Seabourn v Silversea

[TakingFlight]

Lots of good information to be had on the Muse on the Silversea forum. Personally, I have been on one Seabourn cruise and two Silversea expedition cruises so I’m not the one to give you advice. But they are not shy on the Silversea forum!

[gonetravellin]

Hi,

I'm new to this forum but have read intently over the last few years many comments and reviews that have really helped my cruising experiences.

 

This topic has really resonated with me.

 

I'm from the UK and after many years cruising in Europe, Caribbean and Asia thought we would take the plunge and join a Christmas Silversea cruise last December from Sydney on Silver Muse. This would be our first (and probably last) time with Silversea.

 

I was so disappointed from start to finish:

1. Silversea refusing to issue flight tickets early despite me paying the full flight cost early to my Travel Agent. Comparing this to Seabourn whom we are with in Jan next year have issued tickets already and we have booked our plane seats. We are travelling as a family of four and not unreasonable to be sat with my family.....clearly did not work out that way.

2. Embarkation in Sydney was a disaster. All crammed into a building with lack of seats, no available water and just sooo slow. It took nearly two hours to eventually get onto the ship.

3. Totally agree with the comments on the effectiveness of the butler...or rather non effectiveness. On the one occasion we used room service after a full day and late night arrival back to the ship the food took over an hour to turn up and it was cold.

4. We found the food in general awful...limited followed by a shoddy service level.

5. Other guests: I've never been on a ship and witnessed so many other people complaining about service, food and the fact that a port visit was abandoned due to poor weather yet we could see other ships entering port! Only beaten by the very odd attitude of fellow passengers- quite frankly I've never experienced such rudeness and perceived entitlement in a set of people only exacerbated by the crew who seem to ignore new customers and dote on those with multiple trips under their belts. Massive own goal as they are alienating younger customers who have many years of cruising ahead of them.

6. The highlight of the ship had to be the service and pleasure of eating in Hot Rocks. We were greeted and treated as old friends....something the rest of the ship needs to learn from.

7. The low point was arguing with the MD regarding service (or lack of) at breakfast. My wife asked for a cafe latte to be then presented with a glass of milk! The MD seemed to take pleasure in loudly telling me that my wife actually wanted a cappuccino at which point I suggested that maybe he needed to visit Starbucks where no such issue has ever arisen! The remaining week on the cruise then led to very awkward exchanges which we simply had to ignore and rise above.

 

I did raise this with Silversea on my return and given a significant cruise credit however I have to say this is something I won't be using.

 

We are looking forward to our first cruise with Seabourn on Ovation in Jan next year.....I'm hoping for a less stressful and more relaxing time!

[wine-wine-wine]

50 passengers is not a large space on a ship of this size.  Go look at crystal serenity or any Viking ocean ship with multi story windows in forward facing spaces that can accommodate many times that pax count. 

Sorry to offend Silversea fans. To each their own - enjoy! 

Edited July 24, 2023 by wine-wine-wine
Typo

[markandjie]

On 7/17/2023 at 12:56 PM, markham said:

 

If you look at the deck plans of my favorite-by-far Silversea ships, Muse, Moon and Dawn you will see they all have high deck forward Observation Lounge/bar/library/games rooms. Same will be true on Nova and Ray.

 

So you WILL be able to see where you are going after all.

 

Just spent 7 days on the Muse and I have to say the forward views are disappointing relative to any Seabourn ship. You can't get out on deck closer to the water, like you can on all SB ships. And the library itself leaves much to be desired.

 

First, and perhaps most important, the bar was only staffed after 6p. This despite the fact that most sail-aways were at 4 or 4:30. People were constantly trekking out to the pool bar to get drinks and bring them back.

 

Next, the ceilings are relatively low, such that at standing height (I am 5'10") I can't see the horizon. This is partially because of the bulky blinds they have which are a bit of an eye-sore as they were never all pulled up to the same level cleanly. Photo taken from eye level:

 

About a third of the space doesn't have low chairs but rather high-top tables with stools. This limits visibility from these seats, which again take up a good chunk of the limited real estate:

 

When seated, even in the prime spot right at the center, there is a minor obstruction immediately in your sight line. Just another indicator that sight lines are absolutely an afterthought.

 

There were several special events held up there (returning cruisers, a Tauck event, a back pain seminar) and when they would set up (hours and hours early!) for those events they would turn all the chairs to be inward facing! What's the point of an Alaskan cruise if not to SEE Alaska??!?!?

 

 

 

Finally, there is only a single stair to the rooftop observation deck, so at peak whale spotting times this became very congested. On Seabourn ships there are always access doors to the outside on both sides.

 

 

 

[markandjie]

On 7/23/2023 at 4:34 AM, gonetravellin said:

We found the food in general awful...limited followed by a shoddy service level.

5. Other guests: I've never been on a ship and witnessed so many other people complaining about service, food

 

This was our experience as well on the Muse this past week. With relatively few exceptions service on the ship was a disappointment. It felt very much like they had poorly trained and perhaps newly hired staff, not dissimilar to (though worse than) Encore last year. I would expect better on all lines now that we're yet further from the COVID shutdown. I can't help but wonder whether the launch of the Silver Nova has strained their staffing, though the ship was fully staffed, with over 400 on board.

 

• Our butler, Nelson, was outstanding. He served us cavier and canapes each evening around 4:30, whether we were in our room or in the Library on 11.
• The one night we tried Indochine the person who seated us did not pull the chair for my wife, our server never greeted us nor proactively took our drink order, and she had very little understanding of the menu. It was a terrible dining experience.
• Our first night in Atlantide our server was curt and perfunctory, showing little personality. When my wife sent back the ahi tuna for being over-cooked it took a while for it to come back and he just dropped it off without checking to see if this time it was better (spoiler: it was not). He told us the manager would come speak to us and that didn't happen, until he chased after us as we were ascending the stairs. Said he meant to come by our table but "I forgot." Seriously.
• We had a reservation for the Grill that was inexplicably cancelled without checking with us. When we worked to get in regardless the Grill manager made sure to point out that we did not have a reservation. Only once we pushed back, showing him the confirmation message we originally received did he share that he had a cancellation and could seat us. Good grief man, why didn't you just lead with that? Even worse, by the end of our meal we counted 5 tables that went unused for the evening!!!
• At one point the sommelier at La Terraza (during lunch) asked if we wanted something to drink. We asked for sparkling water, as no one had taken our order (the waiter for our section had followed us to our table when we came in, never spoke to us, then walked away and did not return). The sommelier responded "Sparking water is not a bar drink" before reluctantly agreeing to get it for us.
• It wasn't all bad, Marlon in the Grill was an excellent waiter and Jeffrey in the Arts Cafe was an absolute delight, we had a very enjoyable meal in Silver Note, and our second dinner at Atlantide was significantly better from a service perspective. But hard to really appreciate those islands of excellence when you're drowning in a sea of bad service.

[highplanesdrifters]

19 hours ago, markandjie said:

 

Just spent 7 days on the Muse and I have to say the forward views are disappointing relative to any Seabourn ship. You can't get out on deck closer to the water, like you can on all SB ships. And the library itself leaves much to be desired.

 

First, and perhaps most important, the bar was only staffed after 6p. This despite the fact that most sail-aways were at 4 or 4:30. People were constantly trekking out to the pool bar to get drinks and bring them back.

 

Next, the ceilings are relatively low, such that at standing height (I am 5'10") I can't see the horizon. This is partially because of the bulky blinds they have which are a bit of an eye-sore as they were never all pulled up to the same level cleanly. Photo taken from eye level:

 

About a third of the space doesn't have low chairs but rather high-top tables with stools. This limits visibility from these seats, which again take up a good chunk of the limited real estate:

 

When seated, even in the prime spot right at the center, there is a minor obstruction immediately in your sight line. Just another indicator that sight lines are absolutely an afterthought.

 

There were several special events held up there (returning cruisers, a Tauck event, a back pain seminar) and when they would set up (hours and hours early!) for those events they would turn all the chairs to be inward facing! What's the point of an Alaskan cruise if not to SEE Alaska??!?!?

 

 

 

Finally, there is only a single stair to the rooftop observation deck, so at peak whale spotting times this became very congested. On Seabourn ships there are always access doors to the outside on both sides.

 

 

 

Thanks for the photos and report. I completely concur with your comments. I was not a fan of the Muse. The obs/library is cramped, mediocre viewing, access to outside limited, and low ceilings.  The low ceilings and cramped feel in most of the restaurants was also a negative.  Nothing luxury about the  spaces, IMHO. However, the pizza was top notch.

[Vallesan]

Really interesting thread!

So objective.

It just shows that there really are ‘different horses for different courses’.

We sailed on the Encore in 2018, Singapore to Dubai, and it was amazing. So, we booked a cruise for 2019 but unfortunately had to cancel. 
Then of course came the ‘lost years’.

We sailed SS in June on the Dawn and loved it …. amazing butler, lovely cosmopolitan travelling companions (very important for any cruise for us), good food. Maybe an odd niggle but then what in life is perfect?
So, due to board Encore again in a few weeks. I’m really interested to see how well it has stood up to the last few years and how it compares to our very recent Silversea trip.

At the moment it’s difficult for me to choose between the two.

Maybe after this next trip I will come down one way of the other although, my guess is, that itinerary at specific times will win us over at the end if the day.

 

 

[fdnycruiser]

Forget the Muse. Go look at the pictures of the Silver Nova from the shakedown cruise, on the Silversea forum. Spectacular! 

[highplanesdrifters]

16 hours ago, fdnycruiser said:

Forget the Muse. Go look at the pictures of the Silver Nova from the shakedown cruise, on the Silversea forum. Spectacular! 

It's looking pretty sweet!

[bitob]

On 7/12/2023 at 8:42 AM, SLSD said:

You make it sound easy Markham.  

 

What about the bar situation on the newer SS ships?  Is there anything to compare to the Obs Bar on SB?  Where do you hang out in the evening?  Is it a ghost town?  Is the clientele even more elderly than SB?  I remember you saying it is like being a fine hotel.  I'm sure that now that you are a regular you know quite a few people who sail SS.  Has that made a difference in terms of the social atmosphere?

I have sailed both Ss and Seabourn and like both for different reasons.  I see no difference in the clientele.

[bitob]

On 8/11/2023 at 8:50 AM, Vallesan said:

Really interesting thread!

So objective.

It just shows that there really are ‘different horses for different courses’.

We sailed on the Encore in 2018, Singapore to Dubai, and it was amazing. So, we booked a cruise for 2019 but unfortunately had to cancel. 
Then of course came the ‘lost years’.

We sailed SS in June on the Dawn and loved it …. amazing butler, lovely cosmopolitan travelling companions (very important for any cruise for us), good food. Maybe an odd niggle but then what in life is perfect?
So, due to board Encore again in a few weeks. I’m really interested to see how well it has stood up to the last few years and how it compares to our very recent Silversea trip.

At the moment it’s difficult for me to choose between the two.

Maybe after this next trip I will come down one way of the other although, my guess is, that itinerary at specific times will win us over at the end if the day.

 

 

My Seabourn Encore cruise in March was fabulous -- and up to that time I liked Seabourn but did not love it.  Now I love it.  I saw major improvements in the food, service and entertainment (not that it was bad before).  Just booked another Seabourn cruise.

[Vallesan]

On 8/11/2023 at 10:44 PM, fdnycruiser said:

Forget the Muse. Go look at the pictures of the Silver Nova from the shakedown cruise, on the Silversea forum. Spectacular! 

I’ve seen all the photos/videos and I have to say she doesn’t really appeal to me! Reminds me a little of the Viking ships!
Just my opinion and I could very well be wrong.

Once she’s in full service the passengers views will  tell us more.

Who knows she might just be the best thing since sliced bread!

[commodoredave]

I still can't decide which of Seabourn and Silversea I like best, so I've booked additional cruises with both over the next 6 months. If I haven't decided after that which one I like best, I'm going to book them both again and keeping doing so until I decide. I know this kind of self-sacrifice is not common, but I want to do a thorough job of choosing the winner even it it takes me another 10 years.

[SLSD]

19 minutes ago, commodoredave said:

I still can't decide which of Seabourn and Silversea I like best, so I've booked additional cruises with both over the next 6 months. If I haven't decided after that which one I like best, I'm going to book them both again and keeping doing so until I decide. I know this kind of self-sacrifice is not common, but I want to do a thorough job of choosing the winner even it it takes me another 10 years.

I totally commend your process!

[highplanesdrifters]

19 hours ago, commodoredave said:

I still can't decide which of Seabourn and Silversea I like best, so I've booked additional cruises with both over the next 6 months. If I haven't decided after that which one I like best, I'm going to book them both again and keeping doing so until I decide. I know this kind of self-sacrifice is not common, but I want to do a thorough job of choosing the winner even it it takes me another 10 years.

Thanks for doing the hard work.  Public service is never fully appreciated. 😁

[commodoredave]

32 minutes ago, highplanesdrifters said:

Thanks for doing the hard work.  Public service is never fully appreciated. 😁

Is there some kind of government grant available for this kind of public service?

[ak1004]

21 hours ago, commodoredave said:

I still can't decide which of Seabourn and Silversea I like best, so I've booked additional cruises with both over the next 6 months. If I haven't decided after that which one I like best, I'm going to book them both again and keeping doing so until I decide. I know this kind of self-sacrifice is not common, but I want to do a thorough job of choosing the winner even it it takes me another 10 years.

 

I have a solution for you: keep sailing on both! Why to decide? I'm pretty sure they are both fabulous..

[Vallesan]

21 hours ago, commodoredave said:

I still can't decide which of Seabourn and Silversea I like best, so I've booked additional cruises with both over the next 6 months. If I haven't decided after that which one I like best, I'm going to book them both again and keeping doing so until I decide. I know this kind of self-sacrifice is not common, but I want to do a thorough job of choosing the winner even it it takes me another 10 years.

I wonder if there are  ‘mystery cruisers’ like there are mystery shoppers? If so sign me up to be a ‘mystery cruiser’ straight away …..but only for the luxury lines!!

[Utopia1]

I've sailed Silversea, Crystal, and Seabourn extensively.  The itinerary is important-- but in choosing the line the ambiance and comfort is most important for me .  Every line has its own "personality" and comfort zone- and presently Seabourn is the right fit for me-- despite the recent negative changes in the line.

I have a lot of booked Seabourn cruising in front of me--  If I continue to see negative changes there is always another luxury ship in the sea. 

[highplanesdrifters]

21 hours ago, commodoredave said:

Is there some kind of government grant available for this kind of public service?

Yes, but you have to give them kickbacks to get it. 😃

[SLSD]

I have noticed that Virtuoso at their annual conference has awarded Silversea their top accolades.  

[markham]

I don’t know enough about how these decisions/judgments are made but I have to believe that Silversea gets high marks for 2 reasons:

 

Firstly, despite having a set of older ships which in all likelihood suit many of Silversea’s veteran customers, it is the verve and upgraded facilities deriving from the Muse, Moon, Dawn, and now Endeavour and Nova and soon Ray that make people excited. Incredible options in the layouts and food for starters; and

 

Secondly, how Seabourn has drifted and not for the best. The classic ships have suffered over the past few years so many cutbacks that it is not necessarily considered “luxury”. This needs to be - and apparently is- being addressed by the new president. And, apart from the newly launched expedition ship Pursuit and year old Venture, Seabourn ships are getting old and reveal their design limitations. No new classic ships to get excited about.

 

BTW, the Regent story is more like that of Silversea. Reportedly they have impressive and new ships that sustain the brand. And they can.

 

Why not check out their websites to see.

 

Happy and healthy sailing!

[caviarforme]

I am UK based and as far as I know we don not have \Virtuoso.  I agree we do not know how the award was assessed but in principle are cruise agents the best to measure? Have they really experienced each brand? Are they influenced by commission rates etc etc etc

 

Maybe their should be annual Cruise Critic awards voted by real "cruisers" from an international forum?

[Isklaar]

2 hours ago, caviarforme said:

I am UK based and as far as I know we don not have \Virtuoso.  I agree we do not know how the award was assessed but in principle are cruise agents the best to measure? Have they really experienced each brand? Are they influenced by commission rates etc etc etc

 

Maybe their should be annual Cruise Critic awards voted by real "cruisers" from an international forum?

 

We do have access to Virtuoso in the UK. 

[caviarforme]

18 minutes ago, Isklaar said:

 

We do have access to Virtuoso in the UK. 

I was not aware - I may try them against my regular agent.