gratuities package opt out options.

[boards]

Thought so, that makes the Cyber Sale promotion even better, for us, that is and hopefully the staff as well.

[Tara Jane]

HAL have an office in Sydney.

[Marithol]

On 11/27/2018 at 8:56 AM, Stratheden said:

The Australian Consultant does not have to tell them about the HSC nor is it added to the advertised price unless it is part of a HAL promotion.  We have one cruise coming up without the HSC included and one with it included so it really is the same as in the US.

 

Some TA's may inform a new cruiser about the HSC and may tell them that it can be removed as it is something that is completely unknown over here.  We simply do not tip and we do not have HSC's nor Resort Fees.  Here it is illegal to advertise a product that is not fully inclusive of everything, including tax.  

I guess as we are purchasing a US product from a US company it is different as far as cruising is concerned, although our prices are different from yours. 

 

PS.  We never remove the HSC and we tip extra because we have travelled a lot and know that it is the accepted thing to do in the US.

 

PPS. Please stop telling Australians that they are "stiffing" the crew.  New cruisers assume that the crew are paid a decent wage like everyone in Australia is paid and unless they read Cruise Critic they wouldn't know any better. 

Exactly. We assume the workers are paid sufficiently by the cruise company, and not that part of their wage will come from the customers who have already paid for the cruise itself. Tips in Australia are rare, and given to individuals who the customer feels has gone above and beyond in their service. 

[ellieanne]

On 11/26/2018 at 3:56 PM, Stratheden said:

The Australian Consultant does not have to tell them about the HSC nor is it added to the advertised price unless it is part of a HAL promotion.  We have one cruise coming up without the HSC included and one with it included so it really is the same as in the US.

 

Some TA's may inform a new cruiser about the HSC and may tell them that it can be removed as it is something that is completely unknown over here.  We simply do not tip and we do not have HSC's nor Resort Fees.  Here it is illegal to advertise a product that is not fully inclusive of everything, including tax.  

I guess as we are purchasing a US product from a US company it is different as far as cruising is concerned, although our prices are different from yours. 

 

PS.  We never remove the HSC and we tip extra because we have travelled a lot and know that it is the accepted thing to do in the US.

 

PPS. Please stop telling Australians that they are "stiffing" the crew.  New cruisers assume that the crew are paid a decent wage like everyone in Australia is paid and unless they read Cruise Critic they wouldn't know any better. 

 

I usually book my cruises in the US and pay for them with my US credit card. But I book my flights, hotels, and travel insurance with my local Australian travel agent. My Australian travel agent always mentions that the HSC is NOT included in the US price. The last time I was in the agent's office there was a couple booking the cruise right after mine. We were comparing things. The agent specifically told the couple that their HSC was included in the price (because by law it has to be) so they could (and should) opt-out of the HSC onboard as it has already been paid. But then the agent told me that I could opt-out, but because the cruise was booked int he US, the HSC was not included in the fare and would not be double paid the way the Australian couple's would be if they didn't opt-out on board.

I would definitely urge the Original Poster to check with whomever s/he made the booking to determine if the HSC was included in the booking. It should also be disclosed in the booking paperwork. And if the HSC was included in the fare, it is perfectly acceptable to opt-out on board. In that case, the crew will NOT be stiffed. I specifically asked about that, both with my Australian travel agent and once on board. It is recorded that the HSC was already paid if the cruise was booked & paid for in Australia, so the crew does not have to report cash tips the way they would with a US-booked/paid cruise.

Edited December 22, 2018 by ellieanne

[knittinggirl]

The hotel service charge is more of a salary than a gratuity.   I've heard on some cruise lines that they have printouts of passengers that opt out of the hotel service charge.  They've  even posted photos of same at cruise critic. But I've been pretty nosy, and even been known to look on the steward cart for such a list, and never seen one.  (Another reason for keeping the steward cart out of the hallway.)  

 

On that subject, I thanked our Neptune Concierge for removing the carts from the hallways and she said it was a safety issue, because people w/ wheelchairs can't get past in the event of an emergency.

 

The closest I've come to removing the hotel service charge came when they called me to ask if I had meant to remove the charge.  Apparently, the neighbor had requested hotel service charge removal, and they'd posted it to the wrong room.

 

 

Edited December 22, 2018 by knittinggirl

[Marithol]

17 hours ago, ellieanne said:

 

I usually book my cruises in the US and pay for them with my US credit card. But I book my flights, hotels, and travel insurance with my local Australian travel agent. My Australian travel agent always mentions that the HSC is NOT included in the US price. The last time I was in the agent's office there was a couple booking the cruise right after mine. We were comparing things. The agent specifically told the couple that their HSC was included in the price (because by law it has to be) so they could (and should) opt-out of the HSC onboard as it has already been paid. But then the agent told me that I could opt-out, but because the cruise was booked int he US, the HSC was not included in the fare and would not be double paid the way the Australian couple's would be if they didn't opt-out on board.

I would definitely urge the Original Poster to check with whomever s/he made the booking to determine if the HSC was included in the booking. It should also be disclosed in the booking paperwork. And if the HSC was included in the fare, it is perfectly acceptable to opt-out on board. In that case, the crew will NOT be stiffed. I specifically asked about that, both with my Australian travel agent and once on board. It is recorded that the HSC was already paid if the cruise was booked & paid for in Australia, so the crew does not have to report cash tips the way they would with a US-booked/paid cruise.

OK.  I booked and paid in Australia. The agent did mention the HSC and also said it could be refunded if we wished. She did not mention whether it had been included in our cost, and on my invoice it says only that some fees and charges of @$@l!n@about $370 is included, but does not specify what the fee is. If I have already paid it I will opt out, but if it’s not, I don’t want to make the crew go without an essential part of their pay. My agent is a bit hopeless, she couldn’t give correct advice on a visa for Turkey either. It is a 21 day at sea cruise.

[kazu]

17 minutes ago, Marithol said:

OK.  I booked and paid in Australia. The agent did mention the HSC and also said it could be refunded if we wished. She did not mention whether it had been included in our cost, and on my invoice it says only that some fees and charges of @$@l!n@about $370 is included, but does not specify what the fee is. If I have already paid it I will opt out, but if it’s not, I don’t want to make the crew go without an essential part of their pay. My agent is a bit hopeless, she couldn’t give correct advice on a visa for Turkey either. It is a 21 day at sea cruise.

 

I'm guessing that the $370 is port taxes.

It can't be HSC if there are two of you and you are on a 21 day cruise.  It would be more than that.

 

The question is though if HSC is included in your cruise fare and not part of the fees?  Assuming you can book directly with HAL, I'd tell your TA you need an answer in writing from HAL and ask them to reach out to HAL to get the right answer - otherwise, please transfer the booking to Holland America Line.  (I'm guessing your TA does not have any perks for you?).

[Mickb]

Why do people have to be so rude on this forum? The OP asked a perfectly reasonable question and was as usual ‘flamed’ - although happily not by every one! Various parts of the world have different approaches to gratuities. Just because tipping is the ‘norm’ in the US, it doesn’t mean that it is the same everywhere. It certainly isn’t in Australia or in many parts of Europe. Workers are paid a living wage and leaving a gratuity is a reward for going the extra mile.

I know it’s a HAL forum but I am often shocked by the responses when posters comment on or criticise elements of their cruise. We are humans and perception is very much reality!

Please flamers -  let people express an opinion or ask a question without a nasty personal response?

Happy Christmas one and all!

 

[catl331]

2 hours ago, knittinggirl said:

But I've been pretty nosy, and even been known to look on the steward cart for such a list, and never seen one.

Some stewards stick them up on the wall in their service rooms, some don't. I don't recall ever seeing a room steward cart on a HAL ship, just hand-carriers of their cleaning supplies. (The room service food deliveries do use a cart.)

Edited December 22, 2018 by catl331

[Marithol]

3 hours ago, kazu said:

 

I'm guessing that the $370 is port taxes.

It can't be HSC if there are two of you and you are on a 21 day cruise.  It would be more than that.

 

The question is though if HSC is included in your cruise fare and not part of the fees?  Assuming you can book directly with HAL, I'd tell your TA you need an answer in writing from HAL and ask them to reach out to HAL to get the right answer - otherwise, please transfer the booking to Holland America Line.  (I'm guessing your TA does not have any perks for you?).

I have already paid in full. No perks... and we seem to have paid a premium price by going through an agent anyway. But I certainly don’t want to pay twice, but don’t want to disadvantage staff either and find the fact that service staff are reliant on tips or extra charges to the customer quite shocking really. 

[kazu]

1 hour ago, Marithol said:

I have already paid in full. No perks... and we seem to have paid a premium price by going through an agent anyway. But I certainly don’t want to pay twice, but don’t want to disadvantage staff either and find the fact that service staff are reliant on tips or extra charges to the customer quite shocking really. 

 

so you are past the cancellation phase - got it.  Then put the pressure on the TA to get the answers.  If they won't call HAL and say you need to know and your TA doesn't have the answer.

 

My experience only is that Aussies (and I love my Australian CC friends) don't have to pay in many cases if they are on Australian cruises but do in Europe and other sailings.  

 

Wish I could help more.  And hope you get the answers you need.

[Chinook Wind]

Where is the "popcorn" emoji when you need it?

[SetAnOpenCourse]

4 hours ago, catl331 said:

Some stewards stick them up on the wall in their service rooms, some don't. I don't recall ever seeing a room steward cart on a HAL ship, just hand-carriers of their cleaning supplies. (The room service food deliveries do use a cart.)

I’ve never opted out of the HSC, but hearing about this “list” sure doesn’t influence my opinion!  Such a list is just plain wrong.  If I was managing, the employment of anyone  maintaining such a list would be in jeopardy.  If I understand the nature of this list, it is a disgrace for the cruise line.

[catl331]

55 minutes ago, SetAnOpenCourse said:

 If I understand the nature of this list, it is a disgrace for the cruise line.

The nature of the list is just to let the stewards know what cash tips must be turned into the pool,  namely any that were given by people who opted out of the HSC.  How else would the stewards know what cash they can keep and which they can't?

[anniegb]

23 hours ago, Marithol said:

I have already paid in full. No perks... and we seem to have paid a premium price by going through an agent anyway. But I certainly don’t want to pay twice, but don’t want to disadvantage staff either and find the fact that service staff are reliant on tips or extra charges to the customer quite shocking really. 

 

Just off a Zaandam cruise and Americans were lining up to remove gratuities.  Go figure as they say.  I overheard one passenger stating that the service was excellent but the rate of gratuities is simply too high.  GSC staff did not blink.

 

Annie

[Marithol]

1 hour ago, anniegb said:

 

Just off a Zaandam cruise and Americans were lining up to remove gratuities.  Go figure as they say.  I overheard one passenger stating that the service was excellent but the rate of gratuities is simply too high.  GSC staff did not blink.

 

Annie

I don’t like that either! Americans know that is expected and the standard of service will suffer if They are paid poverty wages and customers all opt out. If I have NOT already prepaid, I would happily pay as I want the staff to be happy in their jobs as this will result on a better experience for everyone. 

[anniegb]

5 hours ago, Marithol said:

I don’t like that either! Americans know that is expected and the standard of service will suffer if They are paid poverty wages and customers all opt out. If I have NOT already prepaid, I would happily pay as I want the staff to be happy in their jobs as this will result on a better experience for everyone. 

There is a simple solution.  Add the cost of the gratuities to the cruise fare.

 

It does not help when half of the passenger list claim that their gratuities were included as part of a promotion.  Then there is all the additional tipping done by non-American staff.

 

Maybe HAL should follow the TUI model - yes I can hear the howls of protest already.

 

Annie

[Marithol]

I don’t know what the TUI model is but if it means simply adding a bit into everyone’s fare so that a decent wage is paid, I’m in agreement. 

[RuthC]

10 hours ago, anniegb said:

There is a simple solution.  Add the cost of the gratuities to the cruise fare.

That solution isn't nearly as "simple" as it sounds. There is an extensive thread about it somewhere on this board. Feel free to read it (please don't bump it up!) to learn about all the pros & cons.

The bottom line is that the workers do not have gratuities charged as income for tax purposes, but would have to claim them if they were included in the fare. That means we would have to pay more than the current $14.50 per day for them to net that amount.
Are you willing to pay perhaps $25 per person per day extra in your fare to avoid paying $14.50 per day as a Hotel Service Charge?

I'm not. Whether it's increased fare or Hotel Service Charge, it all comes out of the same bank account. I prefer less come out.

[anniegb]

7 minutes ago, RuthC said:

That solution isn't nearly as "simple" as it sounds. There is an extensive thread about it somewhere on this board. Feel free to read it (please don't bump it up!) to learn about all the pros & cons.

The bottom line is that the workers do not have gratuities charged as income for tax purposes, but would have to claim them if they were included in the fare. That means we would have to pay more than the current $14.50 per day for them to net that amount.
Are you willing to pay perhaps $25 per person per day extra in your fare to avoid paying $14.50 per day as a Hotel Service Charge?

I'm not. Whether it's increased fare or Hotel Service Charge, it all comes out of the same bank account. I prefer less come out.

Other cruise lines overcome the challenge of Income Tax - surely Carnival can do too?? But again Carnival appears not to be consistent across their brands.

 

Honest my last word 🙂

 

Annie

 

 

Edited December 24, 2018 by anniegb

[kazu]

2 minutes ago, anniegb said:

Other cruise lines overcome the challenge of Income Tax - surely Carnival can do too??

 

Honest my last word 🙂

 

Annie

 

 

 

The only cruise lines I know of that have overcome the issue are much pricier than HAL.

 

Most luxury lines are "no tipping" but the price is much, much higher.

 

[Randyk47]

38 minutes ago, kazu said:

 

The only cruise lines I know of that have overcome the issue are much pricier than HAL.

 

Most luxury lines are "no tipping" but the price is much, much higher.

 

 

True but there’s a lot more to their higher fares than just including gratuities or paying higher wages.

[Randyk47]

On 12/22/2018 at 7:52 PM, SetAnOpenCourse said:

I’ve never opted out of the HSC, but hearing about this “list” sure doesn’t influence my opinion!  Such a list is just plain wrong.  If I was managing, the employment of anyone  maintaining such a list would be in jeopardy.  If I understand the nature of this list, it is a disgrace for the cruise line.

 

In light of the policy that tips received from passengers reducing or removing the HSC must be turned in how would you proposed that information be provided to the appropriate staff and crew?   

[kazu]

8 minutes ago, Randyk47 said:

 

True but there’s a lot more to their higher fares than just including gratuities or paying higher wages.

 

Oh, no question about that for sure 😉 😄 

[bennybear]

12 hours ago, anniegb said:

 

It does not help when half of the passenger list claim that their gratuities were included as part of a promotion.  Then there is all the additional tipping done by non-American staff.

 

Annie

Don’t understand your comment re the gratuity promos?