CDC Open To U.S Cruising This Summer

[nocl]

On 4/10/2021 at 7:42 AM, beg3yrs said:

This is probably naive but if the lawsuit gets the CDC to take another fresh look at its technical instructions that would be something.

 

In my engineering experience it's always been better to initially understand what requirements are, i.e. what we want to achieve and how well something must be done rather than just tell someone what to do. If the CDC had told industry what and how well, the industry could have set out to achieve these requirements with solutions of their own design that would have been acceptable to both industry and the CDC. But alas, that kind of approach evidently isn't in their playbook.

They did, it is called the framework that they published last November, the problem is that the cruise lines did not submit any plans.  Without that the CDC took the next step to publish technical instructions which provided more detail but still leaves a lot for the cruise lines to fill in with their own procedures and policies.  We will see if they actually engage now or merely keep asking CDC to drop the entire order.

[nocl]

4 hours ago, Fat Albert said:

Cruise ships have foreign flags, they are NOT US businesses.  They are only in port to drop off passengers and pick up new ones. The ship is then sent to open waters and they pay taxes to a foreign country for operating under that flag. The HQ are just administration offices and those employees are either citizens or work with visas. If the ships were US businesses we would not need to stop in Mexico or Alaska out of the west coast when the company does Hawaii or Alaska from US ports.

However, the ports are operating entities within the state of Florida.  In most cases they a under the control of port authorities that tend to be part of the county governments.  As such the ports would fall under the governors orders, even if the cruise lines do not.

[Potstech]

6 hours ago, Babr said:

I was not aware of any federal push to implement a passport. The press secretary addressed that at a recent briefing. She said there would not be a federal requirement for vaccines nor would there be a federal database.

So what is the source of all the outrage? Who is forcing anyone to have a passport?

 

No one currently. The press secretary was correct but she did not mention that the Department of Health anf Human Services and the CDC were looking into it.

[Babr]

28 minutes ago, Potstech said:

No one currently. The press secretary was correct but she did not mention that the Department of Health anf Human Services and the CDC were looking into it.

Currently?  I think it is a dead issue - permanently.

 

When I first heard of the idea, I thought it would be a way to simply collect and store information about vaccines, Covid test results, and possibly boosters if needed. I saw it as a way to conveniently have the information easily accessible in situations that required it, like international travel. 
 

Instead, it has become a flash point like so many other aspects of this pandemic. I can’t see even state governments trying to implement it.

[nocl]

12 hours ago, Babr said:

Currently?  I think it is a dead issue - permanently.

 

When I first heard of the idea, I thought it would be a way to simply collect and store information about vaccines, Covid test results, and possibly boosters if needed. I saw it as a way to conveniently have the information easily accessible in situations that required it, like international travel. 
 

Instead, it has become a flash point like so many other aspects of this pandemic. I can’t see even state governments trying to implement it.

Hawaii is working on a vaccine passport, the Governor said that it would take about 4 weeks for the tech to be ready.

 

New York has launched a passport project called Excelsior

 

2 states - Florida and Texas have instituted bans

 

 

Edited April 12, 2021 by nocl

[Treasure Hunter]

We both are fully vaccinated with Moderna and signed up for the New York Excelsior pass on our phones. It was easy. Anything that gets us closer to cruising! Or Yankee games! It's crazy how can Florida sue the government to allow cruising on the one hand but forbid the one thing that will allow it?

[rabin1]

7 minutes ago, Treasure Hunter said:

We both are fully vaccinated with Moderna and signed up for the New York Excelsior pass on our phones. It was easy. Anything that gets us closer to cruising! Or Yankee games! It's crazy how can Florida sue the government to allow cruising on the one hand but forbid the one thing that will allow it?

This is just my personal opinion and an idea. I think he filed the lawsuit to cause attention to get people thinking about cruising not for his political ambitions as others have stated. He really does want to keep Florida business open and doesn't want to hurt businesses. Now having said that I think he will do one of two things when cruising is permitted and they are requiring vaccines. He will change his playbook and give the cruise lines permission to request proof of vaccinations. I do on the other hand have an idea if he does not. Yes this will be a little work but it will give the cruise lines the proof they need. It would cause the cruisers and the lines a little work. They could ask the cruisers to send a copy of the certified proof of the vaccines with a picture id to be mailed to them. This then could be put on there travel documents or a sticker sent to add to the travel documents. This would solve the problem. The thing is the Feds have required no such passport and I do think he will relent somehow someway on the cruise lines so they can get the Floridians out of work because of no cruising back to work

Kathy

[Treasure Hunter]

50 minutes ago, rabin1 said:

This is just my personal opinion and an idea. I think he filed the lawsuit to cause attention to get people thinking about cruising not for his political ambitions as others have stated. He really does want to keep Florida business open and doesn't want to hurt businesses. Now having said that I think he will do one of two things when cruising is permitted and they are requiring vaccines. He will change his playbook and give the cruise lines permission to request proof of vaccinations. I do on the other hand have an idea if he does not. Yes this will be a little work but it will give the cruise lines the proof they need. It would cause the cruisers and the lines a little work. They could ask the cruisers to send a copy of the certified proof of the vaccines with a picture id to be mailed to them. This then could be put on there travel documents or a sticker sent to add to the travel documents. This would solve the problem. The thing is the Feds have required no such passport and I do think he will relent somehow someway on the cruise lines so they can get the Floridians out of work because of no cruising back to work

Kathy

Very thoughtful and good ideas. Please send to Princess in case they haven’t thought of it. We have October 2 booked on the Enchanted. Out of Barcelona that I don’t have much hope for and then December 4 from Fort Lauderdale🤞. NCL has said no vaccine no cruise. We hope Princess will do the same. 

[rabin1]

13 minutes ago, Treasure Hunter said:

Very thoughtful and good ideas. Please send to Princess in case they haven’t thought of it. We have October 2 booked on the Enchanted. Out of Barcelona that I don’t have much hope for and then December 4 from Fort Lauderdale🤞. NCL has said no vaccine no cruise. We hope Princess will do the same. 

Thanks for the compliment but I highly doubt they would listen to me nor would I know who to contact

Kathy

[Treasure Hunter]

I liked It!

[caribill]

16 hours ago, nocl said:

Hawaii is working on a vaccine passport, the Governor said that it would take about 4 weeks for the tech to be ready.

 

New York has launched a passport project called Excelsior

 

2 states - Florida and Texas have instituted bans

 

 

 

This is the vaccine passport that I already have.

 

[gmjc2]

The passport would be a way to prove that you are safe to travel Internationally and hopefully other countries would relax the strict rules for quarantine and multiple Covid tests for those carrying it! 

[USCcruisecrazy]

2 hours ago, gmjc2 said:

The passport would be a way to prove that you are safe to travel Internationally and hopefully other countries would relax the strict rules for quarantine and multiple Covid tests for those carrying it! 

If the Passport isn't going to prevent quarantines or COVID tests, then I see no reason to have it.  If it means we can all cruise or go to a ballgame without masks for no fear of dying from the virus, then I'm all for them sooner than later.

[voljeep]

3 minutes ago, USCcruisecrazy said:

If the Passport isn't going to prevent quarantines or COVID tests, then I see no reason to have it.  If it means we can all cruise or go to a ballgame without masks for no fear of dying from the virus, then I'm all for them sooner than later.

are you in favor then of Brice stadium requiring that all people that attend Gamecock games in the fall be vaccinated ?

[USCcruisecrazy]

3 minutes ago, voljeep said:

are you in favor then of Brice stadium requiring that all people that attend Gamecock games in the fall be vaccinated ?

Great question:  I think for all adults (17 and over) that have the opportunity to be vaccinated, they can not attend games in Willy B without the vaccine or until the SC Health Department decides herd immunity has been reached for our state.  Personally, I don't care if unvaccinated folks attend because I feel comfortable that the vaccine will prevent me from getting deathly ill...that's a risk they are willing to take...but I understand for many it makes them uncomfortable.  For me the line in the sand would be "if all attendees are vaccinated no mask required" and then I'd feel a bit different about non vaccinated people attending. But, if a mask is still required, I see no reason for only vaccinated folks.  

[voljeep]

20 minutes ago, USCcruisecrazy said:

Personally, I don't care if unvaccinated folks attend because I feel comfortable that the vaccine will prevent me from getting deathly ill...that's a risk they are willing to take.

does that also apply for you and cruise ships ?

 

on cruise ships, at least for us, the problem is not being able to re-port and disembark with ANY quarantine - which is obviously not a problem with other venues because of the duration of the events

Edited April 13, 2021 by voljeep

[USCcruisecrazy]

5 minutes ago, voljeep said:

does that also apply for you and cruise ships ?

Yes!  If the requirement is everyone needs a vaccine, I'm good with that if it means no masks required.  However, the other part (and what is different from attending a ball game) if non vaccinated folks cruise and get sick, how will that be treated.  Until I know that answer, I'm not very keen on them sailing.  Make sense?  How about you?  Ballgame...concert...cruise ship...what do you think should be the current standard operating procedures?

[caribill]

7 minutes ago, USCcruisecrazy said:

Yes!  If the requirement is everyone needs a vaccine, I'm good with that if it means no masks required.  However, the other part (and what is different from attending a ball game) if non vaccinated folks cruise and get sick, how will that be treated.  Until I know that answer, I'm not very keen on them sailing.  Make sense?  How about you?  Ballgame...concert...cruise ship...what do you think should be the current standard operating procedures?

 

It must be remembered that 95% efficacy means that each vaccinated individual is 95% less likely to contract the virus if exposed to it. So even every vaccinated person has the possibility of getting sick, even if the result is a mild case or non-symptomatic.

[voljeep]

7 minutes ago, USCcruisecrazy said:

Yes!  If the requirement is everyone needs a vaccine, I'm good with that if it means no masks required.  However, the other part (and what is different from attending a ball game) if non vaccinated folks cruise and get sick, how will that be treated.  Until I know that answer, I'm not very keen on them sailing.  Make sense?  How about you?  Ballgame...concert...cruise ship...what do you think should be the current standard operating procedures?

Cruise ships are different from other venues, whether we like it or not ... since we are vac'd, of course we want everyone else to be vaccinated as to not disrupt the cruise, at least at first until the cruise lines show they can handle an outbreak on board

 

everything else - doesn't really matter to me - we will still wear our masks when needed ( and prolly times when not )

[USCcruisecrazy]

4 minutes ago, caribill said:

 

It must be remembered that 95% efficacy means that each vaccinated individual is 95% less likely to contract the virus if exposed to it. So even every vaccinated person has the possibility of getting sick, even if the result is a mild case or non-symptomatic.

Yes, I understand that.  But the chance of death after vaccination is almost nil across all age groups.  At some point, you have to just accept the minimal risk.  No different than driving to the Cruise Terminal.  I'm probably more likely to die in a crash then die from COVID once vaccinated.

[caribill]

This just in:

 

Cruises New Scott, Rubio bill seeks to override CDC’s cruise regulations, allow sailing soon Florida’s U.S. Senators introduced legislation Tuesday to override the Centers for Disease Control’s existing framework cruise ships must follow to resume operations and replace current regulations with a new set of recommendations to mitigate the spread of COVID-19 aboard ships.

[beg3yrs]

16 minutes ago, caribill said:

This just in:

 

Cruises New Scott, Rubio bill seeks to override CDC’s cruise regulations, allow sailing soon Florida’s U.S. Senators introduced legislation Tuesday to override the Centers for Disease Control’s existing framework cruise ships must follow to resume operations and replace current regulations with a new set of recommendations to mitigate the spread of COVID-19 aboard ships.

Happy to see this but since they are in the minority party right now I am sad to think there will be any action. Still, the pressure on the CDC increases...

[rabin1]

5 minutes ago, beg3yrs said:

Happy to see this but since they are in the minority party right now I am sad to think there will be any action. Still, the pressure on the CDC increases...

They are but what about other states who have cruise ports with workers not working and people who want to cruise. That might put a little pressure on them to vote for it.

 

Also I think not 100% sure but one of the CDC's guidelines is that if any Covid outbreaks they must have a way on the ship to isolate that person in a separate medical facility.

 

No matter what I wish they would quit fiddling around and let the ships sail already. They will need time to get staff etc on board

 

Kathy

[voljeep]

11 minutes ago, rabin1 said:

No matter what I wish they would quit fiddling around and let the ships sail already. They will need time to get staff etc on board

even if the CDC relents 'today' - is 7/1 still realistic for US cruises to begin ?

[Roberto256]

23 hours ago, rabin1 said:

 It would cause the cruisers and the lines a little work. They could ask the cruisers to send a copy of the certified proof of the vaccines with a picture id to be mailed to them.

Vaccine Passport are the buzz words.

 

However desantis said:

"It's completely unacceptable for either the government or the private sector to impose upon you the requirement that you show proof of vaccine to just simply be able to participate in normal society,"

 

So, under Ron's rules, a cruiseline can not ask for a proof of vaccine.

 

Well, I guess the cruise line could ask, but they could not refuse to embark a customer who decline to show proof...