Will Regent become a two class cruise line?

[DaveFr]

One of the things I like the most about Regent is that, once you leave your suite, all passengers are treated equally, both on the ship and before the cruise. There is no class system on Regent. So I was distressed today to read information posted by Threechicks on the Town Hall thread about the new Concierge Program, effective April 2012. (I verified the information using Google.) This program, IMHO, will have the effect of dividing passengers into two classes (call them First and Second Class or Patricians and Plebeians if you like :D). The details of the Concierge program are as follows:

 

New Regent Seven Seas Cruises Concierge Program

 

Guests booking suite categories E and above on Seven Seas Voyager and Seven Seas Mariner and category D and above on Seven Seas Navigator will receive the following services:

 

* priority specialty restaurant reservations

* 25% off premium purchased wines & liquors

* priority spa reservations

* 10% off pre-or-post hotel or land packages

* priority embarkation

* space available upgrades at time of sailing

* priority luggage delivery

* complimentary binoculars

* 15 min. worth of free phone calls per suite

* complementary Regent Seven Seas tote bag

* one free hour of internet per suite

* printed air boarding passes

 

The two items that concern me the most are priority specialty restaurant reservations and priority embarkation. I speculate that Regent will use a variant of Oceania's procedure. So while online restaurant reservations will still be available 75 days before the cruise, E suites and above on Mariner and Voyager will probably be able to make online reservations earlier, say 90 days before the cruise. Since Regent holds back reservations for onboard booking, it is likely that there will be few or any reservations left for the Second Class passengers at the 75 day mark. Of course Plebeians can always make reservations once onboard but the priority embarkation perk will adversely affect that course of action. Concierge passengers most likely will be able to board several hours before the remaining passengers and will be able to snap up the good remaining time slots before the Second Class passengers get on the ship.

 

In addition to affecting restaurant reservations, priority embarkation can set up an "us versus them" feel on the ship. On my one Oceania cruise, I remember some of the looks we received as we and other suite passengers walked past the non-suite passengers who faced the prospect of waiting another hour or so before they were allowed to board the ship. Those who are able to board the ship early also will have a better chance of getting desirable spa reservations.

 

Some of the other perks, such as 15 minutes of phone time and one hour of free internet are of lesser consequence since a majority of Plebeians will already have those perks through Society benefits. However, any increase in usage because of the Concierge Program will slow down internet access and make it more difficult to make a satellite phone call. Many of the remaining perks are only minor benefits IMHO. Of course, it wouldn't be a big step to add priority excursion reservations to the program. That, IMHO, would be a disaster.

 

I don't think the Concierge Program would concern me as much if it were restricted to a small number of suites, i.e., the most expensive suites. I realize that Regent defined the program as it did because, in general, the D and E suites on Voyager and the D suites on Navigator tend to be the last suites to sell. However, this program will affect a significant percentage of passengers on each Regent ship. I calculate that about 37% percent of suites on Mariner will be Cat. F, G or H. On Voyager the figure will be 32.5%. On Navigator, about 47% of suites will be Cat. E or less.

 

I'm probably overreacting to the Concierge Program and will wait until it is implemented to make my final judgment about it. I've booked a Cat. G suite on the Voyager in June 2012. Whether or not I'm overreacting, I feel I've lost some control over certain aspects of that cruise that I deem important.

 

I'll get off my soapbox now but I feel that a luxury cruise line, where the per diem on most cruises starts at $1000 to $2000 for a couple, should not adversely affect any passenger as I believe the Concierge Program will.

 

Dave

[laryrob]

One of the things I like the most about Regent is that, once you leave your suite, all passengers are treated equally, both on the ship and before the cruise. There is no class system on Regent. So I was distressed today to read information posted by Threechicks on the Town Hall thread about the new Concierge Program, effective April 2012. (I verified the information using Google.) This program, IMHO, will have the effect of dividing passengers into two classes (call them First and Second Class or Patricians and Plebeians if you like :D). The details of the Concierge program are as follows:

 

New Regent Seven Seas Cruises Concierge Program

 

Guests booking suite categories E and above on Seven Seas Voyager and Seven Seas Mariner and category D and above on Seven Seas Navigator will receive the following services:

 

* priority specialty restaurant reservations

* 25% off premium purchased wines & liquors

* priority spa reservations

* 10% off pre-or-post hotel or land packages

* priority embarkation

* space available upgrades at time of sailing

* priority luggage delivery

* complimentary binoculars

* 15 min. worth of free phone calls per suite

* complementary Regent Seven Seas tote bag

* one free hour of internet per suite

* printed air boarding passes

 

The two items that concern me the most are priority specialty restaurant reservations and priority embarkation. I speculate that Regent will use a variant of Oceania's procedure. So while online restaurant reservations will still be available 75 days before the cruise, E suites and above on Mariner and Voyager will probably be able to make online reservations earlier, say 90 days before the cruise. Since Regent holds back reservations for onboard booking, it is likely that there will be few or any reservations left for the Second Class passengers at the 75 day mark. Of course Plebeians can always make reservations once onboard but the priority embarkation perk will adversely affect that course of action. Concierge passengers most likely will be able to board several hours before the remaining passengers and will be able to snap up the good remaining time slots before the Second Class passengers get on the ship.

 

In addition to affecting restaurant reservations, priority embarkation can set up an "us versus them" feel on the ship. On my one Oceania cruise, I remember some of the looks we received as we and other suite passengers walked past the non-suite passengers who faced the prospect of waiting another hour or so before they were allowed to board the ship. Those who are able to board the ship early also will have a better chance of getting desirable spa reservations.

 

Some of the other perks, such as 15 minutes of phone time and one hour of free internet are of lesser consequence since a majority of Plebeians will already have those perks through Society benefits. However, any increase in usage because of the Concierge Program will slow down internet access and make it more difficult to make a satellite phone call. Many of the remaining perks are only minor benefits IMHO. Of course, it wouldn't be a big step to add priority excursion reservations to the program. That, IMHO, would be a disaster.

 

I don't think the Concierge Program would concern me as much if it were restricted to a small number of suites, i.e., the most expensive suites. I realize that Regent defined the program as it did because, in general, the D and E suites on Voyager and the D suites on Navigator tend to be the last suites to sell. However, this program will affect a significant percentage of passengers on each Regent ship. I calculate that about 37% percent of suites on Mariner will be Cat. F, G or H. On Voyager the figure will be 32.5%. On Navigator, about 47% of suites will be Cat. E or less.

 

I'm probably overreacting to the Concierge Program and will wait until it is implemented to make my final judgment about it. I've booked a Cat. G suite on the Voyager in June 2012. Whether or not I'm overreacting, I feel I've lost some control over certain aspects of that cruise that I deem important.

 

I'll get off my soapbox now but I feel that a luxury cruise line, where the per diem on most cruises starts at $1000 to $2000 for a couple, should not adversely affect any passenger as I believe the Concierge Program will.

 

Dave

 

i couldn't agree more-what we liked about Regent is that everyone was "First class" when out of their cabin. Definitely cost more than many other cruise lines but worth it. We have typically been in Penthouse or Horizon Suites and understood there was no special treatment once we crossed into the hallway, but also have been in F and G and never felt 2nd class. This program cheapens the brand and is causing us to rethink our previously booked cruise in March of 2012.

[rallydave]

Think you are absolutely correct Dave. With all the issues Regent has with the Destinations Organization, one has to wonder how Regent will be able to handle all the "perks". Sounds like a very low to no cost change to increase the occupancy on those suites just below Penthouse.

 

Another disturbing issue is that Regent announced this new "perk" to Seven Seas Members and now they announce the changes to the general public via press releases and not taking care of existing customers..

 

Have to echo tc's comments in another thread in that Regent appears to be going after new customers to the detriment of taking care of existing customers.

 

While the other Dave is correct in that many of these extra perks do not affect most current Regent current customers some of them affect those of us Silver and above should we choose to book a lower suite. Another indication that Regent is looking at the bottom line and new customers and in some ways telling loyal Regent customers to move to another cruise line.

 

The other Dave

[ChatKat in Ca.]

It seems they are adapting Oceania policies thoughout the system which further matches my belief that the two lines are in effect merging.

 

Next to be missing and is already absent in Oceania is the past passenger program....which gives the Seven Seas Society benefits that are similar to the Concierge Program.

[Travelcat2]

It does not surprise me that we have 100% agreement on this issue.

[pacheco18]

Starting to regret booking my first Regent cruise -- I wasn't planning to be a second class citizen

[Threechicks]

I'm glad that someone has finally read what I posted. This in my opinion means that Regent is now a two class cruise line. I am GOLD but from now on it won't mean much when the Concierge Class kicks in. I have four cruises booked. Only one will qualify for the Concierge Class. I'm not sure if want to continue with Regent. Very disappointed.

[Travelcat2]

Starting to regret booking my first Regent cruise -- I wasn't planning to be a second class citizen

 

Please don't regret that you have booked Regent. You will have an amazing cruise. The negativity you are reading is from many loyal, long-tme Regent passengers who are extremely disappointed by the direction the cruise line is taking. This should not affect your experience.

[mariners]

We also agree. We have no interest in sailing on ships where "classes" affect the masses.

[Island Cruiser]

DaveFr, I strongly endorse every word you wrote and then some. This is an AWFUL developement. It will strongly change the culture of a Regent cruise ship and, IMO, in a substantially negative direction. If this policy happens, our inclination, as Regent gold, will to give much stronger consideration to Regent's competitors as long as they don't follow along. We already hate the excursions included add on. But THIS! Absolutely nuts. As a change from the status quo, this policy REWARDS HIGHER PAYING PASSENGERS AT THE EXPENSE OF THOSE WHO PAY LESS. If Regent wants to give more to passengers who pay more, bravo. Give free internet, laundry, premium wine discounts, etc. As long as REGENT pays I don't care. But compared to current policy, to insert people in line in front of me is essentially making me pay for their perks. It is lowering the value my cruise. I hate the tought of it.

[journeyfan]

I quite agree. This is an "AWFUL devvelopment." Sounds like Regent is becoming NCL. If this is true, I have booked my last Regent cruise.

[TahoeTraveler]

But compared to current policy, to insert people in line in front of me is essentially making me pay for their perks. It is lowering the value my cruise.

I know I'm going to get completely flamed for this, but I'm really wondering, based on the posts here, how people feel about first class passengers on airlines. They pay more for their seats, they get to board before everyone else, they get cocktails while everyone else is getting seated in their "second class" seats, they get a bathroom that is supposedly off limits to the "second class" passengers, etc, etc. Does this bother everyone here as well? Do you also think that YOU are somehow paying for their perks in the first class seat, even though it is obvious they have paid more for those seats? And is your seat value somehow lowered because you chose to pay less for that seat?

 

I'm just amazed at how so many people are saying, "I'm done with Regent if this is true." Is this new policy really so awful that it will completely ruin any future cruise you might have on Regent? I mean, completely ruin it? I just feel that if you are blessed enough to be able to even afford a Regent cruise, and you are blessed enough to have your health to be able to go on a Regent cruise, maybe this change should be put into perspective. And if indeed it will ruin your cruise, then I'm sure there must be other cruise lines out there that will satisfy your needs.

 

Flame away...as a retired Air Force Lieutenant Colonel, I'm just too concerned about our troops now involved in a third conflict (who, I am quite sure, would be thrilled to be able to go on a Regent cruise, much less afford one, class-based or not) to be to worried about this change.

[mariners]

TahoeTraveller, When I take a plane, I am not socializing with others on the plane and fully understand that there are different perks according to the first/business/economy class. We are not there to socialize but merely to travel from point A to point B.

When I cruise, I am there for the package. I choose not to sail on cruise lines where there is a class system which lends to passengers believing that they belong to a certain class. Like Island Cruiser, I have no difficulty with passengers getting perks such as free laundry, extra internet/phone, etc. I do have difficulty with perks that create a class system.

Yes, there are other cruise lines out there that would be a better fit. I am happy to go with the best fit and will choose a cruise line based on the best fit for me.

These comments have nothing to do with who you are, what employment you have, or how you feel about our troops. My heart goes out to our troops, the people who live in or who are affected by what has happened in Japan, the people of Haiti who have yet to recover, the people of countries who are facing adversities that we only read about, etc. I feel very privileged to have lived the life that I live. That does not change my disappointment that Regent has chosen to go this route.

There is no place for "classes" in my world and I do not support such a system.

[Ka Honu]

I'm not so sure TahoeTraveler's airline analogy works, simply because the Regent policy will affect use of common areas which all passengers have paid to access - not an issue on a flight. I also think the "third conflict" comment may have been out of line but I'm just a retired grunt and don't have the noble perspective of my high-flying brethren.

[tallship]

This is a pretty dumb move by Regent.

 

Tahoe traveller- as retired military, you would also know that retired and active military personnel receive amazing discounts to cruise on Regent - often up to 75% off. I unfortunately do not and like others will likely be looking elsewhere.

 

Don't really get the airline analogy either - completely different, in my opinion

 

Sad to see a company with such a loyal following head in this direction.

[TahoeTraveler]

I completely understand (and agree with) the fact that there shouldn't be "classes" on a ship or anywhere else for that matter. But I definitely got the feeling on my Mariner cruise in January that there was some distinction between cabin categories by the other passengers, simply by virtue of their location. We had booked a PH A category, because it was literally the last cabin on the ship, and friends of ours really wanted us to go with them. Since the A cabins are on Deck 11 on the Mariner, they are on the same deck as the pool, grill, and La Veranda. I cannot count the number of times we would get off the elevator and head towards our cabin up front, and other people on the elevator who were going to the pool area would make some comment like, "Oh, aren't you special, you're way up here on Deck 11." One woman even said, "Oh, let me bow to you"...and then proceeded to do so (she was joking, but still...!). I cannot even begin to describe how uncomfortable I was, and I even started just taking the stairs (even if it meant going up four flights) to avoid the elevators. WE were not making a big deal of having a higher category cabin, but some of the other passengers sure were (and I felt terribly, terribly guilty every time someone said something. Why, I have no idea, but it was there, nonetheless). I know it is not the same as "class distinction" but I still feel that there was a type of distinction based on cabin, even if it wasn't overt (why would anyone feel it is appropriate to comment on another passenger's cabin category???). I hope this new program of Regent's doesn't add to that, but in a way, at least based on that cruise, I think some distinction is already there.

 

And no, I had no idea Regent offered military discounts...I will have to check with my TA on that one, as she never mentioned it.

[freddie]

TahoeTraveler - As it appears much of your previous cruising experience is with lines that clearly define a great deal of the cruise privileges (such as special lounges, the best restaurant tables, etc.) based upon the suite category, you might not be accustomed to the luxury cruise segment's general mode of providing all passengers with the full benefit of the offerings of the ship, irrespective of the category of cabin. That is the mode to which repeat passengers of Regent, Silversea & Seabourn have become accustomed and have the reasonable expectation to find on the ships of those lines.

 

As previous posters have pointed out, your attempted analogy to airline travel is entirely inappropriate, nearly as inappropriate as is your gratuitous reference to the members of our military forces. That reference has nothing whatever to do with this discussion and is offensive to this particular veteran. Should we reduce every discussion of cruise matters to a bottom line of how lucky we are to be able to cruise at all??!!

 

In any event, this new Concierge program seems to have been designed by the same group of monkeys at typewriters (the "infinite monkey theorem") that has developed the series of Regent passenger loyalty programs. Regent has, one could well assume, determined that it will become a sort of "super main-stream cruise line", competing not with other luxury lines but with the upper end of the mass-market lines and adopting the on-board models of those lines.

 

For many years, we Radisson/Regent loyalists have enjoyed (and often trumpeted) the lack of a class system on Regent. If that changes, there will certainly be a lot of unhappy people. However, there are two groups who will be quite happy with the change: the marketing/sales organizations of Silversea and Seabourn, who will welcome us heartily onto their ships.

 

In summary, Carnival can keep its class system on Cunard and Regent can become an up-scale mass-market line by instituting such a system. Fortunately, we all have alternative lines to book if that becomes the case.

[tallship]

Even though others repeatedly state that Oceania and Regent are not merging, Concierge class provides essentially the same benefits on both lines.

Sure will make price and value comparisons easier.

[SanFranCruizer]

Well, I guess it is good I tried out Silversea last year and liked it well enough. I have a cruise this year on Regent and one next year on Silversea. I don't like the sound of this. If I wanted this, I would sail on Oceania in a PH suite where it was blatantly obvious we got more reservations to the specialty restaurants, the spa, etc. They even had a whirlpool tub at the front of the ship that only those in Owners and Vista Suites could use! I didn't like that at all. But if Regent is heading that way, then the overall product is not luxury but mass market rewarding passengers who pay more with "luxury." For that, I could sail Oceania or other premium line. Yes, I think the folks at Silversea and Seabourn will, indeed, love this new level of service at Regent; it will drive a good number of us to their ships!

[tallship]

Very well stated by both Freddie and SanFran

Have you checked out the amazing pricing on Seabourn for the Baltics this summer?

[ChatKat in Ca.]

Ka Hanu:

 

You said it very nicely. (Thank your neighbors for their hospitality last week during the tsunami - the spirit of Aloha was evident)

 

What I see next is that Voyager and Mariner will go to Dry Dock and be retrofitted to work as Oceania ships. The next Marina and Riviera will have luxury suites. I think by the end 2012 schedules, we will have one line. There is already movement to Seabourne and Silversea and even Crystal among the Regent loyalists. Maybe they will even call them Regent Suites and not PH Suites. After our Med cruise in November, we will have no Regent cruises booked. We have a Viking River Cruise booked and if we like that, it's an option to do again. We like the ability to tour inland. We haven't done much of it and Ocean liners can't do those itineraries.

[OrpingtonT]

Just caught up with these interesting comments as it is morning here in the UK whilst through the night our US friends have been commenting on these changes. And I have to say that I agree with everyone. Time and time again I have said to friends that what I love about Regent is that irrespective of the suite booked, or the price paid for the cruise, everyone is treated the same.

 

It seems no more.

 

I have some sympathy with the planners in trying to find a bit extra for those who, because the lower decks sell out first, are forced to pay higher prices for D suites for example, even though those are exactly the same and because of their position high up, may be less attractive because of potential sea sickness. Thus I don't mind the proposition that any upgrades should be first offered to them. But most of the rest is simply offering preference where none is needed.

 

The practicalities also puzzle me. Early embarkation for some means coralling others away somewhere. Early luggage delivery means sorting luggage out to hold some back. These things mean more staff. Has it really been thought through?

 

In our six Regent cruises only a couple have been in the new "steerage" class, so my thoughts are not self interest and by definition, Regent could not conceivably call itself a luxury experience for all when these changes take place.

[smilingcruiser]

Time to stick my 3 cents into this discussion. I have a few questions:

 

1. When we sailed on the QMII to Europe, we did not, at all, feel like members of a lower class because we were not in a grill suite. Actually, when we sneaked through the Queen's grill dining room, we thought how much prettier the Brittania dining room was and the food basically comes from the same kitchen.

 

2. We become gold on our next cruise - so don't we have nearly the same privileges as the "concierge class" will have? Free internet, free telephone time (both a lot more than what will be offered). I think losing those perks would bother me more than a concierge class would. And it doesn't bother me that platinum passengers have free laundry - if I want my laundry done, I will pay for it.

 

3. We have always sailed in a Penthouse suite or above, and never had a problem with dining reservations. If we could not obtain them on our own, our butler could usually do it for us.

 

The only real annoyance would be priority boarding - I think that is blatantly unfair.

 

As an aside, we have only been on 1 cruise with included excursions. We never waited more than 10 minutes in the theater and most of the excursions were excellent. One was a real clinker (both the driver and the guide were terrible) and when we spoke with the tour desk about it, we were asked to write up the experience and assured that those individuals would not be hired again.

 

I hope that people are not over reacting and that Regent will remain basicallhy as good as it always has been for us.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

As I said in another thread, I hate this idea. Since we have such a wide consensus, how do we convey this to Regent? Perhaps they don't care if they don't really care about loyalty, but there must be a way of expressing our dismay.

 

Tahoe, the incidents you describe are pretty out there. Yes, there are (muted) distinctions already. There is a hushed tone when you walk by the Master's Suites on deck 11 of Voyager, as people come in and out. But that's *all*. Some stateroom envy, for sure, but that's trivial.

 

One of the nice things, always, about Radisson, now Regent, is the democratic feel of the passengers--except for the odd snob, no one discussed their stock portfolios or their financial success--just as religion and politics are rarely discussed, so too money discussions are avoided. Everyone was welcomed and mutually welcomed by fellow pax.

 

If Regent wants to have people pay for these expensive big cabins, then they should make these cabins *really nice*, and shower them with champagne and cosset them with butlers. Or give them perks like free dry cleaning. I'm surprised they don't do more of that, actually--why not? I know they provide laptops for these cabins, so why not more perks? But just not perks that affect the rest of us.

 

Let's face it, no one who takes these cruises is poor. There's just different levels of wealth. Yes, look around the world and at home--we are all extremely lucky.

[Emdee]

I totally agree with Mariners and a few of the other posters ( too numerous to name). I have never sailed Cunard for that specific reason. We do not book the high end suites on Regent as the size and comforts of the lower end on Regent are quite acceptable to us so this will definitely impact us.

 

I have only one Regent cruise booked for the next little while having cancelled one that was to hit the middle east area and I may rethink it when the time comes. There are a lot of cruise options in the market and we are intent on completing our bucket list so this may not be very difficult.

 

I have to admit when I have railed about something similar on another cruise line my family did remind me that I accept the perks of Business Class very quietly including early boarding, lounges better service etc. So while the analogy is not perfect there are some areas of similarity.