Volendam Stuck in the Mud

[Copper10-8]

Those two Amazon pilotos, at least the one who was on duty on Volie's bridge this morning at oh dark thirty, will have some. serious 'splainin' to do

[rucrazy]

3 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

Those two Amazon pilotos, at least the one who was on duty on Volie's bridge this morning at oh dark thirty, will have some. serious 'splainin' to do

Other than a firing, what consequence might an infraction like this have on the piloto on the bridge at that time?

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, drowelf said:

Does the Volendam even have rudders? I thought the ship has the directional azipods at the stern, which would probably do an even better job of scouring when pulling the ship backwards. 

You're right, I don't deal with azipods anymore, so I just think along the lines of conventional ships.  And, yes, the pods may do a better job.

[chengkp75]

59 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

Those two Amazon pilotos, at least the one who was on duty on Volie's bridge this morning at oh dark thirty, will have some. serious 'splainin' to do

 

55 minutes ago, rucrazy said:

Other than a firing, what consequence might an infraction like this have on the piloto on the bridge at that time?

Not really.  As I said, this happens quite frequently, and is just something shipping companies deal with when going up the Amazon.  There won't be anything said either by HAL or the Brazilian Coast Guard to the pilot's association.  Most shipping companies, when notified by the Captain that they are aground in the Amazon, go "okay, let us know when you're off", and that's about it.  

 

As for any consequences to the pilot, HAL can't fire him, and since pilots are in professional associations (the pilots own the company), they are not likely to fire one of their own, and as stated, Brazil takes a pretty casual approach to groundings here.  As long as the ship does not completely obstruct the channel, they don't really care.

[Copper10-8]

1 minute ago, chengkp75 said:

 

Not really.  As I said, this happens quite frequently, and is just something shipping companies deal with when going up the Amazon.  There won't be anything said either by HAL or the Brazilian Coast Guard to the pilot's association.  Most shipping companies, when notified by the Captain that they are aground in the Amazon, go "okay, let us know when you're off", and that's about it.  

 

As for any consequences to the pilot, HAL can't fire him, and since pilots are in professional associations (the pilots own the company), they are not likely to fire one of their own, and as stated, Brazil takes a pretty casual approach to groundings here.  As long as the ship does not completely obstruct the channel, they don't really care.

 

Sounds like an "accepted fact/cost of doing businesss" then. Do you have any experience with similar occurrences on the Saint Lawrence? Some years back, Maasdam struck a pier while under pilotage coming into Montreal

[Wehwalt]

[usn1964]

55 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

You're right, I don't deal with azipods anymore, so I just think along the lines of conventional ships.  And, yes, the pods may do a better job.

Those bow thrusters probably offer some help too. Apparently it wasn't all that big of a deal. All is well that ends well as they say. At least it wasn't some big rocks.

[Copper10-8]

1 hour ago, chengkp75 said:

You're right, I don't deal with azipods anymore, so I just think along the lines of conventional ships.  And, yes, the pods may do a better job.

 

Volendam still has propellers and rudders, as does the lead ship of her class, Rotterdam and her near sister, Zaandam. Amsterdam, the last ship in the "R"-class is the only one with the Azi-pod propulsion system

[Krazy Kruizers]

I am glad that she is safely on her way.

 

[rafinmd]

So basically they freed themselves by emptying the swimming pool (oversimplifying a bit)?

 

Roy

[AmazedByCruising]

59 minutes ago, Wehwalt said:

 

It's very nice that the ship is so transparent and includes details about the exact problem, how they tried to remedy the situation, even including the options that didn't work. 

[sevenseasnomad]

Interesting tale for passengers to relate when they return home.  Happy the ship wasn't damaged.  We're due to sail Volendam next Christmas/New Year's.  I know, a long time away even if something drastic had occurred to damage the ship.  Glad for the passengers' sakes that everything turned out okay and that she's on her way to the next port.

[chengkp75]

2 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

Sounds like an "accepted fact/cost of doing businesss" then. Do you have any experience with similar occurrences on the Saint Lawrence? Some years back, Maasdam struck a pier while under pilotage coming into Montreal

Yeah, it's a much bigger deal in the St. Lawrence, as most of the bottom is granite.  The Norwegian Sky has a plaque with a piece of granite that was removed from one of the ballast tanks after she ran aground in the St. Lawrence on her maiden voyage.

[chengkp75]

2 hours ago, usn1964 said:

Those bow thrusters probably offer some help too. Apparently it wasn't all that big of a deal. All is well that ends well as they say. At least it wasn't some big rocks.

Most likely they stayed away from the bow thrusters and only used the stern thrusters.  You don't want to suck all that sand and debris into the thruster shaft seals.  Not a lot of rocks in the Amazon, especially down near the mouth.  Lot like the Mississippi, they are all ground up by the time they get downriver.

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, rafinmd said:

So basically they freed themselves by emptying the swimming pool (oversimplifying a bit)?

 

Roy

Well, no.  I know you're kidding.  They emptied ballast tanks, and moved fuel from forward tanks to aft tanks.  By removing the weight of the sea water in the ballast tanks, the ship is lighter, so it does not want to sit so far into the water, and that buoyant force, added to the propulsion force did the trick.  

[Sir PMP]

Reading the captain's letter, a change in the itinerary is coming..

[usn1964]

34 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Well, no.  I know you're kidding.  They emptied ballast tanks, and moved fuel from forward tanks to aft tanks.  By removing the weight of the sea water in the ballast tanks, the ship is lighter, so it does not want to sit so far into the water, and that buoyant force, added to the propulsion force did the trick.  

Archimedes knew of which he spoke 2300 years ago. 

[AmazedByCruising]

12 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Well, no.  I know you're kidding.  They emptied ballast tanks, and moved fuel from forward tanks to aft tanks.  By removing the weight of the sea water in the ballast tanks, the ship is lighter, so it does not want to sit so far into the water, and that buoyant force, added to the propulsion force did the trick.  

 

(1432 pax + 558 crew) * 70 kg is still 140 metric tonnes.  Would simply asking everyone to go to the MDR (free drinks, of course) have made a measurable difference? (Besides turning running aground that sounds dangerously much like a Costa ship into a fun event on Twitter)

 

[Primus]

Around 1:00 today it was announced we would be arriving in Santarem at 5 pm, staying overnight, and shore excursions scheduled for today would be rescheduled for tomorrow. At 3:00 we found out that all shore excursions and shuttle buses would be canceled for both days. During the 5:00 announcement we found out that we will be leaving Santarem at 8:00 in the morning and heading to Manaus. No mention of our scheduled stop in Boca Da Valeria. Found out that port was also cancelled by asking an officer. 

[SilvertoGold]

9 minutes ago, Primus said:

Around 1:00 today it was announced we would be arriving in Santarem at 5 pm, staying overnight, and shore excursions scheduled for today would be rescheduled for tomorrow. At 3:00 we found out that all shore excursions and shuttle buses would be canceled for both days. During the 5:00 announcement we found out that we will be leaving Santarem at 8:00 in the morning and heading to Manaus. No mention of our scheduled stop in Boca Da Valeria. Found out that port was also cancelled by asking an officer. 

 

Wow!  Hope you get Santarem and Boca on the return trip!! Both are really worth the stop.

[chengkp75]

58 minutes ago, AmazedByCruising said:

 

(1432 pax + 558 crew) * 70 kg is still 140 metric tonnes.  Would simply asking everyone to go to the MDR (free drinks, of course) have made a measurable difference? (Besides turning running aground that sounds dangerously much like a Costa ship into a fun event on Twitter)

 

Not even close to Costa.  It's not so much the weight as the moment.  Ships have what is called the "MT1", or the "moment to trim 1 cm".  That is how much weight, at a distance from midships, that would result in a 1 cm change in draft.  Let's say that Volendam has a MT1 of 650 tonne-meters, which is about right for a ship that size, that means add 650 tonnes to the ship, one meter back from midships, you would raise the bow 1 cm.  Or, add 325 tonnes one meter aft of midships, and subtract 325 tonnes one meter forward of midships, and you get the same effect, and so on.  Given that the original condition likely has the "human ballast" evenly spread over the length of the ship, your 140 metric tonnes gets way less effective, some folks adding a lot of benefit (if they are at the bow) and some no benefit at all (if they are at the stern already).  It may have resulted in a 10-15 cm change in draft at the bow, in the best case scenario.  However, moving 1000 mt of fuel from a forward tank (fixed point) to an aft tank (fixed point) (say 40 meters difference), that is 40,000 mt-mtr of trimming moment, and would result in a change of 61 cm at the bow.

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, Primus said:

Around 1:00 today it was announced we would be arriving in Santarem at 5 pm, staying overnight, and shore excursions scheduled for today would be rescheduled for tomorrow. At 3:00 we found out that all shore excursions and shuttle buses would be canceled for both days. During the 5:00 announcement we found out that we will be leaving Santarem at 8:00 in the morning and heading to Manaus. No mention of our scheduled stop in Boca Da Valeria. Found out that port was also cancelled by asking an officer. 

 

57 minutes ago, SilvertoGold said:

 

Wow!  Hope you get Santarem and Boca on the return trip!! Both are really worth the stop.

Interestingly, Santarem is where ships that have grounded in the Amazon go for a diver's inspection of the hull.  The Tapajos river enters the Amazon with water nearly as clear as the Bahamas, so the divers can see more than a couple inches in front of their faces.

[Copper10-8]

8 hours ago, GeezerCouple said:

Do all ships have properly trained scuba divers on board during all voyages "just in case" something (e.g., like this) happens and they then need to inspect the integrity of the hull before proceeding?

How much can be seen from "rescue boats" at the surface?

 

How would this happen with two (?) pilots on board and underwater sensors of varying/whatever types?

 

GC

 

No cruise lines that I'm aware of carry trained/certified commercial (not recreational) scuba divers onboard. During those times that divers are required for under hull maintenance, inspections and/or repairs, commercial divers are hired. HAL does it on a semi-regular basis, when in Ft. Lauderdale, by hiring those specialists from an outfit by the name of "Miami Divers"

[chengkp75]

58 minutes ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

No cruise lines that I'm aware of carry trained/certified commercial (not recreational) scuba divers onboard. During those times that divers are required for under hull maintenance, inspections and/or repairs, commercial divers are hired. HAL does it on a semi-regular basis, when in Ft. Lauderdale, by hiring those specialists from an outfit by the name of "Miami Divers"

Yeah, Miami Divers are the "go to" guys for most of the cruise lines.  We used a local outfit in Santarem for our grounding, but it is more the fact that the divers cannot determine the condition of the ship, even though they are the ones looking at it.  You need to have a class surveyor watching real time video from the divers, and the ability to ask questions, get answers from the divers that will determine the status of the hull.  And unless you are at Santarem, as I said in an earlier post, the divers wouldn't see their hands in front of their facemasks.

[Himself]

3 hours ago, Copper10-8 said:

 

Volendam still has propellers and rudders, as does the lead ship of her class, Rotterdam and her near sister, Zaandam. Amsterdam, the last ship in the "R"-class is the only one with the Azi-pod propulsion system

That is what I tought.  Thank you for the clarification.