Oasis of the Seas Person overboard

[A&L_Ont]

I'm suspect the crew will be ok. They have not lived in bubbles. People deal with all types of loss and tragedies in their lives. You are the last person I need to tell that to. They will put this into perspective and move on. It is the only way to survive what life throws at you. And I don't mean that to sound cold.

 

As usual you are right, we sure don't live in bubbles. I sometimes like the innocence of them though, even though it is not reality. :)

[chengkp75]

As usual you are right, we sure don't live in bubbles. I sometimes like the innocence of them though, even though it is not reality. :)

 

The vast majority of crew come from countries where the concept and familiarity with life and death is far different than in the US. Most would not understand counseling for a death.

[Trotter95]

My guess would be that they did not launch a life boat, but used the two fast rescue boats. These are far faster, more maneuverable, better equipped, and faster to launch than the lifeboats. They are also much easier to get someone into than a lifeboat. And no boat, whether FRB or lifeboat would be launched while the ship was moving. That is a certain recipe for disaster.

I watched Freedom launch a rescue boat to pick up stranded Cubans in a raft while we were underway.

 

 

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[Lil2Angelic]

Pardon my ignorance, but I always assumed that the emergency calls for ships were the same universally. For example when we had a "jumper" on Carnival the call from the bridge was "Bravo, bravo, bravo" portside. Passengers that were on the Oasis are saying the call was "Oscar, oscar, oscar". Can someone elaborate on this?

 

Also, if the calls aren't universal then when the ship calls the Coast Guard is there a universal code or name for "man overboard"? or do they just say what happened i.e. we have a man overboard?

[Palmetto Pilot]

Not likely. Even those helipads that exist on cruise ships are not capable of landing helicopters with the range and payload capacity necessary, which is why most evacs are winch ones (let alone the dangers of landing a helo on a moving ship). The cruise lines would not be interested in investing space and dollars (initial construction cost) to build a helipad and hangar for an onboard bird. Also, you would need to have two pilots that you would have to pay every day, even though they would only rarely fly. Also, the amount of training required for maritime operations (hovering near large ships in all weathers), search and rescue, and flight medicine is extremely costly, best absorbed by government agencies, and without constant training, which a crew assigned to a cruise ship wouldn't get, their effectiveness would be marginal. Even if a cruise line could shanghai a flight crew from the USCG, without the constant training and actual operations their skills would atrophy.

 

You can land a H-60 on that helipad easily. Even if I had to do a pinnacle landing I could do it in the space available.

[LMaxwell]

You can land a H-60 on that helipad easily. Even if I had to do a pinnacle landing I could do it in the space available.

 

I don't think the deck is designed to support the full load of a helicopter for extended periods of time. Short touch and goes probably. think of it more as a weather deck over the marine operations gear below.

[beachbuddy]

Pardon my ignorance, but I always assumed that the emergency calls for ships were the same universally. For example when we had a "jumper" on Carnival the call from the bridge was "Bravo, bravo, bravo" portside. Passengers that were on the Oasis are saying the call was "Oscar, oscar, oscar". Can someone elaborate on this?

 

Also, if the calls aren't universal then when the ship calls the Coast Guard is there a universal code or name for "man overboard"? or do they just say what happened i.e. we have a man overboard?

 

 

Bravo is for a fire.

 

 

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[chengkp75]

Pardon my ignorance, but I always assumed that the emergency calls for ships were the same universally. For example when we had a "jumper" on Carnival the call from the bridge was "Bravo, bravo, bravo" portside. Passengers that were on the Oasis are saying the call was "Oscar, oscar, oscar". Can someone elaborate on this?

 

Also, if the calls aren't universal then when the ship calls the Coast Guard is there a universal code or name for "man overboard"? or do they just say what happened i.e. we have a man overboard?

 

The "code" calls are not universal, but are specific to various cruise lines. They were developed to be able to call specific emergency teams to a situation without using the "general alarm" bells that merchant ships use. They also can call emergency teams without alarming passengers. On merchant ships, there are only two signals: "fire and general emergency" and "abandon ship". Once these signals alert the crew, the specific emergency situation (fire, flooding, grounding, man overboard) will be passed by PA announcement. Due to smaller crew size, all crew on merchant ships will respond to every emergency, while on a cruise ship only the fire teams, the medical teams, the fast response tech team, and the security team, for example will only respond to a fire emergency, and the rest of the crew will continue with their normal duties. Only when the signal for passenger muster (more than six short blasts followed by one long blast), which is actually the signal for "fire and general emergency", will all crew respond to their emergency stations.

 

The USCG or other government agency doesn't know or care about the "code" messages. The ship will notify the maritime agencies exactly what the ship is experiencing: fire, flooding, man overboard, medical emergency, etc.

[Lil2Angelic]

Bravo is for a fire.

 

 

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I am certain that the "Bravo" call on Carnival was for the man overboard.

[waterbugohio]

Any word from passengers boarding and leaving on the Oasis??

 

I noticed she is still in port (webcam) What time is she scheduled to leave? Was she delayed just because of getting back late? Or are there investigations to be done?

[Retired LEO]

I am certain that the "Bravo" call on Carnival was for the man overboard.

 

Cruise lines have their own codes.

[chengkp75]

You can land a H-60 on that helipad easily. Even if I had to do a pinnacle landing I could do it in the space available.

 

I'm not trying to school an experienced Army aviator, but rotor circle is not the only limitation of these helidecks. Aircraft weight, along with the need to keep down force on the rotors to keep it stuck on the moving deck, could exceed the design load of the deck. With the helideck on the bow, the motion of the ship is maximized. This just based on my time as a helicopter passenger and ship's engineer in over a decade of offshore oil exploration utilizing helicopters, and training for helicopter operations on merchant ships.

[depplep]

I see she is just now leaving. We left around 5pm last week. Disembarkation was a nightmare for Express departure. Nothing to do with the man overboard. Just not very well organized. Others report late embarkation today. Wolfganghowell may be able to say more as he is on this sailing.

[Lil2Angelic]

The "code" calls are not universal, but are specific to various cruise lines. They were developed to be able to call specific emergency teams to a situation without using the "general alarm" bells that merchant ships use. They also can call emergency teams without alarming passengers. On merchant ships, there are only two signals: "fire and general emergency" and "abandon ship". Once these signals alert the crew, the specific emergency situation (fire, flooding, grounding, man overboard) will be passed by PA announcement. Due to smaller crew size, all crew on merchant ships will respond to every emergency, while on a cruise ship only the fire teams, the medical teams, the fast response tech team, and the security team, for example will only respond to a fire emergency, and the rest of the crew will continue with their normal duties. Only when the signal for passenger muster (more than six short blasts followed by one long blast), which is actually the signal for "fire and general emergency", will all crew respond to their emergency stations.

 

The USCG or other government agency doesn't know or care about the "code" messages. The ship will notify the maritime agencies exactly what the ship is experiencing: fire, flooding, man overboard, medical emergency, etc.

 

Thank you!

[Palmetto Pilot]

I'm not trying to school an experienced Army aviator, but rotor circle is not the only limitation of these helidecks. Aircraft weight, along with the need to keep down force on the rotors to keep it stuck on the moving deck, could exceed the design load of the deck. With the helideck on the bow, the motion of the ship is maximized. This just based on my time as a helicopter passenger and ship's engineer in over a decade of offshore oil exploration utilizing helicopters, and training for helicopter operations on merchant ships.

 

I'm well aware of what's required to keep a helicopter "anchored" while performing loading and unloading. Doing it at 11,000 feet of top of a mountain while only being able to put one wheel down is more my specialty. I've only landed on ships a handful of times. My point being is you could get a H60 size helicopter on most modern cruise ships, at least for a quick load/offload. That being said, if the USGC C-130 and H60 couldn't find the guy having a helo on board wouldn't do an ounce of good. Those guys are the absolute best. Bar none.

[alocsin]

The Coast Guard has suspended the search for the man overboard:

 

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/fort-lauderdale/fl-man-overboard-oasis-of-seas-folo-20151107-story.html

[chengkp75]

I'm well aware of what's required to keep a helicopter "anchored" while performing loading and unloading. Doing it at 11,000 feet of top of a mountain while only being able to put one wheel down is more my specialty. I've only landed on ships a handful of times. My point being is you could get a H60 size helicopter on most modern cruise ships, at least for a quick load/offload. That being said, if the USGC C-130 and H60 couldn't find the guy having a helo on board wouldn't do an ounce of good. Those guys are the absolute best. Bar none.

 

Wasn't trying to give offense, just pointing out that helidecks designed for light helicopters are the norm on ships, not normally able to accommodate USCG Dauphins. And I agree, the "Knee Deep Navy" are the "pros from Dover" when it comes to SAR (Canadian Forces SAR are in the same class, I've been the recipient of their skills).

Edited November 7, 2015 by chengkp75

[h-sar]

The vast majority of crew come from countries where the concept and familiarity with life and death is far different than in the US. Most would not understand counseling for a death.

 

Having been born in a country from where a huge percentage of cruise line service personnel originate, you're absolutely right. They will, of course, be devastated, but will take comfort from each other instead. My heart goes out to the friends and family of the deceased as well as all those who witnessed this tragic event.

[Ocean Boy]

I agree with your sentiment here though most may not understand. I bet if they get counselling they will come out worse! I estimate I have seen over 1000 people die in my company from a variety of accident, illnesses, mishaps and crimes (don't ask). I only get a little haunted by a couple of those (usually children). But counselling just turns a bad event you move on from into a festering sore that the counsellors like to keep 'active'.

Moving on is the best way to go...if you can. The assumption that you can't is self defeating.

 

I have seen counselors get a hold of people who were doing fine after tragedies and turn them into blubbering messes. They even have a way of making you feel like there is something wrong with you, or that you are just suppressing your feelings, if you are doing ok.:rolleyes:

[tarheelmjfan]

We live in South Florida & our news is reporting the family has retained an attorney. They're blaming RCCL for the death & are considering suing. This is certainly a strange situation.

[AndyT3]

We live in South Florida & our news is reporting the family has retained an attorney. They're blaming RCCL for the death & are considering suing. This is certainly a strange situation.

 

I don't understand how that would even work...

[emdia43]

I don't understand how that would even work...

 

If he was under the influence of alcohol, they will blame Royal for serving him .....would be my guess.

[AndyT3]

If he was under the influence of alcohol, they will blame Royal for serving him .....would be my guess.

 

 

Ahh, good point. I would assume that would be the case. I can't imagine why anyone else would jump from their balcony and end up on the lifeboat to begin with (according to reports and previous posts from passengers).

[spookwife]

Pardon my ignorance, but I always assumed that the emergency calls for ships were the same universally. For example when we had a "jumper" on Carnival the call from the bridge was "Bravo, bravo, bravo" portside. Passengers that were on the Oasis are saying the call was "Oscar, oscar, oscar". Can someone elaborate on this?

 

Also, if the calls aren't universal then when the ship calls the Coast Guard is there a universal code or name for "man overboard"? or do they just say what happened i.e. we have a man overboard?

 

Oscar is the Navy and Coast Guard code for Man overboard.

 

again I'd have to ask the actual Naval Officer of the family to clarify( sorry guys At the precise moment Navy is taking on Memphis and the Squid Shall Not Be Disturbed )

 

but Alpha and Bravo are usually classes of fire( chemical, etc) at least according to my Firefighter Brother.

[tarheelmjfan]

I don't understand how that would even work...

 

They're saying the crew harassed him & his DH the whole cruise for being gay. Their lawyer is reporting it got really bad at one of the bars. According to them the constant taunting & harassing pushed him too far. (I'm paraphrasing). They say the crew were then inept at the rescue attempt. It appears to me to be a classic case of looking for someone to blame instead of the guilty party(ies).

Edited November 8, 2015 by tarheelmjfan
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