This Thread Is To Be Used For All Discussions About HAL's On Board Smoking Policies

[chrispb]

Nobody can give any reliable statistics about smokers from another line or the chances of having a balcony next to smokers. It's just down to sheer luck of the draw.

[Sow There]

KeyInPitt raises a most valid point. Profanity laced "conversations" in an adjacent balcony are, in my opinion, far more pernicious than the occasional puff of cigarette smoke.

 

At least there's the current movement to ban smoking on balconies that addresses that issue. But how does one deal with excessive profanity?

 

I will say it happened to us only once, and many years ago, but it remains a vivid memory. We tried using the balcony back when the veranda cabins were first introduced by HAL's Statendam whenever we could and loved the ability to enjoy the quiet sounds of the ship plying the ocean, the aroma of the open sea and the squawking of the occasional seagull.

 

But on that one occasion, after repeated profanity laced "conversations" by our neighbor, I finally leaned out around the partition with the intention of simply demonstrating the couple had an unwitting audience. They went ballistic and gave me "what for" without me saying a word. From that time forward we always booked the rearmost veranda cabin on the Navigation deck. That way we reduced our chance of crude neighbors in half.

 

We've had other experiences, mostly positive, where we got to know our neighbor through simple conversation or where we heard the happy laughter of kids at play.

Edited February 19, 2015 by Sow There

[Silver sailor]

Nobody can give any reliable statistics about smokers from another line or the chances of having a balcony next to smokers. It's just down to sheer luck of the draw.

 

Totally agree

[cbr663]

I don't, but thanks for proving my point. The days of simply being able to talk to other people are long gone. Even right here, I try to tell a story of politely talking to a neighbor, yet you translate it as a "demand." This also proves another point.....polite people like KevInPitt are a very rare breed nowadays. :(

 

Would you be so kind as to when I translated your statements into a demand? My statements to your story were an attempt to try and present another point of view.

[KevInPitt]

Would you be so kind as to when I translated your statements into a demand? My statements to your story were an attempt to try and present another point of view.

 

Perhaps by your statement here:

 

How do you know that the passenger next to you has not curbed their smoking? How do you know that the passenger next to you may already be accommodating the passenger on their other side or above or below them? Unfortunately, some people just can't see beyond the fact that they are not the only passenger on a ship and they may not be the only passenger making demands on other passengers.

[81Zoomie]

We just sailed on Celebrity in the caribbean. There was no smoking allowed anywhere on the inside of the ship or the balconies. We actually enjoyed being in the casino! There were designated smoking areas in several locations outside. The passengers were a very international mix and everyone seemed to be accommodated.

[RuthC]

There were designated smoking areas in several locations outside. The passengers were a very international mix and everyone seemed to be accommodated.

How/where are the smokers accommodated when the outside decks are closed?

[hrhdhd]

Negative. That's just one example because it happends to be the topic of this thread.

 

Well, yes, my example is about smoking because this is a smoking discussion. And in regards to the smoking issue, it does appear that the smoker is generally the one who is expected to make concessions.

[taxmantoo]

Well, yes, my example is about smoking because this is a smoking discussion. And in regards to the smoking issue, it does appear that the smoker is generally the one who is expected to make concessions.

 

And that is the price to pay for maintaining the smoking privilege in certain areas of the ship. There is no way a non-smoker should have to make concessions to a smoker unless that non-smoker is occupying space in a designated smoking area.

[regnig]

And that is the price to pay for maintaining the smoking privilege in certain areas of the ship. There is no way a non-smoker should have to make concessions to a smoker unless that non-smoker is occupying space in a designated smoking area.

 

But isn't that the whole point--- balconies are one of the "designated smoking area" therefore shouldn't they, the non-smoker, make at least some type of concession? Why should the sole responsibility lie with the smoker?

Edited February 19, 2015 by larsen

[taxmantoo]

But isn't that the whole point--- balconies are one of the "designated smoking area" therefore shouldn't they, the non-smoker, make at least some type of concession? Why should the sole responsibility lie with the smoker?

 

The smoker has every right to smoke on his/her balcony and the non-smoker has every right to breathe fresh air on his or hers. What to do? Where is Judge Judy when you need her :D

[sail7seas]

Do you have any reliable statistics indicating that 3 out of 4 veranda passengers will be smokers?

I find the 50/50 split a little bit of over kill

PS I am a nonsmoker quit 18 years ago

 

Did you notice my use of the word "IF"?

 

If not, kindly reread my post. I never said it IS 3 out of 4, I said "IF" it is 3 out of 4. :)

For all I know, it could be 5 out of 6 verandah cabins have at least one smoker?!!

 

Edited February 19, 2015 by sail7seas

[sail7seas]

KeyInPitt raises a most valid point. Profanity laced "conversations" in an adjacent balcony are, in my opinion, far more pernicious than the occasional puff of cigarette smoke.

 

At least there's the current movement to ban smoking on balconies that addresses that issue. But how does one deal with excessive profanity?

 

I will say it happened to us only once, and many years ago, but it remains a vivid memory. We tried using the balcony back when the veranda cabins were first introduced by HAL's Statendam whenever we could and loved the ability to enjoy the quiet sounds of the ship plying the ocean, the aroma of the open sea and the squawking of the occasional seagull.

 

But on that one occasion, after repeated profanity laced "conversations" by our neighbor, I finally leaned out around the partition with the intention of simply demonstrating the couple had an unwitting audience. They went ballistic and gave me "what for" without me saying a word. From that time forward we always booked the rearmost veranda cabin on the Navigation deck. That way we reduced our chance of crude neighbors in half.

 

We've had other experiences, mostly positive, where we got to know our neighbor through simple conversation or where we heard the happy laughter of kids at play.

 

 

 

If the language is so offensive and so frequent as to be disruptive to your enjoyment, you might consider enlisting the aid of Security. If you had rowdy, loud, abusive neighbors at home, you might consider calling police.

 

[Sow There]

If the language is so offensive and so frequent as to be disruptive to your enjoyment, you might consider enlisting the aid of Security. If you had rowdy, loud, abusive neighbors at home, you might consider calling police.

 

When we checked with the Pursers Office, she said she was sorry, there was nothing she, or the security staff, could do. She also reminded me that I acted improperly when I "invaded" their space by peering around the partition.

 

More to the point, let's say the HAL security guy accepted the issue and came by the offender's cabin. What, exactly, could he do? The issue isn't rowdy behaviour or abusive behaviour against us, it was loud obscene language.

 

Then, let's say the security guy asks them to pipe down, and they go at it again. Or let's say we both leave, or return to. our cabins at the same time. I'd hate to think what he/she/both might say to us about filing a complaint.

 

In any case, it's hard to believe the two (husband/wife? who knows?) actually chose to take a cruise because they were at each other's throats (at least orally) throughout the 10 day cruise.

 

The good part for us is how we fell in love with the cabins at the back end of the Navigation deck on the S Class ships. Just one short flight under the Lidio where one of us could pick up breakfast for dining on the balcony, a few steps away from the "back door" to the very quiet Nav Deck pool and a few steps from the elevator for everything else. And because it was a "dead-end" hallway, there was hardly any traffic outside our door.

 

So the Bickersons, as we called them, actually did us a favor by making us find our ideal cabin. (Bickersons was the name of a popular radio comedy back a few centuries ago when we were growing up.)

[kennicott]

When we checked with the Pursers Office, she said she was sorry, there was nothing she, or the security staff, could do. She also reminded me that I acted improperly when I "invaded" their space by peering around the partition.

 

The issue isn't rowdy behaviour or abusive behaviour against us, it was loud obscene language.

 

[/i]

 

That would really irritate me too Sow There. Fortunately we have never had any problem with neighbors on balconies. Started using balconies back in 2007. Knew what would happen when we did our first balcony, and it did, we got spoiled. So fortunately for us we have always had good neighbors, made friends with many. Actually, more often than not it gets a little lonesome because I use the balcony so much and they don't.

 

What made me chuckle though is your mention of peering around the partition. Somewhere on C.C. not long back there was a discussion pertaining to such. Some argued that with certain reflections/refractions you see everything next door whether you wanted to or not. I thought that strange, so I began paying attention. Sure enough, it is true, we just got off the Coral Princess and not only was reflections into adjoining balconies possible but also there were gaps in the partition that provided the same. The posts on the thread not only dealt with smoking and such but they got even better when nudity came up. Haw

[Silver sailor]

Did you notice my use of the word "IF"?

 

If not, kindly reread my post. I never said it IS 3 out of 4, I said "IF" it is 3 out of 4. :)

For all I know, it could be 5 out of 6 verandah cabins have at least one smoker?!!

 

 

Yes you did use the word "if" and it was in response to a post stating that the possibility was 50/50 that there would be a smoker next to you.

 

IF only 20% were smokers then the possibility would decrease to 1 out of 5

The possibility is ACTUALLY ranges from 0 to 100 percent

 

Speculation and exaggeration adds nothing to this thread

 

If you travel on HAL and have a veranda there is a possibility that you might have a smoker in the veranda next to you. This is FACTUAL not based on "IFS"

[serendipity1499]

When we checked with the Pursers Office, she said she was sorry, there was nothing she, or the security staff, could do. She also reminded me that I acted improperly when I "invaded" their space by peering around the partition.

 

More to the point, let's say the HAL security guy accepted the issue and came by the offender's cabin. What, exactly, could he do? The issue isn't rowdy behaviour or abusive behaviour against us, it was loud obscene language.

 

Then, let's say the security guy asks them to pipe down, and they go at it again. Or let's say we both leave, or return to. our cabins at the same time. I'd hate to think what he/she/both might say to us about filing a complaint.

 

In any case, it's hard to believe the two (husband/wife? who knows?) actually chose to take a cruise because they were at each other's throats (at least orally) throughout the 10 day cruise.

 

The good part for us is how we fell in love with the cabins at the back end of the Navigation deck on the S Class ships. Just one short flight under the Lidio where one of us could pick up breakfast for dining on the balcony, a few steps away from the "back door" to the very quiet Nav Deck pool and a few steps from the elevator for everything else. And because it was a "dead-end" hallway, there was hardly any traffic outside our door.

 

So the Bickersons, as we called them, actually did us a favor by making us find our ideal cabin. (Bickersons was the name of a popular radio comedy back a few centuries ago when we were growing up.)

 

I really don't know if you or a member of your party are smokers or not, but I suspect you are, only because out of all your posts many of them seem to be trying to say that smoke drifting to another balcony does not cause problems for others.. (sorry for the run on sentence) As an ex smoker I fully understand why smokers make excuses & also know that smoke can't be tolerated by many of us....Until HAL bans smoking on balcony's, we will not book & pay for a balcony..

 

I also wonder if you are trying to influence us & pretend that smoke drifting to another balcony is less annoying than foul language!:rolleyes:

 

It won't work!

[regnig]

Originally Posted by Sow ..... When we checked with the Pursers Office, she said she was sorry, there was nothing she, or the security staff, could do. She also reminded me that I acted improperly when I "invaded" their space by peering around the partition.......

There I really don't know if you or a member of your party are smokers or not, but I suspect you are, only because out of all your posts many of them seem to be trying to say that smoke drifting to another balcony does not cause problems for others.. (sorry for the run on sentence) As an ex smoker I fully understand why smokers make excuses & also know that smoke can't be tolerated by many of us....Until HAL bans smoking on balcony's, we will not book & pay for a balcony..

 

I also wonder if you are trying to influence us & pretend that smoke drifting to another balcony is less annoying than foul language!:rolleyes:

 

It won't work!

 

Perhaps serendipity1499 before you go accusing another poster of something you should perhaps do a bit of research. Sow There is not a smoker and has stated so. He is simply more tolerant than others.

 

Civility on a smoking thread! Wonderful, and thanks for your observation. We've never smoked, not our thing, but we are tolerant of those who choose to smoke and admire greatly those who formerly smoked but have since stopped. Based on what we've seen with friends who did smoke it's not easy at all dropping the habit.

 

I think there's an element of "holier than thou" on the part of the staunch anti-smokers who never smoked and feel it's OK to vilify those who smoke now or who use "vapes" as a legitimate way to stop smoking tobacco.

 

The operative word here is TOLERATE. "Can we all just get along?" (Rodney King, 1991)

[KevInPitt]

I really don't know if you or a member of your party are smokers or not, but I suspect you are, only because out of all your posts many of them seem to be trying to say that smoke drifting to another balcony does not cause problems for others.. (sorry for the run on sentence) As an ex smoker I fully understand why smokers make excuses & also know that smoke can't be tolerated by many of us....Until HAL bans smoking on balcony's, we will not book & pay for a balcony..

 

I also wonder if you are trying to influence us & pretend that smoke drifting to another balcony is less annoying than foul language!:rolleyes:

 

It won't work!

 

I was a part of the sharing of a situation that I found bothersome although it is "allowed" conduct on a balcony.

 

I didn't express one behavior as being more or less annoying than the other. That is entirely a personal assessment to make and not one that can be universally determined by anyone for anyone else. Certainly not me and certainly not you.

 

What I was trying to express was this was personally-experienced behavior I found annoying in a similar way as many non-smokers find smoking. I did so in the spirit of expressing that a little consideration of those around you goes a long way for both sides.

 

That's the influence I was trying to evoke.

[babyher]

I was a part of the sharing of a situation that I found bothersome although it is "allowed" conduct on a balcony.

 

I didn't express one behavior as being more or less annoying than the other. That is entirely a personal assessment to make and not one that can be universally determined by anyone for anyone else. Certainly not me and certainly not you.

 

What I was trying to express was this was personally-experienced behavior I found annoying in a similar way as many non-smokers find smoking. I did so in the spirit of expressing that a little consideration of those around you goes a long way for both sides.

 

That's the influence I was trying to evoke.

 

 

 

If everyone here wrote a list of what bothers, annoys, disgusts , or offends them , despite the fact it is completely legal, or suddenly acceptable "because its 2015" . I bet we would have one hell of a thread .

 

And you know what ?

 

No one would be anymore right or wrong than the other.

 

Maybe some will present their views a little more in your face or nastier than others. But you can't be faulted by the way you feel.

[Bookited]

Where did everyone go?

[taxmantoo]

Where did everyone go?

 

Out for a cigarette break :D

[HamOp]

Where did everyone go?

 

Maybe, just maybe this horse has been beat to death?:D

[natski]

Well i am one of those sinners that smoke guilty as charged !

But

I am very very considerate to people that do not as i would expect in return !

I love a good cigar after a great meal a true story this , we had a balcony and I follow Hal,s rules but I also consider before i light up .

I on the first day try very hard to meet the people in the rooms either side of ours I also let them know I smoke either cigi,s or that cigar . If the cigar might bother them i ask what a good time it would be for me also to enjoy My cigar on My Balcony say after they have retired or maybe if they were going to the casino ect ect . I have only once had anyone be slightly upset by my requests and I think his wife thought more that I was intruding on there privacy then trying to get along with My nasty addiction . That said smokes are free game to Me as it is the reason I book on Hal as they have rules for NON smokers, yes non smokers have far more choices in cruiselines then I do so if you do not like all that nasty smoke go on those lines please !

My money is as good as anyone else and Hal,s rules say I can do it , but all smokers and NON should give each other a little respect as to not ruin each others cruises over something like this .

I have the rules printed out and in my suitcase as long as I stick too my side of the deal peace will be present on My next cruise .

Have a great cruise everyone !

[kennicott]

Well i am one of those sinners that smoke guilty as charged !

But

yes non smokers have far more choices in cruiselines then I do so if you do not like all that nasty smoke go on those lines please !

Hi Natski,

 

You sound like a pretty reasonable fellow, one that I could get along with on the adjoining balcony.

 

Here is the problem though with asking someone to pack it up and simply move on to another line that does not allow balcony smoking. Many of us are long time HAL faithfull who have amassed quite a few perquisites over the years cruising with them, so hard to make a move like that nonchalantly. For instance, on our next HAL cruise we reach the 300 day sailing mark with them.

 

Now in our case, we have never experienced a balcony problem with neighbors, smoking or otherwise. We began exclusively booking balconies since 2007. Knew that when we first got one we would be spoiled and we are. What has happened though is a very recent development. All other significant cruise lines have abolished balcony smoking, leaving HAL the only game in town. The big concern, as you might detect, from many posts on this thread, is what happens if smokers begin to saturate most of HAL's balconies?

 

Obviously, this circumstance isn't a given. It will take a period of time for repercussions to manifest. Smokers may not flock to HAL as feared, instead remain with their favorite cruise line even though they prohibit balcony smoking. On the other hand, as many have postulated here, HAL ships might become the "Ashtrays of the Seas".

 

No one knows for certain. Perhaps HAL may even join the others in their prohibition. Anyrate, we watch and wait, and pay attention to posts on this thread as pertinent trends germinate. In the meantime, HAL will be sailing without us.

Edited February 25, 2015 by kennicott