Help With Flying to Australia

[jajsmom]

Experienced flier who has never been to Australia and looking for some advice.  The thought of being on planes for 24 hours makes me feel uncomfortable just thinking about it.  While I'd love to fly first class, it's just not in the budget. For those that have done this, is economy totally unbearable?  Is it worth the upgrade to premium economy?  Any airlines that are more comfortable for the long flight?  We'd be flying from MCO to SYD round trip.

Also, I've seen some better priced airfares on Delta.  Unfortunately, the only flight leaving Sydney is at 10:25 AM.  Is there any possible way to make this?  I know we could stay another day, but we are doing a week in Sydney before our cruises.  Thanks for all advice!

[CruiserBruce]

So, most likely, you will be flying MCO to a West Coast airport...5-6 hours, then a West Coast (also possible out of DFW, and I think, IAH) airport to Sydney, which is about 13 or so hours from a West Coast airport. So, you won't be on a plane for 24 hours. Around 20.

 

"Unbearable" in economy is a totally subjective judgement. MANY MANY people make that flight daily, keeping mind that each plane with around 250 people will have somewhere around 175 sitting in economy.

 

Economy worldwide is pretty standard, so, no, there isn't a "best" airline for economy. Premium economy has some more competition, and definitely a good idea. 

 

Lastly, most airlines on the US-Australia routes don't have first class anymore. Business class is the best class available. Yes, expensive. But having done SFO-SYD and SFO-AKL in both economy, business and first, I would be looking definitely for Premium Economy, and seriously at Business...seeing whatever you can arrange. Check with your cruise line...they might be able to help make it more reasonable.

 

No, I wouldn't try to catch a 10:25 flight the day you get off the ship. Most of the airlines will be departing for the US in that time frame.

[janert]

Definitely premium economy.  It is a very, very long flight. 

And you will not be able to make a 10:25 flight.  You need to be at the airport at least 3 hours before flight for international.  

Have a good cruise.  Beautiful countries.  

[jajsmom]

Thank you both.  I've put in a google flights reminder to check for airfare on both dates.  I guess we'll be leaning towards staying an extra day.  Flights seem to connect in LAX for Delta.

 

Another question.  Is there a best time to book airfare to Australia?  I know for domestic US flights, there is a sweet spot, and I noticed that for flights to Europe too.  We're 9-10 months out from travel each way right now, so I'll wait, but I noticed more seats being sold over the last few days.

[FlyerTalker]

9 minutes ago, jajsmom said:

I know for domestic US flights, there is a sweet spot, and I noticed that for flights to Europe too. 

 

So....just what is this "sweet spot" and how do you know this is true?

 

Personally, you should just put that away in the "urban legend circular file'.

[CruiserBruce]

There is no sweet spot...just isn't true. Airlines use dynamic pricing, so prices can easily change daily. Today's flight might have high demand and higher prices, and tomorrow's has low demand and lower prices. Other days, there is just no logic. Have been monitoring flights from SFO-BOS for next September, considering flying on either Sunday, Monday or Tuesday. The fares are different on all 3 days...as much as 40% more on the Monday we were most interested in. 3 morning flights each day, 6am, 7am and 8:30. Tuesday was the cheapest, but it's the day before sailing. Suddenly, Sunday dropped 40%, and we bought. Then they canceled 2 of the 3 flights each day, and the fares are higher than they ever were. So we got ours for over 40% below the current price. And according to the seat map (not the most exact source of info) not a single seat in Business has been sold on any of the flights except ours.

 

Award seats have, generally, more of a "sweet spot" than revenue seats. But its usually pretty predictable.

 

Sounds like you are monitoring prices. When you see them at a level you can tolerate, book and don't look back.

[Zach1213]

I am a fairly regular traveler on US-Australia routes, mostly Qantas with some American spattered in there. I am lucky enough to be in business or first class most of the time, but have done economy and premium economy. I personally find Qantas a slight step above the others (I have also ended up on Hawaiian, Delta, and United going to Australia), even in economy. Very slight, but slight. 

 

It's a long trip, there's no way around it, but as mentioned above, the majority of people are in economy and do just fine. When I am paying out of my own pocket, I am flying economy...there's just so much more I can do with that money on the ground, at my destination, to make memories. 

[fbgd]

18 hours ago, jajsmom said:

While I'd love to fly first class, it's just not in the budget.

 

What about business class? Can be a fraction of the price of full fare first class and opens up pretty much every airline (not many airlines offer a true first class on longhaul) whilst typically still offering fully flat beds, plenty of personal space etc.

 

Don't rule out round the world tickets either, the best ones are those through the various alliances (oneworld and Star Alliance are the best for this itinerary, IMO). You can fly back through Asia and Europe with just two stops from SYD to MCO. 

[Gardyloo]

1 hour ago, fbgd said:

 

What about business class? Can be a fraction of the price of full fare first class and opens up pretty much every airline (not many airlines offer a true first class on longhaul) whilst typically still offering fully flat beds, plenty of personal space etc.

 

Don't rule out round the world tickets either, the best ones are those through the various alliances (oneworld and Star Alliance are the best for this itinerary, IMO). You can fly back through Asia and Europe with just two stops from SYD to MCO. 

I wrote a lengthy response to another thread regarding this idea.  No idea if it resonates for the OP; much depends on how far in advance of cruises or vacations (or business/work trips for that matter) the OP plans, but it MIGHT be worthwhile to have a look at this idea.  Here's the post:  

Say, for example, that your cruise plans (apart from the Australian ones) included Alaska and the Mediterranean.  So imagine this.  Just before you travel to Sydney you fly to Norway and begin a business-class round the world ticket that you've purchased in advance.  Because RTW tickets are priced very differently depending on where the travel begins and ends, you've come to Oslo because for the time being it's among the cheapest places to start Oneworld business class RTW tickets, around $5900 plus taxes for a 4-continent ticket, good for a year and up to 16 flights in business or domestic first class over the four continents. (By comparison the same ticket starting and ending in the USA costs over $11,000 plus taxes.)  Here's a map of what happens next.

 

 

From Oslo you fly to Singapore via Qatar, then maybe spend a day or two overcoming jetlag and loading up on pepper crab or chicken rice at a Hawker food center or two.  Then it's off to Sydney for your cruises.   When you're done it's back to Orlando via Dallas, back to work or whatever.

 

Then in the late spring or early summer, say, you use the same ticket to fly to Anchorage.  Tour around, then cruise down to Vancouver.  Fly home using the same ticket.  

 

Then in the autumn, before the year is over, you fly from Orlando to, say, Rome, for a Mediterranean cruise.  (Could be Spain or Greece.)  When you're done, fly back to Oslo to complete the loop. You'll have earned enough frequent flyer miles (and have status in your FF program) to pay for the trip home with miles.  Or maybe you like this idea and just start a new RTW, this time maybe including South America or Africa.

 

What you've done with this is leverage the six grand or whatever into three separate cruise-oriented trips over the space of a year, all of them while flying comfortably up in the pointy end.  

 

This might or might not be of interest, but it's definitely an option.  

[jajsmom]

12 hours ago, Zach1213 said:

I am a fairly regular traveler on US-Australia routes, mostly Qantas with some American spattered in there. I am lucky enough to be in business or first class most of the time, but have done economy and premium economy. I personally find Qantas a slight step above the others (I have also ended up on Hawaiian, Delta, and United going to Australia), even in economy. Very slight, but slight. 

 

It's a long trip, there's no way around it, but as mentioned above, the majority of people are in economy and do just fine. When I am paying out of my own pocket, I am flying economy...there's just so much more I can do with that money on the ground, at my destination, to make memories. 

Thanks!  I don't even like long trips in the car, so I'm scared about  being in a plane so long.  I think we've decided on premium economy.  Prices were "great" yesterday, up $1000 today.  And I'm realizing that even though our cruise fare is pretty good, everything else is going to be much more expensive than on other cruises.

[jajsmom]

11 hours ago, fbgd said:

 

What about business class? Can be a fraction of the price of full fare first class and opens up pretty much every airline (not many airlines offer a true first class on longhaul) whilst typically still offering fully flat beds, plenty of personal space etc.

 

Don't rule out round the world tickets either, the best ones are those through the various alliances (oneworld and Star Alliance are the best for this itinerary, IMO). You can fly back through Asia and Europe with just two stops from SYD to MCO. 

Business class is only a few hundred dollars less than first class, so way out of our price range.  Would consider the round the world tickets at another time, but we're already gone for a month, and we'll just want to get home.

[jajsmom]

9 hours ago, Gardyloo said:

I wrote a lengthy response to another thread regarding this idea.  No idea if it resonates for the OP; much depends on how far in advance of cruises or vacations (or business/work trips for that matter) the OP plans, but it MIGHT be worthwhile to have a look at this idea.  Here's the post:  

Say, for example, that your cruise plans (apart from the Australian ones) included Alaska and the Mediterranean.  So imagine this.  Just before you travel to Sydney you fly to Norway and begin a business-class round the world ticket that you've purchased in advance.  Because RTW tickets are priced very differently depending on where the travel begins and ends, you've come to Oslo because for the time being it's among the cheapest places to start Oneworld business class RTW tickets, around $5900 plus taxes for a 4-continent ticket, good for a year and up to 16 flights in business or domestic first class over the four continents. (By comparison the same ticket starting and ending in the USA costs over $11,000 plus taxes.)  Here's a map of what happens next.

 

 

From Oslo you fly to Singapore via Qatar, then maybe spend a day or two overcoming jetlag and loading up on pepper crab or chicken rice at a Hawker food center or two.  Then it's off to Sydney for your cruises.   When you're done it's back to Orlando via Dallas, back to work or whatever.

 

Then in the late spring or early summer, say, you use the same ticket to fly to Anchorage.  Tour around, then cruise down to Vancouver.  Fly home using the same ticket.  

 

Then in the autumn, before the year is over, you fly from Orlando to, say, Rome, for a Mediterranean cruise.  (Could be Spain or Greece.)  When you're done, fly back to Oslo to complete the loop. You'll have earned enough frequent flyer miles (and have status in your FF program) to pay for the trip home with miles.  Or maybe you like this idea and just start a new RTW, this time maybe including South America or Africa.

 

What you've done with this is leverage the six grand or whatever into three separate cruise-oriented trips over the space of a year, all of them while flying comfortably up in the pointy end.  

 

This might or might not be of interest, but it's definitely an option.  

Definitely something to thing bout in the future, but it would not work out for us at this time.

[fbgd]

11 hours ago, jajsmom said:

 Would consider the round the world tickets at another time, but we're already gone for a month, and we'll just want to get home.

 

There's no requirement to stopover at each place on a RTW ticket. You can just use it to fly straight back from Australia, just needs to be westbound if you flew over the Pacific to Australia to start. 

[zdcatc12]

My DW and I went to Sydney a few years ago. I flew middle seat on the upper deck of a Quantas A380 from LAX, just to fly on the upper deck of an A380 (these were the only upper deck coach seats left). I figured that if I can do 16 hours doing that, I can do anything. On the return, we were on the lower deck, but got lucky as the empty seat in our row was only one of about five on the plane.

[jajsmom]

I bit the bullet this week and purchased Premium Select seats on Delta.  We're paying more for airfare than for the two cruises.  The day after I purchased, the fares went up $1000 pp. I did delay our departure by a day to get the early flight.  I also randomly searched flights every month leading up to our flights.  Only one set of flights was sold out in Premium Select.  And the fares were all over the place.  But I did not see any fares as low as what I purchased, so I am somewhat satisfied.

Also, I had looked into Princess EZ Air, as I was told the fares are usually pretty good for international flights. Not in this particular case.  At the same exact time I purchased, the cruise line airfares were significantly higher than buying directly through the airline.

[DogLover]

There's no "u" in Qantas 😉

[FlyerTalker]

1 hour ago, jajsmom said:

We're paying more for airfare than for the two cruises. 

 

There is ZERO relationship between those two items.

 

But if you want to be paying less for your air than for your cruises, there's a simple solution:  Buy more expensive cruises.

[CruiserBruce]

3 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

There is ZERO relationship between those two items.

 

But if you want to be paying less for your air than for your cruises, there's a simple solution:  Buy more expensive cruises.

Or fly shorter distances to your cruises.

 

Of course,  by flying from PA to Australia,  the poster is flying half way around the world. Wonder what the poster thinks that should cost.

[fbgd]

12 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

There is ZERO relationship between those two items.

 

But if you want to be paying less for your air than for your cruises, there's a simple solution:  Buy more expensive cruises.

 

It's one of those arguments I've never understood....

 

2 x J class fares on QF LAX-SYD for a random week in December, $10,400.

One week in an Opera House View Suite at the Park Hyatt $7200.

 

Nobody whinges that you pay more flights than a hotel stay...do they? 😄  

[rljan]

Our first flight to SYD was on Qantas from LAX to SYD, 14.5 hrs.  We vowed not to do that again, although it was coach.  On our next trip, we flew to Honolulu on Hawaiian and spent the night there, continuing on the next day.  The HA flights were premium economy.  The combination of P.E. and braking up the flight made it much better.

[Zach1213]

47 minutes ago, fbgd said:

One week in an Opera House View Suite at the Park Hyatt $7200.

 

 

Funny story about that Park Hyatt - several years ago, my wife and I flew down to Australia for vacation. We flew Qantas DFW-SYD and sat next to pro golfer Jordan Spieth. Chatted a bit at first, and then while we were waiting around baggage claim, and then he went on his way. The next day, at the Park Hyatt in Sydney, we came out of our room as our neighbor across the hall (with the better view, of course) was entering his...Jordan Spieth. We just looked at each other and started laughing about the odds of that. Never did see him again, unfortunately. 

[fbgd]

37 minutes ago, Zach1213 said:

 

Funny story about that Park Hyatt... 

 

Ha, I've had similar to that a weird number of times...

 

In the BA Concorde Room at LHR I had a guy with a hearing aid ask me to nudge him when the Concorde flight was called for boarding. I nudged him as I went to board, then ran into him at the lobby of my hotel a few hours later...

 

A couple of years after I flew BA Club World LHR-SFO. I was in a rear facing exit seat and was facing this guy on and off for the best part of 14hrs (thanks to a delay) who was a couple of rows away but never said a word. A few days later I'm stepping onto one of the cable cars and standing on the opposite side of the cable car...same person and weirdly we do exchange pleasantries acknowledging our BA flight.

 

Getting the opposite room is pretty next level!

[jajsmom]

Wow, a lot taken out of context.  I just meant that I had never spend so much on airline tickets before.  I have certainly spent more on cruises.  Just shocking as we will be spending 23 days in a balcony cabin, and the airfare still costs more than that.

[FlyerTalker]

2 hours ago, jajsmom said:

Just shocking as we will be spending 23 days in a balcony cabin, and the airfare still costs more than that.

 

Why is that shocking?  You are going almost ten thousand miles by air.

 

What did you expect to pay for going half-way round the world?  It's not a $99 ticket to Ft Lauderdale.

[jsglow]

So we are newly interested in this thread as we'll be traveling to Sydney, and then two plus weeks later onto Singapore in September/October 2024.  Just beginning to do my research.  Here's what I think I've learned so far.

1- We'll be beginning the journey in Las Vegas.  I've learned to keep an eye on departures from both LAS and LAX (among other S. Cal airports).

2- My 'mock booking' flights are currently modeled on flying THIS Sept/Oct just to get a feel.

3- From both Cali and LAS we can overnight layover at HNL; something we'll actively consider.

4- The N/Ss from LAX all leave about 11p.

5- Our instincts are to break this up in Hawaii for 15-24 hours as we're not traveling for business. Plus Hawaii Airlines seems to be meaningfully less money.

6- Business Class isn't an option we'll consider. We simply won't do the trip if we've got to pay $4500+pp to fly.

7- I'm learning about Scoot Airlines as our possible link between SYD and SIN. Eight hour flight.

8- We're Trans-Pacific cruising arriving back in Long Beach in early November. Easy SWA flight back to LAS from there.

 

We're quite flexible with our schedule at the start and we have fully 6 days between when we get off the Australian cruise and need to be in Singapore; spending one of those 6 flying and the others in each city. 

 

All you expert travelers are welcomed to help make our journey as painless and enjoyable as possible. We appreciate your assistance more than you know.

Edited February 7, 2023 by jsglow