how strict are they on age in the bars?

[kerryincork]

My grandson is 5, he is very advanced for his age (per doctor, not me), his vocabulary is very advanced as well as all other skills. Do I take him to these events, because he can "handle it", or do I use my own judgement and curb any events until he is of "proper" age.

 

If some adults can't go to entertainment venues for "adult topics" without having to encounter those "below" the age restriction, then why have the restrictions in place. Everything open to all, anything goes, OH, and if there is by chance that something is said or done that is beyond "modesty" they will be the first ones filing a complaint with the cruise line, because little Suzie or Sam were subject to "adult" activity.

Are you seriously comparing a 5 year to a teenager who is a couple weeks away from their 18th Birthday? Are You really arguing there is no difference between a 5 year old with good language skills to an almost adult human being, in level of understanding or emotional maturity!

 

I have no children, so don't have any skin in this game. But your argument is very weak and rather nonsensical.

 

The original OP was talking about letting 17 year old in 21 disco. Which I don't agree with, as most teenagers look anywhere between 15 to 25, in a club situation, where hook-ups are common, the expectation of other patrons is that anyone in that area is a legal adult, which could put the 17 y.o. in a dangerous position, as well as unsuspecting patrons.

 

In regards to the comedy club I do not believe for one moment that a nearly 18 y.o. is going to be emotionally damaged from the show.

 

I do agree though that the seating should be for adults and not kids. I was at one show where the mother had her kid lying on four or five front row chairs asleep while she watched the show, with adults standing around the walls.

 

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[Florings]

I have a quick question. I read through the whole thread and never saw this asked or answered. What do you tell your children when you pass the sign that says 21+ or when the announcer says that if you're under 18 please leave? Do they ask "why are we going in if I am underage?"

 

Look all around you....this country is literally full of people who have been told to disregard the rules....

[kc58ab]

Are you seriously comparing a 5 year to a teenager who is a couple weeks away from their 18th Birthday? Are You really arguing there is no difference between a 5 year old with good language skills to an almost adult human being, in level of understanding or emotional maturity!

 

I have no children, so don't have any skin in this game. But your argument is very weak and rather nonsensical.

 

The original OP was talking about letting 17 year old in 21 disco. Which I don't agree with, as most teenagers look anywhere between 15 to 25, in a club situation, where hook-ups are common, the expectation of other patrons is that anyone in that area is a legal adult, which could put the 17 y.o. in a dangerous position, as well as unsuspecting patrons.

 

In regards to the comedy club I do not believe for one moment that a nearly 18 y.o. is going to be emotionally damaged from the show.

 

I do agree though that the seating should be for adults and not kids. I was at one show where the mother had her kid lying on four or five front row chairs asleep while she watched the show, with adults standing around the walls.

 

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:') This... I was thinking the same thing. Not anywhere close in comparison and weak.

And I agree with you that if adults want to see the show and children are sitting in the seats they should get up and allow the adult to have the seat. I say that also in circumstances like we're in a restaurant waiting to be taken to our table or anywhere else my children know to get up and stand so that elders can sit.

[oceanmom62]

Actually I did already answer one of these, but I'll do it again. When we went to the comedy show it was several years ago and what they actually said is it was for mature audiences. Again I would take that as similar to R-rated movies as a parent it's my option if I want to take my child to something that is suggested 17 and older content.

As for the serenity deck I don't know there was a sign this was years ago. I'm sure now there probably is one somewhere, but no one outright noticed it and commented on it although I did know it was an "adult area". But she was 17 at the time so that is an adult legally in many cases.

I'm sure there are several seemingly adult things she has to look forward to that she hasn't done...

Anything else I can clear up for you that wasn't already detailed in the book I've posted? And all from merely answering the OP's original question....

No, you still didn't answer my question but instead got defensive. You say that you didn't see any signs on the Serenity Deck but you knew it was 21+. Did your daughter know it was 21+? If so, what did you say to her when you took her there? I'm curious to know how you handled a situation where it's against the rules but you let your children do it anyway.

[oceanmom62]

Look all around you....this country is literally full of people who have been told to disregard the rules....

I know. I work in a school and you would not believe the people who don't live in district but try to enroll-or the people who try to enroll kids who are not theirs- or the parents who think court custody orders are merely suggestions. It makes me sad for the future. I am well aware that nobody follows all the rules all the time. I am one of those who speed on the highway. I stay away from other drivers and only drive faster in good conditions. That is the only rule/law that I violate knowingly. I also know how much trouble I will get in so I don't do it often or recklessly- not looking for high insurance or losing my license. I'm also one of those who reads the cruise contract ( and every contract, owners manual, etc.). If I break a rule it is usually by accident and I certainly don't talk about it as being a good thing. Not all rules should be followed but I usually consider those rules to be the immoral ones. Just because I don't like it or would do it differently is not a good enough reason.

[kc58ab]

No, you still didn't answer my question but instead got defensive. You say that you didn't see any signs on the Serenity Deck but you knew it was 21+. Did your daughter know it was 21+? If so, what did you say to her when you took her there? I'm curious to know how you handled a situation where it's against the rules but you let your children do it anyway.

 

I wouldn't say I was defensive. I did answer the question. I guess I'm not sure what exactly you're asking that I didn't. I said I knew it was an adult area. Adult doesn't normally mean 21+. I can't say if 4 years ago she knew it was 21 + because there was no conversation about it being 21 +. She wanted to lay out, I told her she couldn't go alone. Should I try to recall what we had for dinner that night too... I mean if you're curious :')

[kc58ab]

Quote "I am one of those who speed on the highway. I stay away from other drivers and only drive faster in good conditions. That is the only rule/law that I violate knowingly. "

 

This is comical to read from someone who wants to tell me that breaking a rule of laying in a sun lounge chair in a 21 + area is so wrong. I guess your law breaking is not as bad as mine right? I mean look you have good reasons for why you do what you do and you stay away from other cars and and it's only in good weather so that's okay.

Man I wonder what someone like this does when their children ask them why they're breaking the law and speeding.

Gosh I sure hope Sally and Johnny don't grow up to be criminals because of this!!

 

( obvious sarcasm used for those that can't otherwise tell)

Edited July 27, 2017 by kc58ab

[A&Jfamily]

No need to change the rating. The rules say 18 and over. That's it. Period. End of discussion. Some of the stuff is downright crude and nasty. No way should a kid be allowed in even with a parent. It's OK (contrary to some people's belief) to have things for adults only. This is one of them.

 

 

 

I'm not disputing that is the rule and I would not take my child violation of the rules. But I don't buy into the argument that "that's it. Period. End of discussion." It is very American to engage in a debate as to whether a rule is sound or logical as opposed to arbitrary. And this one is quite arbitrary because as I pointed out there is zero distinction in maturity between someone 17 and 11 months and someone who turned 18 today other than a short passage of time which could have no significant affect on maturity. You could have a 17 year old college student who is more mature than an 19 year old still struggling to graduate high school.

 

So IMHO the rule cannot be justified simply based on a numeric age. Not can it be justified simply by insisting that it's OK to have adult only venues. I agree it is OK and they have them - casino, serenity and nightclub - and at least two have US law as backing making them less arbitrary. To me, the comedy club is more akin to an R rated movie and in keeping with US standards that is 17 or with parental supervision. To me, that is a much more loci gal and less arbitrary approach.

 

You are entitled to your opinion just as I am mine.

 

 

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[firemanbobswife]

I'm not disputing that is the rule and I would not take my child violation of the rules. But I don't buy into the argument that "that's it. Period. End of discussion." It is very American to engage in a debate as to whether a rule is sound or logical as opposed to arbitrary. And this one is quite arbitrary because as I pointed out there is zero distinction in maturity between someone 17 and 11 months and someone who turned 18 today other than a short passage of time which could have no significant affect on maturity. You could have a 17 year old college student who is more mature than an 19 year old still struggling to graduate high school.

 

So IMHO the rule cannot be justified simply based on a numeric age. Not can it be justified simply by insisting that it's OK to have adult only venues. I agree it is OK and they have them - casino, serenity and nightclub - and at least two have US law as backing making them less arbitrary. To me, the comedy club is more akin to an R rated movie and in keeping with US standards that is 17 or with parental supervision. To me, that is a much more loci gal and less arbitrary approach.

You are entitled to your opinion just as I am mine.

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Debate or discussion is OK in my book about the age limit set. No matter what we think though, it doesn't change what it is. What is final is that they say 18 and over not 18 or mature younger folks. It's not up for interpretation for any of us to decide on the ship what "should be" because it's set at 18 (or 21 for Serenity). Nowhere does it say "18/21 over only or at Parental Discretion". It gives the age and that's it. It is what it is.

 

When on the ship, people need to follow ship rules. I truly don't understand why some feel the need to say they don't apply to them because they know themselves or their kids better so will do what they want. There has to be a cut off and by making it a certain age across the board for whatever venue, it isn't left up for interpretation or people complaining that they let so and so in (like say a 15 year old and why not a 13 or 14 year old). They will be so quick to cry discrimination based on whatever criteria fits their need at the time in order to get their way. And come on, you KNOW it will happen. By giving a specific standard to be followed, there is no guess work involved. Underage and you simply aren't allowed. It's pretty cut and dry.

 

Now if Carnival wants to revisit it and allow 17 year olds in, then fine. I have no issue with that. Their ships, their rules. I will still feel the same way.

[Domino D]

Wouldn't a lot of this be solved if Carnival made it the same standard as a R rated move? After all, I am not sure any of the adult comedy I have heard truly goes to an X level. If you are a parent and want to subject your 13 year old to this stuff, you are doing it at home, and nothing I say or Carnival does is going to stop that. I wouldn't take my 13 year old son, but depending on the comedian, I would consider 16 or 17 if the rules allowed.

 

I recognize in life that bright line rules are "easy" but they are equally arbitrary; my son a 17 years 11 months and 29 days was no more or less mature than the day he turned 18. I see more maturity after a year of college - but that is to be expected. I also find the arbitrary rile of 18 a little flawed because Carnival is basically suggesting that the comedy is really NC-17 by the current standards and IMHO that is a bit of overkill.

 

So I vote call it R rated and end the debate and carding issues. Just send the kid with an adult.

 

AJ, I agree 100% with your observations and questions. I think it likely comes down to age of majority (or consent). I am guessing, but you would probably find that the legal department determined that an 18 year old (legally an adult) could not win a lawsuit based on discomfort or Corruption of a minor. If they went with 16 or 17, they would be allowing minors in. Maturity wise, I think you are 100% correct that there is little difference, but legally it is completely different. Even though they are not strictly controlled by US Law, it helps them in court to follow as many as they can. Why you have to be 21 (not 18) to go to Serenity, I have no earthly idea.

[A&Jfamily]

Debate or discussion is OK in my book about the age limit set. No matter what we think though, it doesn't change what it is. What is final is that they say 18 and over not 18 or mature younger folks. It's not up for interpretation for any of us to decide on the ship what "should be" because it's set at 18 (or 21 for Serenity). Nowhere does it say "18/21 over only or at Parental Discretion". It gives the age and that's it. It is what it is.

 

When on the ship, people need to follow ship rules. I truly don't understand why some feel the need to say they don't apply to them because they know themselves or their kids better so will do what they want. There has to be a cut off and by making it a certain age across the board for whatever venue, it isn't left up for interpretation or people complaining that they let so and so in (like say a 15 year old and why not a 13 or 14 year old). They will be so quick to cry discrimination based on whatever criteria fits their need at the time in order to get their way. And come on, you KNOW it will happen. By giving a specific standard to be followed, there is no guess work involved. Underage and you simply aren't allowed. It's pretty cut and dry.

 

Now if Carnival wants to revisit it and allow 17 year olds in, then fine. I have no issue with that. Their ships, their rules. I will still feel the same way.

 

 

 

I agree that people should follow the ship rules. I often get slammed for my position on following the rules on this site. My now 19 yr old (then 18) inadvertently (yes truly - he is clueless with his nose chasing Pokémon etc) wandered onto serenity. He described over dinner how he had found this great relaxing place with clam shells. I told him he was an idiot, take his nose out of his phone, read the signs, and stay off that deck. He said "oops" and didn't go back. So please know not all parents want the rules bent for junior.

 

The problem with all of these rules, signs or code, is we have seen that Carnival doesn't enforce its rules consistently from adult only pools, MDR dress code or comedy club. This, even more than people who try to bend them, IMHO creates as much of the problem as anything else.

 

 

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[First and Ten]

I agree that people should follow the ship rules. I often get slammed for my position on following the rules on this site. My now 19 yr old (then 18) inadvertently (yes truly - he is clueless with his nose chasing Pokémon etc) wandered onto serenity. He described over dinner how he had found this great relaxing place with clam shells. I told him he was an idiot, take his nose out of his phone, read the signs, and stay off that deck. He said "oops" and didn't go back. So please know not all parents want the rules bent for junior.

 

The problem with all of these rules, signs or code, is we have seen that Carnival doesn't enforce its rules consistently from adult only pools, MDR dress code or comedy club. This, even more than people who try to bend them, IMHO creates as much of the problem as anything else.

 

 

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Here is my issue.... So because Carnival doesn't have a SWAT team for the comedy club, serenity, MDR, etc you feel they aren't "enforcing" it? What about as an adult, you read that the comedy club is 18+, you obey the rule and if your kid is 17 yrs 11 mos, you DONT take him/her into the club. It seems you justify it with "well if I can get away with it, that's Carnivals fault, not mine". I disagree

[firemanbobswife]

I agree that people should follow the ship rules. I often get slammed for my position on following the rules on this site. My now 19 yr old (then 18) inadvertently (yes truly - he is clueless with his nose chasing Pokémon etc) wandered onto serenity. He described over dinner how he had found this great relaxing place with clam shells. I told him he was an idiot, take his nose out of his phone, read the signs, and stay off that deck. He said "oops" and didn't go back. So please know not all parents want the rules bent for junior.

 

The problem with all of these rules, signs or code, is we have seen that Carnival doesn't enforce its rules consistently from adult only pools, MDR dress code or comedy club. This, even more than people who try to bend them, IMHO creates as much of the problem as anything else.

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That's funny about your son and yes I agree with you about Carnival not enforcing them and that it is a huge problem. I feel like if they have no intention of doing so, then they need to do away with the rules. Otherwise, be prepared to enforce them 100% of the time without fail, no exceptions. It shouldn't depend on what ship, what Captain, what CD, etc. There needs to be consistency so people know they mean business. If not, then again, do away with it altogether.

 

It's my opinion that they are so in fear of people removing tips though, that they won't. It seems like that is the way the disgruntled people "get back" at Carnival not caring that the ones that are truly affected usually have nothing to do with what they are mad about. This is one of the reasons why I think gratuities should be automatically put in at the time of booking under taxes and port fees. Those items are non negotiable and I think gratuities should be too. But that's another subject for another thread ;).

[A&Jfamily]

Here is my issue.... So because Carnival doesn't have a SWAT team for the comedy club, serenity, MDR, etc you feel they aren't "enforcing" it? What about as an adult, you read that the comedy club is 18+, you obey the rule and if your kid is 17 yrs 11 mos, you DONT take him/her into the club. It seems you justify it with "well if I can get away with it, that's Carnivals fault, not mine". I disagree

 

 

 

1) it's pretty undisputed on these boards that the rules and dress code are either not enforced or not consistently enforced. No SWAT team needed - we only use those for armed and dangerous persons. Just make offenders stop when a violation is observed. Pretty simple.

 

2)no where in my post do I justify an attitude if you can get away with it, it is carnivals fault. What I indicated was that Carnivals failure to enforce contributes and fosters the lack of personal accountability. People should be personally accountable but the reality is many are not and need to be policed. It's Carnival's rule and they are the one in position to enforce it.

 

As so many have pointed out, what am I going to do to a fellow cruiser who say is in the MDR on elegant night in shorts? Or the 20 year old on the serenity? As a fellow passenger I only have the ability to report it (which will get you flamed on this board as a tattle tale) and it's up to Carnival to deal with the transgression.

 

 

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[calbred01]

I have a small example: on a cruise my son, then 17 almost 18 was out with some friends (hubby & I went to casino) my son went to the teen dance club BUT (according to my son) there was not much going on, so a group of them decided to hit the adult comedy show! He found us in the casino and told us what he did and also said (while still blushing) that he was NOT prepared for some of the content! He has been exposed to what "normal" teenagers have been exposed to and I just found it funny (not that I let him know that!). He got his lecture (really unnecessary as he was already embarrassed and at least he was honest about it and found us to tell us!). He was monitored closely during the rest of the cruise (he had to tell us where he was going and we would make unannounced "visits") but no other issues!

[FLSteve11]

AJ, I agree 100% with your observations and questions. I think it likely comes down to age of majority (or consent). I am guessing, but you would probably find that the legal department determined that an 18 year old (legally an adult) could not win a lawsuit based on discomfort or Corruption of a minor. If they went with 16 or 17, they would be allowing minors in. Maturity wise, I think you are 100% correct that there is little difference, but legally it is completely different. Even though they are not strictly controlled by US Law, it helps them in court to follow as many as they can. Why you have to be 21 (not 18) to go to Serenity, I have no earthly idea.

 

I don't get that last one either. Do they not card people for drinks there, that's the only real reason I can think. So now at 18 you can do just about anything in the world except drink in the US (or US based ships) or <gasp> go onto Carnival's Serenity deck! :) (I'm sure I'm missing others, but still seems kind of ridiculous. But I don't make the rules)

[Domino D]

I don't get that last one either. Do they not card people for drinks there, that's the only real reason I can think. So now at 18 you can do just about anything in the world except drink in the US (or US based ships) or <gasp> go onto Carnival's Serenity deck! :) (I'm sure I'm missing others, but still seems kind of ridiculous. But I don't make the rules)

 

You can fight in a war, but get out of that clam shell lounger.

[Athankfulheart]

This past May on the Breeze, the entertainment director asked my 24 and 25yo, young looking daughters to see thier ID to get into late night comedy. I may not have believed them, except that I was with them. They carried thier ID every night, but since it was always the ED and she remembered them, she didnt ask them again. So... sometimes it happens.

 

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[oceanmom62]

Quote "I am one of those who speed on the highway. I stay away from other drivers and only drive faster in good conditions. That is the only rule/law that I violate knowingly. "

 

This is comical to read from someone who wants to tell me that breaking a rule of laying in a sun lounge chair in a 21 + area is so wrong. I guess your law breaking is not as bad as mine right? I mean look you have good reasons for why you do what you do and you stay away from other cars and and it's only in good weather so that's okay.

Man I wonder what someone like this does when their children ask them why they're breaking the law and speeding.

Gosh I sure hope Sally and Johnny don't grow up to be criminals because of this!!

 

( obvious sarcasm used for those that can't otherwise tell)

I can read sarcasm. If you read my post carefully then you will notice that I never commented on the rightness or wrongness of what you did- just asked what you told your children. My daughter HAS asked why I speed and I tell her that it's wrong and she shouldn't do it just because Mom does it. I have gotten better at speeding less since I had a child but it is a hard habit to break. I keep trying but I don't go around talking about how I speed and it's OK because I haven't gotten caught. I know it's wrong and I'm working on it.

[kc58ab]

I can read sarcasm. If you read my post carefully then you will notice that I never commented on the rightness or wrongness of what you did- just asked what you told your children. My daughter HAS asked why I speed and I tell her that it's wrong and she shouldn't do it just because Mom does it. I have gotten better at speeding less since I had a child but it is a hard habit to break. I keep trying but I don't go around talking about how I speed and it's OK because I haven't gotten caught. I know it's wrong and I'm working on it.

 

Glad u can read sarcasm, I just wanted to be clear so I didn't have to reexplain a few times.

I don't think I said it is OK to break rules as long as you aren't caught. Please continue to twist it. In all fairness your post about speeding was saturated in excuses to how even your law breaking isn't so devious because your more careful than the next law-breaking speeder. Kinda seems like you were saying it was okay. I didn't see a lot of I know this is wrong and I shouldn't do it. But now that you're called out for it on a public forum suddenly you're remorseful and have been working hard to change it.

I'll repeat myself again in case you missed it the first, second, or however many other times I've already said this; you are no more moral so it boils down to hypocrisy.

[CruisinMom72]

I don't mean this to insult anyone, its just an observation (altho I will probably get flamed....lol, oh well). Why do people even consider its ok to just disregard the age rule? The "R" rated comedy show is 18+....it says it on Fun Times, they make announcement before the show. If you are in the comedy show with your under 18 child, they have to leave....If its necessary that you all have to stay together, you all need to leave and go to something else that is "family friendly"....Why is this even a question? I think this just as much, if not more to any ship club that is deemed 21+. I would ask people if they would take their under age kid into a club meant for adults (21 and over) on land? If not, why would you do it on the ship. Don't they have "teen clubs" up to 18 yrs old? My personal opinion, if I go to an adult event, I want to hang out with adults, not kids. So before people start taking my post to an extreme and twisting it where you are going to accuse me of calling your parenting skills into question, I am not doing that. I am just stating that if there is an age restriction at a certain venue, why cant we just follow that instead of looking for a loophole?

I agree with all you say, except the comedy club. I've brought both of my girls to the comedy clubs on ships, before they were 18. I don't think that's much different than going to an R rated movie, or a comedy club back home. Some kids are mature enough to handle the content. No one is 'partying' with each other in the comedy clubs (at least the ones we've been to). My girls love the shows!

[Saint Greg]

I agree with all you say, except the comedy club. I've brought both of my girls to the comedy clubs on ships, before they were 18. I don't think that's much different than going to an R rated movie, or a comedy club back home. Some kids are mature enough to handle the content. No one is 'partying' with each other in the comedy clubs (at least the ones we've been to). My girls love the shows!

 

 

I’ve seen a show that would be more like a comedian talking about an x rated movie.

 

 

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[kc58ab]

I’ve seen a show that would be more like a comedian talking about an x rated movie.

 

 

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Just out of curiosity what does X rated mean to you?

 

For many I believe *********** comes to mind. Doubt any nudity was shown in stand up not to mention sex acts.

 

The Motion Picture Association of America doesn't have an official X rating. The strongest is NC-17 which means you have to be 17 to watch. R means if under 17 you have to be accompanied to watch.

 

So these adult areas could mean 17 to some. Adult content doesn't specify an age.

 

For grins check out this picture (not mine) from a review on here about Serenity. Again adult...not an age on that particular sign.

 

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[A&Jfamily]

You do realize you have resurrected a thread from months ago...

[Saint Greg]

Just out of curiosity what does X rated mean to you?

 

For many I believe *********** comes to mind. Doubt any nudity was shown in stand up not to mention sex acts.

 

The Motion Picture Association of America doesn't have an official X rating. The strongest is NC-17 which means you have to be 17 to watch. R means if under 17 you have to be accompanied to watch.

 

So these adult areas could mean 17 to some. Adult content doesn't specify an age.

 

For grins check out this picture (not mine) from a review on here about Serenity. Again adult...not an age on that particular sign.

 

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To be more specific...a comedian talking about sex acts...for the entire show. Graphic stuff you don’t hear in movie theaters.

 

They say you have to be 18 to be in the comedy club for adult shows and sometimes card.

 

“Guests under the age of 18 may not attend the Late Night Shows, which are "R" rated”

 

https://help.carnival.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/1061/kw/night%20club%20ages/session/L3RpbWUvMTUwODI3MjE3NS9zaWQvZlVaTUcwMnNUYVRoUVkzNlpRWGgzSmpYaHJOOUFPbEI0dXJkOEkwTmc4eXRMRlQwUHM2N044SXJ2WSU3RWVOMXlXR3RtVzNSNl9iT3BISXpsNWdidVJaWVlUbTRwYzMyOERNMFpLVyU3RSU3RXJxUWprTnMyUWFqdTE0SUNnJTIxJTIx

 

 

 

 

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