clear that ship was sailing without them.  I would keep all those phone call times in my mobile phone for proof.

 

 

 

6 minutes ago, Babr said:

On what grounds?
 

NCL offered to get them to the next port. Even third-party policies that cover Missed Connection to catch up to your cruise have stipulations such as arriving within X hours or missing X% of cruise before they will reimburse the unused portion of the trip.

 

Nobody pays if you just turn around and go home.

 

According to the document that was linked earlier the Cancel for Any Reason is 'not an insurance benefit' so I don't think the insurance company would or should touch that.

 

That said, it does say 'any reason' so you should be eligible even if you 'just turn around and go home', provided that you give the proper notice.   

[Babr]

17 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

Platinum Travel Insurance (underwritten by AEON) is insurance you buy from NCL.  NCL is only the sale agent.

 

So, looking at the terms, cancel for any reason is covered under the insurance.  OP canceled when they could not get to the ship on time.

 

I had a pipe burst in my home theater room.  Ruined about $20K in audio/video equipment, and that didn’t even cover the physical damage to the structure.

 

State Farm said since the pipe burst in two places, it was 2 separate “incidents”.  Since I didn’t fix the first pipe burst incident, the 2nd was not covered.  The same pipe broke in two different places at the same time, and their denial of full coverage was that BS.

 

The amount was too high for small claims, but I had dealt with them before in Small Claims on other issues.  I did have to hire a lawyer, who worked for me for nearly 2 years.  State Farm kept trying to negotiate with me for a lesser amount that my loss.  I took them all the way to court, where I won and received compensation for my lawyer, my time devoted to working on the case, my time traveling to and from, and showing up in court.

 

My State Farm agent goes to the same church I do.  He was friendly when he was collecting my premiums.  Now, he won’t even talk to me, even if we’re 2 feet from each other. I say “hi”, anyway.   Other parishioners comment on his lack of courtesy.

 

 I got a broker who hooked me up with Nationwide, who I’ve been very pleased with.

 

If AEON will not cover the OP’s claim, I wouldn’t hesitate to take them to small claims court.

The OP does not say when he notified NCL, only that he purchased new tickets to fly home. If he waited until he got home thinking that insurance would cover all expenses, then he does not qualify for CFAR which requires notification before the ship’s departure.

 

NCL may choose to extend some kind of goodwill compensation, but the OP so far has received the benefits allowed under the terms of the policy.

[Crazy planning mom]

8 hours ago, ollienbertsmum said:

Just booking flights for my trip in May 2023.  This scenario worries me so much.  Flight delays seem so much more common.  
 

Just wondered, would the response from insurance have been different if you had caught up with the ship and spent the last week on board?

Since you are booking your flights now. book them to arrive at least 1 day early.  Your question was a good one.

[Babr]

3 minutes ago, Crazy planning mom said:

Since you are booking your flights now. book them to arrive at least 1 day early.  Your question was a good one.

In the case of NCL insurance, the response would have been the same. The only expenses eligible for reimbursement were those related to Trip Delay. NCL would have paid for air to catch the cruise at the next port. The difference would be that they would have saved most of their trip.
 

Consider buying a third-policy policy that covers Missed Connection or Trip Interruption caused by common carrier. Many people on CC recommend Trip Insurance Store. Call the professionals, tell them your concerns, and let them help you find a policy.

[weltek]

Oh gawd, what a nightmare. I'm sorry I don't have any experience with this, so can't offer any advice. 

If nothing else, please know that you've helped other cruisers be aware of insurance coverage and implications of decisions made in high-stress times like this. 
 

Best of luck recovering more money, seriously. 

 

[RocketMan275]

11 minutes ago, Babr said:

Consider buying a third-policy policy that covers Missed Connection or Trip Interruption caused by common carrier. Many people on CC recommend Trip Insurance Store. Call the professionals, tell them your concerns, and let them help you find a policy.

Good advice.  Also check with  your credit card company.  My chase card would cover up to $10k PP for Missed Connection/Trip Interruption up to the amount charged to the card.  So does my Costco/Citicard.  I use GeoBlue to cover medical expenses, etc.

[ollienbertsmum]

10 hours ago, Crazy planning mom said:

Since you are booking your flights now. book them to arrive at least 1 day early.  Your question was a good one.

I am thinking of two days early.  I can get to Bologna with a direct flight and explore somewhere that has been on my bucket list.  Win win.  

[Crazy planning mom]

4 hours ago, ollienbertsmum said:

I am thinking of two days early.  I can get to Bologna with a direct flight and explore somewhere that has been on my bucket list.  Win win

Yes, that's what we did when flying to Europe.

Europe at least 2 days early.

[graphicguy]

Here…let me walk you through this if it gets to court….

 

Magistrate….”when did you cancel your cruise?”

Guest…”when they offered to fly me to the next port, and I would have missed 2 days of the cruise and had to get two extra nights at a hotel.  I declined!”

Magistrate to the insurance company….”give these nice people 90% of the cruise value as Future Cruise Credit as you promised.  Case dismissed!”

Edited December 3, 2022 by graphicguy

[Babr]

On 12/2/2022 at 5:01 AM, PATRLR said:

To the OP - Wow, heartbreaking story and I am sorry that happened to you.  I am really surprised by the NCL bus saying "no" - just awful.

 

Did you buy the AON insurance from Steve at the trip insurance store?  If so, I am curious what they (Steve/TIS) have to say about why you are only getting $500.   (If you didn't buy it from Steve, why is Steve's name in the picture you posted?)

 

I know that the insurance Steve sold us came with an 800 number to call if problems enroute.  Did yours have similar?

 

Dave bought NCL insurance from the cruise line, not a third-party policy from Steve. You are seeing a screen shot of Dave’s question posted on Steve’ s Q&A forum about insurance. You’ll find the link at the top of the home page for CC boards.

 

Steve has responded. Anyone still curious about the answer can find it there.

[PATRLR]

32 minutes ago, Babr said:

 

Dave bought NCL insurance from the cruise line, not a third-party policy from Steve. You are seeing a screen shot of Dave’s question posted on Steve’ s Q&A forum about insurance. You’ll find the link at the top of the home page for CC boards.

 

Steve has responded. Anyone still curious about the answer can find it there.

Anyone looking for that other thread:  

 

 

[BigWaveDaveAZ]

Hello everyone, my wife and I thank you for all of your input, we greatly appreciate it. 

There are a couple of things I left out because I spent so much time one fingering this post, I apologize for that. What I would like to add is,

 

Through this whole ordeal, from PHX (Sky Harbor Airport) where our AA Flight was delayed, until we decided we would not chase the ship to Charlottetown PEI, we were in contact with NCL the entire time, we were informed to keep all of our receipts, flight, cab fare, food and hotel expense that we would be reimbursed for all expenses incurred trying to get to the cruise on time. I saw somewhere in a reply that the customer service person on the phone really had no idea what we would be reimbursed for, they were just telling us what we wanted to hear at that time, which we now know is absolutely true, she was just doing her job.

 

The second thing I failed to mention (my fault) is, when we woke up in the hotel on Saturday morning, we turned on the The Weather Channel and CNN to find that Hurricane Fiona had hit Charoletteown PEI, Sydny, and Halifax Canada, which were our first three Ports O Call on this Cruise. Power lines were down and streets were flooded in all three cities. Not that this will change anything or any decisions with AON or NCL that they have already made, but after I thought about it, it may be some critical info that could make a difference to readers. So many people that we have told about this experience have told us, someone was watching out for us and there is a reason that we were not on that cruise.

We do have a 15 day Panama Canal Cruise scheduled for April of 2023, at this time we are very hesitant and thinking twice if we really want to give NCL any more of our money. 

 

Thank you again for all your input, my wife and I, along with other readers have learned alot from our experience.

                                                                       Thank you again, BigWaveDaveAZ      

[kitkat343]

I recently read a post from someone who stated that she had been told 3 times that covid tests were not required for her cruise by the phone operators (I think this was RC, not NCL).  Unfortunately, her trip was a transatlantic so she was required to still get a covid test, even though this requirement had been dropped for most cruises and she was denied boarding at the pier after flying all the way to Europe from the US with kids  (the covid requirements were correctly stated on the website, but new cruisers assume they can call a cruise line and receive an accurate answer to their questions)..  I sailed with RC last August, and will sail with NCL soon, and was given totally incorrect information by the phone reps for both cruises.  As an experienced cruiser who is very familiar with cruise critic, I know not to depend upon the phone operators to give me correct information.  But it is really is terrible that new cruisers and people facing emergencies like yourself don't have a reliable source of information to turn to on the phone.  If anyone is hoping to learn something from this (aside from please be very cautious with cruise line airfare, and buy 3rd party insurance instead of NCL insurance) is that  if anything bad happens, try to post on cruise critic where people might be able to help you.  Oh, and also you can download one of the free apps that let you record phone conversations, assuming that is legal in the state you are stranded in.  

 

Absolutely none of this was OPs fault, and if the southwest flight was the fastest alternative I don't think cruise critic could have helped the OP either but I do hope the cruise lines start to train their employees because travelers deserve to have help navigating these kinds of stressful and difficult situations.  I hope you receive a full refund or at least a credit soon.

Edited December 4, 2022 by kitkat343

[RocketMan275]

8 hours ago, BigWaveDaveAZ said:

We do have a 15 day Panama Canal Cruise scheduled for April of 2023, at this time we are very hesitant and thinking twice if we really want to give NCL any more of our money. 

BigWaveDaveAZ      

I think the lesson is:  make your own flight arrangements.  It may cost a bit more but it's the best way to avoid these kinds of disappointments.  BTW, go to any cruise line forum on CC and you will find the same experiences using cruise line flights.  This is isn't unique to NCL.

[graphicguy]

10 hours ago, BigWaveDaveAZ said:

Hello everyone, my wife and I thank you for all of your input, we greatly appreciate it. 

There are a couple of things I left out because I spent so much time one fingering this post, I apologize for that. What I would like to add is,

 

Through this whole ordeal, from PHX (Sky Harbor Airport) where our AA Flight was delayed, until we decided we would not chase the ship to Charlottetown PEI, we were in contact with NCL the entire time, we were informed to keep all of our receipts, flight, cab fare, food and hotel expense that we would be reimbursed for all expenses incurred trying to get to the cruise on time. I saw somewhere in a reply that the customer service person on the phone really had no idea what we would be reimbursed for, they were just telling us what we wanted to hear at that time, which we now know is absolutely true, she was just doing her job.

 

The second thing I failed to mention (my fault) is, when we woke up in the hotel on Saturday morning, we turned on the The Weather Channel and CNN to find that Hurricane Fiona had hit Charoletteown PEI, Sydny, and Halifax Canada, which were our first three Ports O Call on this Cruise. Power lines were down and streets were flooded in all three cities. Not that this will change anything or any decisions with AON or NCL that they have already made, but after I thought about it, it may be some critical info that could make a difference to readers. So many people that we have told about this experience have told us, someone was watching out for us and there is a reason that we were not on that cruise.

We do have a 15 day Panama Canal Cruise scheduled for April of 2023, at this time we are very hesitant and thinking twice if we really want to give NCL any more of our money. 

 

Thank you again for all your input, my wife and I, along with other readers have learned alot from our experience.

                                                                       Thank you again, BigWaveDaveAZ      

Good luck in your pursuits with the insurance company and/or NCL.  Personally, I think you’ve got a good case to claim the 90% FCC for the “Cancel for any Reason” clause.

[graphicguy]

1 hour ago, RocketMan275 said:

I think the lesson is:  make your own flight arrangements.  It may cost a bit more but it's the best way to avoid these kinds of disappointments.  BTW, go to any cruise line forum on CC and you will find the same experiences using cruise line flights.  This is isn't unique to NCL.

Yeah…hind sight being what it is, I want to control my flights to and from the cruise.  Lots of reasons, but this thread is just one of them.

 

I’d rather be “penny foolish and dollar rich” than vice versa.  Then again, I have my own rules flying in day of cruise.  Primary one is no crossing time lines West to East (East to West gives me some time advantages).  Plus, I have to have back up flights that will get me to the pier on time.  Plus, there has to be another airport within 2 hours of the ship’s pier other than the one I’m flying into.  Plus, I only have carryons only…no trips to the luggage carousel.  I get off the plane and go directly to my ride to the pier.

[Babr]

24 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

Good luck in your pursuits with the insurance company and/or NCL.  Personally, I think you’ve got a good case to claim the 90% FCC for the “Cancel for any Reason” clause.

If it is granted, it will be a goodwill gesture on the part of NCL separate from the terms of the BookSafe travel policy.

 

You can’t cancel after the ship has sailed. At that point, you are a no-show.