Cruising doing well.

[Interestedcruisefan]

38 minutes ago, majortom10 said:

It seems to me with your relative cruise inexperience a lot of your information is just guess work without personal knowledge. Having done over 60 cruises you are assuming a lot and are totally wrong. With regards to Arvia/Iona having bigger dance troupes and comparing it to a Britannia Staycation is completely wrong. Having cruised on all P&Os current ships since 2000 the dance troupes are no bigger on normal cruises and not staycation. There 13 on our recent Arvia cruise and was no bigger than all the other ships.

I did say myself it was a staycation so unfair comparison for Brittania where the quality was noticeably poor. I try to be fair.

 

I do know and believe the entertainment is excellent though on the big ships and at least on a par with RCL and P and O we've enjoyed before. Carnival had comedy clubs and a piano bar that were  great and P and O don't have, so it's not all better. 

 

But  the big  ships have 710 club which IMO surpasses anything I've seen on RCL, Carnival, P and O on previous cruises and is a struggle to find anything like it on land let alone a cruise 

 

Also limelight club itself on P and O is relatively  knew and the success of that  speaks for itself 

 

The addition of lImelight club and 710 club are undoubtedly hugely successful additions to P and O ships that never even existed before and only on recent cruises for you yourself Major Tom are they even entertainment options for you to now be able to try for the first time alongside theatre and pianists etc

 

You don't have to enjoy it of course but at least they are there to try 

 

And the fact  they are  full all cruise shows many people do enjoy them and value them. 

 

So entertainment for me has moved forward a notch just because of those additions that  smaller ships dont have

 

We now have cinemas as common place. Escape rooms which are popular in every town and city across the UK (with adults and kids)

 

It's impossible to argue entertainment options haven't increased significantly over the course of time on cruise ships in general to what we now have available

 

People don't need to like the skydome entertainment themselves either (including me) to at least accept  its another option that wasnt there before that does appeal to some. And more likely the younger demographics as its more modern stuff out there in the evenings at least. And loud by the pool during the day. But if you don't like it then do what  I do and leave it to the ones that do like it.

 

Whilst the bigger ships stil offer traditional quizzes and bingo and gameshow type entertainment for those that enjoy that as well

 

(You can of course argue they don't make entertainers like Roy Walker and Bernie Flint any more of course!)

 

And I wouldn't disagree

 

 

Edited October 2, 2023 by Interestedcruisefan

[Interestedcruisefan]

19 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

You cannot state that - you really don't know. You are speaking purely on price and very many don't book just on price.

 

My 35 year old friends booked Celebrity for their first cruise with their boys. They've just booked two more, yes they are fly cruising as they want to introduce the boys to some cultural spots in Europe with higher quality and P&O don't offer much of that nowadays, certainly not on Arvia.  Then the Caribbean in November, again another Celebrity.  My 30 year old niece has sailed RCI with her parents when she was a child, again her and her partner are now cruising as a couple and their go to company is RCI as it's a brand she knows.  Overall the cost is what they are prepared to pay for a brand they know and trust.  They looked at Arvia and Iona as their parents have sailed P&O and decided not for them as they want a better itinerary.

 

So yes, the other lines are getting new cruisers.  Some time ago Moley stated the Ant and Dec generation were P&O's target audience and they most certainly are not 16-24!

 

You are forgetting not all families want a tiny cheap inside cabin, those with more disposable income who stay in the likes of TUI Blu family resorts do not pay bargain basement prices. They want comfort over cost and hence the big expansion of that side of TUI's business which is their fastest growth area since the pandemic and ironically is helping drive the lack of aircraft for TUI to charter.

The ones who want to pay extra can pay double or treble for balcony and deluxe cabins of course on P and O as well as elsewhere of course

 

But very very many do book on price. Especially nowadays MB? 

 

Cruising is now becoming affordable to lots more people than ten, twenty or thirty years ago

 

Whilst it can still be  expensive for those who want to pay more still?

 

Surely thats a good thing

 

The choice is there now for all budgets?

 

Why cruising is doing well?

 

 

[Megabear2]

8 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

The ones who want to pay extra can pay double or treble for balcony and deluxe cabins of course on P and O as well as elsewhere of course

 

But very very many do book on price. Especially nowadays MB? 

 

Cruising is now becoming affordable to lots more people than ten, twenty or thirty years ago

 

Whilst it can still be  expensive for those who want to pay more still?

 

Surely thats a good thing

 

The choice is there now for all budgets?

 

Why cruising is doing well?

 

 

I'm happy to say some book on price but your constant bulldozing of alternative opinions to yours - and I don't mean me before anyone screams at me - is at serious risk of undermining any alternative opinion and as a result people will just stop posting and leave the conversation.  

[majortom10]

2 hours ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

 

What I can't see happening is younger demographic cruisers picking Celebrity or Princess for their first cruise as the pricing and options on board won't be as enticing to someone who is new to cruising?

 

Once again you are repeating your own belief. Princess is a mostly American cruise line which is very popular with families from US and they travel to Alaska, Far East, Caribbean and the Med. They are just as popular in America as P&O are in UK and many younger people travel on them because there patents did so just as high in first time cruiser's. The Med cruises with Princess are majority UK passengers many who have moved across from P&O because they are disgruntled with them. Americans if they want to go to Med generally fly to Barcelona so they are not suffering inclement weather and BoB. The round Britain cruises are very popular with Americans and not so UK cruiser's. So you are again wrong in basing that youngsters don't want to go to Princess in general, perhaps so with UK cruiser's but not so American youngsters and families. The elephant in the room which I think P&O are trying is to lure youngsters away from Royal Caribbean and Norwegian cruise lines and cruise with them. But even with Arvia a paltry rope experience, a mini golf and Escape Room and even less on Iona is a poor example of what is available with Royal Caribbean.

 

[majortom10]

19 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

The ones who want to pay extra can pay double or treble for balcony and deluxe cabins of course on P and O as well as elsewhere of course

 

But very very many do book on price. Especially nowadays MB? 

 

 

 

 

That is total nonsense because not all new cruiser's to P&O are only booking Saver price inside cabins. They might book Saver price which is their choice but many wouldn't step foot on any cruise ship unless in at least a balcony.

[majortom10]

I have a neighbour whose son has recently started cruising last 2-3 yrs with his wife both in late 20s. They asked my advice knowing I have done a lot of cruising about cruising in general and when I suggested P&O they laughed. They have been with Virgin since 3 times and in the equivalent of a suite so proves not all Brits want Saver Inside cabins.

[Chrish2]

On 10/1/2023 at 11:26 AM, daiB said:

“On the European front, occupancy came in better than anticipated for Costa and AIDA, with both brands hitting 119 percent occupancy in August. Not to be outdone, P&O Cruises achieved its highest occupancy in over a decade,” said Josh Weinstein, president and CEO, on the company’s third quarter earnings call.

 

The quote seems a little unclear. Does P&O Cruises have the highest occupancy it has had over the last 10 years for its entire fleet or just for European sailings? Also what time frame is it? Just August? Well that would be easy due to the shift to support more families, it's pure focus on the UK market and school holidays all come into it.

 

To me it sounds a big positive sound bite but when you dig into it there does not seem to be much substance to understand if this is long term (what about the other 11 months, what if you look at all geo locations.

[Interestedcruisefan]

11 minutes ago, majortom10 said:

That is total nonsense because not all new cruiser's to P&O are only booking Saver price inside cabins. They might book Saver price which is their choice but many wouldn't step foot on any cruise ship unless in at least a balcony.

Balconies on Arvia in the Caribbean still come in as a way cheaper option for new cruisers than attempting a cruise with RCL, Princess of Celebrity ??

[CarlaMarie]

16 minutes ago, majortom10 said:

But even with Arvia a paltry rope experience, a mini golf and Escape Room and even less on Iona is a poor example of what is available with Royal Caribbean.

 

 

You are spot on. What actually is P&O's identity in the market? They have had both Iona and Arvia built fairly recently, yet the amenities onboard for families and children are fairly limited - yet they want to attract the young families.

[FamilyCruiserUK]

Holding my hands up here. I always book the cheapest room i can on a cruise. This gives me more money to spend on more cruises and onboard. I dont drink alcohol anymore, winner but i do enjoy good food so will book the odd speciality restaurant.

I also look for the cheapest cruise company going to the places i want to visit. I love RC, ships are good for us as a family but expensive. P&O offer much better value for money compared to many other lines. 

As for young drinking all day around the pool, didnt see that on Arvia during school holidays. Mostly just grumpy old experienced cruisers moaning about the kids and queues etc. 

[majortom10]

10 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Balconies on Arvia in the Caribbean still come in as a way cheaper option for new cruisers than attempting a cruise with RCL, Princess of Celebrity ??

Fortunately not everyone is driven by cost alone but the experience and the quality of the product.

[Interestedcruisefan]

24 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

I'm happy to say some book on price but your constant bulldozing of alternative opinions to yours - and I don't mean me before anyone screams at me - is at serious risk of undermining any alternative opinion and as a result people will just stop posting and leave the conversation.  

Totally unfair MB

 

Check this thread from the start page

 

A thread another poster started about "cruising doing well"

 

All I've done is reply to posters who have questioned or disparaged cruising is going well on P and O?

 

In a P and O forum

 

Why aren't you accusing Major Tom of bulldozing above as all I've done is reply to his negative comments on P and O ships and it's passengers and what they want to do and why other cruise  lines are better

 

Another poster who reckon younger people just want to drink and sit next  to pools on the big ships?

 

Another poster who has an big dislike to big P and O ships because of a half term  cruise that was too busy for her

 

Each time I've answered positively against negatives?

 

And despite digs about me going to bed at 10pm and not having  cruised enough times. 

 

And digs about inside savers etc lol

 

Digs that I've answered back politely without lowering myself to that level? 

 

But I'm the one bulldozing?

 

I'm not. I'm defending P and O and I'm defending my positive  opinion of P and O whilst  trying to show respect to other posters including yourself now who do not show the same respect to me

 

Just because you  don't like my positive replies as a poster does not mean you guys have  the right to attack me as a poster?

 

Any personal comments above are not needed 

 

Sorry if I don't just bow down and agree cruising can't possibly be going well on P and O after all because some aren't enjoying it on here themselves 

 

But it is actually  possible you know guys?

 

 

[FamilyCruiserUK]

6 minutes ago, CarlaMarie said:

 

You are spot on. What actually is P&O's identity in the market? They have had both Iona and Arvia built fairly recently, yet the amenities onboard for families and children are fairly limited - yet they want to attract the young families.

Totally agree and have said this plenty of times. P&O have done a half harted attempt to ttract families. Those who are first time will love P&O but those who have experienced RC will understand how limited P&O is for families. 

[Interestedcruisefan]

7 minutes ago, CarlaMarie said:

 

You are spot on. What actually is P&O's identity in the market? They have had both Iona and Arvia built fairly recently, yet the amenities onboard for families and children are fairly limited - yet they want to attract the young families.

 

Just now, majortom10 said:

Fortunately not everyone is driven by cost alone but the experience and the quality of the product.

Why is that fortunate though?

 

Do you want Arvia and Iona to fail just because you don't like them personally?

 

 

[majortom10]

Just now, Interestedcruisefan said:

 

Why is that fortunate though?

 

Do you want Arvia and Iona to fail just because you don't like them personally?

 

 

No but you state on a regular basis that people are being attracted to cruising with P&O with Saver inside cabins. Just because you do that doesn't mean everyone else is the same.

[Interestedcruisefan]

Just now, FamilyCruiserUK said:

Totally agree and have said this plenty of times. P&O have done a half harted attempt to ttract families. Those who are first time will love P&O but those who have experienced RC will understand how limited P&O is for families. 

But pricepoint will preclude a huge number from being able to try RCL at any stage even if they wanted to

 

Which helps Arvia and Iona even more

 

Pricepoint precludes many in the UK from holidaying in the Caribbean full stop until arvia?

 

I met a guy from Scotland in his 50s on his first cruise on Arvia in February

 

He said when his wife came back from the travel agents with the price he wanted to check they wouldn't be sleeping in a dinghy being pulled behind the back of the ship

 

That was his words. And it was cheaper to do a cruise in the Caribbean than their normal holiday to Canaries

 

They've had 30 years plus to be put off cruising  due to the comparative cost

 

Whether you guys like it or not the big ships with the low pricepoints are attracting new UK cruisers in larger numbers than ever

 

Ps he was loving the cruise and couldn't believe what he was getting in return for his outlay

[Harry Peterson]

32 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Totally unfair MB

 

Check this thread from the start page

 

A thread another poster started about "cruising doing well"

 

All I've done is reply to posters who have questioned or disparaged cruising is going well on P and O?

 

In a P and O forum

 

Why aren't you accusing Major Tom of bulldozing above as all I've done is reply to his negative comments on P and O ships and it's passengers and what they want to do and why other cruise  lines are better

 

Another poster who reckon younger people just want to drink and sit next  to pools on the big ships?

 

Another poster who has an big dislike to big P and O ships because of a half term  cruise that was too busy for her

 

Each time I've answered positively against negatives?

 

And despite digs about me going to bed at 10pm and not having  cruised enough times. 

 

And digs about inside savers etc lol

 

Digs that I've answered back politely without lowering myself to that level? 

 

But I'm the one bulldozing?

 

I'm not. I'm defending P and O and I'm defending my positive  opinion of P and O whilst  trying to show respect to other posters including yourself now who do not show the same respect to me

 

Just because you  don't like my positive replies as a poster does not mean you guys have  the right to attack me as a poster?

 

Any personal comments above are not needed 

 

Sorry if I don't just bow down and agree cruising can't possibly be going well on P and O after all because some aren't enjoying it on here themselves 

 

But it is actually  possible you know guys?

 

 

How do you find the time for all this? 😉

[Interestedcruisefan]

42 minutes ago, majortom10 said:

No but you state on a regular basis that people are being attracted to cruising with P&O with Saver inside cabins. Just because you do that doesn't mean everyone else is the same.

 

I'm a bad example

 

Our first cruise was Xmas/ New Year cruise RCL with 2 kids (not a cheap cruise)  out of New York to the Caribbean and back 14 nights (we sorted our own flights and had  a couple of nights near Times Square in a nice hotel at the start)

 

When we were in our early 40s (I'm 54 now)

 

We had a balcony as we were unsure what to expect from cruising and our kids were old enough to be safe on a balcony on a cruise ship

 

(We ended up only using the balcony for extra storage I seem to remember) 

 

And we've never paid for one since (Apart from once maybe when the price wasn't too much more than whatever else we could book as cheapest option so we had one and again didn't use it hardly)

 

We had several cruises with the kids at same times Xmas/new year since then always having to pay more for that time of year cruise

 

Including Carnival from San Juan via New York flight with a few nights in New York again then flight to Puerto Rico before it started

 

Carnival Vista from Barcelona summer holiday cruise

 

We also did 2 weeks Azura Caribbean fly  cruise with the kids Xmas and new year as well as Britannia staycation

 

RCL from Dubai Xmas/New year with a few nights in Dubai first

 

So we've spent plenty on cruises and seen RCL and P and O and Carnival to compare all 3

 

I would say RCL best for couples 

Carnival by far the best for families who want fun

P and O (now with Arvia not Azura) best for value by FAR and  now with the bigger ships offering great choice of things to do on board that suits us

 

But there's nothing I remember I could get on RCL that I can't now get on Arvia and Iona for a fraction of the price (albeit I fondly remember our MDR waiter from that first cruise. He's probably retired now though)

 

Taking into account inflation and the fact we use speciality a lot I'm probably paying far less than half of what I paid to cruise before in real terms.

 

Maybe even a third because they were Xmas/new year cruises

 

I choose to go for value for money with the cabins. But I don't have to. We just don't stay in our cabins long enough to pay more for them. I'm extravagant with my spend outside the cabins though but again that's my choice

 

Many new cruisers won't have the choice but to start at low pricepoints.  Many new cruisers will have the choice but will still find better deals first time on Arvia and Iona than on other cruiselines if they are from UK

 

But ive seen RCL. I've seen what Carnival offer younger cruisers but I genuinely find Arvia and Iona can match and better them for what we need

 

And then you compare the pricepoints and it blows them away

 

Carnival cruises are cheap but look at the flight costs now getting there and back for 2 people (let alone pricing up for 2 adults and 2 kids)

 

4k ish on return flights alone with luggage for 4 before you even price up transfers and then look at the cost of the  cruise you want?

 

Incredible prices for Caribbean with return flights and luggage  and transfers included 

 

Just incredible 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 2, 2023 by Interestedcruisefan

[Interestedcruisefan]

11 minutes ago, Harry Peterson said:

How do you find the time for all this? 😉

I  don't it's why I have to enforce breaks on myself

 

Lol

 

I sense another break coming very soon!!

[JeanieC,Aston]

Hi ICF

Just for info…….I am male.
Can I put one reasonable question to you?

 

Why are P&O pricing Iona and Arvia so low?
If every cruise was full dynamic pricing would push pricing way higher than that.

 

I saw one cruise priced at £349 today,,,surely no cruise line can survive selling cruises at that price.

And I can’t imagine P&O being a charity.

[Interestedcruisefan]

55 minutes ago, FamilyCruiserUK said:

Holding my hands up here. I always book the cheapest room i can on a cruise. This gives me more money to spend on more cruises and onboard. I dont drink alcohol anymore, winner but i do enjoy good food so will book the odd speciality restaurant.

I also look for the cheapest cruise company going to the places i want to visit. I love RC, ships are good for us as a family but expensive. P&O offer much better value for money compared to many other lines. 

As for young drinking all day around the pool, didnt see that on Arvia during school holidays. Mostly just grumpy old experienced cruisers moaning about the kids and queues etc. 

Spot on

 

To all of that

 

I also think younger travellers in general with or without kids will be far less inclined to want to sit on the balconies in their cabins with so much happening for them outside their cabins

 

Some won't want balconies just because they are worried about kids online balconies to start with

 

So will be interesting to see what happens with balcony prices on the bigger ships over time. They may come closer to insides or outsides etc

 

Ps no disrespect to people who love balconies on cruises. My parents would never cruise without a balcony.  Never

[lancashire_cruisers]

8 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

I  don't it's why I have to enforce breaks on myself

 

Lol

 

I sense another break coming very soon!!

I feel your pain! 😂

 

We’re due to cruise on Iona in a few weeks and was going to do a ‘live from’ but don’t think I’ll bother now given the reception the ship gets from a few extremely vocal individuals and also the ridiculous turn the recent ‘Saga’ review took.

 

I cruise to have a nice holiday and relax, especially after the last 12 months where I lost my Mum in quite traumatic circumstances and had major surgery 10 weeks ago. I CBA to defend my holiday experience against those descend like locusts on nearly every single thread.

[Interestedcruisefan]

13 minutes ago, JeanieC,Aston said:

Hi ICF

Just for info…….I am male.
Can I put one reasonable question to you?

 

Why are P&O pricing Iona and Arvia so low?
If every cruise was full dynamic pricing would push pricing way higher than that.

 

I saw one cruise priced at £349 today,,,surely no cruise line can survive selling cruises at that price.

And I can’t imagine P&O being a charity.

They  are surely growing a new brand and building a new customer base?

 

And won't they be getting more and more new cruisers to try cruising compared to more expensive overseas holidays ?

 

Has there ever been a better time to have a cheap holiday available for people to try for the first time?

 

I don't particularly think they are targetting cruisers from other lines or ships but new customers who used to think cruising was for other people but now thinking the price sounds appealing to them

 

I definitely know the Scottish guy above  thought there was going to be a catch because the price was so low

 

So they have the added advantage of new cruisers coming who are sceptical and not sure what to expect being pleasantly surprised when seeing everything they can eat, or enjoy in terms of entertainment and facilities

 

Not all of them of course but enough of them to come back again and tell their friends etc

 

Honestly in the chats I had or overheard on Arvia and  Iona I heard far far more positives than negatives

Edited October 2, 2023 by Interestedcruisefan

[Megabear2]

50 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Totally unfair MB

 

Check this thread from the start page

 

A thread another poster started about "cruising doing well"

 

All I've done is reply to posters who have questioned or disparaged cruising is going well on P and O?

 

In a P and O forum

 

Why aren't you accusing Major Tom of bulldozing above as all I've done is reply to his negative comments on P and O ships and it's passengers and what they want to do and why other cruise  lines are better

 

Another poster who reckon younger people just want to drink and sit next  to pools on the big ships?

 

Another poster who has an big dislike to big P and O ships because of a half term  cruise that was too busy for her

 

Each time I've answered positively against negatives?

 

And despite digs about me going to bed at 10pm and not having  cruised enough times. 

 

And digs about inside savers etc lol

 

Digs that I've answered back politely without lowering myself to that level? 

 

But I'm the one bulldozing?

 

I'm not. I'm defending P and O and I'm defending my positive  opinion of P and O whilst  trying to show respect to other posters including yourself now who do not show the same respect to me

 

Just because you  don't like my positive replies as a poster does not mean you guys have  the right to attack me as a poster?

 

Any personal comments above are not needed 

 

Sorry if I don't just bow down and agree cruising can't possibly be going well on P and O after all because some aren't enjoying it on here themselves 

 

But it is actually  possible you know guys?

 

 

Bulldozing?  By that I mean ending every point you make an answer to with a question mark, almost like a challenge.  We all have things we feel are right or wrong but we don't challenge people to enter into the same old discussion every time a new topic comes up.  We are all fully aware you love Arvia and Iona, I get it and great that you love them.  

 

Unfortunately my experience with the cruisers on Arvia - young and old - very much mirrored Majortom's with people failing to control children being loud and argumentative and overall selfish with their me first attitudes.  My opinion (please don't question mark me!) is that the ship with its known problems with queues etc breeds anxiety which in turn rubs off on people, many of whom would not normally act this way. As a result I can identify with Majortom and Jeanie, however I am also aware that Caribbean cruises are completely different to European, particularly Mediterranean voyages so listen with interest to your opinions, with the caveat you haven't sailed on Arvia since last year and she had only just been introduced.  The people flying out to join her this year will have different expectations and I doubt that they'll be as willing to put things down to teething troubles or post pandemic at this stage.

 

DaiB very helpfully set up this thread, lots of full and helpful thoughts and opinions were/are being made.  My bulldozing comment refers to every comment made by others being challenged and queried.  

[Interestedcruisefan]

1 minute ago, Megabear2 said:

DaiB very helpfully set up this thread, lots of full and helpful thoughts and opinions were/are being made.  My bulldozing comment refers to every comment made by others being challenged and queried.  

I feel like I'm just replying to others comments. 

 

I can stop adding question marks to my replies if that's considered bulldozing

 

I darent put one above now!

 

Lol