Cuba.....uh, oh.

[Beamafar]

Just now, Jossie1960 said:

Please don’t attempt to justify MSC actions.

Others cruise lines acted responsibly and it’s about time MSC did the same.

 

What "MSC" actions????  This ISN'T MSC's doing!!!

 

Please do not advise me what to post on this forum!

[EngIceDave]

I don't understand why people seem to think MSC (or any other cruise line) owes them anything for actions not of their own, had no hand in, and is solely due to the US Government?

 

If a hurricane wiped out part of the Caribbean again (and will happen again) is everyone due compensation by their cruise line?

 

If someone wants to do something, fine, but why act as if it's somehow due you?

Edited June 8, 2019 by EngIceDave
typo

[mickey89]

Cruise lines reaction to the US Foreign policy towards Cuba is summarised as follows -https://www.travelagentcentral.com/cruises/carnival-corp-cancels-cuba-cruises-other-lines-analyzing-details

Why have MSC acted so differently?  They all have recognised that Cuba was a special cruise destination.  All have offered the option to cancel except MSC - WHY?

 

MSC if you read these posts, there is still time to act responsibly as others have done, it is not too late.

[Wyoming2010]

26 minutes ago, EngIceDave said:

I don't understand why people seem to think MSC (or any other cruise line) owes them anything for actions not of their own, had no hand in, and is solely due to the US Government?

 

If a hurricane wiped out part of the Caribbean again (and will happen again) is everyone due compensation by their cruise line?

 

If someone wants to do something, fine, but why act as if it's somehow due you?

 

Whether you feel they owe us compensation or not, we've been on three cruises during three hurricanes and each cruise line offered compensation with discounts, onboard credits and future cruise discounts.  It's just plain good customer service.  NCL refused last year to do anything for any of us onboard and as a result, we will never sail with them again.  It's just a personal choice by how one is treated.  We work hard to get the time off and pay for the cruise, so every bit of good intentions by the cruise lines keeps us interested in their brand.  

[EngIceDave]

I think the issue is, "due" or not?

 

As I said earlier, if someone wants to provide some form of compensation, that's great.

It's when you believe you're "owed" compensation for an Act of God/Force Majeure 

[thecruisers6]

3 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

Totally agree, many US consumers are solely price driven and would never even consider a BBB rating. However; the current stance by MSC regarding imposing cancellation fees for Havanna supports the BBB "F" rating (since this rating is more about a companies integrity and willingness to resolve conflict). I think we all can agree that MSC often has an "our way or the highway" philosophy. As mentioned, I thought the failure rating was perhaps because MSC is an Italian line, but Costa has managed to pull out an A rating from the BBB.

 

I hypothesize, that in order to fill 4 ships from Miami this Winter, MSC will need to price themselves at the bottom of the barrel. Time will tell. 

Time will indeed tell BB. 

Don’t forget though there is an ever increasing demand for cruise holidays this side of the pond. Especially from mainland Europe, with ever increasing amounts of people looking for a bit of warmth in the winter or like us, a bit of cold out of New York 🙄

And although it’s hard to believe for a lot of people your side, they want to go with a cruise line they know and trust - MSC. 

 

[Wyoming2010]

5 minutes ago, thecruisers6 said:

MSC did not lie about the itinerary, they had it snatched away from them by the US authorities. Even preventing a ship from docking in Havana that was half way there! 

Please stick to the facts 

 

You misread my post.  I was referring to what NCL did on our last cruise.  I've never taken MSC nor am I booked with them for Cuba.  So yes, I was stating my facts.  

[thecruisers6]

1 minute ago, Wyoming2010 said:

 

You misread my post.  I was referring to what NCL did on our last cruise.  I've never taken MSC nor am I booked with them for Cuba.  So yes, I was stating my facts.  

Silly me 🙄

i thought this was the MSC section

 

[Wyoming2010]

4 minutes ago, thecruisers6 said:

Silly me 🙄

i thought this was the MSC section

 

 

Oops, silly me, I thought this thread was about MSC AND the Cuba situation.  I was just responding to other posts.  Moving on........

[evandbob]

Cuba cruises were priced higher than sailings with the substitute ports, sometimes by about $200 per fare.  With a "lesser" priced port now on the itinerary, the cruiseline fare should be lowered, or an equal amount of OBC granted.

 

The Cuba cruises were usually undertaken by the oldest and smallest of the cruise lines ships.  Most Cuban bound pax probably would not ever book these old ships if it was doing a regular itinerary.

 

Say you agreed to buy a diamond, and the jeweler gave you a price that you agreed to - due to a diamond shortage by a strike or natural disaster, the jeweler was forced to substitute a used zircon replacement.  Shouldn't he then lower the price accordingly?

Edited June 8, 2019 by evandbob

[EngIceDave]

If they took you off Seaside and sent your rez to the Armonia, without being asked or notified, then your premise, as it relates to cruises, would fit.

 

Same ship, same amenities, same ocean, same sun....different port, due to no fault of the cruise line, same as if it was closed due to hurricane

[abbeytravelstheworld]

 

I understand MSC have to offer us nothing. I read the fine print and I get it but when you start comparing their offer to those of their competitors it stings. Especially for those of us that leave in a week with $5000 on airfares already invested. While I understand not picking my cruise for the ports side of things I did and if I was getting compensated the way other lines were I would be cancelling and going to Cuba by land. 

 

As a travel agent myself this has left me with a very sour opinion of MSC. It sends a message that if something goes wrong for my clients this is not a cruise line that goes to much effort to put things right. I told them as much on the phone and was told in no uncertain terms that "we don't care". That's probably the most honest statement I have got from them all week.

 

As far as OBC goes I finally got an answer yesterday that as we are on a 2 week b2b we do indeed get the $800USD. While it makes things a little better I am still bitter I can't cancel. 

 

We fly out for Miami next weekend. Here's hoping for calm seas and some. Effort on board to cheer people up for their dismal impressions so far. 

[AerynSun_JohnCrighton]

25 minutes ago, abbeytravelstheworld said:

 

 

 

We fly out for Miami next weekend. Here's hoping for calm seas and some. Effort on board to cheer people up for their dismal impressions so far. 

I have a friend who's a TA and work with a teacher who also does that on the side. Both asked me to report back to them when we get off so they can give clients who asked a better understanding. I'm gonna do my best to watch and be honest. 

 

 

Btw... id love to know what time on boarding day they offer a ship's tour. It's one of my things I do to help me later in cruise. And any other sea days activities that stand out (as they now have an added one due to cuba being cancelled) thanks and hope your trip goes well.

[BermudaBound2014]

3 hours ago, Beamafar said:

 

What "MSC" actions????  This ISN'T MSC's doing!!!

 

Please do not advise me what to post on this forum!

 

I think what Jossie was referencing was MSC's REACTION to the Cuba embargo. All cruise lines were forced to react to the exact same action (closing Cuba). 

 

In this case, MSC's reaction is not equal to their main stream US competition. Every single other cruise line offered the opportunity to cancel without penalty. Every single other cruise line also offered to make the pot a bit 'sweeter' for travelers. No one is suggesting MSC needed to do diddly squat when it comes to the contract, but the reality is that all other cruise lines did offer more.  A fact that those considering MSC should be aware of.

 

I honestly think some of this comes down to culture differences. North American consumers have higher expectations for service. I'm not making a judgement regarding whether said expectations are appropriate, I'm just stating the baseline reality that most seem to understand.

 

On a side note, RCL's older/smaller vessels that were doing the Cuba run have cut prices on future cruises by more than 50% already and we haven't even hit the slow season. For those that just want to get on the sea, there will most certainly be some insanely great offers available on the Armonia in the future. It wouldn't surprise me to see $30 pp/pd return. 

[BermudaBound2014]

2 hours ago, thecruisers6 said:

Time will indeed tell BB. 

Don’t forget though there is an ever increasing demand for cruise holidays this side of the pond. Especially from mainland Europe, with ever increasing amounts of people looking for a bit of warmth in the winter or like us, a bit of cold out of New York 🙄

And although it’s hard to believe for a lot of people your side, they want to go with a cruise line they know and trust - MSC. 

 

 

I agree with you! MSC has a good opportunity to capture the expanding European market. It's also clear that MSC has loyal followers on your side of the pond. they even have a small percentage of loyal followers state side. The market approval is evident in pricing structure. US customers seem to pay significantly less than what our Europeans are required to spend on MSC. 

[sidari]

7 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

I agree with you! MSC has a good opportunity to capture the expanding European market. It's also clear that MSC has loyal followers on your side of the pond. they even have a small percentage of loyal followers state side. The market approval is evident in pricing structure. US customers seem to pay significantly less than what our Europeans are required to spend on MSC. 

And also lose Deposits if they cancel.

[EngIceDave]

And MSC pricing is generally less than its counterparts, yes?

[Mattnvick]

re·spon·si·ble

 

Having an obligation to do something, or

having control over or care for someone

 

• being the primary cause of something and so able to be blamed 

   

  So basically they dont have to do anything as they didnt have control over Cuba nor were they the promary cause of it.

   

  Its funny but a while  back when a major hurricane slammed into the gulf disrupting cruises in a huge way MSC did far better for their guests than anyone else. Eveyone was full of praise.

   

  This time, different scenario but still needed to be delt with they (in some eyes) didnt do as well as their competitors. 

   

  Every time something happens every  cruise lines handles it in the way they see fit. Might suit you, might not. 

   

  Bottom line -  all lines  will always fill their ships.  You may walk away, but others will take your place.

   

  You pay your money you take your choice. 

Edited June 8, 2019 by Mattnvick

[jes1941]

8 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

Totally agree, many US consumers are solely price driven and would never even consider a BBB rating. However; the current stance by MSC regarding imposing cancellation fees for Havanna supports the BBB "F" rating (since this rating is more about a companies integrity and willingness to resolve conflict). I think we all can agree that MSC often has an "our way or the highway" philosophy. As mentioned, I thought the failure rating was perhaps because MSC is an Italian line, but Costa has managed to pull out an A rating from the BBB.

 

I hypothesize, that in order to fill 4 ships from Miami this Winter, MSC will need to price themselves at the bottom of the barrel. Time will tell. 

Regarding your mention of the F rating from the BBB...this is nothing.  Do you realize how many millions sail on MSC and 77 complaints is hardly worth mentioning;  there were 7,000 passengers on just our 5/11 sailing.  the only reason that they have this rating is because they didn't deal with the complaints, that's it, and most huge companies won't bother because it won't hurt their business. Having worked for the BBB in Orlando,  I know exactly how this works, so if this alone is going to stop you from sailing with them, except for this Cuba thing, they are great.

 

Complaints..how about Royal Caribbean with 564 in the last three years and 264 in the last twelve months.  The reason they have such a good rating is because they DO deal with the complaints.  Look up all the cruise lines, none are complaint free!

Edited June 8, 2019 by jes1941
Additional information

[Beamafar]

3 minutes ago, Mattnvick said:

re·spon·si·ble

 

Having an obligation to do something, or

having control over or care for someone

 

• being the primary cause of something and so able to be blamed 

   

  So basically they dont have to do anything as they didnt have control over Cuba nor were they the promary cause of it.

   

  Its funny but a while  back when a major hurricane slammed into the gulf disrupting cruises in a huge way MSC did far better for their guests than anyone else. Eveyone was full of praise.

   

  This time, different scenario but still needed to be delt with they (in some eyes) didnt do as well as their competitors. 

   

  Bottom line every time something happens every  cruise lines handles it in the way they see fit. Might suit you, might not. 

   

  Bottom line -  all lines  will always fill their ships.  You may walk away, but others will take your place.

   

  You pay your money you take your choice. 

 

The very best post on the subject!

 

You are so right about how well MSC behaved during that terrible situation.  We were extremely well treated by MSC last year for missing 2 ports (1 being substituted) due to bad weather in Asia, too.

 

I totally understand people's disappointment at Havana being cancelled, having sailed on Armonia in January primarily for the port.  However, I also missed a port on that cruise that I had really wanted to visit (for personal reasons) due to bad weather.

 

In this instance, the blame lies squarely at the feet of the current US administration.  Most of the cruise lines that are being hailed here as 'wonderful' due to giving 'more' than MSC are American companies whose main customer base is Americans.  They know they'd better be generous or else! 

 

How many times have we read on here in reviews about the high percentage of passengers on MSC ships sailing from Miami being from anywhere else other than the US?  Guess MSC really isn't depending on Americans sailing (or not) so aren't going to be swayed by a small number of disgruntled customers.  People from Europe are prepared to fly to Miami to sail on MSC ships which is evident by the demographic of the vast majority of passengers.

 

 

[EngIceDave]

On our Armonia/Havana cruise a couple months back, we were AT Grand Cayman, but due to high winds and seas, we could not use the tenders, so we left.....day at sea....got our port fees refunded, that's it!

 

Never imagined they somehow owed us anything due to high winds!

[Mattnvick]

4 hours ago, evandbob said:

, sometimes by about $200 per fare.  With a "lesser" priced port now on the itinerary, the cruiseline fare should be lowered, or an equal amount of OBC granted.

 

 

Im not sure what point you are trying to make as this is EXACTLY  what they have offered. $400 per cabin OBC paid out afterwards for all or whatever portion you have left after the cruise.

Edited June 9, 2019 by Mattnvick

[BermudaBound2014]

2 hours ago, Mattnvick said:

Its funny but a while  back when a major hurricane slammed into the gulf disrupting cruises in a huge way MSC did far better for their guests than anyone else. Eveyone was full of praise.

 

Bottom line -  all lines  will always fill their ships.  You may walk away, but others will take your place.

 

You pay your money you take your choice. 

 

I remember the hurricane incident differently.  Can you please provide a reference indicating where "MSC did better for their guests than anyone else?"  I believe others were offering full refund and 50% future cruise credit while MSC only offered 25%.  Here is the press release: 

 

"MSC Cruises cancelled the September 9 sailing from Miami aboard the MSC Divina, citing Hurricane Irma in a prepared statement. Guests will receive a full refund and 25 percent discount voucher on a future sailing.... “Guests who disembark on Thursday will receive a refund for the two days shortening of their cruise vacation and, in addition, will also get a voucher for a 25% discount on the price of a future MSC Cruises vacation. Guests who will continue the cruise after Thursday’s call to Miami will also receive the same voucher.”

 

I'm truly not a MSC hater. I consider myself a realist, with realistic expectations of MSC.  As a budget cruise line, MSC provides a very nice product. When we (consumers) pay more, we expect more customer care when things go sideways. As long as MSC offers reduced pricing it's only fair for consumers to expect reduced customer care. 

 

 

[BermudaBound2014]

2 hours ago, Beamafar said:

How many times have we read on here in reviews about the high percentage of passengers on MSC ships sailing from Miami being from anywhere else other than the US?  Guess MSC really isn't depending on Americans sailing (or not) so aren't going to be swayed by a small number of disgruntled customers.  People from Europe are prepared to fly to Miami to sail on MSC ships which is evident by the demographic of the vast majority of passengers.

 

 

Interesting perspective. Are you suggesting that MSC is abandoning their North America Plan?  "MSC has thus rolled out more TV advertising in North America than ever before, and recently signed a three-year deal to become the official cruise line of the Miami Dolphins." MSC ambitious North American Plan

Edited June 9, 2019 by BermudaBound2014

[jes1941]

7 hours ago, Wyoming2010 said:

 

Whether you feel they owe us compensation or not, we've been on three cruises during three hurricanes and each cruise line offered compensation with discounts, onboard credits and future cruise discounts.  It's just plain good customer service.  NCL refused last year to do anything for any of us onboard and as a result, we will never sail with them again.  It's just a personal choice by how one is treated.  We work hard to get the time off and pay for the cruise, so every bit of good intentions by the cruise lines keeps us interested in their brand.  

Your problem is easily solved; don't sail during hurricane season!