Things being Discontinued the Fall?

[Laminator]

[quote name='Wakepatrol']Just hang around the front desk near the end of the cruise. You will see a line (as if they're giving away free cruises) with people removing the service charge. The best is those that claim "They Never Knew Of Such A Charge"

Or better yet...They want to tip their waiter themselves.

why? They want to see the smile on their waiters face when they slip him that $10 for a 7 day cruise:eek:

These are the same people that HAL actually gives them OBC and invites them back cause "everything went wrong":eek:[/quote]

Heck...It's become so bad you now see people removing the HSC on the second day of the cruise. Ridiculous!!!

[cruisemom42]

[quote name='sail7seas'][B] An honest question requesting a straight forward answer, if you please.

What on earth is *elitist* (as written in your post) about placing cash in an envelope, writing a nice message of thanks and giving it most politely to a steward or bartender or other crew person who went out of their way to give us the best cruise possible?

We still tip by use of envelope, over and above the HSC. Almost always, our dining and cabin stewards as well as others work very hard to provide us a great cruise, we choose to give something additional. That is elitist? :confused:

This word 'elitist' is being used so often in so many ways, I no longer know what it means.
It seems sometimes it sounds to me like a handy dandy catchall to throw an insult. Am I wrong?


[/B][/QUOTE]

While I am not the poster you asked, I suspect it is the idea of "noblesse oblige" -- the concept that the elite of society have a responsibility to help the less fortunate by handing out largesse (like generous tips). To wit:

"Noblesse oblige" is generally used to imply that with wealth, power, and prestige come responsibilities. The phrase is sometimes used derisively, in the sense of condescending or hypocritical social responsibility.[1] In American English especially, the term is sometimes applied more broadly to suggest a general obligation for the more fortunate to help the less fortunate."

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noblesse_oblige[/url]

I also always feel (on lines that still require it) or felt (on previous cruises) uncomfortable with the process of handing out tips in person. It is such a tacit admission of "I have more than you do." I would so very much rather do it via the automatic charge.

Edited to add: Oops, I just went back and realized the person you addressed had already responded. So the above sentences represent solely my own thoughts on the subject.

[cruisemom42]

[quote name='surfergirle']I promise you, I know what I am talking about. Typical Seaborn balcony suite, does not have seperate bath and shower.

Molton Brown shower gel, lotion, shampoo, conditioner, soap, yes, *but so does HAL*


Also not enough sea days, no cabana, no Pan Asian.

Def not for us. Aprox 277 sf? No thanks.

To each his own...

We know JUST what we are looking for.[/QUOTE]

My philosophy has always been that when one thinks they know "just" what they are looking for, they may be missing out on other things that they would like just as well....or even better. (Like the kid who refuses to try any other ice cream flavor besides vanilla, but insists it is best.)

I hope I never become so rigidly fixed on a few variables that I wouldn't consider alternatives that might offer me a totally different, but still wonderful, experience.

I find that on each line I've sailed (with the exception of NCL), there have been many good differences and a few not-so-great ones -- but I am happy to make such trade-offs. I'd never pass up a superb one-time itinerary just because the ship didn't offer a specific type of ethnic cuisine....

[NoWhiners]

[quote name='lorekauf']Bad day.....hmmmmmm.......I think that's pretty much sop for that poster.[/QUOTE]

Yes, that appears to be the case. Guess his Mom never taught him the "if you can't say something nice, don't say anything". Maybe we could paraphrase that to "if you can't contribute without insulting people, then don't".

Whatever choice people make, it is (currently) allowed on HAL to bring water, soda and wine. Some people do this, others don't. I don't see it as an "abuse" to bring on a case or any desired quantity of whatever it is. And, while I am sure some people bring some wine out of their cabins, I don't see how that is anyone's business but theirs. Ship happens and I for one don't care to police other pax for their indiscretions.

I would be bothered if HAL changed their wine policy to be more like other lines. And I think we would be more likely to look at other cruise lines as result. (now, we just look at what HAL offers and pick one that suits us) Pricing is often better and I think it may be easier to achieve status that allows more perks. You know more about this than me--is that true? We have only cruised HAL and have only been on 4 cruises (soon to be 5).

I have seen a lot of interesting thoughts about what might change in the fall, and some seem more likely than others (like the HSC being mandatory, maybe reducing perks for suite guests, or removing/charging for some perks for non-suite guests). I was surprised when they started charging for Canaletto, so maybe that is a clue as to where they are going?

I would love to know--the suspense is killing me.:D maybe you can do some recon in August, if you can tear yourself away from that wrap-around balcony!!

ML

[scdreamer]

[quote name='lorekauf']There was a lot of complaining going on the Princess board that people were going to leave when they changed their policy. They claimed they love Princess but that fixed it for them. I like my wine but I think to leave as cruise line over that is a bit much. My guess lots of people complained but very few would actually leave.[/quote]


Possibly, but for us if HAL restricts wine being brought aboard and continues to allow smoking on balconies ... well, those two could easily push us over to another line.

We have cruised on Oceania and really loved it. Yes, it is a bit more expensive - but their published rates include airfare, but you can book your own and get a pretty good reduction on their fares - and they have great itineraries, no formal nights, elegant smaller ships, and very good service in our experience.

I guess we'll just all have to wait and see what the "shocking" changes turn out to be. This could all be a tempest in a teapot, but it does make for interesting "conversation." ;)

[cruz chic]

[quote name='NoWhiners']Yes, that appears to be the case. Guess his Mom never taught him the "if you can't say something nice, don't say anything". Maybe we could paraphrase that to "if you can't contribute without insulting people, then don't".

Whatever choice people make, it is (currently) allowed on HAL to bring water, soda and wine. Some people do this, others don't. I don't see it as an "abuse" to bring on a case or any desired quantity of whatever it is. And, while I am sure some people bring some wine out of their cabins, I don't see how that is anyone's business but theirs. Ship happens and I for one don't care to police other pax for their indiscretions.

I would be bothered if HAL changed their wine policy to be more like other lines. And I think we would be more likely to look at other cruise lines as result. (now, we just look at what HAL offers and pick one that suits us) Pricing is often better and I think it may be easier to achieve status that allows more perks. You know more about this than me--is that true? We have only cruised HAL and have only been on 4 cruises (soon to be 5).

I have seen a lot of interesting thoughts about what might change in the fall, and some seem more likely than others (like the HSC being mandatory, maybe reducing perks for suite guests, or removing/charging for some perks for non-suite guests). I was surprised when they started charging for Canaletto, so maybe that is a clue as to where they are going?

I would love to know--the suspense is killing me.:D maybe you can do some recon in August, if you can tear yourself away from that wrap-around balcony!!

ML[/QUOTE]

I doubt if I'll be able to find out anything because I'm not personal friends with any hotel managers. I just wish that either people tell the story or don't drop hints at all. I find it a little annoying, especially when nothing changes. How long have we heard about changes in the wine policy or elimination of smoking on balconies. I'll believe it when it happens or doesn't.

[Vict0riann]

On the subject of tipping - and I do think the HSC should become "Part" of the fare, with no way to reduce or remove it - but we have absolutely no problem handing a tip to the people who have served us well. They are so gracious in their manner of accepting it - I think in many cases we might feel embarrassed for them, but they consider it something they worked hard for, and earned. And that's what we say, when we go around the ship looking for them at the end of the cruise, "Thank you so much for taking good care of us, and making our cruise a wonderful memory, and we hope that everything goes well for you."

Thinking about it, I guess I don't really think it should become embedded in the fare, because that would make the fare seem more expensive, and also we wouldn't get "star" days credit for the amount charged. How could they make it compulsory without a lot of people fussing?

[coka]

Interesting thread! Any of the changes guessed so far are ones that make sense (even the no chocolate on pillows, Ruth)! I only began sailing HAL a few years ago and only sailed three of their ships. On the first trip I found myself questioning how on earth do they make a profit? Passengers bringing wine onboard, two for one happy hours multiple times daily in various bars, venison, crab legs, filet mignon in the main dining rooms, beautifully decorated ships, hospitable staff, the list goes on. With the price of food, gas, and just about everything else being so high these days, the cutbacks I read about on the boards (which is happening on most mainstream cruise lines), are not surprising to me as most want cabin fares they are used to seeing and paying for.
Edited to add...all cruise lines are looking for ways to capture new cruisers...and sorry to say...many of us who have sailed a long time with a particular cruise line...will probably continue to do so. Some will defect...but not all.

coka

[BumperII]

[FONT="Times New Roman"][SIZE="3"]I can't believe that I just sat here and read this entire thread. That doesn't mean I understood it all, but I did read it all.

We could care less about bringing alcohol on board. I can't use it, and my DW won't use it. It is a rare occasion when we run across a alcohol abusers among our shipmates.

There is a perfectly good reason why we booked inside cabins for our first thirty cruises. We're poor. We prepare a budget for every cruise and stick with it.

There are two reasons why we have never removed a HSC and why we always allow extra money for our stewards and servers. 1. We both started out empty handed, and have depended upon tips to pay the rent. 2. We want to leave the ship on good terms because we know we are coming back.

We fell in love with HAL because of the stewards and servers. We find our cruise mates to be well met, well read, well mannered, well behaved well informed, (OK, well heeled) and a whole lot of fun. The ship's managers do an excellent job so for the most part, we have never had to meet them personally.


Now that the retirement portfolio has recovered we are able to book our first Vista stateroom. That means we'll skip the float planes

Sorry fellow cruisers, we don't cruise in hopes of receiving buttons with stars.

It's you that we like.

[/SIZE][/FONT]

[Typhoon1]

The disembarkation talk is a waste of time.

We dropped in one year, there were only about ten people sitting there, listening to the CD babble.

[lovetocruise2020]

[quote name='cruisemom42']My philosophy has always been that when one thinks they know "just" what they are looking for, they may be missing out on other things that they would like just as well....or even better. (Like the kid who refuses to try any other ice cream flavor besides vanilla, but insists it is best.)

I hope I never become so rigidly fixed on a few variables that I wouldn't consider alternatives that might offer me a totally different, but still wonderful, experience.

I find that on each line I've sailed (with the exception of NCL), there have been many good differences and a few not-so-great ones -- but I am happy to make such trade-offs. I'd never pass up a superb one-time itinerary just because the ship didn't offer a specific type of ethnic cuisine....[/QUOTE]

We could care less about port stops, the ships, the cabin is the destination for us.

[peaches from georgia]

[quote name='surfergirle']I promise you, I know what I am talking about. Typical Seaborn balcony suite, does not have seperate bath and shower.

Molton Brown shower gel, lotion, shampoo, conditioner, soap, yes, *but so does HAL*


Also not enough sea days, no cabana, no Pan Asian.

Def not for us. Aprox 277 sf? No thanks.

To each his own...

We know JUST what we are looking for.[/QUOTE]
I'm sorry, but you don't know what you are talking about re Seabourn bathrooms and your info is VERY outdated and incorrect. The SB 'Little Sisters' are all to be sold and will no longer be in the SB fleet of ships. The newer and larger ships which have been sailing for the last 5 years or so, the Odyssey, Sojourn, and Quest, are absolutely gorgeous with bathrooms as large and luxurious as many new homes- all beautiful granite from ceiling to floor, double sinks, very large granite separate showers similar in size and luxury to what you might in your bathroom at home, a separate jetted tub, and a private water closet with sink with an additional entry from the hall so you can use it as a powder room for guests and close off the bathroom itself. This is a typical bathroom in a typical suite on the SB ships that are now and will be in service in the future. All cabins are suites.

Also, the alternative restaurants vary their menus among many different cuisines and there are many nights of Pan Asian on the typical SB cruise. No cabanas, but with only 400 pax (and few to no kids) there is no lack of quiet or fighting for space at the peaceful pool area.

[NoWhiners]

[quote name='lorekauf']I doubt if I'll be able to find out anything because I'm not personal friends with any hotel managers. I just wish that either people tell the story or don't drop hints at all. I find it a little annoying, especially when nothing changes. [COLOR="Red"]How long have we heard about changes in the wine policy or elimination of smoking on balconies[/COLOR]. I'll believe it when it happens or doesn't.[/QUOTE]

LOL--I was thinking the same thing earlier. Maybe we can start a betting pool--what the change(s) will be, when they will start, and if they will affect everyone. If we each put in a dollar, it could pay for our next cruise!!

I suggest you work a little harder at sucking up to the hotel manager, captain, officers and anyone else who is "important" :D;) maybe the head chef too?? Then you can post here and tell everyone how connected/tuned in/etc you are.

Just kidding...
ML

[kazu]

[quote name='peaches from georgia']I'm sorry, but you don't know what you are talking about re Seabourn bathrooms and your info is VERY outdated and incorrect. The SB 'Little Sisters' are all to be sold and will no longer be in the SB fleet of ships. The newer and larger ships which have been sailing for the last 5 years or so, the Odyssey, Sojourn, and Quest, are absolutely gorgeous with bathrooms as large and luxurious as many new homes- all beautiful granite from ceiling to floor, double sinks, very large granite separate showers similar in size and luxury to what you might in your bathroom at home, a separate jetted tub, and a private water closet with sink with an additional entry from the hall so you can use it as a powder room for guests and close off the bathroom itself. This is a typical bathroom in a typical suite on the SB ships that are now and will be in service in the future. All cabins are suites.

Also, the alternative restaurants vary their menus among many different cuisines and there are many nights of Pan Asian on the typical SB cruise. No cabanas, but with only 400 pax (and few to no kids) there is no lack of quiet or fighting for space at the peaceful pool area.[/QUOTE]

This is great info - thanks:)

[startwin]

[quote name='lorekauf']I doubt if I'll be able to find out anything because I'm not personal friends with any hotel managers. I just wish that either people tell the story or don't drop hints at all. I find it a little annoying, especially when nothing changes. How long have we heard about changes in the wine policy or elimination of smoking on balconies. I'll believe it when it happens or doesn't.[/quote]

Exactly! My TA is a good friend, and I asked her today if she had heard anything about HAL changes. Nothing. So unless you are willing to tell what you know then just leave it alone and stop creating all the speculation.

[cruz chic]

[quote name='NoWhiners']LOL--I was thinking the same thing earlier. Maybe we can start a betting pool--what the change(s) will be, when they will start, and if they will affect everyone. If we each put in a dollar, it could pay for our next cruise!!

I suggest you work a little harder at sucking up to the hotel manager, captain, officers and anyone else who is "important" :D;) maybe the head chef too?? Then you can post here and tell everyone how connected/tuned in/etc you are.

Just kidding...
ML[/QUOTE]

I'm totally unconnected:D. The most "fancy" thing I ever did was on our cruise. Got to eat with an officer and I think 13 others. He was gorgeous and I don't think I heard a word he said:D;):p.

[Wakepatrol]

If one bases their cruise on how much wine they can bring aboard.

They most likely have a drinking issue.

"Probably Go To Another Line"

Like where? They all have policies on how much hooch you can bring aboard.

Oh yea not Crystal Or Seabourne

Which is way more expensive and is like comparing
Neiman Marcus to Marshalls

[ellieanne]

[quote name='startwin']I'm going to disagree with the general assumption here (not just by your post, Lisa, there are others) that it is people who scrape together the cruise fare that ask to have gratuities removed. I have been standing in line at the front desk watching and listening to people I know are "well-heeled" demanding that the HSC be removed. I have had to listen to some of these same people bragging about how many cruises they take a year and how many countries they have visited. And yet it seems routine for them to remove the tips.

Personally, I save hard for my cruises especially now in retirement and on a "fixed income" - somewhat scraping together the fare. And in recent years, I am very careful to budget my spending. What I spend onboard, or not as the case may be, is no one else's business. The cruise contract does not contain any clause requiring a certain amount to be spent on board the ship.[/QUOTE]

I agree fully with you. I save my money for a cruise and have never removed the Hotel Service Charge. I rarely spend more than $200 on board, not including the Hotel Service Charge. There is nothing to indicate an expected level of on-board spending. I resent the idea that people who have to save for a vacation are looking for something for nothing. I find it's more often than not those who appear to have money to spend who argue with the front desk staff over charges. And unless you know the truth about a person, and not just what they say about themselves, there is no way of knowing how they financed their cruise, or what their level of disposable income is.

[Wakepatrol]

[quote name='ellieanne']I agree fully with you. I save my money for a cruise and have never removed the Hotel Service Charge. I rarely spend more than $200 on board, not including the Hotel Service Charge. There is nothing to indicate an expected level of on-board spending. I resent the idea that people who have to save for a vacation are looking for something for nothing. I find it's more often than not those who appear to have money to spend who argue with the front desk staff over charges. And unless you know the truth about a person, and not just what they say about themselves, there is no way of knowing how they financed their cruise, or what their level of disposable income is.[/QUOTE]

We don't spend much either a drink here or there a specialty coffee and the t-pool.

Most of HALS revenue comes from those that bring their own beverages aboard.

Don't you know that every cruiser who totes cases of wine aboard also has a $1000 bar tab.

[G&G]

[quote name='CowPrincess']Pinnacle Grill being changed to Hooters? ;)

ry?[/QUOTE]

Great idea. No one would complain about slow service :eek: !

[RetiredMustang]

Lord help me, but has this thread gone widdershins?

I remember when ...

- An eon ago, I was a very junior enlisted Navy guy, and a once-a-month treat for DW and me was a pizza, and a pitcher of beer, on payday. Simple pleasures ... where did they go?

- A night out from our two sons was such a treat, we did not care that it was at Burger King. We could afford a babysitter, or a nice restaurant, but not both the same night, so guess what we chose? Those Whoppers were pretty good.

- I burned burgers and cooked fries extra-grease after a day at my Navy job, so we could put aside a bit extra. Lord, I was young!

Forty some odd years later, we cruise a lot. We bring aboard wine, primarily because HAL does not have our favorites. I hope they don't, but if they decided to stop the unlimited wine privilege, we would adjust. Being 4-star Mariners, we would just order packages at half price for the cabin, and possibly for the MDR.

But, we will not reduce the auto tips. I have worked too long at too low pay ever to stiff a working stiff. We add extras for special favors, such as bringing coffee or ice. I have been there ... I don't ever want to be there again, but I have been there.

I can now afford wine at on-board prices. I always have afforded paying for service, and always will.

Dave

[SilvertoGold]

[quote name='ellieanne']I agree fully with you. I save my money for a cruise and have never removed the Hotel Service Charge. I rarely spend more than $200 on board, not including the Hotel Service Charge. There is nothing to indicate an expected level of on-board spending. I resent the idea that people who have to save for a vacation are looking for something for nothing. I find it's more often than not those who appear to have money to spend who argue with the front desk staff over charges. And unless you know the truth about a person, and not just what they say about themselves, there is no way of knowing how they financed their cruise, or what their level of disposable income is.[/quote]

Very, very nicely explained!!

[pms4104]

Some things not otherwise mentioned that HAL may be thinking of getting rid of:
[LIST]
[*]Formal nights
[*]Traditional/fixed dining ... maybe HAL is looking at making the entire ship Anytime/Anywhere. An early poster here mentioned that maybe the Lido would be the only included/non-surcharge venue ... it that came to pass, the MDR food quality and service would need to perk up a bit.
[*]The fig and olive soap ... posters on other threads seem not to be a fam of it
[/LIST]

[SilvertoGold]

[quote name='pms4104']Some things not otherwise mentioned that HAL may be thinking of getting rid of:
[LIST]
[*]Formal nights
[*]Traditional/fixed dining ... maybe HAL is looking at making the entire ship Anytime/Anywhere. An early poster here mentioned that maybe the Lido would be the only included/non-surcharge venue ... it that came to pass, the MDR food quality and service would need to perk up a bit.
[*]The fig and olive soap ... posters on other threads seem not to be a fam of it
[/LIST][/quote]

Those are certainly interesting possibilities, which should get some responses.
Some would no doubt love Formal Nights to disappear. Me, not so much.

[startwin]

[quote name='ellieanne']I agree fully with you. I save my money for a cruise and have never removed the Hotel Service Charge. I rarely spend more than $200 on board, not including the Hotel Service Charge. There is nothing to indicate an expected level of on-board spending. I resent the idea that people who have to save for a vacation are looking for something for nothing. I find it's more often than not those who appear to have money to spend who argue with the front desk staff over charges. And unless you know the truth about a person, and not just what they say about themselves, there is no way of knowing how they financed their cruise, or what their level of disposable income is.[/quote]

You said it all way better than I did.:)