Joebucks Posted April 27, 2021 #976 Share Posted April 27, 2021 11 hours ago, jfunk138 said: Surprised nobody posted this yet: https://news.yahoo.com/cdc-guidance-says-cruise-ships-154352815.html "CDC guidance says cruise ships won't need to mandate vaccines" Apparently Arnold Donald and CDC are on the same page. Thankfully, we can move past this topic now. Since the experts have given their guidance, that satisfies the safety crowd. Right? 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdr69 Posted April 27, 2021 #977 Share Posted April 27, 2021 11 hours ago, jfunk138 said: mandate something they won't yet even approve beyond emergency use? Would that not be the Food and Drug Administration that gave the emergency use and also approves regular usage? Not sure if that is in CDC's mandate to give vaccine approvals? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisingguy007 Posted April 27, 2021 #978 Share Posted April 27, 2021 12 hours ago, jfunk138 said: April 5th is a microsecond ago in slow moving CDC time. I don't think they would change their mind in 20 days given the time it has taken to get this far. That said, in general, folks here seem to be far too confident in the CDC's ability to mandate the vaccine. They aren't even willing to sign off on full approval, are they really going to put their bureaucratic rears on the line and mandate something they won't yet even approve beyond emergency use? Going on a cruise is no "emergency" in their mind. I suspect they will abandon the masks outdoors entirely as well since it will be announced today that masks outdoors don't reduce transmissions. I actually think this kicking the can thing is great for the lines. They want cruising back to how it was. The margins weren't meant for 60%-75% capacity cruises. The executives want those bonuses and those only come with full ships. Del Rio has said as much on the record. If they wait long enough, full ships with close to normal cruise experience may be a better deal than changing a bunch of rules and having to slowly walk them back. They want as little yoke as possible. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfunk138 Posted April 27, 2021 #979 Share Posted April 27, 2021 29 minutes ago, kdr69 said: Would that not be the Food and Drug Administration that gave the emergency use and also approves regular usage? Not sure if that is in CDC's mandate to give vaccine approvals? Sure. Would that not be the CDC stepping on the FDA's toes to "mandate" a vaccine that the FDA has been unwilling to approve? I'm just not sure how it would work for the CDC to override the FDA's authority by mandating something that had not even been approved. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdr69 Posted April 27, 2021 #980 Share Posted April 27, 2021 10 minutes ago, jfunk138 said: Sure. Would that not be the CDC stepping on the FDA's toes to "mandate" a vaccine that the FDA has been unwilling to approve? I'm just not sure how it would work for the CDC to override the FDA's authority by mandating something that had not even been approved. Yes but your statement was worded as if the CDC were the ones who approved for emergency use which is what i questioned. The above bolded portion of your reply is much clearer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mondello Posted April 27, 2021 #981 Share Posted April 27, 2021 1 hour ago, cruisingguy007 said: I actually think this kicking the can thing is great for the lines. They want cruising back to how it was. The margins weren't meant for 60%-75% capacity cruises...full ships with close to normal cruise experience may be a better deal than changing a bunch of rules and having to slowly walk them back. They want as little yoke as possible. This is pretty much exactly what I posted a week ago. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamesatgsu Posted April 27, 2021 #982 Share Posted April 27, 2021 16 hours ago, BlerkOne said: Okay, how did it get from bats to people? Diseases move frequently between humans and animals. In the case of bats, humans come in frequent contact with the feces and urine. Then there are also parasites such as ticks that spread the disease between hosts. And of course eating a bat is also possible. At the end, we'll never know with absolute certainty unless it was lab created and records are discovered proving it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwordBlazer Cruising Posted April 28, 2021 #983 Share Posted April 28, 2021 Has anyone pondered the reason as to why almost all cruiselines have not mandated vaccines to cruise from the US ports? It is because the CDC has not mandated this. No other form of travel is this required and if it would be for the cruise industry, it makes more sense for them to say " This is a CDC requirement " than to say its our policy. Good cop, bad cop. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pizzasteve Posted April 28, 2021 #984 Share Posted April 28, 2021 22 hours ago, cruisingguy007 said: I suspect they will abandon the masks outdoors entirely as well since it will be announced today that masks outdoors don't reduce transmissions. I actually think this kicking the can thing is great for the lines. They want cruising back to how it was. The margins weren't meant for 60%-75% capacity cruises. The executives want those bonuses and those only come with full ships. Del Rio has said as much on the record. If they wait long enough, full ships with close to normal cruise experience may be a better deal than changing a bunch of rules and having to slowly walk them back. They want as little yoke as possible. Exactly. Its pretty clear the majority of cruise lines will pursue strategies to mothball the majority of their fleets, leave most lower income crew staff hanging, wait it out, posture to blame 'big old nasty government' for the health issues on ships, try to hold onto as much cash as possible, try to preserve some customer goodwill with a few sailings to keep brand active, appoligise over cancelled cruises, restart when pandemic is considerd 'managed' so they can operate with same old same old model. Its rational. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdr69 Posted April 28, 2021 #985 Share Posted April 28, 2021 2 hours ago, Pizzasteve said: Its rational. 🤨 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bamaone Posted April 28, 2021 #986 Share Posted April 28, 2021 5 hours ago, Pizzasteve said: Exactly. Its pretty clear the majority of cruise lines will pursue strategies to mothball the majority of their fleets, leave most lower income crew staff hanging, wait it out, posture to blame 'big old nasty government' for the health issues on ships, try to hold onto as much cash as possible, try to preserve some customer goodwill with a few sailings to keep brand active, appoligise over cancelled cruises, restart when pandemic is considerd 'managed' so they can operate with same old same old model. Its rational. I apologize up front if I misunderstood your post. My sarcasm meter isn’t what it used to be. I can’t imagine any cruise line not doing everything they can to revive their product ASAP if they get the ok to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
embarkation75 Posted April 28, 2021 #987 Share Posted April 28, 2021 On 4/26/2021 at 11:25 PM, BlerkOne said: I believe it had been mentioned. I do like the masks will be required. It is possible I suppose that there could be different requirements for passengers with vaccines vs those without. As I mentioned way earlier in this thread, it looks likely Carnival will take the same approach as their river cruise friends in American Cruise Lines with different requirements for vaccinated vs unvaccinated... "Fully vaccinated guests are not required to obtain a COVID-19 test prior to travelling to the ship and will be asked to present proof of the vaccine (i.e. vaccination card) at time of boarding. A guest is considered fully vaccinated two weeks after receiving the last recommended dose of vaccine. Guests who are not fully vaccinated must take a COVID-19 test within 4 days of the start of their cruise package. Only molecular test results (such as a NAAT or PCR test) will be accepted. Guests are asked to submit their test results to American Cruise Lines at healthsafety@americancruiselines.com and present the result at the time of boarding" 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stellarose Posted April 28, 2021 #988 Share Posted April 28, 2021 and many many more universities are asking students to submit vaccination records. now PSU wants students to upload their Covid shots- not required but HIGHLY HIGHLY suggested. so sure cruise lines will ask the same. I have my vaccine records with my primary care doc- so that is NOT faked as many think with the vaccine cards. but again, I don't sail till the winter and who knows where we will be then. I take things DAY by DAY for now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
embarkation75 Posted April 29, 2021 #989 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Welp, as many suspected this entire debate has largely been decided by the CDC at least for initial cruises as noted in the USA today story from this morning... "Ships can bypass the required simulated test voyages carrying volunteers and jump to sailings with paying passengers if 98% of crew and 95% of passengers are fully vaccinated." 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasonsterling Posted April 29, 2021 #990 Share Posted April 29, 2021 44 minutes ago, embarkation75 said: Welp, as many suspected this entire debate has largely been decided by the CDC at least for initial cruises as noted in the USA today story from this morning... "Ships can bypass the required simulated test voyages carrying volunteers and jump to sailings with paying passengers if 98% of crew and 95% of passengers are fully vaccinated." I wonder which route Carnival will take on this. That said I'm glad the CDC is acknowledging that getting the vaccine should be indictive of being able to get life back to normal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
embarkation75 Posted April 29, 2021 #991 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Jasonsterling said: I wonder which route Carnival will take on this. That said I'm glad the CDC is acknowledging that getting the vaccine should be indictive of being able to get life back to normal. Carnival (like any other corporation) will go the route that gives them the quickest path to revenue. In other words, you better be vaccinated or you are likely not sailing on Carnival or any other cruiselines for possibly up to a year after return to cruising. Edited April 29, 2021 by embarkation75 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasonsterling Posted April 29, 2021 #992 Share Posted April 29, 2021 4 minutes ago, embarkation75 said: Carnival (like any other corporation) will go the route that gives them the quickest path to revenue. In other words, you better be vaccinated or you are likely not sailing on Carnival or any other cruiselines for possibly up to a year after return to cruising. Granted that's my first thought as well but Carnival has been so reluctant to make that decision and the CDC option is not a firm mandate so it leaves room for Carnival to decide if they can satisfy the other requirements in quick enough fashion or if they are going to chose vaccines. One thing in favor of Carnival deciding to not go the vaccine route is they really have become a "family" cruise line over the years with a large contingent of young children sailing, so they may not want to risk that loss, especially during the summer. Personally I am vaccinated and just glad that my future plans are at least a little bit more secure now- I wonder how long it'll be before an official statement from CLIA and the cruise lines themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slavens_09 Posted April 29, 2021 #993 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Booked July 19th out of Galveston is looking more and more likely! Keep the good news coming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProgRockCruiser Posted April 29, 2021 #994 Share Posted April 29, 2021 8 minutes ago, Jasonsterling said: Granted that's my first thought as well but Carnival has been so reluctant to make that decision and the CDC option is not a firm mandate so it leaves room for Carnival to decide if they can satisfy the other requirements in quick enough fashion or if they are going to chose vaccines. If Carnival were to choose the "Test cruise" route, they won't be sailing for many months - the process hasn't started, and it seemed pretty clear it was at least a 90 day process. And that is if it is approved. So if they want to cruise, they'll comply with the vaccination requirement, IMHO. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkinmr Posted April 29, 2021 #995 Share Posted April 29, 2021 16 minutes ago, Jasonsterling said: I wonder how long it'll be before an official statement from CLIA and the cruise lines themselves. I wouldn't hold my breath. They haven't even acknowledged the CDC sit-down with cruise line execs on April 12th or that the cruise line reps have been meeting with the CDC twice weekly since then. I'm sure whatever statement they do make will be more gnashing of teeth about how unfair the whole process is and why can't the CSO just go away. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare IntrepidFromDC Posted April 29, 2021 #996 Share Posted April 29, 2021 (edited) 12 minutes ago, ProgRockCruiser said: If Carnival were to choose the "Test cruise" route, they won't be sailing for many months - the process hasn't started, and it seemed pretty clear it was at least a 90 day process. And that is if it is approved. So if they want to cruise, they'll comply with the vaccination requirement, IMHO. I agree it makes the most sense, both from a business standpoint and based on the Galveston and other port sightings and announcements. Someone raised an interesting point about whether the 5% non-vaxxers would be reserved for kids only. I wonder if Carnival's stance that they will not require vaccinations will result in fractured non-vaxxer cruisers once Carnival switches from "no vaccinations required" to "only 5% non-vaxxers allowed"... Just anticipating the back and forth on cruisecritic about a new hot topic "5%" is popcorn-worthy, IMO. Edited April 29, 2021 by IntrepidFromDC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mondello Posted April 29, 2021 #997 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Nobody seems to mandate 100% vaccinated required. I can just imagine who is gonna be trying to board through that 5% loophole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dallasdan Posted April 29, 2021 #998 Share Posted April 29, 2021 I agree with another poster. I doubt the 5% includes children. I think the 5% would be for those that have medical reasons to not be vaccinated. Also, on a large ship that is still over 200 non vaccinated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Tom-n-Cheryl Posted April 29, 2021 #999 Share Posted April 29, 2021 Without a secure digital passport (not happening), even if they required 100% of guests to be vaccinated, they won't be - pure and simple. There are plenty of people who would forge the necessary documents (CDC card, attesting to it on a form, bring a note from a Dr written on the back of a napkin, etc..). Back in the day, we used Rum Runners to smuggle booze - and so did a number of others. People all have different levels of adherence to "rules". Some will comply with everything, others will find justification to do, basically, whatever. Tom 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gooscar Posted April 29, 2021 #1000 Share Posted April 29, 2021 No Masks, Please. No Requirement for the Experimental shot. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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