Teen accuses RCI employee of rape

[akcruz]

She does have some responsibility to behave responsibly. Getting drunk (if she did) when she is with a a stranger is not responsible. Does this mean she asked to get raped (if she did)? Of course not and it doesn't excuse what may have happened. But it means she has to hold some responsibility for whatever happened.

 

In addition, she is not innocent. She was drinking underage. Bad move, even on a supposedly "safe" vacation.

 

Lastly, he is INNOCENT until a jury proves him GUILTY. Something many seem to have forgotten.

 

I think this says it. While she did not deserve to have this happen and I hope that if there was wrongdoing on the musicians part he gets what he deserves.

 

On the other hand, she was underage and most likely fully aware she was doing something she wasn't supposed to by having the alcoholic drinks. Yes, kids often try to do these types of things on vacation, but if a parent is paying attention and making sure the rules are well known it is less likely to be an issue. We do give our teens freedom while on board but check up on them, most often without them knowing. Does this mean they don't ever do anything wrong, absolutely not, but it cuts back on the possibility a heck of lot, and if they do it is not as serious. Sharing this incident with your kids is a good way of letting them know what consequences are out there waiting for them if they try to push it too far.

[believer33323]

The FBI was all over it. They did not find anything. Anybody can file a lawsuit that don't make it true.

 

Can you say, Duke lacrosse???

[Debde]

I would hate for most of the posters here to be on any jury involving a rape victim. The majority here blame the victim and blame the parents without a whit of evidence to go on.

 

You are all speculating and putting your own spin on everything with absolutely no knowledge of anything that actually happened. You are guessing and surmising and nine of ten of you are pointing the finger at the girl because she didn't hide in her cabin the whole time she was on that ship.

 

No wonder the majority of rape cases never get reported. They victim is then victimized again - as this thread proves.

 

Agreed

No means NO and some responses from posters here are just frightening!!! I'm thinking a girl-any age sitting in a hallway crying must have uttered that two letter word at one time.

[Stags14]

What were the parents doing while teenage daughter was drinking and dancing with the crew?

 

Why was a teenager alone in a bar?

 

Very sad and upsetting for this young girl. But my question is...Where were the parents when she was hanging out in a bar?

 

The parents were probably sleeping. This isn't a 13 year old girl - she's a 17-18 year old girl. While still young, she is college-bound and likely won't have her parents there to hold her hand any longer.

 

Seems like she was having a fun night, gettin a nice buzz on some free drinks - went back with a guy and in the end when all was said and done she felt some guilt. My opinion... if it weren't for the photos - we wouldn't even be reading about this.

 

Truth is... girls this age get drunk and have sex all the time. I don't know why everyone is reacting like it never happens or like they never did it. The photographer thing was probably a bit too much... and like someone said - if there ARE pictures and she doesn't seem to be resisting then it will likely be very difficult if not impossible to charge him with rape. Is it wrong? Yea, it's wrong... but we could be dealing with a 22 year old magician which... 17 and 22 year olds "get together" all the time. We do not know the facts.

[Stags14]

Agreed

No means NO and some responses from posters here are just frightening!!! I'm thinking a girl-any age sitting in a hallway crying must have uttered that two letter word at one time.

 

Doesn't state she said no. Says she wanted to leave and it doesn't really explain at what point she said that.

 

When a girl goes back to a guy's room... it usually means sex. While I agree no means no - it doesn't seem like she resisted that much.

[Debde]

like I said............. frightening :rolleyes:

[Stags14]

like I said............. frightening :rolleyes:

 

I don't think my comments are frightening at all. They are simply my opinion. Reality is, guys and girls in this age group get drunk and have sex all the time... with the pictures involved she was probably concerned they'd end up all over the internet. Do you not think the FBI looked at the pictures? You think they would have photographic evidence of a rape and not charge the guy? C'mon.. :rolleyes:

[ryano]

like I said............. frightening :rolleyes:

 

Not frightening.....Reality.

 

Stags14 hit the nail on the head.........one of the best posts in this thread.

[Aquahound]

No means NO and some responses from posters here are just frightening!!! I'm thinking a girl-any age sitting in a hallway crying must have uttered that two letter word at one time.

 

Truth is, all this is over an article. And believe me, no media outlet ever gets the story straight. Media sensationalizes. It's their business. And I never believe what I read in the Sun Sentinel. Trust me, I've been victim of it more than once (media sensationalism resulting in false stories). In reality, none of us know what really happened....including whether or not this was consensual sex.

[sherilyn70]

Agreed

No means NO and some responses from posters here are just frightening!!! I'm thinking a girl-any age sitting in a hallway crying must have uttered that two letter word at one time.

 

Well then let me tell you a story about an 18 year old girl back in 1988 that met a 30 year old man that owned a store she frequented. They talked and had good conversations and the day she turned 18 he asked her out. She was naive and foolish and thought nothing was wrong with that. A couple of days later she found herself in a situation she had not expected, said no but it was not respected.... but also realized that she had been foolish enough to put herself in that situation and held herself accountable for it as well. Even worse, she ended up pregnant from it and her parents kicked her out of the house before high school was over and she had to move in with him to survive.

 

Bad things happen, we all make choices in our lives and we learn from them and (hopefully) grow stronger from them. I know that I did. Did he rape me? Yeah, he probably did. Did I put myself into that situation by going back to his apartment with him alone? Yeah, I did and I knew deep down inside that I should have not done that. So after a miscarriage we parted ways and I forgave him and myself for everything that had happened and all went on to live happily ever after.

 

I'm sorry but even having been an 18 year old "victim" I still think that she is most likely exaggerating and trying to save face for an embarrassing situation. She was with her parents and was probably too afraid to tell them the truth, that she let him buy her drinks (she could very easily have said no thanks) and then lapsed in judgement and went back to his room because she was enjoying the attention. Too many women these days try to push the blame onto the man because of their own lack of common sense and personal embarrassment.

 

The fact that the FBI has not pressed charges against him tells us she was 18 and that they also don't believe her story is credible.

[kaylorcc]

Agreed

No means NO and some responses from posters here are just frightening!!! I'm thinking a girl-any age sitting in a hallway crying must have uttered that two letter word at one time.

 

Oh no, Debde. Clearly she was crying in the hallway because she was ashamed at being so very, very drunk. :rolleyes:

[boowaaccaa]

If, as someone has suggested, she was likely at least 18 years old, would that not be the legal drinking age in some states? In our province, for example, the age of majority is 18. So she could probably just as easily have gone to a bar -- without her parents' knowledge or consent - in her home town.

 

The drinking age in your province (Ontario) is 19 -- next door in Quebec it is 18. In the USA it is 21.

[richstowe]

Reading all these posts, including my own ,many are hard and cold.

As I thought about this situation I realized 2 things. First I actually feel sorry for the young woman.

This was not in any way what she hoped for on her cruise.

Second thought was even having sympathy for her doesn't mean I believe she (and her family)

should get a financial windfall out of this sorry incident. Yes the staff member should have been fired but perhaps that's were this story should end.

[sherilyn70]

Second thought was even having sympathy for her doesn't mean I believe she (and her family)

should get a financial windfall out of this sorry incident. Yes the staff member should have been fired but perhaps that's were this story should end.

 

I absolutely agree. I feel bad that she went through this and had learn a hard lesson.... but I don't feel that she deserves compensation from anyone from it and they should have let it just end after the employee was fired for inappropriate behavior with a guest.

[thelion]

Oh no, Debde. Clearly she was crying in the hallway because she was ashamed at being so very, very drunk. :rolleyes:

 

Her crying the hallway very well could have been due to guilt. Or she was already set on setting him up.

 

Again, I'm not claiming she is lying or she is telling the truth. I am just saying there are A LOT of assumptions both ways going on here. The fact is, none of us were there.

[ryano]

The fact that the FBI has not pressed charges against him tells us she was 18 and that they also don't believe her story is credible.

 

I agree with this......Its amazing to me, how some here, living in a country whose judicial system is based on "INNOCENT until proven guilty" have already convicted the man based on one article posted in the Sun Sentinel even when the FBI has obviously decided there is no evidence to press charges.

 

Alot of what I read just does not add up and thats all I will say about this. Its a one sided story at best and none of us was there.

 

No worries.......Im going to don the flame proof suit now :)

[RBKL]

Why would they not prosecute though? Lack of evidence? Even if they said she was a willing participant -- she was only 15, wouldn't that have been enough to prosecute? Would the ship's doctor perform a rape kit onboard -- enough to stand up in court?

 

 

I'm not an expert but it is possible the FBI doesn't have jurisdiction in international waters on a non-U.S. flagged / registered ship. I'm also not sure the FBI is the law enforcement agency that handles rape charges. I'm sure there are legal experts or actual FBI agents that would know far better than me.

 

Just offering one option for why criminal charges may not have been filed.

[ryano]

I'm not an expert but it is possible the FBI doesn't have jurisdiction in international waters on a non-U.S. flagged / registered ship. I'm also not sure the FBI is the law enforcement agency that handles rape charges. I'm sure there are legal experts or actual FBI agents that would know far better than me.

 

Just offering one option for why criminal charges may not have been filed.

 

Maybe this will clear up a lot. It appears they do.

 

http://www.fbi.gov/news/testimony/crimes-against-americans-on-cruise-ships

 

Jurisdiction

First, I would like to briefly discuss where the FBI obtains its jurisdiction over crimes committed on cruise ships. The authority of the FBI to investigate criminal offenses and enforce laws of the United States on cruise ships on the high seas or territorial waters of the United States depends on several factors: The location of the vessel, the nationality of the perpetrator or victim, the ownership of the vessel, the points of embarkation and debarkation, and the country in which the vessel is flagged all play a role in determining whether there is federal authority to enforce the laws of the United States.

The principal law under which the U.S. exercises its Special Maritime and Territorial Jurisdiction is set forth in Section 7 of Title 18 of the U.S. Code. This statute provides, in relevant part, that the U.S. has jurisdiction over crimes committed on a ship if:

• The ship, regardless of flag, is a U.S.-owned vessel, either whole or in part, regardless of the nationality of the victim or the perpetrator, when such vessel is within the admiralty and maritime jurisdiction of the United States and out of the jurisdiction of any particular state;
  
• The offense by or against a U.S. national was committed outside the jurisdiction of any nation;
  
• The crime occurred in the U.S. territorial sea (within 12 miles of the coast), regardless of the nationality of the vessel, the victim or the perpetrator; or
  
• The victim or perpetrator is a U.S. national on any vessel during a voyage that departed from or will arrive in a U.S. port.
  

However, it is important to note, that when an incident occurs outside the territorial waters of the U.S., there are numerous other factors that come into play in determining the FBI's role and ability to investigate. In addition to the laws of the U.S., the laws of other sovereign nations, and international law will determine our legal authority to respond to and/or investigate the crime. As these incidents may involve the citizens or interests of other countries, the FBI's investigative efforts may implicate the sovereignty interests of other involved nations. Resolution of these questions requires consultation and coordination within the U.S. government

[Stags14]

Reading all these posts, including my own ,many are hard and cold.

As I thought about this situation I realized 2 things. First I actually feel sorry for the young woman.

This was not in any way what she hoped for on her cruise.

 

Second thought was even having sympathy for her doesn't mean I believe she (and her family)

should get a financial windfall out of this sorry incident. Yes the staff member should have been fired but perhaps that's were this story should end.

 

It's not that I don't feel bad for the girl or don't think the crewmember should be punished. I just don't think it was a non-consentual encounter.

 

I'm not an expert but it is possible the FBI doesn't have jurisdiction in international waters on a non-U.S. flagged / registered ship. I'm also not sure the FBI is the law enforcement agency that handles rape charges. I'm sure there are legal experts or actual FBI agents that would know far better than me.

 

Just offering one option for why criminal charges may not have been filed.

 

If the FBI didn't have jurisdiction, I don't think they would have not been involved at all. They get involved in pretty much whatever they want - and the boat left from Ft Lauderdale - I'm not 100% certain that where the ship is registered really matters to them.

[ryano]

I'm not 100% certain that where the ship is registered really matters to them.

 

Apparently, as long as the victim or perp is a US citizen and the ship left from or is arriving at a US port, it doesnt matter one bit.

[Maryscooking]

I am really tired of reading these responses about the girl's responsibility in this. What about the guy, who was older, and more worldly? What was his responsibility?

 

At least in Ohio, if you have sex with someone unable to consent, that is considered rape. And drunk = unable to consent. (As a side note, this doesn't only pertain to rape. As an RN, I know that consent for treatment cannot be obtained from a person who has taken narcotic pain meds because they are considered impaired.)

 

My husband was in a college fraternity. They were very big on "risk management." One HUGE thing drilled into their heads was not to engage in sexual activity with an intoxicated woman - because she cannot legally agree to it, and you are culpable for rape. Not saying everyone stuck to that advice, but it was there.

 

I don't know the laws that pertain to Florida, or what kind of evidence would be needed to prove rape, but I have to say that several of the responses in this thread are disturbing to say the least.

 

Not every 18 yr old girl has experience with or understands the effects of alcohol on her body, especially large amounts of alcohol.

 

Not every 18 yr old girl believes (or understands that men believe) that going back to a guys room = sex.

 

If some 20-something cruise ship musician (singer? I forget.) violates his employer's policies, provides a teenager with several alcoholic drinks and then takes her back to his room to have sex with her, and then later gets accused of rape (lets leave the "photographer" part out for now)? I know who I think has more responsibility in that case.

[Maryscooking]

It's not that I don't feel bad for the girl or don't think the crewmember should be punished. I just don't think it was a non-consentual encounter.

 

I thought this might be of interest to you:

A person who is asleep or mentally or physically incapacitated either through the effect of drugs or alcohol, or for any other reason, is not capable of giving valid consent.

 

The State of Connecticut amplifies the definition of lack of consent in the following ways: someone might not give consent because of mental incapacity (they might have consumed alcohol or drugs so as to become significantly impaired in awareness or judgment,

 

http://yalecollege.yale.edu/content/definition-sexual-misconduct-including-sexual-assault-and-sexual-harassment

[Scotty G]

Here is the link to the applicable US Law regarding this allegation:

 

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-3360

 

Since we don't have the facts in this case, I suggest we just wait and see what transpires.

[cruisecrasy]

This reminds me that I need to talk to my daughter about putting herself in situations where things could happen. I don't blame any victims, but some victims could avoid becoming one if only they would only use precaution. Don't leave with a man you don't know! You hear too many stories about young women like Natalie Holloway...if only...

 

While I am very sympathetic to this child if this did happen as reported - where were this young ladys parents for heavans sake??? :O

 

I am appalled having had a very attractive daughter myself that travelled with us on cruises from age 13 to 18 yrs old..I never went to sleep until she was back and had an itinerary from her ea eve also which she was happy to give me knowing it was for her safety..Always checked in a couple of times ea eve and if changing the itinerary she wld let us know. She had a great time ea cruise and never experienced anything remotely like this!

She never ordered alcoholic drinks nor drank anything offered either and wldn't even entertain the idea of going with anyone anywhere & I made sure she was aware of men putting drugs into her drinks if left unattended also..

 

This young girls parents shld be up on charges of child endangerment or something IMO anyway - don't they care about their child - if she is ONLY 15 yrs old they failed their child!! Its not the crews job to look after her, it was theirs!!

Now, if she is older then they still failed because they didn't teach her the problems facing young ladies today OR of course, she might be a trifle silly and like to take chances..Hard lesson to learn if that is the case and while another poster said they were tired of reading about the girls responsibilty & how about the mans instead - he wasn't the one raped!! I do believe he shld be held fully responsible I so agree..but girls/ladies need to protect themselves cause they are the ones at risk!!

 

So sad & unnecessary with a little common sense from the girl plus her parents if they were onboard!!

[Debde]

Oh no, Debde. Clearly she was crying in the hallway because she was ashamed at being so very, very drunk. :rolleyes:

 

do you know this for a fact???

 

The article states at one point she had a moment of being able to think clearly and wanted to leave and it is worded to make us think she was not allowed to leave.

 

Thank the lord, I have never beem raped nor held against my will to be anywhere with anyone and if either of the above happened, I do not know what my reaction would be.

 

Stags-your frightening comment was one that said many that go back to someones room wants sex. Ryano thinks you hit the nail on the head. That mentality frightens me in my opinion. We're all entitled to them, we'll all agree to disagree!;)

 

None of us have any good information to properly access this situation but to those who threw this girl under the bus immediatly might want to look at some human compassion for a bit-that's all I'm trying to say.