Help please with 'free' gift from recent cruise

[Yellowfurbaby]

Hi. We sailed on the Eclipse in august and enjoying attending the art seminars. We were 'lucky' enough during the Thomas Kinkade seminar to win a small print through a raffle.

We excitedly took our winning ticket to the art desk and signed the paperwork. There we discovered the 'free' painting carried a 65 dollar delivery charge.

A bit saddened we handed over our seapass card and duly paid the 65 dollar charge on disembarkation.

Today a knock on the door and my painting has arrived. Yippppeeee. Until...... The UPS man hits me with another £20 fee for taxes. Now this we were NOT informed of. I sent him away with painting until tomorrow.

Something is not right here. A free gift will now be costing more money than I was led to believe.

I will have no choice no doubt to pay the man as if I refuse it I will have lost the painting plus the 65 dollars I've already spent getting the painting from the US to the UK.

I feel done as this was NOT explained. I have now looked through the three sheets of print out given to me and it does say in the terms and conditions but extremely small and not clear at all.

I wish I hadn't actually won this now. :/

Not really expecting any advice as such but it's a lesson learnt from me and I hope people reading this may think twice before picking up a 'free' raffle ticket.

[Phxazzcruisers]

So sorry. We AVOID the art area just for that reason. We are avid art collectors and will only purchase from galleries we are familiar with. The art dealers on ships do not have good reputations, to say the least. Again, sorry for your issues.

[ghstudio]

Hi. We sailed on the Eclipse in august and enjoying attending the art seminars. We were 'lucky' enough during the Thomas Kinkade seminar to win a small print through a raffle.

We excitedly took our winning ticket to the art desk and signed the paperwork. There we discovered the 'free' painting carried a 65 dollar delivery charge.

A bit saddened we handed over our seapass card and duly paid the 65 dollar charge on disembarkation.

Today a knock on the door and my painting has arrived. Yippppeeee. Until...... The UPS man hits me with another £20 fee for taxes. Now this we were NOT informed of. I sent him away with painting until tomorrow.

Something is not right here. A free gift will now be costing more money than I was led to believe.

I will have no choice no doubt to pay the man as if I refuse it I will have lost the painting plus the 65 dollars I've already spent getting the painting from the US to the UK.

I feel done as this was NOT explained. I have now looked through the three sheets of print out given to me and it does say in the terms and conditions but extremely small and not clear at all.

I wish I hadn't actually won this now. :/

Not really expecting any advice as such but it's a lesson learnt from me and I hope people reading this may think twice before picking up a 'free' raffle ticket.

 

Since that money isn't going to Park West, it was technically free...just pay shipping and handling.....sounds like the TV pitchmen...two for the price of one...just pay the additional shipping and handling fee.

 

Sorry you learned about ship art auctions the hard way....as others have suggested, best to avoid them completely.

[DebbieMacG]

Sounds like you are paying the import fee which applies to anything worth over £18 :(

[Sloop-JohnB]

Lesson learned.

 

If you won this on a US Cruise, I cannot say I am surprised... As Canadians we often hear stories about folks who have won FREE stuff in the USA then finding that free isn't truly free (here in Canada when you win something... There are usually no extra taxes or fees levied... You win $ 1 Million in the lottery... You get $ 1 M)

 

In the USA, they have to pay fees & taxes upfront / upon delivery. They win $ 1 M in the lottery they are lucky if the see 35% ($ 350,000)

 

No where was this more of an issue than when Oprah gave her audience free cars a decade or so ago. Many of those in the audience needed those cars but didn't have the funds to take delivery of them (over $ 10,000 cash upfront). In the end, some arrangement was made with the State / US taxman, and Oprah paid the taxes & delivery costs for the winners.

 

In your situation, I guess I would be like you... Understandable of the delivery charge and ticked at the tax bill (although it sounds to me more of a case of Customs & Duty imposed by the UK at that small amount than actual US taxes... As I would expect them to be much higher... Unless this is a really tiny painting :(:confused: )

 

On the other hand...

 

Thomas Kinkaid was a fairly well known American Artist with ties to Disney. I wouldn't be on for spending oodles for one of his large paintings that the Cruise Line Art Auctions hawk... But the amount that you will have paid out sounds like an ok deal to me.

 

Given also that the value of said painting will probably only increase over time... Now that the man is dead & gone (died of an alcohol & drug overdose). This could be an interesting story & family heirloom that the great grandkids talk about in the future.

 

Cheers!

Edited September 10, 2014 by Sloop-JohnB

[Orator]

Lesson learned.

 

If you won this on a US Cruise, I cannot say I am surprised... As Canadians we often hear stories about folks who have won FREE stuff in the USA then finding that free isn't truly free (here in Canada when you win something... There are usually no extra taxes or fees levied... You win $ 1 Million in the lottery... You get $ 1 M)

 

In the USA, they have to pay fees & taxes upfront / upon delivery. They win $ 1 M in the lottery they are lucky if the see 35% ($ 350,000)

 

No where was this more of an issue than when Oprah gave her audience free cars a decade or so ago. Many of those in the audience needed those cars but didn't have the funds to take delivery of them (over $ 10,000 cash upfront). In the end, some arrangement was made with the State / US taxman, and Oprah paid the taxes & delivery costs for the winners.

 

In your situation, I guess I would be like you... Understandable of the delivery charge and ticked at the tax bill (although it sounds to me more of a case of Customs & Duty imposed by the UK at that small amount than actual US taxes... As I would expect them to be much higher... Unless this is a really tiny painting :confused::( :( )

 

On the other hand...

 

Thomas Kinkaid was a fairly well known American Artist with ties to Disney. I wouldn't be on for spending oodles for one of his large paintings that the Cruise Line Art Auctions hawk... But the amount that you will have paid out sounds like an ok deal to me.

 

Given also that the value of said painting will probably only increase over time... Now that the man is dead & gone (died of an alcohol & drug overdose). This could be the funny story & family heirloom that the great grandkids talk about in the future.

 

Cheers!

 

Might want to check prices for his works on art auction sites. They sell for a fraction of the Park West prices. So massed produced that I doubt the stuff sold on ships will gain in value. The postage and taxes probably exceed the real value of the work.

[Lsimon]

Was the fee for customs import duty? We have some friends in the UK whom we sent a gift to a while back, some relatively inexpensive items, and they had to pay a pretty good duty tax to get the package. I think it was higher than your £20 tax and it seemed way out of line for the value of the items sent but it is what it is. Just part of the issue with shipping good across borders.

 

Years ago my son won two prints at an art auction on the cruise. Cost me $50 each to have them shipped which I paid against my better judgment. Ten years later he hasn't lived home in over 5 years and the prints are still sitting in the mailing tube someplace around the house.

 

The art auctions on the ship are a very suspect operation and often do their marketing in a less than forthright manor. Some really like them but many have had issues. If you're curious about this then google "cruise line art auction" and/or "Park West", with or without the words "complaint" or "rip off" and you'll find some interesting reading.

Edited September 10, 2014 by Lsimon

[cruisestitch]

The title of your post is "help please" but I don't think that there's anything that can be done to help you. If the possibility of a fee was mentioned in the T & C, even if the print is small, you agreed to it.

[AmberCascades]

We bought some art earlier this year from Park West (not as an investment, of course, but because we loved it). They gave us a "deal" (of course :rolleyes:) but we were only going to buy it if it didn't bankrupt us having it shipped.

 

The PW dealer worked at getting reasonable shipping costs for us and confirmed that we would likely have to pay something to Canadian customs when it arrived.

 

As someone else said, there are going to be costs for shipping across borders.

 

Hopefully you like the Kinkaid enough for it to be worth it.

[Redtravel]

I avoid art auctions or buying anything on a cruise. When shipping anything to the USA from outside the country, you are liable for paying duty. Also, you can wait forever to get the item. I swore off sending after we bought a Turkish rug . We were told that it would arrive in 6 weeks. It was more like 6 months. I will never do that again. Fortunately, the rug was considered to be a local work of art. No extra duty. I bought it from a tour approved dealer. The amount of time that it took me to contact the tour company was outrageous. I kept sending emails which went unanswered until a week before the rug was due to arrive. I was happy to finally get my rug. However, I now do not buy anything outside the country unless I can carry it in myself.

 

As for winning a painting on the ship. You were taken. I hope that you contacted Royal Caribbean Ltd. you deserved better.

[TorontoSailor]

Hi. We sailed on the Eclipse in august and enjoying attending the art seminars. We were 'lucky' enough during the Thomas Kinkade seminar to win a small print through a raffle.

We excitedly took our winning ticket to the art desk and signed the paperwork. There we discovered the 'free' painting carried a 65 dollar delivery charge.

A bit saddened we handed over our seapass card and duly paid the 65 dollar charge on disembarkation.

Today a knock on the door and my painting has arrived. Yippppeeee. Until...... The UPS man hits me with another £20 fee for taxes. Now this we were NOT informed of. I sent him away with painting until tomorrow.

Something is not right here. A free gift will now be costing more money than I was led to believe.

I will have no choice no doubt to pay the man as if I refuse it I will have lost the painting plus the 65 dollars I've already spent getting the painting from the US to the UK.

I feel done as this was NOT explained. I have now looked through the three sheets of print out given to me and it does say in the terms and conditions but extremely small and not clear at all.

I wish I hadn't actually won this now. :/

Not really expecting any advice as such but it's a lesson learnt from me and I hope people reading this may think twice before picking up a 'free' raffle ticket.

 

"Art" on ships is a GIANT scam. Avoid at all costs.

[Yellowfurbaby]

Thanks all for your words. It is only our second cruise and first cruise The independence of the seas we never bothered with the art gallery. However this time we actually did enjoy browsing and attending the seminars.

Next time though no free raffle ticket shall be given to me. I wouldn't want to 'win' again.

Shame really as I do feel this should have been explained and not just hidden in small print. It leaves a nasty taste in the customer mouths.

So really I know nothing can be done except when the ups man comes again tomorrow I shall pay up and consider it a lesson. Hope this makes newbie cruisers think. Even on holiday nothings free.

Edited September 10, 2014 by Yellowfurbaby

[miched]

We atttend a Parkwest auction many years ago as a time killer. There was a blind auction. The auctioneer said that the painting was really nice and worth taking a chance on. Every one held up their signs for the starting bid of $5 and then the bidding increased in $5 increments. It got to $45 and a bunch still had their signs up and I was one of them. At $50 there were a few of us left. It increased to $55 and there were no takers, all of the signs were down. The auctioneer said that they would honor anyone that wanted the print for $55. I decided to take a chance as it was only $5 more so I along with about 10 others put up our sign and they recorded our numbers.

 

The print was exposed and it was hideous, and I was stuck with one. After the auction I went to ante up and somehow they did not have my number or info. I was told to fill out some sheets and than the shock really hit. The $55 now was up to over $185. There was the auction fee, restocking, fee, shipping fee, handling and insurance, appraisal cost, and then because I lived in Mi I had to pay 6% sales tax. I told them that I didnt need the appraisal as it was only $55. They would not waive that cost. I also said that I could carry it off the ship. Was told that it was being shipped from Mi. I also said that since it was being shipped from Mi why should I pay a restocking fee and as for the shipping I could pick it up asthe plae was about 20 miles from me. None of it would be waived. I was now stuck with a painting that I didn't like for a artificial inflated cost. Luckily there was a lot of confusion and since they didn't really have my info I snuck out and never looked back. I avoided the area and luckily didn't have to pay for it.

 

A few years later Parkwest was with a big law suit concerning some misrepresesntation and shady practices. They were rather quite for a while and not on any cruise lines. The old saying that time heals is right as they are back and still doing their con.

 

Happy crusing 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌅

Edited September 10, 2014 by miched

[A1A]

Thanks for the heads up, very informative thread.

Ken

[Sloop-JohnB]

We atttend a Parkwest auction many years ago as a time killer. There was a blind auction. The auctioneer said that the painting was really nice and worth taking a chance on. Every one held up their signs for the starting bid of $5 and then the bidding increased in $5 increments. It got to $45 and a bunch still had their signs up and I was one of them. At $50 there were a few of us left. It increased to $55 and there were no takers, all of the signs were down. The auctioneer said that they would honor anyone that wanted the print for $55. I decided to take a chance as it was only $5 more so I along with about 10 others put up our sign and they recorded our numbers.

 

The print was exposed and it was hideous, and I was stuck with one. After the auction I went to ante up and somehow they did not have my number or info. I was told to fill out some sheets and than the shock really hit. The $55 now was up to over $185. There was the auction fee, restocking, fee, shipping fee, handling and insurance, appraisal cost, and then because I lived in Mi I had to pay 6% sales tax. I told them that I didnt need the appraisal as it was only $55. They would not waive that cost. I also said that I could carry it off the ship. Was told that it was being shipped from Mi. I also said that since it was being shipped from Mi why should I pay a restocking fee and as for the shipping I could pick it up asthe plae was about 20 miles from me. None of it would be waived. I was now stuck with a painting that I didn't like for a artificial inflated cost. Luckily there was a lot of confusion and since they didn't really have my info I snuck out and never looked back. I avoided the area and luckily didn't have to pay for it.

 

A few years later Parkwest was with a big law suit concerning some misrepresesntation and shady practices. They were rather quite for a while and not on any cruise lines. The old saying that time heals is right as they are back and still doing their con.

 

Happy crusing 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌅

 

That is INSANE !!

 

Thanks for sharing your experience... Most definitely a con job.

 

We have pretty much avoided the Art Gallery Presentations... Lol in fact the whole area except for a stroll thru usually on E-Day... Just never interested us, either because of the art we saw there (very particular in its taste / style) or we couldn't imagine the trouble of getting it home (fragile, shipping, duty & taxes) just a headache as we saw it.

 

Guess I can count myself even luckier now... Cause your story truly does read like a con job / scam. I would have disappeared into the woodwork too given the circumstances.

 

On the other hand they say statistically that even when it is an obvious con... As yours was... That there is a stunningly high percentage of folks who still don't know how to say NO or walk away... Afraid of making a scene / confrontation. Part of the reason no doubt cons are truly the oldest profession (lol, the snake having been around before anyone discovered sex)

 

Cheers!

[dkjretired]

Lesson learned.

 

If you won this on a US Cruise, I cannot say I am surprised... As Canadians we often hear stories about folks who have won FREE stuff in the USA then finding that free isn't truly free (here in Canada when you win something... There are usually no extra taxes or fees levied... You win $ 1 Million in the lottery... You get $ 1 M)

 

In the USA, they have to pay fees & taxes upfront / upon delivery. They win $ 1 M in the lottery they are lucky if the see 35% ($ 350,000)

 

No where was this more of an issue than when Oprah gave her audience free cars a decade or so ago. Many of those in the audience needed those cars but didn't have the funds to take delivery of them (over $ 10,000 cash upfront). In the end, some arrangement was made with the State / US taxman, and Oprah paid the taxes & delivery costs for the winners.

 

In your situation, I guess I would be like you... Understandable of the delivery charge and ticked at the tax bill (although it sounds to me more of a case of Customs & Duty imposed by the UK at that small amount than actual US taxes... As I would expect them to be much higher... Unless this is a really tiny painting :(:confused: )

 

On the other hand...

 

Thomas Kinkaid was a fairly well known American Artist with ties to Disney. I wouldn't be on for spending oodles for one of his large paintings that the Cruise Line Art Auctions hawk... But the amount that you will have paid out sounds like an ok deal to me.

 

Given also that the value of said painting will probably only increase over time... Now that the man is dead & gone (died of an alcohol & drug overdose). This could be an interesting story & family heirloom that the great grandkids talk about in the future.

 

Cheers!

 

As someone who actually won a life changing amount of money, your comments are not accurate about winnings in the US.

 

Wife does auctions all the time, she will look at the art but won't participate in ship auctions.

[Yellowfurbaby]

We atttend a Parkwest auction many years ago as a time killer. There was a blind auction. The auctioneer said that the painting was really nice and worth taking a chance on. Every one held up their signs for the starting bid of $5 and then the bidding increased in $5 increments. It got to $45 and a bunch still had their signs up and I was one of them. At $50 there were a few of us left. It increased to $55 and there were no takers, all of the signs were down. The auctioneer said that they would honor anyone that wanted the print for $55. I decided to take a chance as it was only $5 more so I along with about 10 others put up our sign and they recorded our numbers.

 

The print was exposed and it was hideous, and I was stuck with one. After the auction I went to ante up and somehow they did not have my number or info. I was told to fill out some sheets and than the shock really hit. The $55 now was up to over $185. There was the auction fee, restocking, fee, shipping fee, handling and insurance, appraisal cost, and then because I lived in Mi I had to pay 6% sales tax. I told them that I didnt need the appraisal as it was only $55. They would not waive that cost. I also said that I could carry it off the ship. Was told that it was being shipped from Mi. I also said that since it was being shipped from Mi why should I pay a restocking fee and as for the shipping I could pick it up asthe plae was about 20 miles from me. None of it would be waived. I was now stuck with a painting that I didn't like for a artificial inflated cost. Luckily there was a lot of confusion and since they didn't really have my info I snuck out and never looked back. I avoided the area and luckily didn't have to pay for it.

 

A few years later Parkwest was with a big law suit concerning some misrepresesntation and shady practices. They were rather quite for a while and not on any cruise lines. The old saying that time heals is right as they are back and still doing their con.

 

Happy crusing 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌅

That story is worse than mine! Thanks for sharing. Although on future cruises I may have a wander around the art and attend seminars I shall not ever do an auction or wish to recieve a gift again. Please think twice everyone.

Although not celebrity's fault (we had the best holiday) I shall email them for feedback regarding this. If they have enough unhappy cruisers something eventually may be done.

[Iamthesea]

No where was this more of an issue than when Oprah gave her audience free cars a decade or so ago. Many of those in the audience needed those cars but didn't have the funds to take delivery of them (over $ 10,000 cash upfront). In the end, some arrangement was made with the State / US taxman, and Oprah paid the taxes & delivery costs for the winners

 

A few years ago, I won one of ELLEN's 12 Days. :D A TV, Blu-Ray DVD Player, 35mm camera, gaming equipment, some other things that I cannot remember. Based on the Oprah situation, the first thing I asked when I got the call about winning was to make sure that I was not responsible for taxes, shipping or prize taxes. I was assured that I was not. I even had them send me something in writing, by email. Not until then did I accept the winnings.;) Pretty sweet Christmas that year!:) I kept the TV and DVD player, and gave the other gifts to my children. There was one thing that we could not use. A membership to a health club based out west. We live in the southeast. :rolleyes:

 

OP, sorry that you had to learn a hard earned lesson. You are not the first! Take your loss and try to sell the print on eBay. ;)

[wallie5446]

Our daughter works with a young lady that worked for Park West on ship for 3 years. Look, touch, drink the cheap bubbly, don't bid nor buy:rolleyes:

[biker1972]

The truly sad part of all of these stories as well as the Park West history is that the cruise lines still have these "Art" auctions. They have no personal stake in them other than getting a fee for use of the area by the auction company. Their almost standard answer is that you have to deal with the art company and not the cruise line.:eek:

[Lsimon]

...As for winning a painting on the ship. You were taken. I hope that you contacted Royal Caribbean Ltd. you deserved better.

 

Contact Royal Caribbean? Are you klidding. They, and Celebrity, and all the other cruise lines, are in on the action. The unscrupulous side of the operation is nothing new to them and they make a tidy profit on it.

 

The art auctions, together with the whole "port shopping" scam are a really dark side of the way cruise lines generate profits and I remain very disappointed that they allow these schemes on their ships.

 

(By Port Shopping scam I'm referring to the whole presentation of port talks, recommended shops and the port shopping consultant/guide as being a "service" to the cruiser when really these are just paid advertisements)

Edited September 10, 2014 by Lsimon

[Sloop-JohnB]

The truly sad part of all of these stories as well as the Park West history is that the cruise lines still have these "Art" auctions. They have no personal stake in them other than getting a fee for use of the area by the auction company. Their almost standard answer is that you have to deal with the art company and not the cruise line.:eek:

 

Contact Royal Caribbean? Are you klidding. They, and Celebrity, and all the other cruise lines, are in on the action. The unscrupulous side of the operation is nothing new to them and they make a tidy profit on it.

 

The art auctions, together with the whole "port shopping" scam are a really dark side of the way cruise lines generate profits and I remain very disappointed that they allow these schemes on their ships.

 

(By Port Shopping scam I'm referring to the whole presentation of port talks, recommended shops and the port shopping consultant/guide as being a "service" to the cruiser when really these are just paid advertisements)

 

100% agree

 

I always feel sorry for first time cruisers who don't have all the facts... In reality a good lot of the pay extra things on the ship actually are there on a contract basis with kick-backs going to the Cruise Co. (Art Auction - Photography - Excursions - Shopping - Spa Services - and I also believe the Casino)

 

If you take issue with any of these Vendors, then more often than not you will hung out to dry by the Cruise Line.

 

Buyer beware !!

 

Cheers!

[daisy-mae]

The charge levied by UPS was for import duties as well as brokerage, which can amount to a tidy sum; the amount is based on the declared value of the item, plus assorted other charges including advancing payment to the government on the recipient's behalf (sort of like a high-interest short-term loan).

 

With the advent of eBay, Amazon, and other online merchants, Canadians have become acutely aware of the extra charges that online shopping entails, particularly when it comes to dealing with UPS and FedEx; even our postal service now levies a fee to shepherd goods exceeding $20 into the country. And it is not uncommon for prizes that are awarded to be declared at full retail value instead of the wholesale price that it cost the company sponsoring the contest.

 

Thanks to the OP for the heads-up -- we will give the art seminars a wide berth.

[Orator]

100% agree

 

I always feel sorry for first time cruisers who don't have all the facts... In reality a good lot of the pay extra things on the ship actually are there on a contract basis with kick-backs going to the Cruise Co. (Art Auction - Photography - Excursions - Shopping - Spa Services - and I also believe the Casino)

 

If you take issue with any of these Vendors, then more often than not you will hung out to dry by the Cruise Line.

 

Buyer beware !!

 

Cheers!

 

I believe that the Casino is now owned and operated by Celebrity. The other venues you mention are all leased space. Fortunately Cruise Critic is available to assist the new cruiser. Unfortunately, only a small % actually read it.

[miched]

 

(By Port Shopping scam I'm referring to the whole presentation of port talks, recommended shops and the port shopping consultant/guide as being a "service" to the cruiser when really these are just paid advertisements)

 

I am a watch collector and have befriended a few of the store owners and managers that deal in high end watches. One will no longer participate in the recommended shops because of the cost involved. He said it is senseless as passengers will come into his store because he has the exclusive franchise to sell the watches he has and doesn't need to pay the cruise line to put them on their recommended list. He also said that the guarantee form that they want you to fill out is useless and the only purpose it serves is for them to help determine that they are getting their full commission or as Tony would say "taste". If you read what the guarantee is it is not worth the paper that it is printed on, read what it really is and not what you want it to be. This applies to every thing and not just watches.

 

Happy cruising 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌅