It's official! Formal nights gone, evening chic in! (3 Threads Merged)

[BosoxI]

Whew! This is getting quite personal and very nasty. The facts are simple: Celebrity has made a business decision. Possibly the majority of customers agree with it. Possibly a large minority of customers are upset by it.

 

As the clear rules for formal nights were largely ignored, I can't believe that the rules for an ill defined Elegant Chic night will somehow be followed. It remains to be seen the effects of this change. Might I add that most of the snarky remarks I've seen are coming from those in favor of the change, maybe a reflection of their larger numbers.

 

DW and I have always gone our own way on the many cruises we've taken. We'll continue to seek the company of those to whom elegance and chicness come naturally. They'll be easy to spot, I'm sure. Their elegance will show itself in more ways than their mode of dress, I assure you

Edited November 15, 2015 by BosoxI

[roundthenextcorner]

The very definition of Modern Luxury, even McDonalds haven't thought of that. Maybe, instead of background music, someone could make regular announcements over the loudspeaker what the rules of the ship are and the punishments to be handed down to those who break the rules.

 

:D ROFL, Love it!

Keel hauling, flogging round the fleet, etc, etc

We'll get the Class back into Celebrity

:D

[Marelaine]

Celebrity could have "grown a spine", posted a large board referencing banned attire at the entrance to MDR and then proceeded to enforce it. I do agree that "farce" is the appropriate word to attach to Celebrity's approach.

 

 

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Well, a sign would be classy.

 

It's possible that those who have complained to the Maitre d', Guest Services, CC hostess, hotel director, etc... are the reason that Celebrity changed the wording for 'dress up nights.' They may have better things to do than chastise passengers (paying customers) who don't quite measure up to other customers' sense of formality....so they have changed the wording to 'Elegant Chic,' rather than 'Formal.' Celebrity has finally stood up to the complainers. No sign is needed. No gentelmen will be forced to wear a used, loaner jacket over their pefectly nice dress shirt. No more complaints will be taken after December 4th.'

Edited November 15, 2015 by Marelaine
punctuation

[Presto2]

Have sailed with Celebrity 3 times and P&O a few more. Also tried RCI and it was a fabulous formal night and they had a string quartet playing in he restaurant as we ate!

 

Very, very disappointed re the way that Celebrity has gone. If it has been like this before we booked our first cruise with them we would have looked elsewhere. From someone looking on, I do think that there have been massive changes over the last 3 years and it is no longer our cruise line of choice.

 

We are now looking at RCI for 2017 when their routes come out as there seems to be little difference.

 

:rolleyes:

[Ordinary Chef]

To begin with, I could care less what others wear. Having said that, what seems to be missing in this thread is not that the dress code has changed, but that those who ignore what ever the code is, will continue to ignore it and dress the way they want. Although the formal dress code, as previously stated, left openings for interpretation, I would think most people understood the intend. The same with the new dress code. To me it is not the change in the dress code that matters, but the continued arrogance of those who think because they paid for their cruise, they can dress however they want, regardless of the stated dress code. Life is too short to let something as trivial as what someone is wearing to ruin your vacation. However, a non respect for an understood decorum can put a damper on the anticipated ambiance during one's time during a cruise.

Edited November 16, 2015 by Ordinary Chef

[kands6191]

To begin with, I could care less what others wear. Having said that, what seems to be missing in this thread is not that the dress code has changed, but that those who ignore what ever the code is, will continue to ignore it and dress the way they want. Although the formal dress code, as previously stated, left openings for interpretation, I would think most people understood the intend. The same with the new dress code. To me it is not the change in the dress code that matters, but the continued arrogance of those who think because they paid for their cruise, they can dress however they want, regardless of the stated dress code. Life is too short to let something as trivial as what someone is wearing to ruin your vacation. However, a non respect for an understood decorum can put a damper on the anticipated ambiance during one's time during a cruise.

 

Very well said!

[jjwoben1]

Since our next cruise starts on Nov 29, what dress code do we fall under?

[Charles4515]

Since our next cruise starts on Nov 29, what dress code do we fall under?

 

 

The old one. The new dress code is for sailings starting Dec 4 and after.

 

 

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[K.T.B.]

To begin with, I could care less what others wear. Having said that, what seems to be missing in this thread is not that the dress code has changed, but that those who ignore what ever the code is, will continue to ignore it and dress the way they want. Although the formal dress code, as previously stated, left openings for interpretation, I would think most people understood the intend. The same with the new dress code. To me it is not the change in the dress code that matters, but the continued arrogance of those who think because they paid for their cruise, they can dress however they want, regardless of the stated dress code. Life is too short to let something as trivial as what someone is wearing to ruin your vacation. However, a non respect for an understood decorum can put a damper on the anticipated ambiance during one's time during a cruise.

 

Very well said, especially what I bolded.

[DannyS]

This seems like a classic case of lowering the requirement to increase the compliance.

 

Look at the descriptions for men:

Formal: Tuxedo, suit, or dinner jacket with slacks

Evening Chic: Pants or designer jeans with a dress shirt, button-down shirt or sweater, Optional sport coat or blazer

 

And women:

Formal: Cocktail dress, gown, or dressy pantsuit

Evening Chic: A cocktail dress, Skirt, pants or designer jeans with an elegant top

 

There's a lot in Formal that results in people saying, "I don't own that, and I'm not shopping for the cruise, so I'll wear whatever." Evening Chic is far more achievable by everyone. Which also makes it much more enforceable.

 

As things are today, they'll let you into the MDR wearing pretty much anything on Formal Night. Now that the guidelines are something everyone should be able to achieve and pack - they have a lot more ability to enforce the rules.

 

Where I live, there was a highway with a speed limit of 50mph. Everybody drove 70. They wanted to bring speeds down. So they raised the speed limit to 60, and then enforced it rigidly. Enforcing a 50MPH speed limit on that road wasn't realistic. But 60 was, and it brought speeds on the road down. You wouldn't think you could lower speeds by raising the limit, but you can.

 

Same here. They're lowering the standard to raise the level of dress in the dining room. I'm looking forward to it.

[RocketMan275]

Firstly I highlighted MAY to indicate that it was not a clear case. My humble opinion is that the chances of winning would be about 50/50 hence why I didnt think it worth the hassle. On the one hand I could argue that the cruise wad booked with a Clear written undertaking that there would be x formal nights. We could use all the furore on here and social media to demonstrate that such a change has people cancelling cruises and vowing never to ho Celebrity again. On the other hand Celebrity would argue that the change was minor and only affects one room on the ship. The judgement would be whether the claimants expectations were reasonable and that the change would have meant them not booking the cruise if the new arrangements had been in place at the time of booking. Hard to predict an outcome.

 

Celebrity would simply claim that this change in now way affects your ability to dress in any way you find appropriate. You would be, in effect, suing your fellow passengers to cause them to dress in a way you find appropriate. Do you think you would prevail in a suit where you sued your fellow passengers for failing to dress to your standards?

[LA_Design]

Celebrity would simply claim that this change in now way affects your ability to dress in any way you find appropriate. You would be, in effect, suing your fellow passengers to cause them to dress in a way you find appropriate. Do you think you would prevail in a suit where you sued your fellow passengers for failing to dress to your standards?

 

 

This reply assumes that the quoted poster accepts I was commenting about bookings made under English law.

 

Any claim would be against the Company for breach of contract. Whether such a claim would succeed is open to question. The claimant would not be taking action against fellow passengers and to suggest so is either naive or disingenuous IMHO.

 

The real test for an advocate would be to show that a claimant had a reasonable expectation removed by the change of policy and that had the change been clearly in place at the time of booking the claimant would not have made the booking. IMHO this would be a tricky task with chances of succeeding at about 50/50.

[RocketMan275]

This reply assumes that the quoted poster accepts I was commenting about bookings made under English law.

 

Any claim would be against the Company for breach of contract. Whether such a claim would succeed is open to question. The claimant would not be taking action against fellow passengers and to suggest so is either naive or disingenuous IMHO.

 

The real test for an advocate would be to show that a claimant had a reasonable expectation removed by the change of policy and that had the change been clearly in place at the time of booking the claimant would not have made the booking. IMHO this would be a tricky task with chances of succeeding at about 50/50.

 

I fully understood you would be suing under UK law since you would be laughed out of court in any other jurisdiction.

 

Your cause for action would be the fact that your fellow passengers did not meet your standard for dress. You would be claiming damages for the loss of 'ambiance' resulting from their failure to dress as you would choose. So, I ask again, since it is the action of fellow passengers that is causing you harm, why not just sue any fellow passenger who fails to meet your acceptable standard for dress?

[Spender Nui]

"no ripped jeans".

 

So that means ripped jeans are ok on other nights in the MDR?

 

Wow.

 

While we're past the tuxedo and gown days, I think this is way, way too lax.

 

Could never understand why anyone would want to wear "ripped jeans". The only people I knew who did had to wear them because they couldn't afford better ... And then they tried to mend them.

 

But I do agree with eliminating the formal requirement although it hasn't been enforced for years.

Edited November 17, 2015 by Spender Nui

[Tura Lura]

Could never understand why anyone would want to wear "ripped jeans". The only people I knew who did had to wear them because they couldn't afford better ... And then they tried to mend them.

 

But I do agree with eliminating the formal requirement although it hasn't been enforced for years.

 

Ha- they're not ripped, they're distressed. And some cost hundreds of $.

[jagoffee]

With respect there is a world of difference between litigation and a Casino - I think ! [emoji33]

Of course. I was only referencing your calculation of odds. #️⃣#️⃣

 

On the other hand you have given us a story to share. "Someone said" kind of story.

Edited November 17, 2015 by jagoffee

[seapals2]

 

 

Found this when doing a bit of browsing on cruise wear history.

 

 

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[Wine-O]

I guess I can leave my tux at home for future cruises. Now I'll be going "chick." :rolleyes:

[jerseygirl3]

Dockers and a button down would be smart casual. Evening Chic would be your black pants, beautiful purple shirt and a waistcoat....Just an example, I don't expect you to run to Banana Republic for a purple shirt :)

 

How will eliminating formal nights translate into less luggage? A tux doesn't weigh much more than a pair of dress slacks and a nice shirt. And women's dresses can be very lightweight (i.e., jersey material).

 

I'm not happy about this. Folks who don't want to do formal night have the option of various other dining venues. However, since Celebrity is "dumbing down" the dress code to "no ripped jeans", I think those of us who still like to dress up will look out of place.

 

Sad...

[kenevenpar]

Ha- they're not ripped, they're distressed. And some cost hundreds of $.

 

They are ripped, torn, cut.

 

A pig with lipstick is still a pig. And they cost more than the ripped jeans.;)

[gek]

How will eliminating formal nights translate into less luggage? A tux doesn't weigh much more than a pair of dress slacks and a nice shirt. And women's dresses can be very lightweight (i.e., jersey material).

 

Formal wear requires a whole outfit of clothes which you might only wear for a few hours over the whole cruise. That outfit can be eliminated entirely with the new code and replaced by clothes which could be mixed and matched with other clothes for use on other nights.

 

A lot of people don't seem to understand the "pack light" philosophy of travel. Sure, it's not necessarily required on a cruise ship but as my wife always says, the less you pack the more room there is for shopping.

 

The bottom line is that if you enjoy dressing up then you will find room in your luggage. If not then you shouldn't have to and the space can be used for something more important to you.

[kenevenpar]

They are ripped, torn, cut.

 

A pig with lipstick is still a pig. And they cost more than the ripped

 

Where I live a rare breed pig is a very expensive item. they sell easy without gimmicks such as lipstick .

 

What type of lipstick , cheap brand or designer?

 

Evening Chic

[Tiggertastic]

I'm looking forward to comparing how much it changes from our December cruise to our May and August cruises. I think we will see quite a few n formal over Christmas and then it reduce down.

[Natalia&Nick]

I intend to put some rips into the trousers of my old dinner suit - my legal training suggests this may well be within the new code and VERY chic [emoji32]

 

 

I'm going for Punk style zips ;)

[Jobeth66]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. What one wears is no indication of 'class'. One's behavior, however, is.