Measuring COVID on board - NSW Health levels

[datone]

4 hours ago, Auscruisefam said:

but God forbid an unvaccinated person is allowed to cruise …. They might drop dead and hold up your cruise, it’s a bit far fetched.

People have always gotten ill on cruise ships from many different things.   If someone is airlifted off a ship or even ends up dying doesn't mean it is from Covid.  So many old and unhealthy people on cruise ships all the time.    Maybe these are the ones who should take boosters etc.   But is it really fair to make healthy people with no underlying conditions take jabs all the time when they are not at real risk of being seriously ill or dying from Covid - even if they are unvaccinated.

[arxcards]

On 4/1/2023 at 12:42 PM, Aussieflyer said:

I have just noticed Coral Princess has been listed as Level 2 on the NSW Cruising and COVID site - haven't seen a level 2 for quite a while. I wonder what the numbers are like and whether this is at the end of a long cruise (so any pax with COVID are likely to be still on board as opposed to short cruises where they are off before any symptoms).

Coral announced elevated levels of covid to the passengers prior to the ship arriving in Darwin, and masks were required to be worn on the ship. I figure she has been on level 2 ever since, but the report to any other state authority doesn't get added to an online page. Fair to presume she was also at about tier 2 for NT and QLD ports.

 

So yes, it was a long cruise - ended in Sydney yesterday for some, with many others staying on to complete a lap around to Fremantle.

[arxcards]

15 hours ago, Auscruisefam said:

I have only had 2 shots right at the beginning for work at the time. I haven’t had a vax in over 2 years. So technically I am unvaccinated but I can still cruise because I have a piece of paper that says I’m vaccinated. Makes zero sense.

If they are actually serious make anyone who wants to cruise have a booster within 6-9 months of cruising. 
My point is that cruises are already pretty much unvaccinated anyway. 11 and under don’t need vax, plus 5% exceptions, plus all those who never got a booster etc. 

For the life of me I will never understand this distaste towards unvaccinated people. No one seems to have an issue if someone with multiple health conditions gets on board, if they are elderly, have breathing devices, are frail, morbidly obese, have heart issue, asthma’s etc no problem but God forbid an unvaccinated person is allowed to cruise …. They might drop dead and hold up your cruise, it’s a bit far fetched.

 

 

Do you consider catching the virus counting as a booster? After all, catching rona on Majestic at the end of October, I am not advised to get another booster till 6 months after having it. By the time I am eligible, it will be nearly a year since my last boost.

 

The whole premise of restricting those that can cruise was about protecting the ship. Tier 2 of mostly vaccinated passengers might result in a couple of hospitilisations or a medevac. Tier 2 of unrestricted passengers could result in the medical facilities aboard being overwhelmed - this is purely about safety at sea, and medical gurus still say you have more chance of serious illness if you are unvaccinated. If the ship facilities are overwhelmed, they risk being unable to provide an emergency response to anything, including cardiac arrest or strokes etc. The season is almost over, and they are sure to address the restrictions that have been in place for the past year.

 

Comments above about getting a sniffle or a head cold - congratulations, the vaccine may have worked a treat or you may be naturally resilient to the bug. I wish I could say the same, having man-flu followed by 5 months of fatigue. I am otherwise a well person, but despite having the jabs, this bug has more lingering effects than anything else I have had. We only got our jabs because we thought we would need them for travel, which turned out to be true. I am glad we got them, as I would hate to think how my body would have responded to the bug without those jabs in my system. Halfway between Noumea and Sydney wouldn't be a great place to find out.

[Auscruisefam]

I won’t quote your whole post. But yes I believe in natural immunity. I’m not really going to go into the whole booster thing but for me it’s not the right decision. I work in the community and what I have seen has altered my views. Let’s leave it at that.

As for protecting the ship/medical facilities … no that’s not it. Its what the government require and the cruise lines have to follow. In the USA as soon as the government left the mandates up to the cruise lines and took their noses out of the cruising business everything started to drop within weeks. Cruise lines no longer wanted to protect the ship/medical facilities I guess…

Look I get it everyone has a different opinion and it’s fine. I don’t really care what other people do, if they have boosters, if they wear masks etc. I just don’t agree with the narrative and believe unvaccinated people pose no risk to anyone and that the protocols are pointless. 

 

[arxcards]

20 minutes ago, Auscruisefam said:

I won’t quote your whole post. But yes I believe in natural immunity. I’m not really going to go into the whole booster thing but for me it’s not the right decision. I work in the community and what I have seen has altered my views. Let’s leave it at that.

As for protecting the ship/medical facilities … no that’s not it. Its what the government require and the cruise lines have to follow. In the USA as soon as the government left the mandates up to the cruise lines and took their noses out of the cruising business everything started to drop within weeks. Cruise lines no longer wanted to protect the ship/medical facilities I guess…

Look I get it everyone has a different opinion and it’s fine. I don’t really care what other people do, if they have boosters, if they wear masks etc. I just don’t agree with the narrative and believe unvaccinated people pose no risk to anyone and that the protocols are pointless. 

 

You are correct, the ships aren't setting those rules, and they are government mandated. Read those protocols in detail though, and the whole premise is not to prevent covid aboard or any individual from contracting it, but to mitigate spread to safeguard the operation of the ship. Whether they are still relevant after 10 months of operation, probably not. The US did drop covid specific responses, but the ships still report all communicable diseases to the CDC. Their thresholds are higher than ours, and 95% of their cruises are 7 nights or less, so very different to a Coral Princess lap around Australia. Everything changed the day they stopped publishing covid specific tiers, and maybe NSW will do the same sometime soon.

 

The narrative is changing - slowly. Inconvenient for some, but a shipload better than a year ago, even navigating these boards with covid being woven through just about every possible topic. The goalposts have moved, but I don't expect the boffins to change the rules every month. Sometime soon after the seasonal ships have departed, there will be changes to those protocols which can be planned around the few remaining ships. Whether that becomes 100% unrestricted cruising (no vaxx, no RAT), who knows. Personally, I don't really care either way.

[resordanis]

1 hour ago, arxcards said:

Do you consider catching the virus counting as a booster? After all, catching rona on Majestic at the end of October, I am not advised to get another booster till 6 months after having it. By the time I am eligible, it will be nearly a year since my last boost.

 

The whole premise of restricting those that can cruise was about protecting the ship. Tier 2 of mostly vaccinated passengers might result in a couple of hospitilisations or a medevac. Tier 2 of unrestricted passengers could result in the medical facilities aboard being overwhelmed - this is purely about safety at sea, and medical gurus still say you have more chance of serious illness if you are unvaccinated. If the ship facilities are overwhelmed, they risk being unable to provide an emergency response to anything, including cardiac arrest or strokes etc. The season is almost over, and they are sure to address the restrictions that have been in place for the past year.

 

Comments above about getting a sniffle or a head cold - congratulations, the vaccine may have worked a treat or you may be naturally resilient to the bug. I wish I could say the same, having man-flu followed by 5 months of fatigue. I am otherwise a well person, but despite having the jabs, this bug has more lingering effects than anything else I have had. We only got our jabs because we thought we would need them for travel, which turned out to be true. I am glad we got them, as I would hate to think how my body would have responded to the bug without those jabs in my system. Halfway between Noumea and Sydney wouldn't be a great place to find out.

Totally agree with you! We are the same, cannot get booster again till May because of getting Covid on Majestic. We are only just getting over the fatigue and hopefully never feel that sick again. Going on Ovation this week with fingers crossed.

[Amaroo Andrew]

1 hour ago, arxcards said:

Coral announced elevated levels of covid to the passengers prior to the ship arriving in Darwin, and masks were required to be worn on the ship. I figure she has been on level 2 ever since, but the report to any other state authority doesn't get added to an online page. Fair to presume she was also at about tier 2 for NT and QLD ports.

 

So yes, it was a long cruise - ended in Sydney yesterday for some, with many others staying on to complete a lap around to Fremantle.

Everything seemed to be going well prior to Darwin on the PER-SYD cruise. The skipper got on the PA prior to Darwin and announced there was a covid outbreak and as a result all pax would be required to wear masks when indoors, no mask requirement when on open decks. There were no other restrictions.

I can't remember if it was pre or post Cairns there was another announcement reinforcing the mask wearing requirement but unannounced all the bar stools at the indoor bars were removed and there was no direct bar service indoors with any orders having to be placed via a steward or the ship's ap.

What is going to make it hard to control is there is not a complete pax turnover on Round OZ cruises. About 500 got off and on in BNE and there was probably a major turnover in SYD.

The NSW Health Advisory is not advised until 24 hrs out from the ship's arrival in a NSW port.

What was a bit disheartening was the complete lack of updated information from the ship about the current status of covid on the ship other than those two announcements in about 10 days.

I have a friend who caught covid on the ship and was confined to his cabin and his opinion from his dealings over covid was the ship's medical staff were clearly under stress coping with the scale of the outbreak, along with the normal staff keeping confined pax fed.

One staff member I spoke to at the start of the cruise prior, to the outbreak, said the ship was running short staffed as it was and the outbreak has led to a perfect storm.

Everybody was doing their best to keep the pax happy and I think they did a pretty good job. 

 

[datone]

21 hours ago, Aussieflyer said:

 

I am really in two minds about the thought of unvaccinated pax. 

Why - what are they going to give you that a vaccinated person can't?

[Amaroo Andrew]

9 minutes ago, datone said:

Why - what are they going to give you that a vaccinated person can't?

It is the luck of the draw. My friend who is up to date on his vaccinations got it. I was around him a lot before he caught it and I didn't get it. His wife who slept in the same bed as him didn't get it. Go figure!

[LittleFish1976]

1 hour ago, datone said:

Why - what are they going to give you that a vaccinated person can't?

A higher viral load.

[OzKiwiJJ]

2 hours ago, resordanis said:

Totally agree with you! We are the same, cannot get booster again till May because of getting Covid on Majestic. We are only just getting over the fatigue and hopefully never feel that sick again. Going on Ovation this week with fingers crossed.

Ditto from getting Covid on Coral, early May for me as well, but I fared better than you, thank goodness - a short bout of rebound Covid a week after disembarking and I was fine. It sounds like you have Long Covid, hopefully you will recover from the fatigue soon.

 

And that's one of the reasons I keep on with the boosters - to reduce my chances of sevete illness or Long Covid.

[OzKiwiJJ]

What saddens me is how quickly people forget the hygiene precautions including mask wearing in busy spaces. Precautions that not only reduce the risk of Covid but also colds and flu. Too many people have gone back to sharing their germs with all and sundry. Plus both of us saw people leave public toilets onboard Grand without washing their hands. Seriously! 🤬

[resordanis]

6 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

Ditto from getting Covid on Coral, early May for me as well, but I fared better than you, thank goodness - a short bout of rebound Covid a week after disembarking and I was fine. It sounds like you have Long Covid, hopefully you will recover from the fatigue soon.

 

And that's one of the reasons I keep on with the boosters - to reduce my chances of sevete illness or Long Covid.

Certainly agree. We have had all boosters but must wait 6 months since Covid to get the 5th booster.we certainly have tried and really wish we could have got it before the next cruise.

[jland]

Australia is one of the few countries left where you have to be vaccinated to get on a cruise ship. The situation is madness. We cannot live in fear forever. If people are so frighten of covid surely the best option is to stay at home. Sorry but I am so fed up and over covid, it is becoming boring. At 75 I want to enjoy what is left of my life, I won’t do that if I am constantly worried I might catch covid or some other disease.

 

[Pushka]

On 4/2/2023 at 2:31 PM, Auscruisefam said:

I have only had 2 shots right at the beginning for work at the time. I haven’t had a vax in over 2 years. So technically I am unvaccinated but I can still cruise because I have a piece of paper that says I’m vaccinated. Makes zero sense.

If they are actually serious make anyone who wants to cruise have a booster within 6-9 months of cruising. 
My point is that cruises are already pretty much unvaccinated anyway. 11 and under don’t need vax, plus 5% exceptions, plus all those who never got a booster etc. 

For the life of me I will never understand this distaste towards unvaccinated people. No one seems to have an issue if someone with multiple health conditions gets on board, if they are elderly, have breathing devices, are frail, morbidly obese, have heart issue, asthma’s etc no problem but God forbid an unvaccinated person is allowed to cruise …. They might drop dead and hold up your cruise, it’s a bit far fetched.

 

 

Given that the Oz Govt has only just now allowed people to have their fifth vaccination and for me that meant 12 months between fourth and fifth, then it's a function of what the Government allows it's citizens to have, and not up to cruise lines to specify a criteria that people can't meet.  Both husband and I caught Covid around 1-2 months after our fourth vaccination. Not on a ship. 

Edited April 3, 2023 by Pushka

[ozdevil]

1 hour ago, jland said:

Australia is one of the few countries left where you have to be vaccinated to get on a cruise ship. The situation is madness. We cannot live in fear forever. If people are so frighten of covid surely the best option is to stay at home. Sorry but I am so fed up and over covid, it is becoming boring. At 75 I want to enjoy what is left of my life, I won’t do that if I am constantly worried I might catch covid or some other disease.

 

while i agree we should start to live with covid   but on cruise ship its hard to Avoid people   specially when you have 1000's of passengers on board.

i believe people should use common sense themselves  and get tested if coming with flu like systems to protect others and isolate themselves no matter how hard it is to avoid the fun of a holiday.  so others  dont have to come down with a flu or covid  

its now should be common sense  and 1st nature to people to do the right thing, rather then be  selfish  and continue as normal....    get flu like symptom - test   if tested positive dont go   if tested while on holiday  you isolate and keep the community safe  it your responsibility having the  shocking disease as much as the cruise company or Airline company to help keep others safe from covid

thats not living in fear thats living  in keeping other safe from covid

 

[OzKiwiJJ]

I'd happily see the vaccination rule dropped as long as all passengers wear masks when moving around the ship, in theatres and other crowded venues ie trivia and bingo, on tenders and excursion buses, and get tested if they develop symptoms. That way the spread of Covid and any other respiratory illnesses would be minimised. I'm sure, like me, that many other regular cruisers have caught the dreaded cruise cough or a cold or even flu while on a cruise in the past. It's a pity we didn't get into the habit of wearing masks years ago instead of spreading germs all over the place. 

[Aussieflyer]

I did not intend this thread to get into the rights and wrongs of vaccinated pax when I made the original post. It was more an observation that Level 2 hadn't been seen for a long while and wondering why. 

My ambivalence on non vaxxed passengers comes from the unknown - given high initial vax rates for Australia I don't think there would be a high number where it is domestic cruisers mainly. I am 5th vaxxed but know that the requirement is for 2 vaccinations -and really I am not sure how much that immunity would remain. 

As noted by others, the requirement has been from the AU Govt - when this changes it will be the catalyst for cruise lines. I think the govt was (and is) very nervous after the early covid outbreaks on cruise ships.

 

[LittleFish1976]

13 minutes ago, Aussieflyer said:

I did not intend this thread to get into the rights and wrongs of vaccinated pax when I made the original post. It was more an observation that Level 2 hadn't been seen for a long while and wondering why. 

My ambivalence on non vaxxed passengers comes from the unknown - given high initial vax rates for Australia I don't think there would be a high number where it is domestic cruisers mainly. I am 5th vaxxed but know that the requirement is for 2 vaccinations -and really I am not sure how much that immunity would remain. 

As noted by others, the requirement has been from the AU Govt - when this changes it will be the catalyst for cruise lines. I think the govt was (and is) very nervous after the early covid outbreaks on cruise ships.

 

 

Cunard requires a basic course of vaccination plus at least one booster, regardless of which country it is sailing from. So some cruise lines have higher requirements coming from them than just the basic two, and in excess of the requirements of the Australian government (if that's where the requirement comes from - I don't know that, personally).

[korky1]

Unless we live in dream-world, we all know that cruising is a unique experience in that we are a group of thousands of people who are all going to be living and intermingling with each other for usually at least a week and quite often for a lot longer.   My husband and I have done 45 cruises since 2009, the shortest being for 8 days and longest 28 days.

Therefore, we know thrre is always a chance of catching narovirus, cold, flu and now covid, regardless of whatever precautions we do or don't take to lower our chances.

Like everything else in life, we all have different levels of risks we are willing to take.  My husband and I are happy with the minimum preventative measures of regular hand washing or sanitising.  Other people prefer to also wear masks and face shields.   Some people may no longer feel comfortable about cruising and may decide to no longer cruise at all  The good thing is we can all make our own decisions.   Our nest cruise is  12 nights on Carnival in late May.  Very much looking forward to it.

I wish you all many wonderful cruises in the future with many great memories and new friendships on board.

[Relaxing Robbies]

16 hours ago, arxcards said:

Coral announced elevated levels of covid to the passengers prior to the ship arriving in Darwin, and masks were required to be worn on the ship. I figure she has been on level 2 ever since, but the report to any other state authority doesn't get added to an online page. Fair to presume she was also at about tier 2 for NT and QLD ports.

 

So yes, it was a long cruise - ended in Sydney yesterday for some, with many others staying on to complete a lap around to Fremantle.

We were on this cruise and disembarked in Sydney on Sunday. Coral reported Tier 2 after 500 passengers disembarked in Brisbane, including some positive cases. Who knows what the tier would have been if those 500 passengers had not been replaced by 500 newbies. There were also a similar number of passengers who disembarked in Sydney.  I did not walk many hallways, but there were certainly many covid tables on Baja mid to aft locations, and also reports of positive staff. Staff wore masks for the entire cruise. Masks for passengers were not required initially.

 

I wonder whether the multiple embarkation points of some Princess cruises contributes to the seemingly higher number of positive cases that Princess has reported this season. The Grand has had many cruises this year with embarkations in Melbourne or Adelaide, and Coral has done longer cruises with embarkations in Sydney or Brisbane. These cruises mean that the ship does have a higher number of continuing passengers and does not return to a mostly clean newbie passenger status as often.

[arxcards]

6 hours ago, Relaxing Robbies said:

We were on this cruise and disembarked in Sydney on Sunday. Coral reported Tier 2 after 500 passengers disembarked in Brisbane, including some positive cases. Who knows what the tier would have been if those 500 passengers had not been replaced by 500 newbies. There were also a similar number of passengers who disembarked in Sydney.  I did not walk many hallways, but there were certainly many covid tables on Baja mid to aft locations, and also reports of positive staff. Staff wore masks for the entire cruise. Masks for passengers were not required initially.

 

I wonder whether the multiple embarkation points of some Princess cruises contributes to the seemingly higher number of positive cases that Princess has reported this season. The Grand has had many cruises this year with embarkations in Melbourne or Adelaide, and Coral has done longer cruises with embarkations in Sydney or Brisbane. These cruises mean that the ship does have a higher number of continuing passengers and does not return to a mostly clean newbie passenger status as often.

We have friends that are doing a full lap from Freo, and they are otherwise still having a great time. A bit more distant from social media, they were shocked with the initial covid announcement.

 

I am not so sure if the multiple embarkation points change things too much, but it doesn't help. So many are doing B2B's this season, so it is rare to embark with a full fresh load of passengers and the crew are a constant as well. 

[capriccio]

We embarked the Coral Princess on Sunday for the round trip Australia cruise.  We were notified in advance that all had to be masked at embarkation.  We were all asked to provide written proof of our vaccinations and attest to our submitted rapid antigen test results.  My sister and brother in law mistakenly took their tests 12 hours or so too early.  The app accepted them but it was flagged at check in and they were administered tests on site.  All handled very efficiently and kindly.

 

It wasn’t until we were in our cabins that we found out - via a letter from the captain - that masks were required everywhere inside except when eating or drinking, and always upon embarking and disembarking, on Princess transportation, and inside when on Princess excursions.  It my totally unscientific survey on Dolphin deck starboard side when walking the entire length of the corridor (our cabin is far aft) I’ve only seen 1 small table outside a cabin.

 

All six people in our party have commented on how pleasantly surprised we have been at the high level of full compliance (wearing the mask correctly).  
 

While it would have been nice for mask wearing not to be a necessity, it hasn’t diminished our enjoyment of this bucket list visit one iota.  We are having a grand time, loving the cruise, this beautiful country, and it’s inhabitants.

[sewgood]

Off the Majestic this week from the round Australia cruise and the cabins that had passengers with covid inside didn't have the tables outside. They only had to put them outside briefly when the meals were delivered then had to put them back inside after they got their meals.

But you could tell the cabins by the red garbage bags outside (I guess their wet towels and maybe dirty sheets) and the extra large food menus hung from their door handles.

[sewgood]

12 minutes ago, capriccio said:

We are having a grand time, loving the cruise, this beautiful country, and it’s inhabitants.

 

What a positive attitude you have for life. Wishing you great weather and calm seas for your cruise.