Response from Princess to email re changes

[startedwithamouse]

4 minutes ago, Cruise Raider said:

It comes to mind that the charge for room service has brought on by passengers themselves.  Or, orders one at a time not even thinking of the extra stress it puts on the system.  
While discussing this topic onboard with another passenger that was quite disappointed with the mere $5 charge, she noted that used to be able to just call room service and order items that aren’t on the menu.  I want and omelet with extra this, extra that!  This requires extra help for “special orders” which everyone seems to think is so very acceptable.  Passengers seem to say ‘jump’ and have heard back, ‘how high?’.  I’ve seen it time and time again .. even here on cruise critic.  They want spaghetti and it isn’t on the menu but someone has to take the time to prepare spaghetti for those guests that just think every rule should be bent for them … multiply that by 3000+ or even by 1000.  I get why the changes were implemented.  
 

And these aren't new cruisers. It's the We get escargot every night!  They make us our favorite dish _____. It's the ones who have been taking advantage of the system for years. Writing in special things on room service. Yelling at the room service operator, demanding items not on the menu.  Albeit, Princess was letting them do this. Like the cruiser who wanted a steak because they didn't like what was on the menu? Princess responded with having a "Make the evening extra special" section. 

[Guest ldtr]

14 minutes ago, B_A_H said:

Nothing @caribill, absolutely nothing.

 

Let me all give you some insight in to my cynicism.  I work for one of the major hotel companies.  I've lost track of the number of customer-unfriendly "enhancements" we've put in place since the pandemic.  Each accompanying public communication is hollowly swathed in the benefit to the customer.

 

Hard truth.  There is no customer benefit.  And the product and/or service degradation is solely to provide additional profit. Everything we degraded was then degraded by competitors.  If a competitor degrading something first we quickly followed. 

 

The airlines, hotel companies, and cruise lines are coming out of a cycle in which they all lost billions. Demand has coming roaring back and they're recouping their losses.  Maybe in a few years the dynamic will change as it has in past cycles.  Then with less demand or too much supply suppliers will start offering benefits for competitive differentiation.  That never works for long though because competitors match it.  The good news is that the raising of the bar will benefit the market.

 

Those of you harping on what customer service used to be like can just stop.  It's gone, at least in the cycle we're in.  This cycle is purely about money.  And none of these customer-unfriendly decisions are made without clear knowledge of their negative impact to loyalty and customer service. 

 

 

If you ask the heads of the major hotel chains, they will tell you that their customers are not the people that stay in the hotels, but are instead the owners of the hotels that sign up with them under their various brands.

 

I have seen far higher price increases and more service reductions in various hotel brands than I have from the cruise lines.

Edited August 20, 2023 by ldtr

[caribill]

5 minutes ago, Cruise Raider said:

It comes to mind that the charge for room service has brought on by passengers themselves.  Or, orders one at a time not even thinking of the extra stress it puts on the system.  
While discussing this topic onboard with another passenger that was quite disappointed with the mere $5 charge, she noted that used to be able to just call room service and order items that aren’t on the menu.  I want and omelet with extra this, extra that!  This requires extra help for “special orders” which everyone seems to think is so very acceptable.  .....  I get why the changes were implemented.  
 

 

The high demand for room service is not from people picking up the phone and ordering something.

 

The high demand is from Princess implementing the app promising easy ordering and delivery to anywhere you are on the ship. 

 

Princess did not increase the staff numbers in order to cope with the demand the app added to room service orders. 

 

Princess over promised what could be provided and instituted a charge (activiation fee if ordered via app, everytime fee if using phone).

 

Do not blame the passengers. Blame Princess for not staffing up to provide what they said they would.

[kywildcatfanone]

6 minutes ago, Cruise Raider said:

 Bravo 👏 

They would much rather not have those that are chronic complainers or super demanding without bringing in any additional revenue!  What business wouldn’t?  

So, standard fare passengers and minimal onboard spenders are chronic complainers and super demanding?

 

I would think the opposite.

[SCX22]

10 minutes ago, ldtr said:

Not quite.  They would like to reduce the number of passengers that purchase basic fare only and do minimal onboard spending.  Either by getting them to spend more on board (preferably by purchasing a package) or to stop booking such that their rooms can be booke by those that are willing to spend more on board.  Their exact goal for the percentage change is what is unknown.  

Age does not matter if you generate sufficient revenue.

 

There are way too many Platinums/Elites that make up the Captain's Circle program.  Most of these Platinum/Elites are older in age (pensioners or about to be pensioners).  Just look at the attendance at P/E events.  These people have been spoiled by Princess and now that Princess is changing it up, they are the first to vent/rant/complain.  This is part of the reason why Princess is attempting to change their demographic.

[Guest ldtr]

20 minutes ago, Cruise Raider said:

It comes to mind that the charge for room service has brought on by passengers themselves.  Or, orders one at a time not even thinking of the extra stress it puts on the system.  
While discussing this topic onboard with another passenger that was quite disappointed with the mere $5 charge, she noted that used to be able to just call room service and order items that aren’t on the menu.  I want and omelet with extra this, extra that!  This requires extra help for “special orders” which everyone seems to think is so very acceptable.  Passengers seem to say ‘jump’ and have heard back, ‘how high?’.  I’ve seen it time and time again .. even here on cruise critic.  They want spaghetti and it isn’t on the menu but someone has to take the time to prepare spaghetti for those guests that just think every rule should be bent for them … multiply that by 3000+ or even by 1000.  I get why the changes were implemented.  
 

I think the room service change was more due to their competition charging more for the same thing so why not with the secondary benefit of reducing calls and directing more requests that do occur to the App. I have seen more issues just getting RS on the phone then in delivery of what was ordered.  Though the App does have the secondary benefit on only allowing the displayed set of options to be ordered.

Edited August 20, 2023 by ldtr

[kywildcatfanone]

24 minutes ago, B_A_H said:

Nothing @caribill, absolutely nothing.

 

Let me all give you some insight in to my cynicism.  I work for one of the major hotel companies.  I've lost track of the number of customer-unfriendly "enhancements" we've put in place since the pandemic.  Each accompanying public communication is hollowly swathed in the benefit to the customer.

 

Hard truth.  There is no customer benefit.  And the product and/or service degradation is solely to provide additional profit. Everything we degraded was then degraded by competitors.  If a competitor degrading something first we quickly followed. 

 

The airlines, hotel companies, and cruise lines are coming out of a cycle in which they all lost billions. Demand has coming roaring back and they're recouping their losses.  Maybe in a few years the dynamic will change as it has in past cycles.  Then with less demand or too much supply suppliers will start offering benefits for competitive differentiation.  That never works for long though because competitors match it.  The good news is that the raising of the bar will benefit the market.

 

Those of you harping on what customer service used to be like can just stop.  It's gone, at least in the cycle we're in.  This cycle is purely about money.  And none of these customer-unfriendly decisions are made without clear knowledge of their negative impact to loyalty and customer service. 

 

 

Well said.  As said many times in this thread and others.  The continued cutbacks and removal of loyalty benefits are all about trying to weed out low revenue loyal customers and replace them with customers who will spend unabashedly on vacation.

 

I do feel badly though for th passenger services people who will deal with angry customers who only find out about these changes once onboard.

[Guest ldtr]

4 minutes ago, SCX22 said:

 

There are way too many Platinums/Elites that make up the Captain's Circle program.  Most of these Platinum/Elites are older in age (pensioners or about to be pensioners).  Just look at the attendance at P/E events.  These people have been spoiled by Princess and now that Princess is changing it up, they are the first to vent/rant/complain.  This is part of the reason why Princess is attempting to change their demographic.

Not if they spend money.  Princess is perfectly happy to have them and everyone else if they meet their revenue goals.

[SCX22]

7 minutes ago, ldtr said:

Not if they spend money.  Princess is perfectly happy to have them and everyone else if they meet their revenue goals.

 

Judging by the vents/rants/complaining on this board, it sounds like they aren't willing to spend money.

Edited August 20, 2023 by SCX22

[Guest ldtr]

10 minutes ago, SCX22 said:

 

Judging by the vents/rants/complaining on this board, it sounds like they aren't willing to spend money.

Now that is a different matter.  I would put myself firmly in the camp of those that book basic fare does not spend much on board, maximize the use of my Elite benefits and the various forms of OBC.  Do book ship excursions but a lot of those are paid for by OBC.  Basically our out of pocket per day average onboard spend is between $25-30 per day including recommend gratuities.

 

The price increase Princess has made is a drop in the bucket compared to those put in place by hotels and tour companies.

[tothemall&beyond]

8 hours ago, rosevew said:

 

[Cruise Raider]

33 minutes ago, startedwithamouse said:Albeit, Princess was letting them do this. Like the cruiser who wanted a steak because they didn't like what was on the menu? Princess responded with having a "Make the evening extra special" section. 

 Although, probably with reluctance as they didn’t want to get any complaints!  I am pretty sure they won’t miss this type of passenger being onboard!  Seriously, I don’t think they will have any trouble if a revenue producing passenger takes their place. 

[SCX22]

1 minute ago, ldtr said:

The price increase Princess has made is a drop in the bucket compared to those put in place by hotels and tour companies.

 

Glad you're of a person of reason!  Unfortunately many don't see it this way. 

[Guest ldtr]

28 minutes ago, SCX22 said:

 

There are way too many Platinums/Elites that make up the Captain's Circle program.  Most of these Platinum/Elites are older in age (pensioners or about to be pensioners).  Just look at the attendance at P/E events.  These people have been spoiled by Princess and now that Princess is changing it up, they are the first to vent/rant/complain.  This is part of the reason why Princess is attempting to change their demographic.

It was interesting being on a recent Alaska cruise on Majestic where 75% of the passengers were new to Princess.  There was only 3% Elite.  The cut off from most traveled was 180 days.

 

Was quite refreshing hearing passengers that were excited and found the cruise wonderful, compared to the TA a few weeks earlier that was 45% Elite and the discussions were more about what has been cut and how bad things have gotten.  It seemed just fine to us.

[Guest ldtr]

deleted

Edited August 20, 2023 by ldtr

[caribill]

3 hours ago, Steelers36 said:

It could be made better, but guests can get a TD experience on request.

The TD experience I used to have:

 

a) Princess scheduled the time to mesh with the Princess Theater schedule. (I did not have to guess many months in advance what time to schedule dinner to be able to make a show. With DMW, if I wait until boarding when the show times are known, dining reservations are usually not available at that popular appropriate time.)

 

b) On the first evening we were seated with four to six strangers who also wanted to eat at that time every evening. They often became friends we kept in touch with after the cruise. (With DMW, there is no guarantee that the strangers on the first night want to eat at that time every night.)

 

c) The table was always ready for us at the designated time. (With DMW there is no assurance that a table, any table, is available at the time you reserved.) 

 

d) Always had the same table and servers for the entire cruise. Knowing where the table was, could just walk in at the proper time each evening. (With DMW must wait in line to see if a table is available at the reserved time, much less with the servers you prefer. When we asked the first evening to have the same table at that time for the rest of the cruise, we were told it would not be possible because someone else had already reserved it.) 

 

So, no, in our experience there is no way to get the TD experience with DMW.

[tothemall&beyond]

8 hours ago, rosevew said:

What a total bunch of c**p Princess is shoveling. Do they really take us for such fools and patsies? The corporate response is actually insulting. Princess is not the only game in town for people who want to travel and explore the world. We've been very loyal to Princess for the past 23 years, only cruising on other lines twice in that entire span of time, but they clearly no longer value nor deserve that loyalty. 

Edited August 20, 2023 by tothemall&beyond

[SCX22]

Just now, tothemall&beyond said:

What a total bunch of c**p Princess is shoveling. Do they really take us for such fools and patsies? The corporate response is actually insulting. Princess is not the only game in town for people who want to travel and explore the world. We've been very loyal to Princess for the past 23 years, only cruising on other lines twice in that entire span of time, but they clearly no longer value or deserve that loyalty. 

 

All of the major mass market cruise lines have done/are doing the same thing.  Unless you're going to a niche up market cruise line, which costs more, you'll be met with the same charges.  Each to their own.

[caribill]

38 minutes ago, SCX22 said:

 

There are way too many Platinums/Elites that make up the Captain's Circle program.  Most of these Platinum/Elites are older in age (pensioners or about to be pensioners).  Just look at the attendance at P/E events.  These people have been spoiled by Princess and now that Princess is changing it up, they are the first to vent/rant/complain.  This is part of the reason why Princess is attempting to change their demographic.

 

Right,

 

Princess can easily replace those old folk with young families who are anxious to cruise durtng September, October, January and other months that school is in session,

 

They can also replace those old folk with young people who have enough time off from work to take those multi-week cruises such as the ones around South America.

[Guest ldtr]

5 minutes ago, SCX22 said:

 

Glad you're of a person of reason!  Unfortunately many don't see it this way. 

We also spend 120 to 150 days each year traveling on sea and land so we get to see a lot of the different cruise lines, as well as land based options.  Will be on 7 different cruise lines in the next 12 months.  From a 50 passenger ship to a 5000 passenger ship.

[kywildcatfanone]

56 minutes ago, SCX22 said:

 

Let's face it...Princess wants the pensioners out.

No, they want people like me out.  A "pensioner" who spends gobs of money is very welcome.

[Guest ldtr]

3 minutes ago, tothemall&beyond said:

What a total bunch of c**p Princess is shoveling. Do they really take us for such fools and patsies? The corporate response is actually insulting. Princess is not the only game in town for people who want to travel and explore the world. We've been very loyal to Princess for the past 23 years, only cruising on other lines twice in that entire span of time, but they clearly no longer value or deserve that loyalty. 

Maybe your mistake was only sailing on one line.  If you sailed on more you see what the entire industry is doing.

[Cruise Raider]

35 minutes ago, caribill said:

 

The high demand for room service is not from people picking up the phone and ordering something.

 

The high demand is from Princess implementing the app promising easy ordering and delivery to anywhere you are on the ship. 

 

Princess did not increase the staff numbers in order to cope with the demand the app added to room service orders. 

 

Princess over promised what could be provided and instituted a charge (activiation fee if ordered via app, everytime fee if using phone).

 

Do not blame the passengers. Blame Princess for not staffing up to provide what they said they would.

 
You really haven’t given me a response to change my mind, though.  The procedure was implemented to order anything, including items off the beverage package, initially during the restart to keep CoVid at bay.  
But, it is overwhelmed the staff.  Can you imagine the outrage if that service was discontinued?  I can tell you, I think it would be worse that the massive complaints they are encountering due to the very small charge we are seeing now.  They really couldn’t hire another 24 staff members to handle the increase in orders once capacity was raised to 100%!  That may be an arbitrary number but I bet it is not far off the mark!  
 

[Guest ldtr]

2 minutes ago, caribill said:

 

Right,

 

Princess can easily replace those old folk with young families who are anxious to cruise durtng September, October, January and other months that school is in session,

No but they can replace them with people from other lines or are new to cruising.  Those from other lines are used to packages and paying higher on board spend amount.

[Steelers36]

1 hour ago, SCX22 said:

 

The article below makes it seem like Accenture played a large role.

 

https://www.travelpulse.com/news/cruise/carnival-corporation-taps-accenture-as-premier-innovation-partner

It is quite possible.  It's been a long time, so I don't recall all of the details from back then (pre-Covid).  This is an operative paragraph:

 

One of the key benefits for guests starts before they even board the ship. Using the OceanReady digital experience, MedallionClass guests can complete 95 percent of boarding steps on mobile devices before arrival. This reduces wait time by more than 90 percent, shortening to about 30-60 seconds a process that used to take 15-20 minutes.

 

I don't recall check-in taking anything like 15-20 minutes pre-Medallion.  Even if they were involved, it seems to have been almost an after-thought compared to the rest of it (infrastructure and on-board experience).  Who knows who managed what at this point - and it doesn't really matter anymore, does it now?  Thanks.