Rhine water levels 2023 and similar topics

[notamermaid]

It was the plateau at Maxau gauge. Now down to 743cm. Back up tomorrow. The authorities expect flooding that occurs statistically every two to five years. At Maxau this means we will likely see 800cm.

 

notamermaid

 

[actusreus]

We are scheduled for the AB itinerary on the Rhine on Wednesday. Viking just switched us from the Sigrun to the Einar. Guessing they stopped the Sigrun northbound. We don't hit Mannheim until Sunday so could be a last minute decision.

[notamermaid]

20 minutes ago, actusreus said:

We are scheduled for the AB itinerary on the Rhine on Wednesday. Viking just switched us from the Sigrun to the Einar. Guessing they stopped the Sigrun northbound. We don't hit Mannheim until Sunday so could be a last minute decision.

Thanks for the info. The problem with the flooding is that you cannot just swap in the middle of the itinerary that is the Rhine Gorge. The problem is at the Southern end. So it will be interesting to see how that is managed. Bussing from Basel to Breisach can only partially work, meaning now, but not when river traffic is banned further North. Coming from Amsterdam you can go far on your itinerary, hopefully up to Mannheim. Last minute decision quite possibly.

 

Hope all goes well for you and you have a great time.

 

notamermaid

 

[Pushka]

We are currently cruising into Cologne on our way to Basel Sunday. We know there may be flooding issues but decisions aren't being made yet. 

[masonpips]

5 minutes ago, Pushka said:

We are currently cruising into Cologne on our way to Basel Sunday. We know there may be flooding issues but decisions aren't being made yet. 

We are at Rudesheim headed for Basel. They have already said bus from Strasbourg to Basel but last night someone overhead not sure we can get to S either. 

[notamermaid]

3 hours ago, Pushka said:

We are currently cruising into Cologne on our way to Basel Sunday. We know there may be flooding issues but decisions aren't being made yet. 

That makes sense. You really need to see how far you can get and what the most sensible/comfortable/doable logistics will be.

 

Hope you are having a great time in Cologne.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

3 hours ago, masonpips said:

We are at Rudesheim headed for Basel. They have already said bus from Strasbourg to Basel but last night someone overhead not sure we can get to S either. 

Good to hear you have been able to sail the Rhine Gorge and the logistics worked out for you after that tanker had delayed things.

 

Basel will be impossible to reach, true, Strasbourg I am not sure what will happen in the time frame that your ship is looking at. It is a difficult, busy time for cruise directors to find the best solution. I hope everything works out well for you and you can see Strasbourg.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

I needed to confirm what I had suspected may happen when I looked late last night: have found a news report that says the river traffic ban has already been issued from Basel to Kembs and then extended to Kehl (that is the German harbour opposite Strasbourg). Now in the last hour or so the gauge at Maxau climbed to 750cm. It is now at 756cm. River traffic is suspended from Iffezheim lock to Germersheim railway bridge as well.

 

I have taken a screenshot for you of the German article:

It says that the authorities expect the ban to last the whole week.

 

The sections in my screenshot, no sailing here:

 

It is not yet clear what will happen further downstream but the gauges are on flood mark I already (up to and including Cologne) which necessitates adjusted sailing as laid down in the regulations for the waterway. There is still a lot of room in the gauges' graphs till they reach their respective levels for a river traffic ban. We will know more by Thursday.

 

notamermaid

 

[Pushka]

We have a minimum of a ship swap tomorrow. More news tonight. We are just two days in. 

[Pushka]

So from Cologne we are being bussed straight to Strasbourg and will become a four day land tour. We don’t know what happens after tomorrow. 

[notamermaid]

45 minutes ago, Pushka said:

So from Cologne we are being bussed straight to Strasbourg and will become a four day land tour. We don’t know what happens after tomorrow. 

Sorry to hear that. If I may say so - I am puzzled as ships can sail to Koblenz and through the Rhine Gorge. Why would a company want to keep a ship in Cologne? Towns of ports between Cologne and Speyer. But then I am neither a captain nor a cruise director.

 

At this point in time, a river traffic ban is not expected at Worms or Mainz within 48 hours. And not at Koblenz either, which you would get to first, i.e. during the night from Cologne.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[Pushka]

We are in Koblenz now. We are being bussed to a small river port, getting on a small vessel supposedly to see the Rhine valley, getting off after two hours then another four hour bus trip in the dark to Strasbourg where we will be berthed for four nights and long bus trips every day to get to see anything. Then another bus trip to Lucerne. Coming from Australia to see our first European Christmas celebrations it’s not exactly what we were expecting. We will miss Rudesheim completely. And likely Speyer and Mannheim. 🤷‍♀️

[notamermaid]

5 hours ago, Pushka said:

We are in Koblenz now. We are being bussed to a small river port, getting on a small vessel supposedly to see the Rhine valley

Good, you made it to Koblenz. Nice that Viking was able to charter a small vessel and you get to see the Gorge from a ship.

 

I think I get the logistics of the ship swap and long bussing now. Have read about it here before, not a new idea of Viking. It means they are trying to keep a downstream itinerary going without having to cancel it, i.e. from Basel coach to Strasbourg, base for a couple of days or so, coach to Koblenz or Cologne, switch to other ship.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

River levels. Maxau still rising, now at 819cm, may get to 830cm tomorrow. Which appears to confirm to suggestion of the authorities that the river ban will be in place for the rest of the week. If the peak is tomorrow, the river is unlikely to return below 750cm this week.

 

Speyer gauge is rising fast, now at 717cm. A river traffic ban is issued at 730cm.

 

I have read that Lake Constance is at its highest level since (modern) records began.

 

If the situation gets much worse downstream, meaning Mannheim to Mainz, ships from the Main river may not be allowed to enter the Rhine. Which would jeopardize both the Grand European journeys and the ones going West to East and vice versa on the Moselle/Rhine/Main.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Speyer gauge has crossed the threshold of 730cm, that is flood mark II with river traffic ban. It is now at 740cm and still rising.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[notamermaid]

10 hours ago, notamermaid said:

I have read that Lake Constance is at its highest level since (modern) records began.

 

I could not verify this. It sounds a bit odd and I must assume the newspaper report has got something wrong. Official date does not put Lake Constance at a record high.

 

As of now, river levels will rise significantly in the Middle Rhine valley still, but the forecast looks favourable for Koblenz gauge not to reach 650cm, at which river traffic would be suspended there.

 

notamermaid

 

[Pushka]

So we took a long bus trip from the Port opposite Rudesheim, which we won't be going to now, and have ended up in a Viking Longboat car park of multiple Viking ships just sitting in Strasbourg. We are in the middle berth so our outlooks all ways are other longboats. No view. It seems we will be here for the rest of our trip. We are being bussed back to Speyer but after the four hour of bus trips yesterday, another four hours return trip today is not going to happen. Our 7 days of cruising will just be three.   The water levels are very evident. And it won't stop raining. 

Edited December 14, 2023 by Pushka

[notamermaid]

2 hours ago, Pushka said:

So we took a long bus trip from the Port opposite Rudesheim

That is Bingen. A good dock but not used often at all. Bingen is a decent place to spent a couple of hours in or be docked overnight.

2 hours ago, Pushka said:

have ended up in a Viking Longboat car park of multiple Viking ships just sitting in Strasbourg

Sounds like the "Cologne Niehl of the South" (my words, Niehl is the winter harbour for Viking). Not fun and not scenic docking I reckon.

 

Why on earth you cannot be in Rüdesheim I do not understand, did Viking give you time to hop over to Rüdesheim on the ferry? It is right there.

 

I can understand that you do not want to be on another bus for that long to get to Speyer. Strasbourg is fabulous but it would be nice if Viking offered you something else today like - perhaps a one hour drive, or tips for a taxi to... where ever it is scenic in the area.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[Pushka]

1 minute ago, notamermaid said:

That is Bingen. A good dock but not used often at all. Bingen is a decent place to spent a couple of hours in or be docked overnight.

Sounds like the "Cologne Niehl of the South" (my words, Niehl is the winter harbour for Viking). Not fun and not scenic docking I reckon.

 

Why on earth you cannot be in Rüdesheim I do not understand, did Viking give you time to hop over to Rüdesheim on the ferry? It is right there.

 

I can understand that you do not want to be on another bus for that long to get to Speyer. Strasbourg is fabulous but it would be nice if Viking offered you something else today like - perhaps a one hour drive, or tips for a taxi to... where ever it is scenic in the area.

 

notamermaid

 

 

That question about why we couldn't simply sail to Rudesheim on Kara is one we have asked to. I expect its to do with their operations being placed as a priority over our preference to see it.  It was so taunting as the cruise director pointed to it.
 

 

I agree about our location here in Strasbourg too. I think we are in their Winter hibernation area, but crewed. It's not a nice area.  
 

 

[notamermaid]

Maxau gauge is at 840cm and tentatively I would say it has reached the plateau.

 

notamermaid

 

[ural guy]

1 hour ago, Pushka said:

That question about why we couldn't simply sail to Rudesheim on Kara is one we have asked to. I expect its to do with their operations being placed as a priority over our preference to see it.  It was so taunting as the cruise director pointed to it.
 

 

I agree about our location here in Strasbourg too. I think we are in their Winter hibernation area, but crewed. It's not a nice area.  
 

 

We were stuck in Basel for 5 days due to low water in 2018, you have my full sympathy...although you have traveled much further and it sounds like, are in a not great area.

 

We did the bus rides there and back to the planned tour stops, each ride getting longer.  I wound up packing an overnight bag, and staying in Strausburg when the bus left, touring longer there and getting some great night pictures, and catching a train to meet the ship in Koblenz, where everyone embarked after bussing to the Mainz tour (I think it was Mainz).  This gave me time to check out a museum in Koblenz I wouldn't have had time for, and saved me about 9 hours on a bus (it got caught in traffic jam, passengers didn't make it to the ship until 2100, scheduled to be 1800).

 

I share this just to remind you that this is still your vacation, roll with the punches, and to try and make the most of it.  We board in Amsterdam in 9 days, which will be our 5th cruise.  We've had missed ports on 3 of the 4 due to low water.  We're a jinx.

[notamermaid]

58 minutes ago, ural guy said:

We've had missed ports on 3 of the 4 due to low water.  We're a jinx.

Oh noooo. I will personally take buckets of water out of the Rhine and dump them in ponds to make sure the river is low enough for you to sail, as this time round it is a bit, let us say, on the high side.

 

To get some geography in: sailing is still possible for a long stretch of the river, from Amsterdam through the canal, up the Waal/Nederrijn/Rhine, into Germany, to Cologne, to Koblenz, to Mainz and further. At this point in time, river traffic around Speyer is suspended but Worms is still okay, although rising. HSW (here called SHWM II) level for the ban at Worms is a low probability. This means it is certainly possible but not likely to happen. Same goes for the gauges at Mainz, Kaub and Koblenz.

 

An example to show the computer modelling, this is Mainz:

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[notamermaid]

2 hours ago, Pushka said:

That question about why we couldn't simply sail to Rudesheim on Kara is one we have asked to. I expect its to do with their operations being placed as a priority over our preference to see it.  It was so taunting as the cruise director pointed to it.
 

Interesting - sorry to read that.

 

I remember @ural guy 's adventure from 2018. It was a bad year for cruising. This bussing to get you from port to port is a nice idea on the one hand to give you the experience you were looking for. But it also gives a company the chance to claim they took you to all the ports and reduce refunds and financial niceties. Let us say, that is what I have read from no other than "ze big boss" of Viking.

 

But enough of that for now. I hope Strasbourg is utterly splendid and you can enjoy some countryside as well.

 

Not sure that it helps you now but here is a town that from what I have been told by dear people is great and that I think Viking should offer a bus tour to: Gengenbach in Germany with its giant Advent Calendar. It is only 45 minutes from Strasbourg: https://www.stadt-gengenbach.de/kultur-tourismus/tourismus

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Forecast for the Lower Middle Rhine valley and the Lower Rhine is not bad, I have just read. Most of the rain has gone, it will be dryer and the Moselle is not giving the Rhine that much water. So no major problems out of the ordinary are expected past Koblenz. Cologne authorities are taking flood protection measures but this current flood is regarded as standard and should not lead to a river cruise ban:

https://www1.wdr.de/nachrichten/hochwasser-dezember-nrw-100.html

 

Remember: the river floods every year at least once, in a few years it is nothing to speak of, most years it is normal snow melt, in a few years it is more than we as locals are comfortable with.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[rcaruso]

2 hours ago, notamermaid said:

Interesting - sorry to read that.

 

I remember @ural guy 's adventure from 2018. It was a bad year for cruising. This bussing to get you from port to port is a nice idea on the one hand to give you the experience you were looking for. But it also gives a company the chance to claim they took you to all the ports and reduce refunds and financial niceties. Let us say, that is what I have read from no other than "ze big boss" of Viking.

 

But enough of that for now. I hope Strasbourg is utterly splendid and you can enjoy some countryside as well.

 

Not sure that it helps you now but here is a town that from what I have been told by dear people is great and that I think Viking should offer a bus tour to: Gengenbach in Germany with its giant Advent Calendar. It is only 45 minutes from Strasbourg: https://www.stadt-gengenbach.de/kultur-tourismus/tourismus

 

notamermaid

 

I have seen posts that the Christmas Market Viking Rhine cruises do offer an excursion to Gengenback, there has been a lot of reporting of that and some very nice pictures.