If I've sailed on Odyssey and Sojourn, will I like Encore or Ovation?

[Happydays2024]

The point about the pool deck is well made. Odyssey in 2018 in the Greek islands was great on the pool deck - never felt crowded except during entertainment.  The big difference is the soft product which seems to have gone down hill significantly. Different calibre of staff but this may be pre-Covid v Post Covid and irrespective of the ship.  

Edited August 21 by Happydays2024

[brittany12]

We were on Odyssey too in summer  of '18 in Greek islands. Same glorious memories. Almost entirely Greek Islands as I recall and really stupendous. Pool deck even with uncomfortable mesh lounge chairs was not crowded. Extra 150 passengers in nearly same size pool and surrounding deck is hard to swallow as an enjoyable experience on warm months cruises.  Based on last cruise short time ago on Sojourn I totally agree with HappyDays2024 about calibre of crew. Plus the Seabourn "efficiency measures". Those of us who have earlier memories of excellence see the difference.  I can't say from personal experience whether same story on Seabourn competitors nowadays 

[SLSD]

29 minutes ago, Happydays2024 said:

The point about the pool deck is well made. Odyssey in 2018 in the Greek islands was great on the pool deck - never felt crowded except during entertainment.  The big difference is the soft product which seems to have gone down hill significantly. Different calibre of staff but this may be pre-Covid v Post Covid and irrespective of the ship.  

We are on Sojourn this summer---fabulous staff---great service and excellent food.  Perhaps things have improved since your journey. I would say that we cannot fault the caliber of the staff.  Each and everyone of them has been top notch.  

[Happydays2024]

12 minutes ago, SLSD said:

We are on Sojourn this summer---fabulous staff---great service and excellent food.  Perhaps things have improved since your journey. I would say that we cannot fault the caliber of the staff.  Each and everyone of them has been top notch.  

The journey has been in the last weeks so maybe it is big ship v small ship experience. And perhaps Sojourn should be our next one. 

[AlexsDogPound]

Well it looks like we're going to be stuck on either Ovation or Encore as we want to go back to the Med in either Sept or October 2025. Hopefully as it's not the dead of summer, the pool situation will not be as bad. 

[nancygp]

1 hour ago, SLSD said:

We are on Sojourn this summer---fabulous staff---great service and excellent food.  Perhaps things have improved since your journey. I would say that we cannot fault the caliber of the staff.  Each and everyone of them has been top notch.  

Recently off the Sojourn…fully concur regarding wonderful staff coupledwith great service and food.

 

this was our 5th cruise on Seabourn in 2 years and it was the best.

 

we’ve done 2 ovation cruises, 2022 and 2023.  As the cruises weren’t what I’d call warm weather cruises plus 75% to 80% of capacity, the ship never seemed overly crowded around the pool area and dining venues.   I cant comment on warmer weather and full passenger loads on the larger ships.

 

we have a booking next year on Ovation.  I’m sure it will sell out and the weather will be nice.  We shall see how it goes!

 

Nancy 

Edited August 21 by nancygp

[brittany12]

Sounds like you never sailed Seabourn pre Covid. See my review I wrote of recent cruise for my total evaluation. 

[nancygp]

33 minutes ago, brittany12 said:

Sounds like you never sailed Seabourn pre Covid. See my review I wrote of recent cruise for my total evaluation. 

if you’re referring to me, you’re correct.  I did read your review.  However, I sailed on crystal over 25 times prior to Covid and once when they restarted in late 21.

 

As I focus my interests on the lux cruise market, all of these lines changed since Covid per my reading on their respective CC boards and conversations with friends.  I have a very good frame of reference.

 

As I stated, my recent seabourn sojourn cruise was excellent for the most part…head and shoulders above the others I mentioned.  Was it perfect?  No and nothing is.

 

my next SB cruise is in the near future and it will be interesting to see how it will compare to my cruise a couple of weeks ago.

 

 

 

Nancy

Edited August 21 by nancygp

[SLSD]

3 hours ago, brittany12 said:

Sounds like you never sailed Seabourn pre Covid. See my review I wrote of recent cruise for my total evaluation. 

We have sailed Seabourn pre-covid quite a number of times.  Yes, the staff was different--primarily from South Africa and Eastern European countries and the Netherlands  pre-Covid.  The crew seems to be from different countries post covid--quite a few from African countries, Mexico, Albanian, etc.  This, in our opinion, has NOT affected the caliber of the crew.  Their service has been excellent.  Their affability has remained one of the charms of Seabourn.  You will have to be more specific in describing what you are referring to when you mention caliber.  We will have been on Sojourn for 28 days  on our current cruise in two more days.  It has really been some of the best service we have experienced pre or post covid.  

Edited August 21 by SLSD

[SLSD]

5 hours ago, Happydays2024 said:

The journey has been in the last weeks so maybe it is big ship v small ship experience. And perhaps Sojourn should be our next one. 

We sailed on Ovation last summer (Sojourn this summer) and there has been no difference in the service--all excellent.  I am well aware that our opinions are subjective.  Two people can be on the same cruise and see everything differently.  

[stan01]

I would not use the term "caliber" of the crew.  I think they are very overworked (short staffed), and don't have time to provide the level of service they'd like to.

[SLSD]

22 hours ago, stan01 said:

I would not use the term "caliber" of the crew.  I think they are very overworked (short staffed), and don't have time to provide the level of service they'd like to.

This may be true in some cases.  We experienced short staffing particularly at the Pool Bar in the late afternoon.  The Sky Bar seemed to be closed the few times we tried to go there.Perhaps this is evidence of too little staff available.    I think the Obs Bar could be staffed a bit more at the height of the evening there.  We did not experience short staffing at The Restaurant or Earth and Ocean. In a full disclosure, we did not frequent The Colonnade enough to offer an opinion.  Staffing at Solis seemed very adequate.  

[brittany12]

I think it's both. Lesser calibre and shorts staffed, or just overworked are obvious. Officers if you talk to some privately admit it. One reason is too many new people and also inadequate training. When you see the DM manager carrying trays of food out of the kitchen to help out at peak hours, as I did on the Sojourn, you know the waiting staff is short, or overextended with too many tables and doing the wine duties too.

[SLSD]

48 minutes ago, brittany12 said:

I think it's both. Lesser calibre and shorts staffed, or just overworked are obvious. Officers if you talk to some privately admit it. One reason is too many new people and also inadequate training. When you see the DM manager carrying trays of food out of the kitchen to help out at peak hours, as I did on the Sojourn, you know the waiting staff is short, or overextended with too many tables and doing the wine duties too.

I did see the Dining Room manager helping out in The Restaurant--carrying trays of food out-helping out where necessary--but this is part of his work ethic--and his desire to make everyone's experience in The Restaurant to be the best that it can be.  

 

I still want a definition of what "lesser calibre" means.  I do think Seabourn needs a bit more crew in various areas at high peak times--but I see no issue with the "calibre" of the crew.  

[nancygp]

40 minutes ago, SLSD said:

I did see the Dining Room manager helping out in The Restaurant--carrying trays of food out-helping out where necessary--but this is part of his work ethic--and his desire to make everyone's experience in The Restaurant to be the best that it can be.  

 

I still want a definition of what "lesser calibre" means.  I do think Seabourn needs a bit more crew in various areas at high peak times--but I see no issue with the "calibre" of the crew.  

+1!

 

Nancy

[brittany12]

How about  lower quality.  Not everyone is cut out to be a great restaurant server.  Or is.  . Particularly today  when the combined waiting/wine  serving jobs combined and number of tables assigned significantly expanded. Degrees of ability, skills, intelligence and understanding of the basic waiting  job among them. Differences in degree of training. . Know a blue cheese from a Brie.  Sometimes language and cultural  issues interfere..  Sometimes where born and raised matters. All pleasant but not all the same.  I repeat.  Not like the pre Covid days when across the board great service was never in doubt. Maybe endemic problem  with all high end cruise lines today.  Officers discussed privately difficulty finding good staff and having to assign  them not fully trained. A number quit  and others don't get their contracts renewed. Very hard jobs in this new mode. And I like to be addressed by my name by most everyone by day 2or 3 of cruise.  Did not happen. 

[SLSD]

1 hour ago, brittany12 said:

How about  lower quality.  Not everyone is cut out to be a great restaurant server.  Or is.  . Particularly today  when the combined waiting/wine  serving jobs combined and number of tables assigned significantly expanded. Degrees of ability, skills, intelligence and understanding of the basic waiting  job among them. Differences in degree of training. . Know a blue cheese from a Brie.  Sometimes language and cultural  issues interfere..  Sometimes where born and raised matters. All pleasant but not all the same.  I repeat.  Not like the pre Covid days when across the board great service was never in doubt. Maybe endemic problem  with all high end cruise lines today.  Officers discussed privately difficulty finding good staff and having to assign  them not fully trained. A number quit  and others don't get their contracts renewed. Very hard jobs in this new mode. And I like to be addressed by my name by most everyone by day 2or 3 of cruise.  Did not happen. 

Wow Brittany.  You expect to be called by your name by most EVERYONE by day 2 or 3?  You are a tough customer.  We were called by our name by most everyone--but not by day 2 or 3.  I think that is a lot to ask for those who have not interacted with you. 

 

Language has always been an issue with some staff on Seabourn.  I saw less of that on this cruise than on previous cruises--including pre Covid cruises.  

 

I also did not see a lack of intelligence in any of the staff.  Certainly there are cultural issues as the crew comes from countries other than the US, UK, Australia, etc.  I remain mightily impressed by them.  

 

If they are indeed short staffed which I do think they are, I would not push this off on the crew and question their training or intelligence.  Everyone I saw was working incredibly hard.  

 

Any issues I had on our 28 day cruise had nothing to do with the crew and more to do with Seabourn itself.  I'll talk about that later on the thread I started about our cruise.  

[Mauzac]

Totally agree.  I do not expect every crew member to know who I am, I'm not that important!  On sea days on the last cruise, I would often have a champagne about 4pm round the Sky bar loungers... of course the lovely bartender knew my name within a day or so, I was a familiar face!

And the most unlikely waiting staff seemed to know me in the MDR but I wouldn't expect this from all the crew.

 

I don't think there's anything wrong with a Manager mucking in... does anyone want more senior staff not getting their hands dirty and doing what they ask of those that report to them?  That is good management in my book. 

[brittany12]

 The DR GM on any ship is like the manager of a lovely restaurant on land we go to special occasions. Ever see one of those restaurant managers walking around carrying trays from the kitchen, acting as an assistant waiter or busboy? Just because he or she wants to get their hands dirty and show they are just one of the crew they supervise, as Mauzac suggests, or another writer suggests is done just because it's their work ethic? No, that's a terrible look and bad management in any high end restaurant. Rather, they do it because it's all hands on deck at those moments when the DR GM jumps in, and the reasons are complicated but mostly relate to staffing. If he or she actually likes to do this and does it voluntarily, night after night, he or she would not be my choice as the DR GM, or Seattle's. The DM GM is at the top the hierarchy in that room. He or she's in charge, not working like one of those at the bottom of the rung at busy times because of the simple necessity that trays loaded with prepared dishes must get out of the kitchen and there's a lack of staff to do this properly. I admire that initiative, to jump in when it's necessary, but I think most of us think it is very unusual and highly unpreferable for DR GM to carry trays rather than concentrate on his or her normal duties to manage the entire room making guests feel comfortable and the room operating smoothly. The GM's job, unlike the servers or kitchen staff, is to manage the entire dining operation, greeting guests at the check-in station as the evening unfolds and guests continually roll in, supervising the serving and wine staff, interfacing with the chef and kitchen, talking to guests at their tables as he wanders the room to make sure all is in order for the hundreds dining there each night, handling special individual dining or serving situations as they arise, doing this over and over each night as they constantly roam the room...not taking himself or herself out of their essential job by filling in as an assistant waiter or busboy at those moments when the kitchen gets backed up because there are not enough people at the bottom of the rung to move the plates out of the kitchen on a timely and efficient basis. Fix the staffing and work assignment issues. Then the DR GM will not be forced to jump in and carry trays.

[Vineyard View]

We haven’t the long term experience with Seabourn that most/many have on this board. We are excited to sail again next year on Ovation, after our first experience on Quest last year. 
We chose Seabourn because we did not like the changes we were seeing with our previous line. Maybe we will go back for the right itinerary/price, but for now, we are looking forward to Seabourn.
We do not have some of the expectations I am reading here. I understand that we don’t have that prior comparison basis. That said, I am fairly certain that we wouldn’t have had some of the expectations that are called out pre Covid. I have read this same type of feedback on other lines regarding pre-post Covid experience. Unfortunately, we see this occurring in many non-cruise businesses as well. Particularly the service industry. Some of our local restaurants have had to cut hours, or days, due to lack of employees wanting to work. Sometimes, owners are working the room, whereas that wasn’t always the case in the past. Some of these are high end restaurants. I hope this  changes, more for the viability of those businesses, than for ourselves. I think shortages of staff are more common now than before in multiple industries. For me, the answer to ‘why’ is pretty elusive. 

[notjaded]

On 8/13/2024 at 4:05 AM, AlexsDogPound said:

We absolutely love Odyssey and Sojourn and the small intimate feel of both of the ships. Is there a noticeable difference in the size of Encore or Ovation?

The increase in passengers? Waiting for tenders? 

 

Thank you all for your input.

Will I like Encore or Ovation? Maybe. Depends on your particular style and experience

Noticeable difference in size? Yes.

Increase in passengers? Not on my one cruise on the Encore, since it was not full.

Extra waiting for tenders?  Not on my cruise

 

We had similar concerns about the bigger ship, but given that the passenger count was low and the staff were great, we very much enjoyed the cruise.

 

The newer ship cabin electronics were an improvement compared to the older one. We liked the dedicated sushi restaurant.

 

One thing I hated about the Encore was that the putting greens were removed.

 

Try it, you may like it.

Edited August 26 by notjaded

[Mauzac]

I agree.  We didn't notice a discernible difference apart from the size of Solis/TK, it's probably 3 times as big, but we actually prefer the smaller size restaurant, we prefer the ambience.

 

Two random differences between the bigger ships and 'O' class.   Alll doors are electronic on Ovation/Encore and open for you, it is a minor thing but when I get up early and get my coffee in the Square, juggling it to get out on deck is not so easy.  Some of the doors on the smaller ship are quite heavy to open. 

Also electronic keycards, no putting your keycard in a slot, just scan it.  Aircon is quieter too, but I like the hum of the aircon actually so that is not a plus for me. 

We also prefer the Obs Bar on the smaller ship, but it's nothing to complain about, just a preference as far as atmosphere.

None of these are complaints, just observations!

[alexander51]

I like both sizes but one difference I noticed was that the big ships had the patio dining at the stern end of the pool instead of the bow end. When underway the biggies were windier when dining because the tables were farther from the superstructure windbreak. A minor issue.

[AlexsDogPound]

We pulled the trigger and are sailing on the Ovation Oct 19-29, 2025. After weighing the pros and cons, we decided it didn't really matter because it's Seabourn, we've never been disappointed by them, and now have something to look forward to.

[nancygp]

54 minutes ago, AlexsDogPound said:

We pulled the trigger and are sailing on the Ovation Oct 19-29, 2025. After weighing the pros and cons, we decided it didn't really matter because it's Seabourn, we've never been disappointed by them, and now have something to look forward to.

There’s a good chance I'll see you in this sailing

 

N