Azamara Wine Discussion (September 2022)

[blag]

And, the Complimentary Red wines...

On previous cruises I don't recall that the Complimentary wines were 'Azamara own-label', but again I may be mis-remembering.

[lisiamc]

23 minutes ago, blag said:

And, the Complimentary Red wines...

On previous cruises I don't recall that the Complimentary wines were 'Azamara own-label', but again I may be mis-remembering.

This is a fairly new development on the wines. Since Sycamore also owns a winery, or at least is heavily involved in one, and should have good connections in that area, it seems like a very reasonable idea. I’ve heard some lacklustre reviews, and some better ones, but I’ve heard the same for the previous included wines too.

[blag]

1 hour ago, lisiamc said:

This is a fairly new development on the wines. Since Sycamore also owns a winery, or at least is heavily involved in one, and should have good connections in that area, it seems like a very reasonable idea. I’ve heard some lacklustre reviews, and some better ones, but I’ve heard the same for the previous included wines too.

We're not impressed by these reds. I'm not much of a wine buff, but these don't do it for me.

Photographing the whites is proving more difficult, because they are on ice!

[luv2travel90266]

On 9/1/2022 at 9:01 AM, blag said:

We're not impressed by these reds. I'm not much of a wine buff, but these don't do it for me.

 

Just off the Pursuit. My opinion of the included wines are they are worth about $6/bottle. If that is what you drink at home you might find them fine.  I upgraded to the Ultimate package after tasting those. The ultimate package wines available were $18-$25/bottle retail (California prices). A plus was I could have a cognac after dinner on the package too.  

[asnaleah]

16 hours ago, luv2travel90266 said:

Just off the Pursuit. My opinion of the included wines are they are worth about $6/bottle. If that is what you drink at home you might find them fine.  I upgraded to the Ultimate package after tasting those. The ultimate package wines available were $18-$25/bottle retail (California prices). A plus was I could have a cognac after dinner on the package too.  

Thank you for this information. We have been considering bringing wine on board. Did you find the wines available on the Ultimate package pretty good? Many choices?

[Zoey]

16 hours ago, luv2travel90266 said:

Just off the Pursuit. My opinion of the included wines are they are worth about $6/bottle. If that is what you drink at home you might find them fine.  I upgraded to the Ultimate package after tasting those. The ultimate package wines available were $18-$25/bottle retail (California prices). A plus was I could have a cognac after dinner on the package too.  

Haven’t had my morning espressos yet so all I can say is……yuck. 

[Grandma Cruising]

17 hours ago, luv2travel90266 said:

Just off the Pursuit. My opinion of the included wines are they are worth about $6/bottle. If that is what you drink at home you might find them fine.  I upgraded to the Ultimate package after tasting those. The ultimate package wines available were $18-$25/bottle retail (California prices). A plus was I could have a cognac after dinner on the package too.  

One of our friends is a qualified Wine Master. He maintains that you shouldn’t judge a wine by its price. He buys and drinks wine at a variety of price points, including some at £5-6 a bottle.

[luv2travel90266]

I am not a certified  sommelier and do totally agree with your friends thoughts. If you can't tell the difference buy the lesser expensive wine. Many on the cruise found the wine acceptable. My comment is my opinion after tasting the wine on board.

 

Azamara house wine does not appear to be found on the open market so I am estimating the value based upon my palate. By comparison an inexpensive wine I do sometimes drink is Bogle Petite Sirah  that can be bought for under $10 and compares with wines more than twice the price. The best way to decide is taste the wine and determine for yourself. My conclusion is the Ultimate package is a good value for me.

[luv2travel90266]

1 hour ago, asnaleah said:

We have been considering bringing wine on board. Did you find the wines available on the Ultimate package pretty good? Many choices?

I did consider bringing wine on board. We began the trip in Reykjavik and wine is sold through government liquor stores which also had a web site. Some of the wines from Europe were good values which I currently buy. On the forum I note people mentioning being charged corkage  $10  and more. I didn't ask as I chose not to bring on a box of wine but there seems to be some inconsistency with the policy or posters made incorrect statements as to cost. 

 

I thought the choices available and reasonable for my palate.  Azamara also gives a discount on the Ultimate package based upon your Member Loyalty Status,  

[Mackdogmolly]

3 hours ago, asnaleah said:

Thank you for this information. We have been considering bringing wine on board. Did you find the wines available on the Ultimate package pretty good? Many choices?

I didn’t think the choices for the white wine were that great, but love the Whispering Angel rose!

[Nippy Sweetie]

I love French roses. On a blind test between Whispering Angel and an ordinary Provencal rose the ordinary one won out. It was £9 a bottle the Whispering Angel was £20. I think the difference must be in the marketing (ie advertising!)

[asnaleah]

I primarily drink white wine, preferably French Sauvignon Blanc. I may just bring a few bottles to enjoy in my suite and hope for the best in the restaurants. Thanks 

[KiniShakenBake]

On 9/1/2022 at 7:06 AM, lisiamc said:

This is a fairly new development on the wines. Since Sycamore also owns a winery, or at least is heavily involved in one, and should have good connections in that area, it seems like a very reasonable idea. I’ve heard some lacklustre reviews, and some better ones, but I’ve heard the same for the previous included wines too.

Sycamore owns the largest and oldest winery in Washington - not just any crappy ol' winery. It's also the largest producer of Riesling in the world by one reputable account. I was there last night, as a matter of fact, for the Chicago concert. It's Chateau Ste. Michelle - They have a huge number of labels they produce for, too. 

 

Chateau Ste Michelle wines are all over the map in terms of cost, but they are far from poor in quality. I enjoy the vast majority of them, though I'm admittedly not a sommelier-class wine drinker. Their Rose is beyond popular and was the official Rose of the Kentucky Derby at one point. Their bubbly muscat canelli is wonderful, especially when a hibiscus flower and some juice from the jar is added to it. I found cabs and cab blends that I could wrap my palate around with their holiday collection one year. 

 

They have tremendous range in flavour profiles within the same grape type, depending on where they were grown. I wouldn't expect that Azamara would have a consistent house Syrah or Merlot or Chardonnay, just because of the process. 

 

I would imagine it is pretty easy to private brand your wines when you own the winery. The only question is how expensive shipping is for that wine from WA if that's how they are sourcing now. 

Edited September 4, 2022 by KiniShakenBake

[luv2travel90266]

Château St Michelle makes a very reasonable Sauvignon Blanc too at around $10 (costco). The Azamara House wines were more like Charles Shaw (Aka 2 Buck Chuck). As a premium cruise line I think they could do better but  it ultimately is a business run for profit. The options are there including upgrading the wine package, wine by the bottle, or pay reasonable corkage. I’m still a fan of the cruise line

[Host Jazzbeau]

I had hoped when Sycamore bought Azamara that they would use their winery connections to upgrade the onboard wines.  But it isn't just a case of "I own a cruise line and I own a winery, so let's bring our wines onboard."  There are so many government regulations about exporting/importing wine that they can't just ship a container from Château St Michelle to each Azamara ship wherever it happens to be.  [Notice the recent post about how hard it has been for Sycamore to convince their suppliers that Royal Club Tonic is not acceptable.  Sadly we don't always have as much control in life as we think we do...]

[DS]

4 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

I had hoped when Sycamore bought Azamara that they would use their winery connections to upgrade the onboard wines.  But it isn't just a case of "I own a cruise line and I own a winery, so let's bring our wines onboard."  There are so many government regulations about exporting/importing wine that they can't just ship a container from Château St Michelle to each Azamara ship wherever it happens to be.  [Notice the recent post about how hard it has been for Sycamore to convince their suppliers that Royal Club Tonic is not acceptable.  Sadly we don't always have as much control in life as we think we do...]

That's my experience.   A Post on "Anyone currently onboard"  board from 4 April lists the source of the Azamara branded wines.... most are from Le Union de Vignerons...not exactly a high end entity    It would be much nicer to have the Chateau St Michelele!   OR BETTER yet, wines from the country that is the subject of a Country Intensive voyage!

[Host Jazzbeau]

16 minutes ago, DS said:

That's my experience.   A Post on "Anyone currently onboard"  board from 4 April lists the source of the Azamara branded wines.... most are from Le Union de Vignerons...not exactly a high end entity    It would be much nicer to have the Chateau St Michelele!   OR BETTER yet, wines from the country that is the subject of a Country Intensive voyage!

That's the feeling I'm getting.  We had originally booked on a deal that included Premium packages all around [a waste because DW doesn't drink at all]; with the Venice to Ravenna change they gave us a new deal with full OBC credit for those premium packages – now my issue is how to use that money?  I look at even the Ultimate package menus and think 'this wine isn't worth the money.'  But $406.80 over 12 days will buy me a lot of bottles – from a much wider selection than any package.  So I think I know which way to go...

[takemewithyou]

22 minutes ago, DS said:

That's my experience.   A Post on "Anyone currently onboard"  board from 4 April lists the source of the Azamara branded wines.... most are from Le Union de Vignerons...not exactly a high end entity    It would be much nicer to have the Chateau St Michelele!   OR BETTER yet, wines from the country that is the subject of a Country Intensive voyage!

Azamara used to bring on wines from the countries you were visiting.  In 2017 we had some wonderful wines when in New Zealand and Australian wines as we headed that way!  I was so happy with the choices that were daily pours…..now not so much at all.  And last Dec., we upgraded to the Ultimate Package wine and I wasn’t really impressed with those, either.  If the next cruise was in Europe, I would pick up some of my own, but it’s the Caribbean.  Maybe I might just look at the wine list and buy bottles from that, unless the wines improve.

[Host Jazzbeau]

10 minutes ago, takemewithyou said:

Azamara used to bring on wines from the countries you were visiting.  In 2017 we had some wonderful wines when in New Zealand and Australian wines as we headed that way!  I was so happy with the choices that were daily pours…..now not so much at all.  And last Dec., we upgraded to the Ultimate Package wine and I wasn’t really impressed with those, either.  If the next cruise was in Europe, I would pick up some of my own, but it’s the Caribbean.  Maybe I might just look at the wine list and buy bottles from that, unless the wines improve.

As I noted above, that's what I'm planning to do.  OTOH there are some places in the Caribbean where you can get good wine – mainly French or British islands.  We had a sherry tasting in Spain last fall that led DW [the non-drinker] and me both to say that Croft Original Pale Cream Sherry was quite nice.  Couldn't find it in the US – but did locate it at a wine store in Bridgetown, Barbados before our January cruise, and picked up two bottles.  Do a little research before your Caribbean cruise, and you may find wine possibilities even there!

[andrcan]

2 hours ago, KiniShakenBake said:

Sycamore owns the largest and oldest winery in Washington - not just any crappy ol' winery. It's also the largest producer of Riesling in the world by one reputable account. I was there last night, as a matter of fact, for the Chicago concert. It's Chateau Ste. Michelle - They have a huge number of labels they produce for, too. 

 

Chateau Ste Michelle wines are all over the map in terms of cost, but they are far from poor in quality. I enjoy the vast majority of them, though I'm admittedly not a sommelier-class wine drinker. Their Rose is beyond popular and was the official Rose of the Kentucky Derby at one point. Their bubbly muscat canelli is wonderful, especially when a hibiscus flower and some juice from the jar is added to it. I found cabs and cab blends that I could wrap my palate around with their holiday collection one year. 

 

They have tremendous range in flavour profiles within the same grape type, depending on where they were grown. I wouldn't expect that Azamara would have a consistent house Syrah or Merlot or Chardonnay, just because of the process. 

 

I would imagine it is pretty easy to private brand your wines when you own the winery. The only question is how expensive shipping is for that wine from WA if that's how they are sourcing now. 

Not sure about the whites but I believe Azamara branded reds are Italian (Merlot), French (Syrah, Cab), and South African by origin.

[Dylandude]

I Googled Le Union de Vignerons and got a link to Yapp.co.uk who are well recognised UK wine merchant. They are selling three of Le Union de Vignerons wines for £12.75 ($15) per bottle.

This is what Yapp wines said “The Union des Vignerons Cave Co-opérative of Saint Pourçain is a benchmark example of a pioneering modern operation producing well-made inexpensive and reliable wines.”

Having tried all the Az house wines (not all are made by Le Union de Vignerons) I think the description above nails it, they are well made and reliable, who cares if they are not expensive.

[lisiamc]

6 hours ago, DS said:

That's my experience.   A Post on "Anyone currently onboard"  board from 4 April lists the source of the Azamara branded wines.... most are from Le Union de Vignerons...not exactly a high end entity    It would be much nicer to have the Chateau St Michelele!   OR BETTER yet, wines from the country that is the subject of a Country Intensive voyage!

We just did a port intensive Iceland cruise. Probably better to have wines from elsewhere! 😄

 

My impression of Chateau Ste Michelle from 30+ years ago (when I liked sweet whites) was that their wines were very sweet, traditional Rieslings and other German-style whites. Too sweet for me even then. I can hope that they have evolved in the three decades that have passed! I now prefer flinty-dry whites and heavy but smooth, dry reds. 

[Norn Iron Man]

Having been lucky enough to have known a wine importer and had many opportunities to sample wines of all types and prices I can honestly say that wine is like beauty. It is in the eyes (tastebuds) of the beholder. Drink what you enjoy regardless of price. What to some may be greatest vintage ever produced to others it may be complete rotgut.

[federalexpress]

3 hours ago, Dylandude said:

I Googled Le Union de Vignerons and got a link to Yapp.co.uk who are well recognised UK wine merchant. They are selling three of Le Union de Vignerons wines for £12.75 ($15) per bottle.

This is what Yapp wines said “The Union des Vignerons Cave Co-opérative of Saint Pourçain is a benchmark example of a pioneering modern operation producing well-made inexpensive and reliable wines.”

Having tried all the Az house wines (not all are made by Le Union de Vignerons) I think the description above nails it, they are well made and reliable, who cares if they are not expensive.

 I'd be surprised if they are the producers. While they might buy in grapes outside the area to make wine to specification, Saint Pourcain itself is pretty much exclusively Gamay and Pinot Noir, not Cab Sauv and Syrah. 

 

The term Unions des Vignerons is a very generic term, there are dozens of these in France, all consisting of producers in a given region. I suspect these wines come from a different union than the one in Pourcain, however the image of the wine labels isn't clear enough to see whether there is a named region or failing that, in very small print, there should be a geographic locator as to where it was bottled which would give us a better clue.

 

The Merlot and Pinotage are easier, Zonin is a mass producer in the Veneto region (though it also owns a vast number of producers elsewhere in Italy). Its a reasonable quality producer, the Merlot from NW Italy maybe retailing for £6-7 in the UK. Personally I find these Merlots thin and shrill but the other Zonin wines from the area are OK if no more than that. Swartland Winery is also respectable and I imagine the Pinotage, although most likely their basic entry point, would be perfectly drinkable if you enjoy that grape. I would have thought the Italian Merlot up against the Matanzas Creek Merlot on the ultimate package would not be much of a contest. 

[asnaleah]

10 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

That's the feeling I'm getting.  We had originally booked on a deal that included Premium packages all around [a waste because DW doesn't drink at all]; with the Venice to Ravenna change they gave us a new deal with full OBC credit for those premium packages – now my issue is how to use that money?  I look at even the Ultimate package menus and think 'this wine isn't worth the money.'  But $406.80 over 12 days will buy me a lot of bottles – from a much wider selection than any package.  So I think I know which way to go...

Is there a link somewhere to the bottle wine list? Thanks!