Oceania Losing Ground - Viking Many New Builds

[ABoatNerd]

I assume others have seen the Oct announcement of 10 new builds for Viking in the ocean and river categories?

 

It seems to me that Oceania is rather being left behind - considering that 4 of the 6 are the old R vessels with the tiny bathrooms and showers.

 

Is there any hint of new construction for Oceania?

 

Consumers like new builds, restaurants, hotels etc - this is not to Oceania's advantage.

 

Thoughts?

[LHT28]

Pick the ship/cruise line that works best for your needs & wants

So far Oceania works for us

 

YMMV

[buggins0402]

 

Thoughts?

 

Seems like a lot of debt to take on in a rising rate environment.

[Paulchili]

Seems like a lot of debt to take on in a rising rate environment.

 

The sad story of Renaissance cruise line comes to mind.

Each cruise line looks to occupy a certain niche. Historically Oceania has done very well and most of its customers like the R ships - such as they are. If they don't, they can cruise on O class ships. With 6 ships they cover the globe with varied itineraries. With more ships - or larger ships - they may have trouble filling them.

JMO.

[bitob]

Royal Caribbean has even more new ships

 

It is not the number of ships or how new they are that matters. It’s the on board experience

 

 

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[docmark]

Pick the ship/cruise line that works best for your needs & wants

So far Oceania works for us

 

YMMV

 

LOL You got up from wrong side of bed today??/ you are in a "take it or leave it mood"

NOT your usual self !!

[RJB]

I assume others have seen the Oct announcement of 10 new builds for Viking in the ocean and river categories?

 

It seems to me that Oceania is rather being left behind - considering that 4 of the 6 are the old R vessels with the tiny bathrooms and showers.

 

Is there any hint of new construction for Oceania?

 

Consumers like new builds, restaurants, hotels etc - this is not to Oceania's advantage.

 

Thoughts?

You are very right. Can't stand still. By doing that you will fall behind. I think O needs some new builds to keep pace with the rest of the industry. Let's see what happens.

[pinotlover]

Perhaps one size fits all isn’t the right answer for the R ships.

 

I’d suggest getting rid of the tubs and putting in a larger shower in some of the cabins, while leaving the tubs in others. Mark the deck plans showing with bath room layout the cabin has and let the cruiser choose.

 

If you must have your tub. Pick a cabin with one. If you want a shower larger than a coffin choose one. May even motivate cruisers to sign up early do they know they’ll get the layout of choice versus tasking whatever is left.

[Classiccruiser777]

I love the R ships just as they are.

 

I’ve been told by an O four striper some new builds are on the near horizon.

[sammiedawg]

Several years ago we were told Viking had an astonishing level of debt.

[buggins0402]

Several years ago we were told Viking had an astonishing level of debt.

 

Private company...no way of knowing what is behind the curtain unless it was pulled.

[rimau]

We've considered Viking, both river and sea. We've been put off by their advance payment requirements. I don't mind making final payment 60 to 90 days prior to sailing but Viking's requirements are, in my opinion, excessive.

[buggins0402]

We've considered Viking, both river and sea. We've been put off by their advance payment requirements. I don't mind making final payment 60 to 90 days prior to sailing but Viking's requirements are, in my opinion, excessive.

 

Free working capital line of credit for the company.

[katz]

I totally agree with Rimau. It really annoys me to have to make final payment, to Viking, so far in advance. We are currently looking at similar itineraries on Oceania and Viking. Viking has the better one, but having to make the payment so far in advance will push us towards Oceania.

[DaKa2002]

Free working capital line of credit for the company.

 

I agree that early payment provides free money for Viking and their flurry of ship building.

 

We have chosen not to assist them in that process, keep our $$$ longer in our accounts, and continue to cruise with Oceania and others at sea and other river cruise companies.

[pinotlover]

Viking River Cruises is a huge cash cow paying for a lot of advertisements, plus providing the cash to build ships and make fast forays into Ocean cruising.

 

Nothing like floating down the Rhine or Donau and seeing 3 Viking Longboats rafted together at a town dock. Kaching, KaChing, KA CHING!

[Paulchili]

There is nothing wrong with people voting with their wallets. It is exactly the way it should be in a free economy.

Surely if they didn’t like those river cruises or thought they didn’t get their moneys’ worth, they wouldn’t pay for them (over & over).

That said, I too would rather have the final payment closer to sailing date.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Paulchili

[cbb]

I guess we're in our dotage, but as we walked into our cabin on Regatta about 2 hours ago, I exclaimed...."oh it is laid out exactly like our ATW Insignia cabin! We're home."

 

I thought perhaps the bed might be oriented in the opposite direction....and i'd kill myself in the middle of the night!

 

So, I'm home....and happy. I don't care about new builds, and I'm certainly not giving some company lots of $ until we have to...my money, my choice.

[YoHoHo]

I assume others have seen the Oct announcement of 10 new builds for Viking in the ocean and river categories?

 

It seems to me that Oceania is rather being left behind - considering that 4 of the 6 are the old R vessels with the tiny bathrooms and showers.

<snip>

Consumers like new builds, restaurants, hotels etc - this is not to Oceania's advantage.

Not just Viking. Cruise industry news

 

A. record order book of 93 new cruise ships extending out to 2026

 

B. Existing ships are not expected to be withdrawn from service on an accelerated basis.

If anything, the withdrawal rate of retiring ships from major brands will slow, while capacity growth further accelerates.

 

2015: Viking’s total river fleet size is 60 and comes just one year after the company set a GUINNESS WORLD RECORD™ for the most new ships launched in a single day.

 

So many ships will be plying the rivers and oceans. The rivers (with many other lines added to Vikings 60+ ships) are crowded and now doing they are same thing to the oceans. Worse for river as there are fewer ports but even now look at the cities where there are protests to curtail cruise ships, or stories reporting the number of visitors is "ruining" the experience. And now record numbers of more and more.

 

I don't know what Vikings current fleet size is. To me I am not certain if that that world record is a positive distinction to hold.

 

For cruise lines in general of course can't hold 'em back. Grow or be left behind; build shiny new things or be left behind as per ABoatNerd's post. Hopefully to fill all those ships the race to bottom will not continue. Cutting costs to keep profits up and lead in price (artificially) low seems to be working despite the complaints on many boards; stock prices are great and ships are still filling.

 

For pricing we got what we wished for with airlines and now suffer through economy class. The plane is no longer part of the vacation but we put up with it because we have to as means to get there. What happened to it is a journey, not just a destination thinking.

 

While in theory competition is good for the consumer it seems that in current market thinking that good thing is a low price and not necessarily good value for a good product. That is where a niche that Oceania carved out is still a very good place to be despite more competition they did not have before. Let others cheapen service and product in order to fill all those new builds. Keep certain standards that add value.

 

Certainly will be interesting to see where this industry goes over the next 15 years.

 

(and yes, the shower is indeed tiny and I hate that clinging curtain)

[bitob]

I guess we're in our dotage, but as we walked into our cabin on Regatta about 2 hours ago, I exclaimed...."oh it is laid out exactly like our ATW Insignia cabin! We're home."

 

 

 

I thought perhaps the bed might be oriented in the opposite direction....and i'd kill myself in the middle of the night!

 

 

 

So, I'm home....and happy. I don't care about new builds, and I'm certainly not giving some company lots of $ until we have to...my money, my choice.

 

 

 

I’m with you

And I’m on marina now only 80% full wishing this b2b had been on a r ship. I hate trekking to baristas on 14. I don’t need all the restaurants. I find these larger newer ships sterile.

 

Give me small and cozy over new build every time

 

By the way our cd this leg is Paul grant. Not impressed. Guess great cds are hard to find

 

 

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[kitty9]

Viking will not accommodate disabled passengers on their ships, therefore I will not be cruising them. When I called to inquire as to this policy, their response was that Viking cruises are all about an active lifestyle, and this doesn't allow for those with disabilities to cruise on their ships.

 

I wonder how they get away with this violation of the ADA, seeing how the US Supreme Court ruled that if a cruise line sails out of a US port, they must accommodate the disabled.

[bitob]

Viking will not accommodate disabled passengers on their ships, therefore I will not be cruising them. When I called to inquire as to this policy, their response was that Viking cruises are all about an active lifestyle, and this doesn't allow for those with disabilities to cruise on their ships.

 

 

 

I wonder how they get away with this violation of the ADA, seeing how the US Supreme Court ruled that if a cruise line sails out of a US port, they must accommodate the disabled.

 

 

 

Absolutely despicable policy.

 

 

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[pinotlover]

There is another complete thread on this issue. Viking is handicap accessible, however they do not allow motorized scooters aboard. They facilitate wheelchairs, walkers, and other non motorized equipment.

 

I’m guessing kitty knew that, but wanted to make a suggestive inaccurate dig.

[tvmovielover]

I like Oceania and Viking equally and hope to cruise on both lines again. I like that all ships are smaller than the RCL, HAL, etc etc lines. I would wish all lines that want to expand would do it on smaller ships rather than larger ones. OTOH, many popular ports in Europe in particular in the summer have too many ships in port already on ocean cruises. The river cruises are worse on all lines on these popular itineraries. Even though I love the Marina, I hated the Baltic Cruise in summer when every port even St Petersberg had multiple ships in port and too many people touring for comfort. Too many people enjoy cruising and enjoy the same itineraries so we get more and more ships and not many different itineraries.

 

I do want to say a couple things about the negatives on Viking. We took our first Viking River cruise in 2007 (China, their best) and paid only 90 days in advance (maybe we booked late). Ever after on both their river and ocean cruises, we just tell them we will only pay the balance 90 days in advance and it usually works.

 

I also was surprised at the statement that they cannot accommodate disabled passengers since that would put many off disabled or not. I looked up the policy just now. They are not encouraging but what they say is that wheel chair cruisers might have problems using the elevators and going on their walking tours over cobbled streets. They do prohibit those motorized vehicles on international itineraries for some reason but do allow seeing eye and therapy dogs. I do not remember if there were disabled people on our ocean cruise but I have seen them on river cruises. Even after an announcement that we would have to climb a steep icy hill on a Seine stop, one passenger insisted on coming with the aid of two canes. He was not stopped. If not encouraging, they were not mean. Of course, this was a liability issue and Oceania also does not like to see cruisers fall in any way while touring or have trouble moving about the boat. I was surprised kitty9 above was spoken to so rudely by Viking and hope she complained. I did not see an emphasis on "active lifestyle" on my cruise unless that means negotiating the cobblestone streets.

Edited December 20, 2017 by tvmovielover
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[Jancruz]

In talking to the executives of Oceania this was the best year they have ever had and they are projected to have their best year ever..in 2018 ....People love O...and they are getting new guests all the time!!

Jancruz1