Opt-Out for Included Excursions?

[Suite Travels]

I must agree with TC on this issue. We do not like to be herded like cattle. We select our tours privately or just walk into town. Our T/A offers us a private tour or OBC. That other line that we go on gives us the As You Wish program. I think if Regent did this they would attract more clients. Just give people an OBC for tours and let people book their own and lower the fare a bit.

[rallydave]

[quote name='Suite Travels']I must agree with TC on this issue. We do not like to be herded like cattle. We select our tours privately or just walk into town. Our T/A offers us a private tour or OBC. That other line that we go on gives us the As You Wish program. I think if Regent did this they would attract more clients. Just give people an OBC for tours and let people book their own and lower the fare a bit.[/quote]

I'll attempt to ignore the cattle comment. Why do you think the fare would be lowered if Regent switched from free tours and increased the OBC?? Seems like a good idea to let people choose how to use the OBC in lieu of free excursions but, don't see how this would lessen the cruise cost. Many of us would rather use the included excursions and in order to reduce the cruise costs, there would need to be a reduction in how many excursions we could purchase as the OBC would need to be lower than the difference between the current fare and the total of the OBC + the new revised fare.

Maybe the solution would be to simply drop the included excursions, lower
the fare and let everyone choose Regent or private excursions? There is no free lunch! Be aware, this would change the all-inclusiveness pitch that Regent uses for their cruises.

Not sure how Regent could accomodate more clients with the comments that they are cruising almost totally full. Maybe if and when the rumors occur and another ship joins the fleet, Regent will need to rethink their marketing but, for now, appears the current Marketing Plans and amenities are working out just fine no matter the naysayers.

[basedow]

I'm sure Regent would like more full paying customers. I'm sure when they added included excursions their fares went up to cover that cost. All I'm saying is that on our cruise the excursions were crushed and the waits were over an hour sometimes. On other cruises that might not be the case but on our 2 week cruise it was.

We have booked a 3 week cruise based on itinerary. There is 0-1 sea day which we prefer. We cruise so that we can meaningfully see countries (as best one can on a cruise.) We do not view the ship as a destination or a second home or care if the waiters remember our food preferences or names. We go to experience the land and if the excursions are sub-par it means a lot to us. The excursions are our #1 reason for cruising.

We have enjoyed Regent very much but we do not want to go through the excursions again with them, so booking all private will add a lot to the total cost.
.

[Travelcat2]

[quote name='basedow']Some of these cruises that people are remarking on that are so full, are being heavily subsidized by Regent. Cruisers were being offered shipboard credits worth thousands of dollars( like $1600), free upgrades to higher suites and free upgrades to business flights. Travel agents are also being used to offer these deals to their clients. Regent will do this if the cruise isn't selling well.

I wonder if this post will be allowed to stay.[/quote]

Yes -- this is what I am seeing and hearing about on our cruises. For the reasons you mentioned, our last cruise was full and suspect our next one will be as well. Someone posted on another thread (perhaps another board?) that Regent's sailing from Auckland to Sydney in February 2011 was full and the same itinerary -- a couple of days later -- on Silversea was not so they booked it. While I remain a Regent loyalist, we are anxious to go on our November, 2010 Silversea cruise to see the differences and perhaps why Regent is running full and Silversea is not. We immediately booked a private excursion -- just to get away from sitting in the theater endlessly while they get themselves organized. Will probably book one excursion on board to see how they handle it. Silversea runs similiar promotions to Regent (less the excursions) at lower prices (on some itineraries). The only differences I see so far is that we were able to deviate our air and still receive transfers to and from the airport. . . and, Regent is a bit easier to deal with than Silversea (from my TA's perspective).

One more point. I am not saying that all Regent sailings have hoards of people in the theater and very long lines to get off of the ship for excursions. Our last cruise (to Alaska on the Navigator two months ago) was full. The theater was completely full of people waiting - for a long time. Lines to disembark were the longest we have seen on any Regent cruise. When Regent went to the included excursions, we were reading that buses were half full -- that the groups were kept small. While we saw that last year on our Cape Town to Rio cruise (not full), it is not what we saw this year.

[basedow]

Yes, we will try SS for your reasons, TC. Besides I think sailing on one ship gets boring anyway.

[Longhorn1]

I've commented on this issue but will again. I agree with those who prefer to make their own arrangements. It's one thing to have everything ON the ship included (save spa treatments which have never been included on any line that I know of) and another to include OFF ship excursions. I just feel that most people who take luxury cruises do not want to be herded around...it's contrary to what I enjoy, that's for sure. I also don't enjoy being left with the feeling of "gee, I better get on one of these crowded bus tours I don't like...after all, we've already paid for these things..." We prefer the options of being on our own, booking a private tour or paying for a excursion offered by the cruise line if it is something that we find desirable. This is a Regent marketing decision, plain and simple. However, the pricing to all for off ship services that clearly a goodly number of Regent loyalists do not want is risky business. We prefer Regent and enjoy the feeling of exclusivity that a luxury cruise line provides---it makes you feel good about spending your money with a particular company (not unlike handbag companies, luggage companies, car companies, etc. etc.) Mass excursions are not my feeling of exclusivity--quite the opposite. Regent should offer OBC to offset at a minimum. Op out, similar to the airfare, would be better. Or go back to the way it was before the crash, best of all. Just my opinion folks..

[ChatKat in Ca.]

Actually, I'd prefer to book private excursions too and create my own itinerary. If you pay for the all inclusive, Longhorn1 is correct. It makes you feel like you've paid for them so you must do them or the alternate is also that you pay twice to take the custom excursion you want because the ones that are offered are not on the list of what you want to do.

I'd love the opt out....Mr. Del Rio I am sure is listening. Actually, it's a good reason to take an Oceania trip as opposed to Regent. We are on the November Australia/New Zealand Itinerary and we have actually booked some private tours because the Regent tours don't have a plan for what we want to do. It's made us pay twice.

[tallship]

ChatKat - I agree. I would welcome the "opt out" option esp. on Caribbean itinieraries.

[wripro]

I don't think you will ever see an opt out option for shore excursions. Even though they are included Regent has raised its prices more than enough to cover them. They would lose money from the passengers opting out. And then how would they decide what the opt out discount would be? Would the person who normally takes three excursions get less than the one who takes ten?

[bk travels]

I was so shocked by the "herding" comments that I had to respond. We were on a port-intensive Mediterranean cruise in June on the Mariner and the excursions were handled extremely well. We walked up to a table in the theater each day, had bus tickets in our hands within a minute, and sat comfortably in the theater chatting with people until our tour was called. It was a pleasure. In fact it gave us one more chance to hit up the rest room before leaving. [IMG]http://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon7.gif[/IMG]

When our tour number was called, it may have taken five minutes at most to disembark. There was a very long line on one day only and that was not for the excursion desk or the gangway. It was the in-person interview in the theater with Israeli immigration that everyone had to complete. The excursion desk was on the pier that day and just as efficient as usual. The buses were comfortable and they were never full. With one exception the tour guides were very good to outstanding. In Venice, for example, after a museum visit, the guide gave us the option of either taking the bus back to the boat as planned or walking back to see some of the neighborhood. It was a very personalized tour and our small group of walkers stopped for a delightful gelato on the way. In general our groups were between 12 and 20 people.

Compared to the excursions offered on a Regent cruise we took a few years ago, I noticed only one difference. This time we had a wider variety of tours to choose from. Perhaps the increased number of people signing up for excursions has allowed Regent to add more choices. The excursion desk staff was very competent, helpful, and professional. We made several changes in our plans while on board and the staff was always willing and able to accommodate us.

This was truly a wonderful cruise and the excursions were a significant part of the luxury we enjoyed. Regent went out of its way to make the experience pleasurable and memorable. I'll never forget the celebratory atmosphere as the band and crew lined up to welcome us all back from Jerusalem at the end of a very long and tiring day. We felt like VIPs.

I do have one other observation. There are far more cruise passengers now than there were a few years ago. It wasn't on board Regent or in the buses that we were overcrowded. It was at some of the sights themselves. In particular there were many,many tourists at the pyramids, Knossos, Jerusalem, and Santorini even before the high season. A private tour guide may have been able to make the experience marginally better, but it's hard to imagine what one could have done to minimize the impact of the large crowds. In Kusadasi, we woke up to find a huge new Celebrity ship dwarfing the Mariner. Those passengers were all headed to Ephesus at the same time we were. However, my husband and I had signed up to view the Terrace Houses -- an option the Celebrity guests did not seem to have available -- and we had a fascinating small group tour in the middle of this popular site.

Maybe the excursion experience varies from region to region or maybe people need to try other lines to find a better fit. We were very happy with the excursions and love Regent's all-inclusive plan.

[Longhorn1]

No, you opt out, period. They manage the issue with the airfares just fine. I am not assuming that you are going to get 100% of their cost deducted from your cruise fare and, in any case, they are not sharing their costs and I don't expect them to. But, I really don't feel it is all that complicated. They could offer a opt out and STILL make "excursion revenue" on the opt out suites. Plus, if a "opt out" wanted to book a tour on board he would pay the full rate, whatever Regent decided that is. Those bookings would be as profitable as they were 14 months ago. A policy that has been in place for only a short time can surely be revisited. And, Regent could still market themselves as "all inclusive" just like they market "free airfare". It doesn't matter that not all pax take advantage of every offer--they may or may not, depending on personal preferences.

[ljk76]

Thank you so much for posting! We leave for our first Regent cruise in just a few days, also a port intensive Med itinerary, and this thread was making me quite discouraged. One could say we are part of the "problem" since the included excursions were attractive to us. And frankly, having cruised on several of the mass market lines, we probably won't be too put off by a bit of a wait here or there. But I'll admit we are hoping to feel a bit spoiled as well. So glad to have a positive experience noted as well.

[quote name='bk travels']I was so shocked by the "herding" comments that I had to respond. We were on a port-intensive Mediterranean cruise in June on the Mariner and the excursions were handled extremely well. We walked up to a table in the theater each day, had bus tickets in our hands within a minute, and sat comfortably in the theater chatting with people until our tour was called. It was a pleasure. In fact it gave us one more chance to hit up the rest room before leaving. [IMG]http://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon7.gif[/IMG]

When our tour number was called, it may have taken five minutes at most to disembark. There was a very long line on one day only and that was not for the excursion desk or the gangway. It was the in-person interview in the theater with Israeli immigration that everyone had to complete. The excursion desk was on the pier that day and just as efficient as usual. The buses were comfortable and they were never full. With one exception the tour guides were very good to outstanding. In Venice, for example, after a museum visit, the guide gave us the option of either taking the bus back to the boat as planned or walking back to see some of the neighborhood. It was a very personalized tour and our small group of walkers stopped for a delightful gelato on the way. In general our groups were between 12 and 20 people.

Compared to the excursions offered on a Regent cruise we took a few years ago, I noticed only one difference. This time we had a wider variety of tours to choose from. Perhaps the increased number of people signing up for excursions has allowed Regent to add more choices. The excursion desk staff was very competent, helpful, and professional. We made several changes in our plans while on board and the staff was always willing and able to accommodate us.

This was truly a wonderful cruise and the excursions were a significant part of the luxury we enjoyed. Regent went out of its way to make the experience pleasurable and memorable. I'll never forget the celebratory atmosphere as the band and crew lined up to welcome us all back from Jerusalem at the end of a very long and tiring day. We felt like VIPs.

I do have one other observation. There are far more cruise passengers now than there were a few years ago. It wasn't on board Regent or in the buses that we were overcrowded. It was at some of the sights themselves. In particular there were many,many tourists at the pyramids, Knossos, Jerusalem, and Santorini even before the high season. A private tour guide may have been able to make the experience marginally better, but it's hard to imagine what one could have done to minimize the impact of the large crowds. In Kusadasi, we woke up to find a huge new Celebrity ship dwarfing the Mariner. Those passengers were all headed to Ephesus at the same time we were. However, my husband and I had signed up to view the Terrace Houses -- an option the Celebrity guests did not seem to have available -- and we had a fascinating small group tour in the middle of this popular site.

Maybe the excursion experience varies from region to region or maybe people need to try other lines to find a better fit. We were very happy with the excursions and love Regent's all-inclusive plan.[/QUOTE]

[Mark_T]

I think we are possibly seeing a fair amount of over-reaction to this change and a lot of assumptions about the degree of 'herding' that is actually taking place.

I'll reserve final judgement for a little longer though as we'll be on Navigator in a little over 4 weeks so we can form our own direct opinion.

I do fully understand that if you've been to a port before and want to do something completely different then this new inclusion may not be welcome, but the answer to that would seem to be Oceania rather than expecting Regent to change a formula that does seem to be appealing to the masses.

[Travelcat2]

[quote name='Mark_T']I think we are possibly seeing a fair amount of over-reaction to this change and a lot of assumptions about the degree of 'herding' that is actually taking place.

I'll reserve final judgement for a little longer though as we'll be on Navigator in a little over 4 weeks so we can form our own direct opinion.

I do fully understand that if you've been to a port before and want to do something completely different then this new inclusion may not be welcome, but the answer to that would seem to be Oceania rather than expecting Regent to change a formula that does seem to be appealing to the masses.[/quote]

Really do not feel this is a case of over-reacting -- at least not for those of us who have cruised Regent multiple times. I also do not feel that anyone on CC should be judging other members. In my case, we are not "assuming" what the degree of herding was. Unfortunately, we were in the middle of it. For those passengers that think included excursions are good -- that is fine. However, the same should be said for those of us who are not happy with higher prices that came along with included excursions.

In terms of the Navigator 4 weeks from now. . . . . the season will be basically over. Children back in school in many parts of the country. When you find that there are short lines in the theater or when you are disembarking to take an excursion, you may want to think about those of us who did wait in long lines during the peak of the season.

What some of us are asking is that we not be forced to pay for a "benefit" that was added on in 2009 and that many people do not want. We have no problem with the fact that some passengers are interested in included excursions. . . . . . simply asking that we not be included in that group.

Thank you.

[tallship]

TC2 - I agree

We waited in long lines on our last 2 cruises

Perhaps a poll is in order

[Mark_T]

[quote name='Travelcat2']What some of us are asking is that we not be forced to pay for a "benefit" that was added on in 2009 and that many people do not want.[/quote]

I'm still not sure about the 'many people do not want' part.

The ships seem to be filling up very well so that would suggest that people are being attracted by this change as not much else has altered recently.

This is not going to be our first Regent cruise and of course I'll take into consideration just how full our ship is when making my own mind up about the impact of the numbers on the excursions and the queues involved.

I just get the sense and it is no more than that so far, that there is an expectation of 'concierge' level excursion experience from something that isn't priced that way.

The desire to opt out is also understandable but I don't see it happening, any more than you can opt out of inclusive drinks etc.

These changes are never going to be popular with everyone and I don't doubt that nobody wants to change to a different line when a change like this happens, but the test of this will be if Regent can fill ships by doing it, not if the long term customers like it or not.

Regrettable, but 'loyalty' to a small but vocal long term customer base is unlikely to drive decisions that impact the bottom line so clearly.

[smilingcruiser]

Although we have not yet experiencd included tours (we will in Sept. on the Mariner), Ithink it totally depends on the cruise. A few years ago, we were on the Voyager from Monaco to Ft. Lauderdale with several stops before leaving for the crossing. The ship was full and the tours were crowded. Yes, it took a few minutes to get organized every morning, but once people were on their assigned buses or vans, all went very smoothly. We didn't feel "herded" and thoroughly enjoyed all of the tours we choose (and paid for). Our next cruise, according to the RSSC site, is far from fully booked, is very port intensive and will be a good opportunity for us to decide for ourselves how much we like touring being included.We will be sailing from Istanbul to Athens, with the Greek Islands and Israel in between, so it will be a very busy trip. The only private tour we have arranged is one where RSSc die not provide what we wanted. I think what I am trying to say here is that I don't think included tours will be any worse than full tours that were paid for individually.

As far as opting out is concerned, to me, that seems just as impossible or unlikely as a non-drinker opting out of included wine and liquor.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

I agree that some cruises and some excursions will be better-organized than others. Let's not fight about our individual experiences.

Why don't we turn the discussion around? I'm *all* for included excursions--IFF (if and only if) they are well-organized and not over-crowded. So why not focus on the quality of excursion delivery? How's that?

I still think that more "enhanced" or concierge-level excursions should be offered at reasonable cost, and that folks should be able to opt-out entirely.

[smilingcruiser]

I totally agree with Wendy - what I was trying to say was, on our last port-intensive-non-included -tour cruise, I don't see where the included tours will be any different, which would be fine.

Everything was well organized - we disliked one of our tour guides, but that is the luck of the draw.

[Longhorn1]

Mark and Smiling--the opt out issue just seems simple to me, Im sorry. I don't think the analogy with onboard free booze is germane. One is ON the ship and the other--like the airline and hotel options--are OFF ship. Two completely different things. I'm not even complaining about the herding issue, although I get why TC, for example, may not like it. I don't like it much either but, to me, that's beside the point. It is easy to satisfy both groups here. Simply offer a "suite opt out" just like the airline option. Lower the fare for those suites, just like the airline deal. They don't have to share their costs with anyone--I assume they will retain a little margin in the opt out. Offer the tours ala carte for those who have opted out, and capture more revenue. Everybody is satisfied at that point, and Regent generates more money for the bottom line. It's not complicated to me but maybe I'm dense...:) PS: The marketing remains the same.

[mountainmare]

We are looking at a Regent cruise moving up from HAL. Actually we have never taken a ship tour and at first I too started to look at shore offerings because "we already paid for them"
Then I stopped and thought--DH doesn't drink--but "we already paid for wine..."
We drive to port--but"we already paid for air"

We are looking at Regent not for what is included but for the service provided. Looking at the ship tours it seems that they are offered by the same companies that offer to other cruise lines--so they are basically "ship tours"

If we pick Regent we can afford to sail Regent, if we can afford to sail Regent we can afford to treat ports the way we always have, either using public transportation or in some cases a private guide. I would be unhappy only if we were prevented from leaving the ship until after all of the ship tours depart. I know that on HAL this has never been the case..even for tender ports. If you have a private tour planned and need to get off the ship you can get permission from the front desk.

In other words I don't understand all the angst about this.

[Travelcat2]

Longhorn1: You totally get it!:)

In terms of quality of excursions prior to mid-2009, we had one extremely bad excursion (for which Regent was kind enough to reimburse us) and thereafter booked our own excursions. We have had two cruises with included excursions. With the exception of one tour (Valdez, Alaska), the quality was quite good. The one excursion that had a cost attached to it was [U]excellent[/U] and only had 12 passengers.

[basedow]

TC2 and Longhorn. Absolutely agree!!!!

[Longhorn1]

TC and Basedow---well that's three of us! We're on a roll!:)

[rallydave]

[quote name='Longhorn1']TC and Basedow---well that's three of us! We're on a roll!:)[/quote]

Well, that's 3 out of maybe 30,000 who cruise with Regent in a year and probably a thousand her on CC. Hardly a majority and a realy small minority, .01% of cruisers and .3% of CC'ers on the Regent Board.

Still many disagree with you. It's really up to Regent and unless and until they change policy, you will remain a very small minority. Why don't we just drop this issue and see what Regent does? Enough has been said to allow them to decide.