Update on FB from Michael Bailey

[Colorado Beach Bum]

7 hours ago, Tolkmit said:

 

Actually, since land positivity rates are averaged over 7 days of testing, and we know every single person on board had a negative test within 7 days of his statement, it is a very accurate comparison. The positivity rate he gives IS the positivity rate of most recent tests, not of population. The only difference is, he is only using each persons most recent test, while on land all tests of people who've been tested multiple times over the last week are included. However, this difference works against Royal Caribbean, if he calculated it the way it is calculated on land, Royal would look even better by comparison.

It is true that the numbers he give don't necessarily represent exactly what percent of people are infected, but that is equally, if not more, true of the land based numbers.

Good point

[Sosai X]

5 hours ago, PhillyFan33579 said:

The one change I would like to see from RCI is requiring 100% of passengers to be vaccinated, with no exceptions. I don’t know how much this would help, but I feel confident saying doing this wouldn’t hurt. 

 

Why?  Those who are vaccinated can still catch and spread it; the only difference appears to be the severity of the illness.  Those who choose to be vaccinated have made a conscious decision, just as those who have not chosen to be have made a decision.

 

And I say this as someone who is sailing a month from now, my wife and I are both fully vaccinated and boosted, and our two young kids get their 2nd shot early next week.

[exm]

6 hours ago, Sosai X said:

 

Why?  Those who are vaccinated can still catch and spread it; the only difference appears to be the severity of the illness.  Those who choose to be vaccinated have made a conscious decision, just as those who have not chosen to be have made a decision.

 

And I say this as someone who is sailing a month from now, my wife and I are both fully vaccinated and boosted, and our two young kids get their 2nd shot early next week.

exactly. Vaccins seem to protect you from serious illness, not from spreading it so you can start to question the vaccine mandates.

[Ocean Boy]

6 hours ago, Sosai X said:

 

Why?  Those who are vaccinated can still catch and spread it; the only difference appears to be the severity of the illness.  Those who choose to be vaccinated have made a conscious decision, just as those who have not chosen to be have made a decision.

 

And I say this as someone who is sailing a month from now, my wife and I are both fully vaccinated and boosted, and our two young kids get their 2nd shot early next week.

Because those who are not vaxxed stand the chance of having more severe sickness which could overwhelm the ships medical facilities, cause more medevacs, cause ports to reject a ship, or cause an early termination of a cruise.

 

If you choose to not be vaxxed that is fine. Just stay off a ship where your decision has the potential to affect the vacation of a few thousand other people.

 

 

[exm]

2 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

Because those who are not vaxxed stand the chance of having more severe sickness which could overwhelm the ships medical facilities, cause more medevacs, cause ports to reject a ship, or cause an early termination of a cruise.

 

If you choose to not be vaxxed that is fine. Just stay off a ship where your decision has the potential to affect the vacation of a few thousand other people.

 

 

that is all wel and good but 12 and up are required to be vaxed so it’s a moot point. Kids under 12 are very rarely really sick with COVID. Very rare. So the current policy works fine.

[Ocean Boy]

30 minutes ago, exm said:

exactly. Vaccins seem to protect you from serious illness, not from spreading it so you can start to question the vaccine mandates.

 

15 minutes ago, exm said:

that is all wel and good but 12 and up are required to be vaxed so it’s a moot point. Kids under 12 are very rarely really sick with COVID. Very rare. So the current policy works fine.

You're the one questioning whether there should be vaccine mandates.

[Sosai X]

4 hours ago, Ocean Boy said:

Because those who are not vaxxed stand the chance of having more severe sickness which could overwhelm the ships medical facilities, cause more medevacs, cause ports to reject a ship, or cause an early termination of a cruise.

 

If you choose to not be vaxxed that is fine. Just stay off a ship where your decision has the potential to affect the vacation of a few thousand other people.

 

 

 

It seems you missed the part where I stated "my wife and I are both fully vaccinated and boosted, and our two young kids get their 2nd shot early next week."  

 

Have a nice day.

[alwaysflyin]

On 12/24/2021 at 6:30 AM, jerseygirl3 said:

I love the spin he put on vaccination for 5-11 year olds. Instead of mandating that they be vaccinated, he states "more and more 5-11 years olds are being vaccinated". Why isnt it mandated, just like the 12 and over? 

 

Because of the other thing he said which is that 98% of those. positive for covid are fully vaccinated.  Requiring kids to be vaccinated is not going to stop covid when the vast majority of those contracting it are vaccinated.  This is just a really infectious variant.  Parents now have less incentive to vaccinate kids when we see that it doesn't prevent an infection that is super mild, and thus they would lose out on all that family revenue.

[alwaysflyin]

10 hours ago, Ocean Boy said:

Because those who are not vaxxed stand the chance of having more severe sickness which could overwhelm the ships medical facilities, cause more medevacs, cause ports to reject a ship, or cause an early termination of a cruise.

 

If you choose to not be vaxxed that is fine. Just stay off a ship where your decision has the potential to affect the vacation of a few thousand other people.

 

 

An unvaccinated kid 5-11 has much less chance of being seriously ill than a vaccinated person over 70, but we don't ban the elderly on cruise ships.  

[Ocean Boy]

6 hours ago, Sosai X said:

 

It seems you missed the part where I stated "my wife and I are both fully vaccinated and boosted, and our two young kids get their 2nd shot early next week."  

 

Have a nice day.

I didn't miss it. The question was why should everyone be required to be vaccinated. I was saying that you should stay home.

[Ocean Boy]

49 minutes ago, alwaysflyin said:

An unvaccinated kid 5-11 has much less chance of being seriously ill than a vaccinated person over 70, but we don't ban the elderly on cruise ships.  

And even less of a chance of becoming seriously ill if they are vaccinated.

[mek]

On 12/24/2021 at 9:22 AM, Mapleleafforever said:

That makes a lot of sense now. 

It always did.

[Mapleleafforever]

47 minutes ago, mek said:

It always did.

Might not be enough though sadly. Currently in my Province 76% of the population is double vaccinated. 44% of those in hospital and 30% of those in ICU are double vaccinated. There is still a good portion of the population who are vulnerable it seems. 

[Ocean Boy]

5 minutes ago, Mapleleafforever said:

Might not be enough though sadly. Currently in my Province 76% of the population is double vaccinated. 44% of those in hospital and 30% of those in ICU are double vaccinated. There is still a good portion of the population who are vulnerable it seems. 

I think the evidence is becoming pretty clear that we need to move toward a three shot series to be considered fully vaxxed. Hopefully, that number doesn't continue to rise into infinity.

[Ourusualbeach]

38 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

I think the evidence is becoming pretty clear that we need to move toward a three shot series to be considered fully vaxxed. Hopefully, that number doesn't continue to rise into infinity.

I had 3 shots yet still caught this new variety. 

[Ocean Boy]

27 minutes ago, Ourusualbeach said:

I had 3 shots yet still caught this new variety. 

But you are not in the hispital, I don't think.

[Ourusualbeach]

7 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

But you are not in the hispital, I don't think.

Definitely kot.  Milder than the cold I had last month. The rest of the family is double vexed and they all have mild symptoms as well. 

[ChutChut]

14 hours ago, Ocean Boy said:

Because those who are not vaxxed stand the chance of having more severe sickness which could overwhelm the ships medical facilities, cause more medevacs, cause ports to reject a ship, or cause an early termination of a cruise.

 

If you choose to not be vaxxed that is fine. Just stay off a ship where your decision has the potential to affect the vacation of a few thousand other people.

 

 

Not for kids. This isn't a kid virus. Mortality rate is virtually zero. Those with co-morbidities need to get healthy first (lose the fat, get off your butt and move, stop smoking, stop drinking, etc.) and stop relying on jabs. We are an unhealthy nation - that's our problem.

[Ocean Boy]

18 minutes ago, ChutChut said:

Not for kids. This isn't a kid virus. Mortality rate is virtually zero. Those with co-morbidities need to get healthy first (lose the fat, get off your butt and move, stop smoking, stop drinking, etc.) and stop relying on jabs. We are an unhealthy nation - that's our problem.

Gotcha, thanks.

[RoyalC]

2 hours ago, Mapleleafforever said:

Might not be enough though sadly. Currently in my Province 76% of the population is double vaccinated. 44% of those in hospital and 30% of those in ICU are double vaccinated. There is still a good portion of the population who are vulnerable it seems. 

Question is when did these people all have their shots and what were their antibody levels? Double vaxxed last February might not mean much anymore. I double vaxxed in October (25th last shot) and caught it on Odyssey Dec 12th cruise. On day seven now of symptoms but feel a little better today after starting Z-Pak yesterday morning to clear what I think is/was developing secondary baterial (as usual for me). No elevated temperature this morning. 

[RoyalC]

5 minutes ago, HappyInVan said:

 

We have to remember that omicron has exceptional evasion characteristics. Perhaps, it doesn't matter how much antibodies are in our blood. Rather, its our bodies ability to identify omicron. 

 

The good news is that those with omicron infections will have good protection.

 

The bad news is that the data we have is at the beginning of this wave. Infections of the younger care-free population. Once omicron spreads to the general population, we'll have a better idea of the 'mildness' among older cruisers.

 

In the meantime, Michael would like you to keep cruising. Do not be afraid of cruising. Be happy! 

 

 

The protection according to studies wanes a lot from not too long after your dose. The other issue is no one really knows what variant they have. I'm sure the crew samples will be tested but for the rest of us we do not know for sure. Symptoms overlap depending on which news article you read. I guess if you get really sick they will check it.

[topnole]

3 hours ago, RoyalC said:

The protection according to studies wanes a lot from not too long after your dose. The other issue is no one really knows what variant they have. I'm sure the crew samples will be tested but for the rest of us we do not know for sure. Symptoms overlap depending on which news article you read. I guess if you get really sick they will check it.

Most likely omicron.  It was already 75% of all new cases several days ago.  That has surely gone up.  Highly likely you have omicron now if you get it.  Soon it will be almost every case.  

[rj59]

I just got off Navigator and felt annoyed at the 2020 dichotomy of vaccinated/everyone venues that hasn't been updated for the reality of breakthrough infections. I particularly was irked by all the blocked-off tables in the WJ and Cafe Promenade but none in the dining room and people packed like sardines in the ground floor in the theater and half the seats blocked off in the balcony. I just want the maximum number of open spaces everywhere so I can make my own choices about distancing, and closing off half the seats in most venues while going up to high capacity just makes the experience frustrating and foolish. The same is true of making me wait for buffet food from a crew member who stands there all day breathing on passengers while possibly having a breakthrough infection--tongs don't pass Covid, people breathing do (especially unlike the other lines, Royal doesn't make its food staff wear KN95 masks). 

 

So while I loved sailing on Ovation at 30%, I didn't feel comfortable on Navigator at 75% with only 50% available seating in many venues. The same is true of Carnival, it felt too crowded and stressful, especially with indoor masking. So I think that instead of staying home, I'll stick with Princess for now, which has kept low capacity for many of their sailings (the Grand that was alongside Navigator had 600 on board), and the rules and practices felt more sensible and less onerous than on other lines. I also appreciated never hearing 'washy washy' on Princess, like I'm a child, and dining room staff don't incessantly beg for a 10 rating on reviews, which to me is as improper as a land waiter begging for a big tip. But mainly, because of omicron I know there are going to be infections on board, but I want the least chance of contracting it and the most pleasant, normal cruise experience that still feels safe.

[Jimbo]

18 minutes ago, rj59 said:

I just got off Navigator and felt annoyed at the 2020 dichotomy of vaccinated/everyone venues that hasn't been updated for the reality of breakthrough infections. I particularly was irked by all the blocked-off tables in the WJ and Cafe Promenade but none in the dining room and people packed like sardines in the ground floor in the theater and half the seats blocked off in the balcony. I just want the maximum number of open spaces everywhere so I can make my own choices about distancing, and closing off half the seats in most venues while going up to high capacity just makes the experience frustrating and foolish. The same is true of making me wait for buffet food from a crew member who stands there all day breathing on passengers while possibly having a breakthrough infection--tongs don't pass Covid, people breathing do (especially unlike the other lines, Royal doesn't make its food staff wear KN95 masks). 

 

So while I loved sailing on Ovation at 30%, I didn't feel comfortable on Navigator at 75% with only 50% available seating in many venues. The same is true of Carnival, it felt too crowded and stressful, especially with indoor masking. So I think that instead of staying home, I'll stick with Princess for now, which has kept low capacity for many of their sailings (the Grand that was alongside Navigator had 600 on board), and the rules and practices felt more sensible and less onerous than on other lines. I also appreciated never hearing 'washy washy' on Princess, like I'm a child, and dining room staff don't incessantly beg for a 10 rating on reviews, which to me is as improper as a land waiter begging for a big tip. But mainly, because of omicron I know there are going to be infections on board, but I want the least chance of contracting it and the most pleasant, normal cruise experience that still feels safe.

Aren't practicing what they preach are they? Safety left town to the almighty $$$

[Ocean Boy]

1 hour ago, Jimbo said:

Aren't practicing what they preach are they? Safety left town to the almighty $$$

When I read things like tables are blocked off in the Windjammer but people are packed together in the MDR  it just makes me believe much of what they are doing is just for show. And to book at 75% capacity with 50% of seating available is crazy. We all know what it is like trying to find seating when booked at 100% capacity with 100% seating available. Maybe I am just too skeptical.