NCL trip insurance vs. Brand X

[Babr]

19 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

None of that is spelled out in any insurance policy I have reviewed. Do you have an example?

 

No, I do not have that at hand. Read the definition of terms in any policy you are considering. Look for it under “Payments and Deposits” or words to that effect. If you have doubts about what it means, ask the person selling you the policy to explain it.

[Babr]

12 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

I’ve never dug as deep as this thread! Anyone with pre-existing conditions needs to be super careful, especially if they accept fcc.

 

We have a next cruise purchased in 2018 applied to an African cruise leaving Jan 2023. If I’m understanding this correct, the clock started ticking in 2018??

If the cruise line retained the original deposit all this time and just kept moving it forward, it seems that is the case. Ask a professional before you buy insurance and be sure to explain the details.

[ChiefMateJRK]

18 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

I’ve never dug as deep as this thread! Anyone with pre-existing conditions needs to be super careful, especially if they accept fcc.

 

We have a next cruise purchased in 2018 applied to an African cruise leaving Jan 2023. If I’m understanding this correct, the clock started ticking in 2018??

Yep. Let the buyer beware always. As with most insurance, you never know what you bought until you file a claim.  75% FCC CFAR at final payment is the safest thing I’ve read. 

[GeezerCouple]

4 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Yep. Let the buyer beware always. As with most insurance, you never know what you bought until you file a claim.  75% FCC CFAR at final payment is the safest thing I’ve read. 

We've filed quite a few claims, including some large ones.  All but one (I think...?) have been for medical reasons.  That one was when our flight home was cancelled, so we spent another night at our 5* resort!

 

We filed all of the documents, which means the claim form (which isn't long) and any medical records.  That tended to be just a letter from a physician.

Once, when we were overseas and I was in hospital, because of the language problem, we just sent the insurer a (thick!) copy of the hospital records we had been given a copy of.  I still don't know what everything that was written there meant.  We didn't even have to bother with the translation; let the insurer deal with that (as they would also have helped with translation while we were overseas in the hospital had that been necessary!).

 

We do get coverage that does not exclude pre-existing conditions, and that applied to family members not traveling with us.  One of the last minute cancellations was when MIL (late 90's) was admitted to hospital with heart trouble.  I think they wanted a letter from her physician and from a cardiologist.  Nothing that we felt was inappropriate or burdensome.

And no physician has ever balked or complained.  They just "state the facts", etc.  If any were ever contacted further by the insurer, we never heard about it.

 

We submitted a copy of our insurance policy, and the confirmation of our original booking and deposit, and a copy of the final "total paid", which was our claim, along with some other costs (for the claims where we cancelled).

 

There seem to be a LOT of mountains being made out of a remarkably tiny <spot?>.

There's never been anything tricky about any of it.  They want to have receipts, to verify the reimbursement is for amounts actually paid, and they want to see documentation that the reason for the claim (cancellation or otherwise) is indeed valid.

They have a right to all of that, or... they'd be swamped with fraudulent claims.

We can only speak for experience with Travel Insured, but it's been a lot easier than even a small claim for auto or household insurance!  

 

Insurance is a regulated industry.

As suggested above, anyone really concerned about any "gotchas" should indeed ask their state's Insurance Commissioner's Office.

 

GC

[Babr]

13 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Yep. Let the buyer beware always. As with most insurance, you never know what you bought until you file a claim.  75% FCC CFAR at final payment is the safest thing I’ve read. 

 

I applaud your efforts to find the information you need to make a good choice when buying insurance. The answers you turned up are useful to lots of people beside yourself. I learned new things, too.

 

You just don’t seem willing to accept those answers. I won’t say it is OK not to be open to new information, but I will say I know what it feels like to be suspicious of things I don’t understand.  
 

Keep trying. You’ve made a valiant effort so far. Bravo!

 

 

 

 

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 minute ago, Babr said:

 

I applaud your efforts to find the information you need to make a good choice when buying insurance. The answers you turned up are useful to lots of people beside yourself. I learned new things, too.

 

You just don’t seem willing to accept those answers. I won’t say it is OK not to be open to new information, but I will say I know what it feels like to be suspicious of things I don’t understand.  
 

Keep trying. You’ve made a valiant effort so far. Bravo!

 

 

 

 

I don’t doubt any of the answers regarding the “right” way to use third party insurance.  Book the itinerary only once. Only pay with new funds. Pay within 21 days.  Good to go. 
 

Then come the what ifs. What if I used FCC?  What if I used a cruise next cert?  What if I had the same itinerary booked six months ago but I cancelled it?  Plus, all the others that may emerge from the fog. 

[Babr]

1 minute ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

I don’t doubt any of the answers regarding the “right” way to use third party insurance.  Book the itinerary only once. Only pay with new funds. Pay within 21 days.  Good to go. 
 

Then come the what ifs. What if I used FCC?  What if I used a cruise next cert?  What if I had the same itinerary booked six months ago but I cancelled it?  Plus, all the others that may emerge from the fog. 

You’re getting there.Things will begin to settle into place. It takes time to digest a lot of new information. 

[BermudaBound2014]

17 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

I don’t doubt any of the answers regarding the “right” way to use third party insurance.  Book the itinerary only once. Only pay with new funds. Pay within 21 days.  Good to go. 
 

Then come the what ifs. What if I used FCC?  What if I used a cruise next cert?  What if I had the same itinerary booked six months ago but I cancelled it?  Plus, all the others that may emerge from the fog. 

What if the line goes solvent? LOl. I know many of you dismiss this possibility, but If I had spent what some on here report I’d want to be protected in these most uncertain fiscal times. One just needs to visit the crystal boards to read just how unprotected many were.
 

Of course, I typically spend less than most on any given cruise and can afford to self insure to avoid this game entirely (especially being that as I have no pre existing medical conditions.).  
 

Keep digging, we are all benefitting 🙂

[ChiefMateJRK]

45 minutes ago, Babr said:

You’re getting there.Things will begin to settle into place. It takes time to digest a lot of new information.

I honestly think I was "there" when I learned about the hidden restrictions on initial payment definitions.  Perhaps it is some others who are still catching up?  The rest was just weighing the costs of admission for third party policies against NCL's offerings (i.e. the original topic of this thread).  😎

 

I've probably digested more mis-information, which is preached as gospel but not documented on any insurance policy.  I mean honestly, why does Nationwide care if I had the same cruise booked a year ago or I used a cruisenext cert to pay for my deposit?  Inquiring minds want to know (or at least see where Nationwide documented this in writing).

[ChiefMateJRK]

32 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

What if the line goes solvent?

I would love it if my cruise line went solvent!!!!  🤣 (jk)

[ChiefMateJRK]

3 hours ago, Babr said:

Nothing is at risk until you pay the final payment. Even if you rebook the same cruise later, it does not matter as long as you got a full cash refund. The deposit date becomes an issue if you are dealing with FCC or a transferred deposit.

That's not what this says:

 

Your Initial Trip Deposit Date « Get the Best Trip Insurance Details, Advice (tripinsurancestore.com)

 

"May I keep the same travel dates, but change my Initial Trip Deposit Date?
No. If any of the money you paid previously is either transferred or applied to your new cruise’s booking, the original deposit date will be the same.

The only way it’s treated as a new trip with a new deposit date is if you can show documentation that the following is true:

• You completely cancelled the first cruise along with all other travel arrangements and
• You received 100% of your money back from all your travel arrangements as either a credit card credit or in the form of a check made payable to you and
• Your new trip has different travel dates than the trip you cancelled"

[iamtrustworthy]

4 hours ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

You keep skipping the part where I said:

 

"Other than cancellation (which my example specifically omitted because it's free to me up until final payment),"

 

It's quite simple.  If I use NCL's insurance, I don't pay a penny until final payment (when I am committed to the cruise) and the worst I can do is 75% CFAR FCC.  Is that ideal?  "Almost."  If I go third party and desire the waiver of the pre-existing condition exemption, I have to pay for the insurance shortly after my initial booking (which some of us do years in advance for flexibility and price protection).  I'm not going to give that up for very expensive 100% CFAR insurance.  This thread was started to discuss this very issue, and I'm pretty close to a conclusion for my needs and preferences.  Others have different needs and preferences.  I do appreciate everybody's inputs.

Hi ChiefMateJRK,

 

> If I go third party and desire the waiver of the pre-existing condition exemption, I have to pay for the insurance shortly after my initial booking.

 

Did you know you have to only insure at least the value of your deposit, but you don't have to insure the full trip cost up front?

 

Steve Dasseos

[iamtrustworthy]

4 hours ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

You keep skipping the part where I said:

 

"Other than cancellation (which my example specifically omitted because it's free to me up until final payment),"

 

It's quite simple.  If I use NCL's insurance, I don't pay a penny until final payment (when I am committed to the cruise) and the worst I can do is 75% CFAR FCC.  Is that ideal?  "Almost."  If I go third party and desire the waiver of the pre-existing condition exemption, I have to pay for the insurance shortly after my initial booking (which some of us do years in advance for flexibility and price protection).  I'm not going to give that up for very expensive 100% CFAR insurance.  This thread was started to discuss this very issue, and I'm pretty close to a conclusion for my needs and preferences.  Others have different needs and preferences.  I do appreciate everybody's inputs.

Hi ChiefMateJKR,

 

> I'm not going to give that up for very expensive 100% CFAR insurance.

 

There are no 100% CFAR insurance plans. 75% is the most.

 

Steve Dasseos

[iamtrustworthy]

2 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

I’ve never dug as deep as this thread! Anyone with pre-existing conditions needs to be super careful, especially if they accept fcc.

 

We have a next cruise purchased in 2018 applied to an African cruise leaving Jan 2023. If I’m understanding this correct, the clock started ticking in 2018??

Hi BermudaBound2014,

 

> We have a next cruise purchased in 2018 applied to an African cruise leaving Jan 2023. If I’m understanding this correct, the clock started ticking in 2018?

 

What do you mean by "a next cruise"?

 

Steve Dasseos

[ChiefMateJRK]

11 minutes ago, iamtrustworthy said:

Hi ChiefMateJRK,

 

> If I go third party and desire the waiver of the pre-existing condition exemption, I have to pay for the insurance shortly after my initial booking.

 

Did you know you have to only insure at least the value of your deposit, but you don't have to insure the full trip cost up front?

 

Steve Dasseos

I remember you stating that, but since my deposit is fully refundable do I really have anything to insure?

[iamtrustworthy]

4 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

I remember you stating that, but since my deposit is fully refundable do I really have anything to insure?

Hi ChiefMateJRK,

 

Yes, you have the money you have paid. The only good reasons I can think of to insure a deposit are:

• You want the benefits that come with the "Time Sensitive Benefits".
• You want to lock in the current prices at your current ages.
• If you are past the 14-21 day "Time Sensitive Benefits" purchase deadline and you have no pre-existing medical conditions, buying the policy locks in the Lookback Period.

Steve Dasseos

[ChiefMateJRK]

19 minutes ago, iamtrustworthy said:

Hi ChiefMateJRK,

 

Yes, you have the money you have paid. The only good reasons I can think of to insure a deposit are:

• You want the benefits that come with the "Time Sensitive Benefits".
• You want to lock in the current prices at your current ages.
• If you are past the 14-21 day "Time Sensitive Benefits" purchase deadline and you have no pre-existing medical conditions, buying the policy locks in the Lookback Period.

Steve Dasseos

Thanks Steve.  It sounds kind of silly but, as with Government rules, I guess insurance rules don't have to make a lot of sense. 

[njhorseman]

1 hour ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Thanks Steve.  It sounds kind of silly but, as with Government rules, I guess insurance rules don't have to make a lot of sense. 

As a a retired actuary I can assure you they make a lot of sense.

[ChiefMateJRK]

35 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

As a a retired actuary I can assure you they make a lot of sense.

On THAT we can agree 100%!  Insurance companies have the best actuaries in the world.  If you were a top math student, you went to work for the insurance companies and made tremendous $$$.  If you didn't make that cut, you probably wound up teaching high school or Junior College (not that there is anything wrong with that.)  I'm sure all of their rules make perfect sense from a business standpoint.  Perhaps I should have clarified that I was speaking from a consumer standpoint.  Back to "let the buyer beware...." 😎

[njhorseman]

33 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

On THAT we can agree 100%!  Insurance companies have the best actuaries in the world.  If you were a top math student, you went to work for the insurance companies and made tremendous $$$.  If you didn't make that cut, you probably wound up teaching high school or Junior College (not that there is anything wrong with that.)  I'm sure all of their rules make perfect sense from a business standpoint.  Perhaps I should have clarified that I was speaking from a consumer standpoint.  Back to "let the buyer beware...." 😎

Actually if I had been a better mathematician I would never have worked as an actuary. I was tired of struggling to do my doctoral dissertation, my wife had finished hers (in a different field) and took a job back in our native New York City so I threw in the towel and got a real job rather than continuing as a wannabe university professor teaching calculus to freshmen.

 

Come to think of it I probably wasn't a very good actuary either. 😄

[Babr]

19 hours ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

That's not what this says:

 

Your Initial Trip Deposit Date « Get the Best Trip Insurance Details, Advice (tripinsurancestore.com)

 

"May I keep the same travel dates, but change my Initial Trip Deposit Date?
No. If any of the money you paid previously is either transferred or applied to your new cruise’s booking, the original deposit date will be the same.

The only way it’s treated as a new trip with a new deposit date is if you can show documentation that the following is true:

• You completely cancelled the first cruise along with all other travel arrangements and
• You received 100% of your money back from all your travel arrangements as either a credit card credit or in the form of a check made payable to you and
• Your new trip has different travel dates than the trip you cancelled"

 

And right below this it says all our policies contain the language “must be first and only booking.”  They do not. I think this may be out-dated wording connected to the blog you saw earlier and got corrected. It is pre-COVID. Many insurance companies have rewritten their policies to accommodate current conditions which include lots of cancellations and re-bookings.

 

But if you do see it, such as in the John Hancock Silver policy, take it seriously. Posting on a website is very different from actual language in the certificate of insurance.

 

[ChiefMateJRK]

3 hours ago, Babr said:

And right below this it says all our policies contain the language “must be first and only booking.”  They do not.

You are correct, yet this seems to be treated as fact for all policies. 

3 hours ago, Babr said:

But if you do see it, such as in the John Hancock Silver policy, take it seriously. Posting on a website is very different from actual language in the certificate of insurance.

Thanks.  I now have one actual sighting of that language in an actual insurance policy. 😎  That took a while....