Can someone explain an overbooke cruise?

[les221b]

I just received an email which has me puzzled. Perhaps someone can

explain it to me.

 

I'm booked on an Oceania cruise which leaves in early July. The date

for final payment was early February.

 

Oceania now says that the cruise is overbooked and is offering a full

refund plus $1,000-$3,000 if I cancel.

 

Does this mean that Oceania collects full fare from more people than

they have room for, with the expectation that some will cancel, with

a 100% cancellation penalty, and they will double-sell some cabins?

I thought that the purpose of a waitlist is to avoid this possibility.

 

How, and, did Oceania screw up? Is this common with other cruise lines?

 

Les

[LHT28]

I just received an email which has me puzzled. Perhaps someone can

explain it to me.

 

I'm booked on an Oceania cruise which leaves in early July. The date

for final payment was early February.

 

Oceania now says that the cruise is overbooked and is offering a full

refund plus $1,000-$3,000 if I cancel.

 

 

Les

 

It seems to be common for cruise lines to over book a cruise just like the airlines ...

If you do not want to take the offer just decline ...someone will take the right offer ;)

 

Lyn

[JimandStan]

I just received an email which has me puzzled. Perhaps someone can

explain it to me.

 

I'm booked on an Oceania cruise which leaves in early July. The date

for final payment was early February.

 

Oceania now says that the cruise is overbooked and is offering a full

refund plus $1,000-$3,000 if I cancel.

 

Does this mean that Oceania collects full fare from more people than

they have room for, with the expectation that some will cancel, with

a 100% cancellation penalty, and they will double-sell some cabins?

I thought that the purpose of a waitlist is to avoid this possibility.

 

How, and, did Oceania screw up? Is this common with other cruise lines?

 

Les

 

It may seem hard to believe , but according to the bean counters, it is safe and even profitable to overbook the ship by a certain percentage, in order to keep it sailing full even after the normal number of last minute cancellations take place.

As you have experienced, sometimes the expected number don't cancel and Oceania is forced to buy people off the cruise, but the big picture is that overbooking is profitable, or they would not do it.

 

Every cruise line, Air Line, Hotel and Car Rental Agency overbook. It is a very very common business practice.

[rallydave]

To add to Jim and Stan's excellent explanation, all of these companies who overbook do not do this blindly. They keep extensive historical records of dates, locations, and many other things relevent to help them come up with the number of cancellations expected based on all of this history. This allows all of these companies to overbook based on history and usually avoid the type of buy off that Oceania is now offering.

 

Assuming history repeats itself the companies can sail with full ships in lieu of booking to capacity and having cancellations result in less than full ships, planes, etc.

 

Yes, sometimes they have to offer rather large sums of money to take care of their customers but, in most cases, the companies come out ahead because of all of the historical records they rely on.

[aohkay]

Over selling hotel rooms is VERY common. If you are going to be late for check in, always, always call ahead to let them know. Generally, when rooms are over sold, the person who shows up first, gets the room. When you show up later, the hotel will "walk" you to another hotel and pay your bill. It is still to their advantage to over sell rooms, even when they pay the occassional folio. As another poster mentioned, they rely on historical data and trends.

 

With regards to Oceania over selling. We were lucky enough to take advantage of their offers. We changed our date, ship and itinerary, but it was well worth it for us.

[gillianrose]

Oceania now says that the cruise is overbooked and is offering a full refund plus $1,000-$3,000 if I cancel.

 

$1,000-$3,000...why the range?

[aohkay]

They'll start off with perhaps offering to pay the gratuities. If you don't move, they'll throw in something else and wait for your reply. On it goes until they've reached what they deem an appropriate amount to get you to move.

 

If you don't want to move, you don't have to and they'll move on to the next person they want to move and start the whole process again.

[Paulchili]

They'll start off with perhaps offering to pay the gratuities. If you don't move, they'll throw in something else and wait for your reply. On it goes until they've reached what they deem an appropriate amount to get you to move.

 

If you don't want to move, you don't have to and they'll move on to the next person they want to move and start the whole process again.

 

We were once in a similar situation with Oceania. We had a veranda and they apparently oversold those, but had oceanview and partial obstructed oceanview cabins. We accepted 2 downgrades and saved THOUSANDS of $$$ on this cruise (we almost sailed for free , but not quite). In the end we had a perfectly good oceanview cabin.

Just decline the offer or wait for the offer that you "can't refuse" :D

[hondorner]

...How, and, did Oceania screw up? Is this common with other cruise lines?

As others have said, this is NOT a screw up, this is a Good Thing, both for the cruise line and the passengers.

 

For the cruise line, because managed properly, it maximises their revenue and makes the greatest number of guests happy.

 

For the passengers, as has been related, if you are flexible enough to accept the offers, they can be very valuable.

 

There really is no downside -- several years ago, the founder of Oceania (Frank Del Rio, now Chairman of parent company Prestige Cruise Holdings) came on to this forum and promised that no one would ever be involuntarily bumped off a cruise due to overbooking. That promise has been kept.

[Shipshape Commodore]

You cannot compare Cruise Lines with airlines. Airlines overbook because they know that some people have fully flexible tickets which they can change or cancel without financial loss. if someone with such a ticket does not show then the airline loses. That is why they overbook flights. It enables them to ensure the plane is full.

 

Oceania overbooks because it wants to profit from peoples misfortune. If you cancel a cruise line booking at the last minute you lose 100% of the cost of the cruise. By overbooking Oceania can get paid twice for one cabin.

 

This is just profiteering. How many times have you heard that Oceania (or any other cruise line) has repaid a cutomer because they have been able to resell their cabin?

[rallydave]

Please see answers in red withing the quote. Basically the poster is almost totally incorrect because of missing some very salient points.

 

You cannot compare Cruise Lines with airlines. Airlines overbook because they know that some people have fully flexible tickets which they can change or cancel without financial loss. if someone with such a ticket does not show then the airline loses. That is why they overbook flights. It enables them to ensure the plane is full.

 

Very few people by airline tickets that are not non-refundable and insurance is available to cover airline tickets much like it is available to cover cruises. Only the value insured is different. Both airlines and cruise lines overbook to insure they are full. The comparison is totally valid and the only difference that I can think of is that people can buy airline tickets that are fully refundable but, except for SW and perhaps one or two others these tickets are really expensive and not worth buying for the risk. Cruises don't sell refundable tickets without insurance.

 

Oceania overbooks because it wants to profit from peoples misfortune. If you cancel a cruise line booking at the last minute you lose 100% of the cost of the cruise. By overbooking Oceania can get paid twice for one cabin.

 

And how is this different from airlines. If someone cancels, they for the most part don't get their money back and the airline, if they resell the seat the airline gets paid twice for one seat. Again, almost totally identical.

 

This is just profiteering. How many times have you heard that Oceania (or any other cruise line) has repaid a cutomer because they have been able to resell their cabin?

 

I'll answer you question in that the same number of times that airlines have repaid a customer. Doesn't happen for airlines or cruise lines. It's certainly not profiteering as you certainly have the option to not book a cruise or a flight. Perfectly legal and in full compliance with the Terms and Conditions that you have access to when you book. It's really a shame people don't read the T's & C's before they sign or agree to a contract which is what you do when you book. Have seen and hear of too many cases in court wasting the court's time and costing us all money because people didn't read what they signed and now want to re-negotiate an agreed to contract. Don't forget, Oceania and most all cruise lines do not keep your money from the time you book until a specified time before the cruise when the money is fully or almost fully refundable. For airline tickets, most all tickets are non-refundable from the moment you book and pay. Also you must pay the full price for the plane ticket when you book; for cruises you only pay a deposit with the balance due later. Now tell me who is profiteering??

 

[Shipshape Commodore]

In my experience i have yet to find a Business or First Class air fare which was not fully refundable. This is why airlines overbook. i agree that most economy tickets are not refundable but these tickets are probably around 10% of the cost of an Oceania cruise. Quite often these can be changed subject to a fee. This makes them totally different from the practice of overbooking by Oceania.

 

The reason it is so different is that there are NO cancellation conditions for the purchase of any Oceania cabin. The minute you make your booking you are subject to their cancellation conditions. Unlike airlines you cannot buy a cabin that gives you a 100% cancellation option (unless you buy an insurance package). This means that whilst an airline could lose money if i did not turn up Oceania does not.

 

The practice of double selling cabins guarantees that Oceania will make money for Oceania so it must be profiteering. How else can it be explained. If they refunded a customer when the cabin is resold when the ship is full (subject to a fee) then I would agree that they would not be profiteering. (The same policy should also apply to airlines).

 

Selling a cbin twice might be legal but that does not make it right.

[dundeene]

prof·it·eer

verb /ˌpräfəˈti(ə)r/ 

 

Make or seek to make an excessive or unfair profit, esp. illegally or in a black market

- the profiteering of tabloid journalists

 

noun /ˌpräfəˈti(ə)r/ 

profiteers, plural

 

A person who profiteers

- a war profiteer

 

I don't see Oceania or Airlines use of "over selling" to meet this definition from Websters

neither is black market or doing anything illegal

travelers are asked and advised many times to buy travel insurance, we certainly do

 

Cruise companies often do not make the bulk of their money on the cruise itself (some such as Carnival actually loose money on the ticket sales!).

It is not having a booked cabin that makes the difference between profit and loss. It is the 2 persons occupying that cabin that purchase spa treatments, excursions, gift shop items, gratuities and alcohol that keep cruise companies out of the red.

 

just my 2 cents:rolleyes:

[Shipshape Commodore]

I am not saying that there is anything wrong with over booking.

 

I fully accept that if the ship is not 100% full Oceania have every right to retain the monies paid.

 

I am not suggesting that the cabin cannot be resold thus ensuring the ship is full and the company can benefit from on board spend.

 

It is when they retain money if the ship is 100% full. If that is not making an excessive or unfair profit what is?

 

As I said earlier it may not be illegal but that does not make it right.

[Floridiana]

How many times have you heard that Oceania (or any other cruise line) has repaid a cutomer because they have been able to resell their cabin?

 

Once, our cabin. We were offered a substantial cabin upgrade for the same cruise a year later. We took it!

[JimandStan]

The practice of double selling cabins guarantees that Oceania will make money for Oceania so it must be profiteering.

 

Quite Right, Comrade, and come the revolution none of these filthy capitalist pigs will dare to dispute your opinions.

You need only to point to the massive success of the Soviet Cruise ship fleet if there is any dissension.

 

 

Their refusal to renovate or redecorate their liners, helped maintain a museum like aura as they aged.

 

So much nicer than what Oceania has on offer

[hondorner]

...How many times have you heard that Oceania (or any other cruise line) has repaid a cutomer because they have been able to resell their cabin?

Me. I was booked on a back-to-back cruise first 14 days from Miami to Barcelona, and then 10 days on to Rome from Barcelona. We were due to sail March 21, 2010. I had a stroke on March 19.

 

Obviously, we had to cancel. And, just as obviously, Oceania had no opportunity to resell our cabin in 1-1/2 days. that first leg was covered by our travel insurance. Someone benefitted from a very nice surprise when they arrived at the ship - an upgrade to stern balcony I had booked!

 

But, while I was in hospital, I received a call from Oceania, telling me they were giving me a full refund for the second leg. I assume it was because they had been able to resell the cabin (it was a very desirable cabin).

 

So, it happens, at least with a great cruise line, perhaps not with the mainstream lines where you're just a number. It may not happen very often, because I suspect that in the case of most last minute cancellations, they are NOT able to readily resell the cabin. Especially with a cruise line like Oceania, where everyone but the rawest newbie knows that late bookings are hard to get and more expensive, I would imagine there are few last -minute customers. Their policy has to be a limitation on the refunds, because they have to cover the probability that the cabin remains empty during the cruise.

 

This boils down to CYA and good business sense, not the deliberate criminal act you implied.

[roothy123]

I am hoping that my cruise gets overbooked. I've got a guarantee for the lowliest of low cabins on Marina (G - only 4 on whole ship, I believe!) and if Oceania has overbooked and nobody cancels, I may get an upgrade! Bring it on! The inside cabins are completely adequate, but an Ocean View or Veranda cabin would be even better so that I could see some daylight!

[JimandStan]

I am hoping that my cruise gets overbooked. I've got a guarantee for the lowliest of low cabins on Marina (G - only 4 on whole ship, I believe!) and if Oceania has overbooked and nobody cancels, I may get an upgrade! Bring it on! The inside cabins are completely adequate, but an Ocean View or Veranda cabin would be even better so that I could see some daylight!

 

You may get an upgrade, in fact, I wish you luck, but it is more likely that you will be offered an up-sell, so if you want to see the daylight, don't put your wallet away just yet! :D

[caroak]

So are you saying if your "guaranteed" cabin in the category you booked is not available you will be bumped up but with the possibility of additional $$$'s? I thought a guarantee meant you are guaranteed the category you booked or higher without an upgrade charge.

[roothy123]

I don't honestly know, although I think it means, as you say, that I'll end up with a category G or higher at no additional cost. However, I suppose they can ASK me if I want to upgrade for more money! In my case, I'll probably say no, and see where I end up, as we have cruised in inside cabins on Regatta and Insignia and found them to be fine. We have only booked a quaranteed cabin once before, but lucked out then - got upgraded for free to a veranda cabin! Now we go ahead and book guaranteed cabins rather than a specific cabin, as cabin number or location (or even category) isn't all that important to us!

[azevedan]

So are you saying if your "guaranteed" cabin in the category you booked is not available you will be bumped up but with the possibility of additional $$$'s? I thought a guarantee meant you are guaranteed the category you booked or higher without an upgrade charge.

Right, but I imagine they'll offer it to all of you in that category and see who bites. If no one does, then they'd do an upgrade for no cost, I guess. But makes sense that they try the upsell first.

[JimandStan]

I thought a guarantee meant you are guaranteed the category you booked or higher without an upgrade charge.

 

That is correct, and you are GUARANTEED at least the category that you bought in on; however, many people will choose to spring for an up-sell in the hand rather than wait for a possible free upgrade in the bush. ;)

[roothy123]

That is correct, and you are GUARANTEED at least the category that you bought in on; however, many people will choose to spring for an up-sell in the hand rather than wait for a possible free upgrade in the bush. ;)

 

Guess most people aren't as cheap (or would that be "cheep...cheep" if in the bush?) as me!

[Kissing Seahorses]

Shipshape Commodore- Many airlines now sell restricted Business and First Class airfares at a considerable discount that are non-refundable and often have other length of stay requirements as well. These fares are aimed at the leisure traveler and are most often not appropriate for a business traveler.

 

Airlines and Cruiselines overbook because they both provide a service that is perishable. Once a plane leaves the gate or a ship departs the dock there is no longer any way to fill that space. They overbook in order to fill all the space possible and then they can reshuffle the mix, usually by offering paid upsells at a discount of the usual fare or by upgrading their best customers to a higher level of seat or accommodation to make space available.