How bad was the Norovirus on the Joy?

[donovanrs28]

1 hour ago, JamesIowa said:

 

Where did you see this report? Can you provide a link? I'm on the 1 Dec sailing and have been trying to find reports of an outbreak on the current 24 Nov cruise.

It’s on the roll call group that’s not on CC. I can’t post as it’s against the T&Cs of this site. 

[LaCal]

5 minutes ago, gooch47 said:

I guess I'm missing something but I still don't understand what sanitizing your own cabin buys you.  The moment you step outside the cabin you are just as liable to get infected.

Sanitizing things in your cabin like the TV remote, and areas in the bathroom like faucets etc that the steward may of overlooked in cleaning or not used a Noro virus killing cleaner will help in case there’s still germs in the cabin from the past guest 

[Jagggg]

55 minutes ago, kenzie said:

Amazon sell Germstar Noro in 2oz bottles-packs of 6- it kills noro virus, I have ordered them for my cruise and used them in 2015 when a previous cruise ship I was to embark had had an issue with Noro - no-one in our party caught the virus on our cruise. I have used this gel on cruises where there has been an outbreak and so far we have been lucky.

 

Thanks for sharing. 

[gooch47]

1 hour ago, LaCal said:

Sanitizing things in your cabin like the TV remote, and areas in the bathroom like faucets etc that the steward may of overlooked in cleaning or not used a Noro virus killing cleaner will help in case there’s still germs in the cabin from the past guest 

True.

[Vyhanek]

The issue is not in cleaning the ship, the ship gets cleaned daily, door knobs get cleaned daily, toilets cleaned.

 

The issue is for the norovirus to make it's way thru the crew onboard.   The crew who cook the food, handle the plates, wrap the silverware, swipe your card.    The crew live and eat and work in even tighter quarters than the passengers.   It will spread thru the crew quickly.   

 

 

[njhorseman]

17 minutes ago, Vyhanek said:

The issue is not in cleaning the ship, the ship gets cleaned daily, door knobs get cleaned daily, toilets cleaned.

 

The issue is for the norovirus to make it's way thru the crew onboard.   The crew who cook the food, handle the plates, wrap the silverware, swipe your card.    The crew live and eat and work in even tighter quarters than the passengers.   It will spread thru the crew quickly.   

 

 

 

 

 

Absolutely untrue for this outbreak. Read the CDC report. Only 6 crew out of 1,769, or 0.34% were ill while 127 of 3,602, or 3.53% of passengers were ill. The rate of infection among passengers was 10 times higher than among crew.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/surv/outbreak/2019/Norwegian-Joy_11-8.html

Edited November 27, 2019 by njhorseman

[nyc2pdx]

I am on the Dec 8th cruise on the Joy, so I am very concerned if there is another outbreak.

[LATK]

57 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

 

Absolutely untrue for this outbreak. Read the CDC report. Only 6 crew out of 1,769, or 0.34% were ill while 127 of 3,602, or 3.53% of passengers were ill. The rate of infection among passengers was 10 times higher than among crew.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/surv/outbreak/2019/Norwegian-Joy_11-8.html

I was also on this sailing.(lucky enough to not get sick)  I would like to point out that these are reported cases. There were a lot of unreported cases. While we were waiting to go through customs there were several people in line who were having gastro issues. Having been in the health care field for over 30 years, let's just say more crew members needed precaution/safety education. I feel all cabin attendants should be wearing gloves while cleaning each cabin all the time, every day. (for their own protection)  I also feel the precautions and extra cleaning was started too late. While I appreciate the efforts of the very hard working crew, more education is needed.

[njhorseman]

41 minutes ago, LATK said:

I was also on this sailing.(lucky enough to not get sick)  I would like to point out that these are reported cases. There were a lot of unreported cases. While we were waiting to go through customs there were several people in line who were having gastro issues. Having been in the health care field for over 30 years, let's just say more crew members needed precaution/safety education. I feel all cabin attendants should be wearing gloves while cleaning each cabin all the time, every day. (for their own protection)  I also feel the precautions and extra cleaning was started too late. While I appreciate the efforts of the very hard working crew, more education is needed.

Isn't it rather obvious that the data in the CDC  report is going to be reported cases? 

 

While I don't doubt there were unreported cases neither you nor anyone else has any idea how many, nor do you have any evidence that would allow you to attempt to quantify it, even as imprecisely as saying "a lot". What's "a lot"? 20? 200? 2000? 

[chengkp75]

6 hours ago, kenzie said:

Amazon sell Germstar Noro in 2oz bottles-packs of 6- it kills noro virus, I have ordered them for my cruise and used them in 2015 when a previous cruise ship I was to embark had had an issue with Noro - no-one in our party caught the virus on our cruise. I have used this gel on cruises where there has been an outbreak and so far we have been lucky.

 

Actually, the FDA has sued Germstar to stop advertising it as being effective against noro, since this has not been proved to the FDA's satisfaction.

[chengkp75]

3 hours ago, Vyhanek said:

The issue is not in cleaning the ship, the ship gets cleaned daily, door knobs get cleaned daily, toilets cleaned.

 

The issue is for the norovirus to make it's way thru the crew onboard.   The crew who cook the food, handle the plates, wrap the silverware, swipe your card.    The crew live and eat and work in even tighter quarters than the passengers.   It will spread thru the crew quickly.   

 

 

 

3 hours ago, njhorseman said:

 

Absolutely untrue for this outbreak. Read the CDC report. Only 6 crew out of 1,769, or 0.34% were ill while 127 of 3,602, or 3.53% of passengers were ill. The rate of infection among passengers was 10 times higher than among crew.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/surv/outbreak/2019/Norwegian-Joy_11-8.html

And the crew live onboard for longer periods than the passengers, so it is in their best interests to not have noro onboard, and they will work to keep it that way, probably practicing better personal hygiene than 90% of the passengers.

[njhorseman]

2 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

And the crew live onboard for longer periods than the passengers,

When we were disembarking a long cruise earlier this year the hotel director on the Gem said to me that it was a good thing we were leaving, because otherwise he'd be forced to add us to the crew manifest. 

 

If he's on the ship this winter he'll be really thrilled to find out we'll be there to aggravate him for almost twice as long. 

[mugtech]

4 hours ago, njhorseman said:

 

Absolutely untrue for this outbreak. Read the CDC report. Only 6 crew out of 1,769, or 0.34% were ill while 127 of 3,602, or 3.53% of passengers were ill. The rate of infection among passengers was 10 times higher than among crew.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/surv/outbreak/2019/Norwegian-Joy_11-8.html

The Joy lists 3804 as capacity, double occupancy, so they were 202 passengers less than full, and perhaps some children were 3 in a cabin.  Did GS have the usual, we are full don't ask us about other cabins sign posted?

[Pduaime]

8 hours ago, LaCal said:

We bought the same one Kenzie mentioned on Amazon....Free shipping with Prime 

 

Thanks LaCal,   Not a guarantee, but worth the investment. Going to order tonight.  

 

[kenzie]

16 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Actually, the FDA has sued Germstar to stop advertising it as being effective against noro, since this has not been proved to the FDA's satisfaction.

Thank you for your input but we can only do our best and buy what is available to consumers, they may not have satisfied the FDA but my have used it on two cruises (6 people travelling) which were suffering an outbreak and we were lucky not to get ill, not one of us. This may be a co-incidence but when I board the Joy in January I will be carrying this and using it constantly. 

[DZcreature]

If I were going to be cruising Joy out of the same cruise terminal that the people who had Noro came through, I would take precautions in the terminal. I would sanitize my hands after touching bins going through security or touching any railings or elevator buttons in the terminal. Also, I would use my own pen to fill out the health questionnaire at check in.

 

My husband thinks my next idea is a little crazy, but due to the fact that so many people do not wash there hands after using the rest room, I actually thought about wearing a disposable glove on the hand I would use to handle tongs and serving spoons in the buffet, and then throw it away before I sit down to eat. I may do this on my next cruise, even if it does not have an outbreak.

[jaja]

20 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Actually, the FDA has sued Germstar to stop advertising it as being effective against noro, since this has not been proved to the FDA's satisfaction.

Thanks.  I may have missed it , but what is your advice re: what PAX should do or use ?  I value your advice as always. 

[chengkp75]

2 hours ago, jaja said:

Thanks.  I may have missed it , but what is your advice re: what PAX should do or use ?  I value your advice as always. 

Wash hands frequently, don't eat anything with your hands.

[ColeThornton]

58 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Wash hands frequently, don't eat anything with your hands.

 

 

I am not using a knife and fork on my burger!

[cb at sea]

They can "sanitize" until the cows come home, but if a new passenger boards with it, it will spread.  You can be infectious BEFORE you come down with symptoms, which is why this is so hard to control.  By the time YOU get sick, you've been in contact with others.

 

It is not a fun virus.

[IrieBajan54]

Doesn't matter if the crew sanitizes 24 hrs a day, the elephant is the room is the cell phone. Passengers use them in the restroom and maybe pick and scratch everywhere. Intermittently using their phones at the meal table,  people reach into the bread basket and also handle the salt & pepper shakers. Hard to stop noro from spreading that way.

Edited November 28, 2019 by IrieBajan54
add text

[Fishstain]

Well I was on the cruise and caught the bug on the morning of disembarkation. Contacted customer services who said someone would get back to me. Two hours later, I’d not heard anything and went to see the doctor. The receptionist tried to palm me off with some tablets but I was concerned I might have to cancel my flight and needed paperwork. In the end I saw the doctor who was very good, but Norwegian just wanted you off the ship to get the next lot of passengers on. I spoke to two girls who’d had to stay in their cabin for three days. On the last day they were told to leave the ship at 6.45am. They then had to wait over three hours to get through immigration. 
I also think more people were affected than the official number because people know if they report it, they’ll be confined to their cabin. 
It’s a shame because it had been a great cruise until then. You can argue that you can’t prevent the illness on the ship but that doesn’t excuse the way Norwegian dealt with the situation. I’m not surprised either that they’ve got the same problem on the current cruise. There’s no way they could have cleaned it properly in time

[hallux]

10 hours ago, DZcreature said:

If I were going to be cruising Joy out of the same cruise terminal that the people who had Noro came through, I would take precautions in the terminal. I would sanitize my hands after touching bins going through security or touching any railings or elevator buttons in the terminal. Also, I would use my own pen to fill out the health questionnaire at check in.

 

My husband thinks my next idea is a little crazy, but due to the fact that so many people do not wash there hands after using the rest room, I actually thought about wearing a disposable glove on the hand I would use to handle tongs and serving spoons in the buffet, and then throw it away before I sit down to eat. I may do this on my next cruise, even if it does not have an outbreak.

In this case it was LA.  The only common areas of that terminal for incoming/outgoing passengers are the gangways and the escalators down from the gangway level.  Once you reach the ground floor the disembarking passengers go through the longhouse which is where embarking passengers drop off luggage for the porters (but never ENTER the building when doing so).

 

Bottom line - in LA (or San Pedro actually), the chances of cross-contamination between disembarking and embarking passengers is fairly slim, at least to the extent that you note.  Shoot - why would there be ANY possibility that the bins at security would be contaminated?  Disembarking passengers never enter that area...

[NLH Arizona]

5 hours ago, Fishstain said:

 You can argue that you can’t prevent the illness on the ship but that doesn’t excuse the way Norwegian dealt with the situation.

What did you want them to do?

[ray98]

On 11/28/2019 at 11:23 PM, NLH Arizona said:

What did you want them to do?

 

 

Wave a magic wand apparently.