Mediation between CDC and Florida Collapses

[WarfRatWA]

31 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

I agree with you but those who oppose vaccinations would not.  They claim that the death toll and case counts are orders of magnitude smaller, that the vaccines are nothing more than a poison that cause more deaths than the virus, etc., etc. 

They are the ones pushing things like the Florida law prohibiting vaccination requirements.   Since they do not believe COVID is a real threat, they do not accept any of the mitigation protocols including masking.  Suppose a cruise line had a requirement that unvaccinated people had to wear a mask outside their cabin but did not have a requirement that one had to prove vaccination prior to boarding, those who oppose vaccinations would simply ignore the mask requirement.  

They should issue a modern day 'Scarlet Letters", like color coded wrist bands.  A nice red (scarlet, if you will) for the unvaccinated.  Blue for the vaccinated.  If folks are outside of their cabin, they have to have their wrist band on.

 

I realize this would never fly, but....

[SSFun]

2 minutes ago, WarfRatWA said:

They should issue a modern day 'Scarlet Letters", like color coded wrist bands.  A nice red (scarlet, if you will) for the unvaccinated.  Blue for the vaccinated.  If folks are outside of their cabin, they have to have their wrist band on.

 

I realize this would never fly, but....

Love it! That would be a way to fix the issue! And since they would be allowing unvaccinated passengers, I suppose they would also allow passengers that were partially vaccinated. They could have a purple wrist band! 🤣

Agreed, would never fly...

[BermudaBound2014]

16 minutes ago, WarfRatWA said:

They should issue a modern day 'Scarlet Letters", like color coded wrist bands. 

 

I've always wondered why we are taught to fear those who wore the Scarlet A, and not those who burned them at the stake?????

[BermudaBound2014]

2 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

Everyone can find scientific data to support his/her position.

 

You have identified what I believe to be the greatest weapon of all time........... control of information. 

[Trimone]

I don’t know what all the fuss is about, NCL are cruising 100% two vaccinations it’s in my paperwork 

[WarfRatWA]

7 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

I've always wondered why we are taught to fear those who wore the Scarlet A, and not those who burned them at the stake?????

If you were taught to fear the letter in the Scarlet Letter, then I think you were sold short.  Of all the themes and morals to be taught in Hawthorne's novel, fear of the letter is not one.  In fact, it's quite the opposite.

[BermudaBound2014]

13 minutes ago, WarfRatWA said:

If you were taught to fear the letter in the Scarlet Letter, then I think you were sold short.  Of all the themes and morals to be taught in Hawthorne's novel, fear of the letter is not one.  In fact, it's quite the opposite.

This is why you struggle to find common ground. Your perspective is founded from a romance novel.

 

You must realize that wearing a letter A was, at one time, required by law in Massachusetts for anyone committing adultery.   

Edited June 15, 2021 by BermudaBound2014

[Laszlo]

So where do with stand at the moment with NCL cruising out of Florida? 

[BermudaBound2014]

7 minutes ago, Laszlo said:

So where do with stand at the moment with NCL cruising out of Florida? 

 

 Nothing new. CDC lawyers asked for two more weeks to gather info. 

Florida Lawsuit Drags On, But It May Have Sped Up Cruising’s Return (cruiseradio.net)

Edited June 15, 2021 by BermudaBound2014

[At Sea At Peace]

3 hours ago, graphicguy said:

If you’re cruising in the foreseeable future, and you’re doing so without the COVID Vaccine, you’ll be required to wear a mask when you’re outside your cabin in closed areas of the ship.

 

 

Even though, other than the N95, they are 100% useless against aerosol form of the virus.  The purpose of the common mask is to 'make others feel better.'

 

That is the science.

 

Edited June 15, 2021 by At Sea At Peace

[BermudaBound2014]

3 minutes ago, At Sea At Peace said:

 

Even though, other than the N95, they are 100% useless against aerosol form of the virus.

 

LOL... I admire your tenacity 🙂

[WarfRatWA]

18 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

This is why you struggle to find common ground. Your perspective is founded from a romance novel.

 

You must realize that wearing a letter A was, at one time, required by law in Massachusetts for anyone committing adultery.   

False equivalence...The Scarlet Letter is not a historical treatise, but rather a work of historical fiction or some call it Didactic fiction.  

 

You can't possibly understand my perspective given the few interactions we have had on a cruising forum.  I take your comment for what it is, trolling.

[roger001]

9 minutes ago, At Sea At Peace said:

 

Even though, other than the N95, they are 100% useless against aerosol form of the virus.  The purpose of the common mask is to 'make others feel better.'

 

That is the science.

 

Those silly folks that are the medical experts for the Mayo Clinic totally disagree.  But what do they know.  I would cut and paste their research here, but what's the point.  Would be wasting my time.  

[At Sea At Peace]

2 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

LOL... I admire your tenacity 🙂

 

Been around 4 awhile.  😉  Seen this kind of 'trust the science' before and the "circle back."  🧐

 

 

 

Big food too.

 

[BermudaBound2014]

11 minutes ago, WarfRatWA said:

False equivalence...The Scarlet Letter is not a historical treatise, but rather a work of historical fiction or some call it Didactic fiction.  

 

You can't possibly understand my perspective given the few interactions we have had on a cruising forum.  I take your comment for what it is, trolling.

 

Considering that the contents of your post  (#101) is the epitome of internet trolling,  I will take that label as a compliment. Thank you.

Edited June 15, 2021 by BermudaBound2014

[RocketMan275]

1 hour ago, harkinmr said:

It has been solved. The cruise lines have developed a process around the ban. And the ban does not “prevent” the cruise lines from requiring vaccines, it just threatens a fine if they do. Celebrity and Carnival are pre-registering passengers. If you agree to voluntarily provide evidence of your vaccine status at the port you go into the 95% bucket. If you don’t agree, to you go in the 5% bucket. If you show up at the port and refuse to provide proof, and the 5% bucket is full, you don’t board. No push back from the state so far and it legally gets the cruise lines around the ban. 

"The law dictates that it is impermissible for any business operating in Florida to require patrons or customers to provide documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery “to gain access to, entry upon, or services from” the business."

 

That  'process' is clearly inconsistent with the intent/wording of the law.  If there are vacancies and a person is denied boarding because of their 'voluntary' refusal to provide  evidence, then the cruise line will be in violation of the law. This process is nothing more than playing word games.  It will not stand.

[B Midged]

3 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

"The law dictates that it is impermissible for any business operating in Florida to require patrons or customers to provide documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery “to gain access to, entry upon, or services from” the business."

 

That  'process' is clearly inconsistent with the intent/wording of the law.  If there are vacancies and a person is denied boarding because of their 'voluntary' refusal to provide  evidence, then the cruise line will be in violation of the law. This process is nothing more than playing word games.  It will not stand.

If that’s true, then I don’t see them being able to segregate the anti Vaxers even on the ship. Someone would complain they were denied the same services as the vacated ones, being not be allowed on one side of the theater or dining room or wherever. 

[KennyFla]

37 minutes ago, At Sea At Peace said:

 

Been around 4 awhile.  😉  Seen this kind of 'trust the science' before and the "circle back."  🧐

 

 

 

Big food too.

 

 

DDT gets a bad rap.  And who doesn't want a little cocaine in their soda?

[harkinmr]

11 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

"The law dictates that it is impermissible for any business operating in Florida to require patrons or customers to provide documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery “to gain access to, entry upon, or services from” the business."

 

That  'process' is clearly inconsistent with the intent/wording of the law.  If there are vacancies and a person is denied boarding because of their 'voluntary' refusal to provide  evidence, then the cruise line will be in violation of the law. This process is nothing more than playing word games.  It will not stand.

We will see won't we. 

 

It may be "impermissible" to "require" documentation, but it is not impermissible for a patron to volunteer that documentation. They cannot stop the cruise lines from sailing with a fully vaccinated passenger cohort. They can only threaten to fine them.  And a post-fine lawsuit would solve that problem as the law applied to the cruise lines is unconstitutional in violation of the Commerce Clause.

 

Do you honestly believe that the high-priced lawyers for the cruise lines have crafted this work-around believing that it will fail?  To my knowledge, there has been no comment from the Governor, or his office, on this plan. In fact, since the lawsuit mediation failed he has been more silent generally about vaccines and the cruise lines. My guess is he is going to let this process slide and it saves face for him.  It would certainly be politically foolish to continue to push this and look like the one who is stopping ships from sailing.

[graphicguy]

1 minute ago, CaptainWoody said:

I'm guessing that you might be left with the land authorities at the next port as well.

Good guess! 😉

[graphicguy]

Cruisers not allowed boarding because of the class of service (in this case, non-vaccinated service) is already sold out, it will be just like someone trying to board the first class section (or even general boarding) on a flight because that area is sold out.  They can whine about it as much as they want, but if it's unavailable, there's really no law that can force the airlines (or a cruise ship) to make accommodations.

 

 

[Trimone]

Proof must be in the form of the original vaccination record document issued by either the country's health authority that administered the vaccination or the guest's medical provider that completed the vaccine administration. Electronic vaccination records will be accepted for residents of countries where electronic documentation is the standard issued form. Communication regarding proof of vaccination submission will be sent to all booked guests in the 30 days prior to setting sail.
Says it all really?

[CroozFanatic]

Pretty sure DeSantis wants this to go to zero hour. No such thing as bad press.

[RaftingJeremy]

6 hours ago, At Sea At Peace said:

 

Even though, other than the N95, they are 100% useless against aerosol form of the virus.  The purpose of the common mask is to 'make others feel better.'

 

That is the science.

 

Absolutely 100% not true 

[At Sea At Peace]

8 hours ago, roger001 said:

Those silly folks that are the medical experts for the Mayo Clinic totally disagree.  But what do they know.  I would cut and paste their research here, but what's the point.  Would be wasting my time.  

 

Why does the May Clinic require their own medical personnel with interaction with potential Covid 19 patients wear 'only the N95 mask?

 

🙃