Oasis 08/25/12 - Security Incident

[Sea and Me]

[SIZE=3]Parents are childrens first "teachers". We are to teach respect for others including their property!! That property includes when we are on a cruise ship, other vacation spots and in our neighborhoods. If parents taught their children well, we would have children who respect their parents, relatives, and the people they encounter on a daily basis.[/SIZE]
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[SIZE=3]To teach children that there is a consequence for their actions is a lesson well taught. The people who did the action are paying the consequence. Enough said.[/SIZE]
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[SIZE=3]Carol[/SIZE]
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[PesterGal]

Bluegirl, very insightful response - realistic food-for-thought for those of us that have never made an error in judgement

[marci22]

[quote name='Ocean Boy']Any seats at "Invitation to Dance" would be my idea of torture. I really dislike that show. And it seems to follow me from ship to ship.:eek:[/quote]

My kids are tortured by the Royal Caribbean Singers and Dancers in general, lol.

[AFS1970]

[quote name='SeaUs'][SIZE=1]agreed, but the family doesn't get arrested for it. Just the one that did it[/SIZE][/quote]

[SIZE=3][COLOR=Blue]Well I suppose they could be given the option of abandoning their child on a foreign island and facing those consequences. Let's face it, even if RCI did say that only the offending party had to leave, how many of us would wave goodby to even the worst of our family members and continue with the cruise?[/COLOR][/SIZE]

[quote name='SeaUs'][SIZE=1]suppose you were the older sister or brother of the kid that did it. Do you think you should be blacklisted just because you were in the same cabin or an adjoining cabin?[/SIZE][/quote]

[SIZE=3][COLOR=Blue]For this one, I might go with a life time ban for the ones that did it and a year or two for the ones that were not involved[SIZE=3]. [/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=3][COLOR=Blue]Let's face it they were raised by the same pack of wolves, er I mean parents.[/COLOR][/SIZE]

[quote name='kassimer1'][SIZE=1]maybe they should also ban adults from meeting and drinking since there are alot of alcohol related incidences on the ships...[/SIZE][/quote]

[SIZE=3][COLOR=Blue]Wow, made it almost to the end for this one. Every thread about youthful behavior on CC eventually gets the reply that adults also behave poorly and therefor we should not unduly punish the children. Well there are two things wrong with that attitude, first being that children are children and do not yet have the same rights as adults, so they can and should be punished. Second, perhaps if children learn these lessons sooner, there will be less problems with bad behavior as adults, because they learned the lessons as children. [/COLOR][/SIZE]

[Onessa]

[quote name='andiloveu']I am not shocked to hear what these kids did or the other stories here of bad behavior. It seems like kids today do not have respect for anyone. That would include parents, teachers or anyone they come in contact with. I feel like children are not taught anything from their parents and learn alot from tv. Most of the kids shows are about how stupid mom and dad are and how the kids are so much wiser and come off like some hero at the end. I feel sorry for teachers today who have to deal with these little monsters. I'm not saying all kids are bad but from what I've seen it is turning out to be alot more lately. I started home schooling my children for this same reason. Within the last year there has been two bomb threats and a fire started in the school. We live in a nice area with new schools but these kids today are out of control. So to hear that these kids did this on vacation does not surprise me in the least because they are probably terrors at home too.[/QUOTE]The "kids these days" argument goes back hundreds of years (literally). I remember a GOF neighbor complaining about "kids these days" 45 years ago when there was a referendum to replace the old high school with a new one.

My DD goes to a public high school and while every year it seems that there is some scandal (drinking party, fight, etal) 98% of the kids are not involved (and most are even unaware). Meanwhile, the kids are living in the real world, and learning how to get along with other people, how to be responsible for themselves (since mommy isn't there tohold their hand 24/7), and to be exposed to some other ideas ( because not everyone is going to think the same way that they do).

We cannot shelter our kids from all outside influences for 18-21 years and expect them to be able to function in the world.

[quote name='crusinmama06']It's not the teens that are participating in the teen club that are the problem. If they were participating in the teen club - then they wouldn't be out roaming the ship and trying to lower a life boat.

It's the ones that think they are "too cool" for the teen club that are out wandering the ship or the parents that don't enforce a curfew that cause the problems.

We just got off the Enchantment and while my daughter was having a fabulous time in the teen club - another group of teens made it their goal that week to be a total nuisance to the other passengers.

While my daughter was attending the "teen prom" - another group of teens were trying to fit as many people as possible into a hot tub. It didn't matter that there were ALREADY 6 adults in the hot tub. These smart alec kids tried to put 15 teens on top of the 6 adults.

While I know that a teen dance party was going on in the teen club. Other teens chose to hang out as a gang outside the solarium doors throwing things at each other from one deck to another. So when adults tried to walk into the solarium you had to duck the things they were throwing.

My teen daughter had a midnight curfew and I met her at the teen club every night.

My youngest had a 10pm curfew.

We can't blame the teen programs. A little bit of common sense parenting goes a long way![/QUOTE]
Some of the parents of those kids you saw causing problems probably thought that thier kids [B]were[/B] in the teen program. And not every teen not at the Prom were causing mischief. Some may have been watching a movie or playing cards.

[deborahjo]

Parents need to watch their kids. Have said this til I am blue in my face. But of course I am wrong. But when your child gets hurt don't come running saying it is the cruise lines fault because you were not watching your child. Parents want it both ways but you can't have it both ways.

[beachnative]

I've been following this thread since it began and have had to laugh at the few posters who said that banning the families from Royal Caribbean was too harsh. Why would they really care...there are other cruise lines out there. The teens probably couldn't care less about the ban because they have grown up in a culture of entitlement and people who think they can talk they way out of any situation.

[johneeo]

[quote name='beachnative'] The teens probably couldn't care less about the ban because they have grown up in a culture of entitlement and people who think they can talk they way out of any situation.[/quote]

Maybe you are 100% correct.

Or possibly, it was a pretty decent kid that did something really stupid.

Gets his or her entire family thrown off of the cruise ship in a foreign country, maybe their vacation of a lifetime .... maybe someone did not even have a passport ..... could not even get back to the US .... as noted, fined $16,000 ...... how do you think that kid felt about all of that?

Couldn't imagine.

[Nyc2tropics]

Listen it was stupid of the teens to do what they did and I'm fine with the fact that they were removed at the next port but to ban them for life? I mean give me a break kids do stupid stuff all the time.

[joe6666]

[quote name='Nyc2tropics']Listen it was stupid of the teens to do what they did and I'm fine with the fact that they were removed at the next port but to ban them for life? I mean give me a break kids do stupid stuff all the time.[/quote]

Stupid stuff all the time?

Perhaps you are right.... But at least it wont be that kid.

[IslandEmily]

Just to mix the ideas up - Say 1,000 couples who lost excursions they paid for said time on vacation which they saved all year for went together and filed a class action against the parents of the teens who ruined this day for them - What then? I am not one to goto the legal system but maybe examples well made will put other parents and children in check. You do not let a child run wild in the street and hope a car stops you are with them and train them accordingly.

[cruzincurt]

[quote name='marci22']I disagree because although a young person may know right from wrong, they don't have the perspective of someone older. Throwing something overboard might be a pattern of destructive behavior but it might also just be a stupid impulse. If you let kids know in advance the ramifications, they might think twice.

Pathological criminals will not be swayed, I agree.[/quote]
So we then have to make up a comprehensive list of no-no's and the related consequences? If it's not on the list, then what?

Can someone define "peer naughtiness"? Is it OK if no one is injured or dies? Boy is that a wimpy PC term.

[chipq]

RCI does not need to use their names but it would be nice to see an official release of this incident and the consequences so that all parents can share with their kids. What sounds like fun or cool many times gets your can in a sling. Nothing like having to work off the cost of the fruise, cost of last minute travel back to originating port, etc. Hope these kids learned something from this.


[url]http://luv2cruise.blogspot.com[/url]

[Mademypoint]

We were on a HAL ship and when it was in port in Key West a few "kids" decided it would be fun (at one of the parents encouragement) to jump off from the 5th deck. They were escorted OFF the ship along with their parents still wet and wearing towels over their bathing suits.

[sr5242]

[quote name='Mademypoint']We were on a HAL ship and when it was in port in Key West a few "kids" decided it would be fun (at one of the parents encouragement) to jump off from the 5th deck. They were escorted OFF the ship along with their parents still wet and wearing towels over their bathing suits.[/QUOTE]

Off the deck into the ocean???? How dangerous!

[How'sBartCruisin'?]

[quote name='Ocean Boy']Any seats at "Invitation to Dance" would be my idea of torture. I really dislike that show. And it seems to follow me from ship to ship.:eek:[/QUOTE]

I agree. I don't enjoy Dancing with the Stars or other dancing shows. I don't enjoy that one either. It bores the death out of me just watching them at the Sail Away show. I'm not going to spend two nights watching just that.

[CruisingMachine]

[quote name='Nyc2tropics']Listen it was stupid of the teens to do what they did and I'm fine with the fact that they were removed at the next port but to ban them for life? I mean give me a break kids do stupid stuff all the time.[/quote]

First of all, RCI has the right to deny boarding for life to anyone they want.

Secondly, the "stupid stuff" these kids did was destruction of safety equipment, create a major inconvenience for thousands of people, and cost the cruiseline tens of thousands of dollars. That is taking "stupid stuff" to a level all its own.

Now, can you imagine a cruiseline kicking you off a ship, giving you a bill for $16,000, and then telling you "come back and sail with us again!"

Uh, NO.

And if these hooligans did go on a cruise with RCI again, what are the chances they would be up to no good again as "payback" for the hell they caught? Pretty good I would say, so why in the world would RCI take that chance? That would be idiotic for the cruiseline to welcome back such guests. They would be asking for trouble.

[How'sBartCruisin'?]

[quote name='kassimer1']maybe they should also ban adults from meeting and drinking since there are alot of alcohol related incidences on the ships. i believe more girls and women were raped on the ships by adult males, maybe male should be banned from talking to females. I dont see your idea as a good responce. how many teens meet life long friends on a cruise, how about all the teens that dont misbehave and act more adultish than some of the adults are. I think punishing the guilty parties was the right thing to do. Also since we dont know the age of the teens involved they could have been 18 and adults so being up that late was legal for them. Yes there are alot of kids that have no respect, but there is also those who actually are polite and helpful but they dont get noticed[/QUOTE]

Oh okay.

[Time2SetSail]

[QUOTE=Cruisin' On A Dime!;35195186]The fight at the beginning of the musical "Hairspray" was totally disruptive to the entire balcony sections. And from what we heard (This man's wife had to give a written statement because she was sitting behind the incident)...The man who threw the first punch was taken off the ship in St. Thomas. We also heard it was over saving seats.

That's good to hear, but our friends saw his family a few days later (maybe he didn't get to come back), so hard to tell what really happend. Either way, this was over a woman saving a couple seats...there were plenty of other open seats; some people just dont like being told they can't have something. The fact that a grown man would sucker punch another grown man over a seat during a FAMILY event was repulsive :mad:

[iheartbda]

[quote name='janetz']Do you really think of all the people on a ship these folks are members of CC or even know about CC?[/quote]
It wouldn't be the first time someone found CC [I]only[/I] to complain about something with their first post never to be heard from again. ;)

BTW, I took the post by the person you were responding to as sarcastic.:)

[dchillis]

Kudos to RccL for not putting money first and booting the brats of and blacklisting them.. Although I wonder if a couple years down the road the list with seem to fade to maybe gray. But anyway good job.

[hsaroya]

[quote name='Bluegirl']I have to admit, reading about these incidents really has me thinking. My kids are a lot younger, just 9 and 7, and while it will be a long, long time till they have any sort of "free run" of a cruise ship or any other vacation spot, I'm still a bit freaked out at the thought of the trouble that even "good kids" can surely get into. Kids, with their not-yet-developed brains and poor impulse control, may not have the presence of mind to realize the ramifications of the company they keep and the actions they're taking or even just going along with. I also think that it would be really easy for kids who would NEVER themselves be instigators to find themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time. And then the consequences of that--of not stopping things from getting out of hand, of not getting out of there if and letting someone in authority know if they can't stop it--are irreversible.

I think my kids are "good kids" but I also dog them mercilessly when we're cruising. In that regard, cruising is no different from daily life (except that, when we're at home, I don't also have to fear offending random strangers or eliciting disapproving looks from others). When we're on the pool deck and they want to go get soft-serve by themselves, I usually agree but end up watching them like a hawk from a good vantage-point--and critiquing their manners, technique, etc. after the fact. Lol, in a constructive way, of course. I mean, they are learning, but you literally have to remind a child 1,000 times to "Please remember to step back and let others off the elevator before you start trying to get in," or "Remember to keep in mind that others are walking behind you, so don't stop suddenly and just stand there," or "Looking so sullen at the dinner table is just as inconsiderate of everyone as eating with your mouth open or talking too loud" ... OK, that last one is my pet peeve.

Anyway, kids are a work in progress. I'm not so sure that the teenagers responsible for the life-ring incident represent "the criminal element." In fact, it's far more likely that they were normal kids who made a very, very bad decision and will now regret it for a long time to come. Maybe first-time cruisers who had no idea of the consequences of what they thought was a "silly prank" (tens of thousands of $$$ in fuel costs?? I'm sure they had NO IDEA of that).

And these thoughts have me shaking in my boots, truth be told. My boys are going to suffer a serious, preachy sit-down with me before we board and probably again while we're unpacking. I know how exciting the idea of spitting off the side of the boat probably seems to them; I've never heard them express such a thought, but I can just FEEL it... I'm thinking now that, though we've cruised many times before, it's probably a good idea to reinforce, reinforce, reinforce--with each new embarkation--what constitutes proper behavior.[/quote]

Well said, Bluegirl. Your kids are exactly the type I want to see more of on my future cruises - the ones who've been preached to!
PS: I'll trade you one sullen 13 yo girl at the dinner table for your sullen 9 yo boy any day of the week!!

[lori450]

[quote name='joe6666'][FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]There should be a curfew for anyone who is not an adult.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]What time?[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]I don’t know.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman][SIZE=3]But minors shouldn’t have the run of the ship late at night.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[SIZE=3][FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][/SIZE][/QUOTE]

There are curfews

[travelplus]

I would hope these teens get punished for their actions. The prank is as bad as activating a fire alarm on the ship. Here the captain really thought someone went overboard. If I saw a life preserver go overboard I would have told a crewmember immediately that I thought someone went overboard. This costs the cruise line both time and money as the Coast Guard has to be called no matter what.

Just imagine the wasted resources, missed tours and lost fuel. I would have hoped RCL persecuted these teens(age does not matter) you are still responsible for your actions as are your parents.

If these were my teenagers I would have told the captain and security officers to charge them even if its in international waters. While I'm the parent and have to pay the fees the teens would work it off. They would have a criminal record and I would not show one ounce of remorse for them.

Secondly they would not be cruising with me or anyone. If RCCL wants to ban someone from cruising its the teenagers who committed the crime and they must do the time. While I would watch them the best that I could and made sure they met their curfew I can;t watch them every second of every waking hour.

As a teen I never would have thought in my wildest dreams to ruin a vacation for others. I cannot even imagine doing a stupid act like this.

Now mind you I love having fun on a cruise and enjoyed my last cruise. If I wanted to have fun with the crew I would just make a joke or talk about where they are from. I would not want to danger the lives of fellow cruisers,

I am fully backing the captain his crew and the headquarters on their decisions

[phabric]

We were on a Princess ship. We had taken the paid ship tour. It was told to us how serious the cruiselines takes for throwing something overboard. It was mentioned that some kid had thrown a basketball overboard and were charged $5,000, they did not mention if anything happened to him.