Tipping in bars/lounges

[Vict0riann]

One of the most negative and degrading consequences of cash tipping is that is leads to collusion between crew members. Waiters who wish to maximize their income are forced to pay dining room managers for larger tables and forced to pay cooks if they want their orders quickly and prepared perfectly. Cabin Stewards must pay their house keeping supervisors in order to be assigned more expensive cabins and also pay laundry room supervisors in order to guarantee clean linens are readily and promptly available. The taxing of a worker’s tips by those in positions of authority creates hostile working environments for all crew and is only made possible by those passengers who solemnly believe that tipping is a personal choice and nothing more than a small gesture of appreciation.

 

Wow! That is really sad.

[Aquahound]

One of the most negative and degrading consequences of cash tipping is that is leads to collusion between crew members. Waiters who wish to maximize their income are forced to pay dining room managers for larger tables and forced to pay cooks if they want their orders quickly and prepared perfectly. Cabin Stewards must pay their house keeping supervisors in order to be assigned more expensive cabins and also pay laundry room supervisors in order to guarantee clean linens are readily and promptly available. The taxing of a worker’s tips by those in positions of authority creates hostile working environments for all crew and is only made possible by those passengers who solemnly believe that tipping is a personal choice and nothing more than a small gesture of appreciation.

 

I work very close with the cruise industry and I have never heard of this happening. I've seen individual cases of nepotism, but not this wide spread bribery you are suggesting. If you have first hand knowledge of it, I'd like to hear more, or at least know your source.

[Linda&Vern]

One of the most negative and degrading consequences of cash tipping is that is leads to collusion between crew members. Waiters who wish to maximize their income are forced to pay dining room managers for larger tables and forced to pay cooks if they want their orders quickly and prepared perfectly. Cabin Stewards must pay their house keeping supervisors in order to be assigned more expensive cabins and also pay laundry room supervisors in order to guarantee clean linens are readily and promptly available. The taxing of a worker’s tips by those in positions of authority creates hostile working environments for all crew and is only made possible by those passengers who solemnly believe that tipping is a personal choice and nothing more than a small gesture of appreciation.

Can you tell us your source for this info. I've never heard of this on a HAL ship. Thanks.

[RuthC]

This is the first time I have ever heard about a "union" on

the ship for stewards.

Do you know what union is involved??

I know it isn't ALF-CIO, or SEIU, but other than that, no I don't know what unions represent the workers on the ships.

I do remember the unions were involved when HAL switched from "No tipping required" to the hotel service charge system about 10 years ago.

[Laminator]

One of the most negative and degrading consequences of cash tipping is that is leads to collusion between crew members. Waiters who wish to maximize their income are forced to pay dining room managers for larger tables and forced to pay cooks if they want their orders quickly and prepared perfectly. Cabin Stewards must pay their house keeping supervisors in order to be assigned more expensive cabins and also pay laundry room supervisors in order to guarantee clean linens are readily and promptly available. The taxing of a worker’s tips by those in positions of authority creates hostile working environments for all crew and is only made possible by those passengers who solemnly believe that tipping is a personal choice and nothing more than a small gesture of appreciation.

 

The more I thought about this the more upset I got. First and foremost HAL promotes from within. The young man who picks up the dirty plates and glasses around the pool area, if he does a good job, will one day become a server in the Lido. If he continues to do a good job he will continue to be promoted. He may become a beverage attendant. You make it seem like jobs are assigned through collusion.

 

On a tight knit environment like a cruise ship there would be a revolt if this occurred. These people spend 12 to 14 hours a day working together and then the rest of the day living together. I feel that these young men and women get promoted through hard work and dedication. Those who are servers in the Pinnacle Grill have worked their way up from the bottom. They are there because they deserve to be there.

 

I simply find your statement very disrespectful to these hard working crew members.

Edited July 27, 2014 by Laminator

[sail7seas]

I believe the individual unions are facilitated through their agents. It's an interesting business. For a lot of crew, their salary is negotiated through their agents, therefore the amount you make in many cases depends on your nationality. An Indonesian bartender could have a different minimum salary compared to a Filipino bartender working the same bar.

 

 

 

 

On HAL, that would not be the case as Filipinos work bar/beverage deparment and Indonesians work cabins and dining room.

 

[jtl513]

Those who are servers in the Pinnacle Grill have worked their way up from the bottom.

Many in the PGs are East Europeans that have not worked in other positions on the ship. When the Eurodam was launched all of the Tamarind waitresses were new hires, and many if not all trained in various PGs around the fleet. I don't know if that's still done for staffing the Tamarinds.

[Aquahound]

Many in the PGs are East Europeans that have not worked in other positions on the ship. When the Eurodam was launched all of the Tamarind waitresses were new hires, and many if not all trained in various PGs around the fleet. I don't know if that's still done for staffing the Tamarinds.

 

Our PG waitress on Zuiderdam, who was Asian, was the same waitress we had in Tamarind on Nieuw Amsterdam 2 years ago. She told us it was common for them to do contracts in PGs throughout the fleet.

Edited July 27, 2014 by Aquahound

[cbr663]

Then don't leave any additional tip. But then your steward doesn't even get a piece of the action. If everyone does that, there's no action at all for anyone to get a piece of.

Somehow I think that if sharing is going on, it all sorts of balances out in the long run. If the stewards didn't like the system, they would have their union speaking up about it.

 

Please remember that pooled tips and then sharing them does not mean that the tips are divided equitably. There can be any number of ways to share the funds that are collected, and many may have nothing at all to do with whether any server had provided any kind of service. Tips may be shared based on seniority, job classification, hours worked, # drinks served, date of hire, # hours worked, glass breakage, gender...there are many ways to divide a pie.

 

Also please remember that the ultimate decision may not be one in which individual servers may have a choice.

[Linda&Vern]

Please remember that pooled tips and then sharing them does not mean that the tips are divided equitably. There can be any number of ways to share the funds that are collected, and many may have nothing at all to do with whether any server had provided any kind of service. Tips may be shared based on seniority, job classification, hours worked, # drinks served, date of hire, # hours worked, glass breakage, gender...there are many ways to divide a pie.

 

Also please remember that the ultimate decision may not be one in which individual servers may have a choice.

Again, can I ask your source for this info. Thanks.

[hrhdhd]

Plus I have spent numerous hours at the SeaView Bar and honestly the way some of the pax treat these kids I find appalling.

 

I simply find your statement very disrespectful to these hard working crew members.

 

You mean like calling men and women "kids"? ;)

[hrhdhd]

Please remember that pooled tips and then sharing them does not mean that the tips are divided equitably. There can be any number of ways to share the funds that are collected, and many may have nothing at all to do with whether any server had provided any kind of service. Tips may be shared based on seniority, job classification, hours worked, # drinks served, date of hire, # hours worked, glass breakage, gender...there are many ways to divide a pie.

 

Also please remember that the ultimate decision may not be one in which individual servers may have a choice.

 

Again, can I ask your source for this info. Thanks.

 

May I ask your source for believing that pooled tips are split equally? If that is your assumption, it's just as evidence-free as cbr663's suggestion.

[boards]

Please remember that pooled tips and then sharing them does not mean that the tips are divided equitably. There can be any number of ways to share the funds that are collected, and many may have nothing at all to do with whether any server had provided any kind of service. Tips may be shared based on seniority, job classification, hours worked, # drinks served, date of hire, # hours worked, glass breakage, gender...there are many ways to divide a pie.

 

Also please remember that the ultimate decision may not be one in which individual servers may have a choice.

 

Cut out the extra tipping and the problem will go away.

Edited July 27, 2014 by boards

[kazu]

Please remember that pooled tips and then sharing them does not mean that the tips are divided equitably. There can be any number of ways to share the funds that are collected, and many may have nothing at all to do with whether any server had provided any kind of service. Tips may be shared based on seniority, job classification, hours worked, # drinks served, date of hire, # hours worked, glass breakage, gender...there are many ways to divide a pie.

 

Also please remember that the ultimate decision may not be one in which individual servers may have a choice.

 

Again, can I ask your source for this info. Thanks.

 

I second Linda and Vern's request. This and your other post are cause for great concern,

 

Somehow, sorry, I am in doubt,

 

Please confirm how you know what you state you do. If my extra tips are not going to whom I have given them that is troubling.

 

I have talked to a number of cruise staff - on longer cruises that happens. I have never heard this and it would be a great plea for extra tips, no?

 

In any case I too request how you know what you state you do.

 

Thank you

[Lizzie68]

Please remember that pooled tips and then sharing them does not mean that the tips are divided equitably. There can be any number of ways to share the funds that are collected, and many may have nothing at all to do with whether any server had provided any kind of service. Tips may be shared based on seniority, job classification, hours worked, # drinks served, date of hire, # hours worked, glass breakage, gender...there are many ways to divide a pie.

 

Also please remember that the ultimate decision may not be one in which individual servers may have a choice.

 

There are restaurants and restaurant chains that have various methods of pooling tips Some may even be shady enough to require kick-backs to whoever controls seating etc. But I do not believe that any of this applies to the HAL's tipping policy. I also would like to see your source.

[serendipity1499]

One of the most negative and degrading consequences of cash tipping is that is leads to collusion between crew members. Waiters who wish to maximize their income are forced to pay dining room managers for larger tables and forced to pay cooks if they want their orders quickly and prepared perfectly. Cabin Stewards must pay their house keeping supervisors in order to be assigned more expensive cabins and also pay laundry room supervisors in order to guarantee clean linens are readily and promptly available. The taxing of a worker’s tips by those in positions of authority creates hostile working environments for all crew and is only made possible by those passengers who solemnly believe that tipping is a personal choice and nothing more than a small gesture of appreciation.

 

I don't believe this nonsense at all! IMO it's a figment of your imagination! We've been cruising for many years & have never heard anything like this../SIZE]

 

I work very close with the cruise industry and I have never heard of this happening. I've seen individual cases of nepotism, but not this wide spread bribery you are suggesting. If you have first hand knowledge of it, I'd like to hear more, or at least know your source.

 

Some people like to seem important by insinuating they know something others don't.. I truly doubt that this poster has first hand knowledge that this exists on cruise ships! However, I do have first hand knowledge that it does happen in the catering/restaurant business but never on cruise ships.. How I know is I once worked in a Restaurant for a short time & shared tips with the busboy..Also worked as a hat checker & gave half my tips to the Matre d' as it was his concession.. My Granddaughter has worked in a restaurant, I'll try to remember to ask her about sharing her tips..

 

BTW We never pre-tip, we give our thank-you's at the end of our cruise with a note of thanks to each individual..

Edited July 27, 2014 by serendipity1499

[dfish]

I know it isn't ALF-CIO, or SEIU, but other than that, no I don't know what unions represent the workers on the ships.

I do remember the unions were involved when HAL switched from "No tipping required" to the hotel service charge system about 10 years ago.

 

This made me curious, so I went looking. I found a news article that mentioned the union for the workers on the ms Veendam http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1347725/union-requests-first-cruise-ship-of-the-season-to-bypass-sydney-port which referred to the union as Nautilus. You can find information about Nautilus https://www.nautilusint.org/About-Us/default.aspx

 

Debbie

[Laminator]

Our PG waitress on Zuiderdam, who was Asian, was the same waitress we had in Tamarind on Nieuw Amsterdam 2 years ago. She told us it was common for them to do contracts in PGs throughout the fleet.

 

When launched that was true. Now quite a few of the Tamarind staff are servers who worked for HAL for quite some time. When there contract is up on either the NA or Eurodam and they go to a ship without a Tamarind they wind up in the Pinnacle Grill.

[Laminator]

You mean like calling men and women "kids"? ;)

 

Maybe where your from it is disrespectful. Not where I am from.

[carolmacey]

Assuming we have had good service and like the bartender who served us regularly, we just about always have an envelope and note of thanks for him the last night of the cruise. We like to give something additional to the automatic tip to show our appreciation and thanks.

 

This is what we do if we have established a rapport with a specific bartender.

[magandab]

Oh let's be honest here. Those of us who tip extra do it to make the rest of you look bad! :D:D:D

[Skipchew]

That's great. The specific bartender who gave you good service and who you developed a rapport with then puts your reward for his good service to you in a pool to be shared with dozens of people who did nothing for you.

 

The gesture is honourable, but ultimately empty.

[Laminator]

That's great. The specific bartender who gave you good service and who you developed a rapport with then puts your reward for his good service to you in a pool to be shared with dozens of people who did nothing for you.

 

The gesture is honourable, but ultimately empty.

 

An honorable gesture is never empty.

[Skipchew]

O.k.

[Memom04263]

Oh let's be honest here. Those of us who tip extra do it to make the rest of you look bad! :D:D:D

 

Lol :D not sure this is my 1st cruise on SOS rccl. I plan on tipping my room person first day as well as last. In hopes my room is takin care of a lil better. And will tip my bartender! i will be drinkin mixed drinks and have heard from loyal cruisers that they some times make your drinks stonger pour a lil more wine and yes if drinks not at bar your at they sometimes go find it else where on ship. They are more likely to remember what you drink and have it ready for you as well :) 5days till we sail frickin EXCITED! ! To each their own. Hopefully good service :)

 

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