To “Tip or Not to”

[CDNPolar]

On 5/19/2023 at 3:15 AM, Mrs Miggins said:

Interestingly this topic spread to the Azamara  board (many like and use both companies) and it has been closed down by the Host Jazzbeau because Azamara say Leave your checkbook behind. All gratuities are included in your cruise fare.

 

 

Pardon me, but I think you indicated on a previous page that being from UK, the gratuity is included in your overall fare, and that would mean to me two things:

 

1). You do NOT see an additional charge on your cabin folio at the end of the cruise, and

2). Like me, being from Canada, and having the amount added at the end of the cruise, you also have the ability to say you don't want to pay the gratuity?  Does Viking state the amount of gratuity included in your fare and give you the option to not pay this?

 

I think that this would be unfair pricing strategy if the UK an amount baked in that cannot be removed, but US and Canada Viking guests and opt not to pay the auto gratuity?

 

 

[CDNPolar]

... and this has been discussed up and down and right and left many times...

 

There are statements in this discussion that crew are saying that they don't receive any additional tips or gratuities, but that it is just part of their contracted pay package.

 

It has also been said here that crew are under non-disclosure on this topic and are not allowed to discuss this with us...  not to say that someone would not share.

 

The fact is that I emailed Viking and asked very direct questions to which I got a phone call back where they refused (politely quoting policy or no knowledge) to answer my direct questions.  They would only state that the gratuities were distributed.

 

I have very strong opinions on this subject, which my partner does not share....

 

If you tell me that this is a Gratuity that is optional and I can pay or remove it, then I would think that it is logical that I might understand, if I ask, how it is distributed.

 

If it is part of the salary package that is a contract rate that does not change whether I pay this or not, then don't put a veil over this by calling it a gratuity.  Call it a service charge, but I don't know when or where service charges are optional.

 

There is probably a very small percentage of people that don't pay it so Viking are collecting this additional revenue stream all the while misleading us.

 

Why do I care so much about this?

 

Because many of the crew are from countries where - IMO - they are being taken advantage of by cruise lines.  I am NOT saying that Viking is taking advantage.  I am saying that this is a very low cost employee to the cruise ship.  

 

My company has vast operations in the Philippines, and I know the economy there and what people don't have there that makes these jobs very attractive.  These attractive jobs however require them to be away from home, and family for months and while away they are working 7 days a week for the entire contract.  Yes, they. are making more than they could at home, but still not enough, IMO.

 

If you tell me that this is a GRATUITY, then I want to know that what I am paying is benefiting every person on the ship, and if you cannot tell me that then unfortunately I will stop paying the "optional" and give to the people that I see and know that I am benefiting them directly.

 

We have a cruise in August.  It remains to be seen if my partner will agree with me, but my intent is to use what would be paid on the auto gratuity to crew directly and just say no to the amount added to the bill.

[Mrs Miggins]

What is the tipping policy?

From the Program Director and Hotel Manager to restaurant servers and housekeeping, the onboard staff is dedicated to serving you. Gratuities are included on board. Any additional tipping is at your discretion; should you choose to tip your local guides and drivers, we recommend tipping at the end of each tour in cash. Most restaurants include service in their prices, and it’s customary to round up generously for good service.

 

The above is from the UK site

 

What is the tipping policy?

Our onboard staff is dedicated to providing you with the best cruise experience possible, and it is customary to give gratuities in recognition of their service. How much you choose to tip is a personal matter and completely at your discretion. To save you worry over whom to tip and how much, we automatically add a discretionary hotel and dining charge of $17.00 USD per guest per day to your shipboard account, which appears on your final invoice at the end of your cruise. This charge will be shared among the onboard staff who helped support and provide your cruise experience, including the waitstaff, stateroom stewards, buffet stewards, galley staff, laundry staff and others. Please note this charge excludes bar gratuity; a 15% gratuity is automatically added to bar, beverage, wine and deck service tabs. Should you wish to make changes to the gratuity amounts or pay in cash, stop by Guest Services at any time. You may also wish to tip your local excursion guides and/or drivers; we suggest doing so in cash at the end of each tour. For your convenience, you can pre-purchase gratuities at our standard recommended rate in My Viking Journey. This charge will be shared among the onboard staff who helped support and provide for your cruise experience, including your Program Director, waitstaff, stateroom stewards, galley staff, nautical staff and others.

 

The above is from the Viking.com site.

 

Therefore in the UK we are not told specifically how much per day the included  'gratuities' are.  I have never tried to remove that cost.  

 

I am interested to learn that both Duquephart and CDNPolar have partners who apparently disapprove of their stance on the policy.

 

Speaking from experience if my DH doesn't really want to make these decisions or indeed on anything controversial then the buck is always passed to me.  I don't mind at all since I am always right as he readily agrees.

[duquephart]

"I am interested to learn that both Duquephart and CDNPolar have partners who apparently disapprove of their stance on the policy."

Where do you get that from?

[CCWineLover]

2 hours ago, Mrs Miggins said:

This charge will be shared among the onboard staff who helped support and provide for your cruise experience, including your Program Director, waitstaff, stateroom stewards, galley staff, nautical staff and others.

From your Viking material.  Interesting that Viking states in writing that the gratuity charge is shared with staff and lists examples, but does not say if this is an “extra” tip or benefit to them above and beyond their “regular” pay.

[BootsyGhost]

On 5/18/2023 at 11:51 AM, duquephart said:

We are very good tippers, and have always tipped stewards and favorite bartenders above and beyond. This is due, in part, to the fact that my wife:

     1. Is very American 

     2. Was a drunken sailor in a previous life

     3. Is in charge of tipping

Not the person you asked, but I suspect this post was the basis for the comment.

[duquephart]

9 minutes ago, BootsyGhost said:

Not the person you asked, but I suspect this post was the basis for the comment.

 

The relevance escapes me. Care to explain?

[Mrs Miggins]

35 minutes ago, BootsyGhost said:

Not the person you asked, but I suspect this post was the basis for the comment.

Exactly. It was great to read an unexpected and apparently lighthearted response to this thread.

Point no 3 says my wife “is in charge of tipping “

Just to clarify  the last paragraph in my previous reply is also supposed to be lighthearted 

Obviously a case of my UK sense of humour being misunderstood on the other side of the pond.

 

[duquephart]

Ah.

[JeffElizabeth]

On 5/18/2023 at 11:36 AM, duquephart said:

 

I have "strong feelings" about any entity that is not upfront in it's pricing. How many first time Viking customers are surprised/distressed to find out that they have not yet paid all that they are expected to pay? Viking would do well to asterisk their published fares.

Agree totally! So tired of resort fees, service charges, and luggage payments.  Just give me the total up front. We have our first Viking cruise next year and one of the reasons we picked Viking was no nickel and dimeing.  

[duquephart]

23 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

 

Pardon me, but I think you indicated on a previous page that being from UK, the gratuity is included in your overall fare, and that would mean to me two things:

 

1). You do NOT see an additional charge on your cabin folio at the end of the cruise, and

2). Like me, being from Canada, and having the amount added at the end of the cruise, you also have the ability to say you don't want to pay the gratuity?  Does Viking state the amount of gratuity included in your fare and give you the option to not pay this?

 

I think that this would be unfair pricing strategy if the UK an amount baked in that cannot be removed, but US and Canada Viking guests and opt not to pay the auto gratuity?

 

 

 

Interesting. Do the folks who have this fee included in their fare have the option of having it removed?

[duquephart]

23 hours ago, CDNPolar said:

... and this has been discussed up and down and right and left many times...

 

There are statements in this discussion that crew are saying that they don't receive any additional tips or gratuities, but that it is just part of their contracted pay package.

 

It has also been said here that crew are under non-disclosure on this topic and are not allowed to discuss this with us...  not to say that someone would not share.

 

The fact is that I emailed Viking and asked very direct questions to which I got a phone call back where they refused (politely quoting policy or no knowledge) to answer my direct questions.  They would only state that the gratuities were distributed.

 

I have very strong opinions on this subject, which my partner does not share....

 

If you tell me that this is a Gratuity that is optional and I can pay or remove it, then I would think that it is logical that I might understand, if I ask, how it is distributed.

 

If it is part of the salary package that is a contract rate that does not change whether I pay this or not, then don't put a veil over this by calling it a gratuity.  Call it a service charge, but I don't know when or where service charges are optional.

 

There is probably a very small percentage of people that don't pay it so Viking are collecting this additional revenue stream all the while misleading us.

 

Why do I care so much about this?

 

Because many of the crew are from countries where - IMO - they are being taken advantage of by cruise lines.  I am NOT saying that Viking is taking advantage.  I am saying that this is a very low cost employee to the cruise ship.  

 

My company has vast operations in the Philippines, and I know the economy there and what people don't have there that makes these jobs very attractive.  These attractive jobs however require them to be away from home, and family for months and while away they are working 7 days a week for the entire contract.  Yes, they. are making more than they could at home, but still not enough, IMO.

 

If you tell me that this is a GRATUITY, then I want to know that what I am paying is benefiting every person on the ship, and if you cannot tell me that then unfortunately I will stop paying the "optional" and give to the people that I see and know that I am benefiting them directly.

 

We have a cruise in August.  It remains to be seen if my partner will agree with me, but my intent is to use what would be paid on the auto gratuity to crew directly and just say no to the amount added to the bill.

 

It remains pretty clear that if one wishes "gratuities" to go directly to the foks who provide him/her services on a particular cruise one must do so by distributing cash out of his/her own pocket without regard to whatever Viking is up to. Note that nobody is "left out" under this scenario because they still get the same level of "gratuity" that Viking provides via their secret distribution scheme. The person who chooses to opt out of the "gratuity" scam is simply signalling that he/she understands the reality of the situation and is unwilling to participate in Viking's shenanigan. For those readying their slings and arrows ----- no, I am not an "opt out" person - not yet. But I may well become one and will, at that point, provide at least the same level of "gratuity" as I do currently to the company slush fund. As stated earlier I am getting to where I feel no obligation to be upfront with a company which is not upfront with me.

Edited May 21, 2023 by duquephart

[duquephart]

15 hours ago, JeffElizabeth said:

Agree totally! So tired of resort fees, service charges, and luggage payments.  Just give me the total up front. We have our first Viking cruise next year and one of the reasons we picked Viking was no nickel and dimeing.  

 

Yeah. A $45 ticket to a MLB game cost me $60 (convenience fee, processing fee, etc.). Boils my blood.

[Squawkman]

On our Viking Med cruise last fall, we gave a cash tip to our room steward who told us it wasn’t necessary because his tips were included in the billed gratuities (we insisted he take the cash). On a Viking river cruise in 2017, i offered a tip to the cruise director as, in addition to great service, she helped in resolving a problem we had with a Viking excursion. She refused, saying her tip was included (we had paid gratuities included in this cruise) and did not take the cash.
 

There is this buffet restaurant we go to that instituted a 10% service charge shared by bus persons a number of years back because they wanted to assure tips were distributed fairly - and they asked patrons not to leave cash tips on the table. Like many buffets, you pay up front - and you cannot decline the service charge.

 

Based on Viking’s explanation and Jim Avery’s post, billed gratuities are shared but not delineated when they get paid - nor is the amount of pay changed by gratuities collected during sailings. Three things we don’t know: how Viking accounts for tips distributed to staff; is the amount ultimately distributed to staff is less if many cruisers request to have gratuities removed from their accounts; and if gratuities are included as a booking perk, does Viking add that amount to the gratuities account.

 

Given the excellent service we have experienced during our 8 past Viking ocean and river cruises, we will continue to pay billed gratuities and also give cash tips when warranted. I won’t second guess Viking - but I do think gratuities should be included for all cruises - not just a perk for some.

[Mrs Miggins]

Just as an aside, in the UK published cruise fares include taxes and port fees.  Therefore in common with gratuities the charges are not listed separately  Viking UK prices also include air transportation and transfers.  

 

Viking advertise extensively in the UK but the proportion of UK cruisers onboard remains low.

[Mackdogmolly]

14 minutes ago, Mrs Miggins said:

Viking advertise extensively in the UK but the proportion of UK cruisers onboard remains low.

I wonder why?

[Hockeyump]

If you compare the number of adults in the UK to the number in the USA you'll see why!

[duquephart]

2 hours ago, Mrs Miggins said:

Just as an aside, in the UK published cruise fares include taxes and port fees.  Therefore in common with gratuities the charges are not listed separately  Viking UK prices also include air transportation and transfers.  

 

Viking advertise extensively in the UK but the proportion of UK cruisers onboard remains low.

 

What about those who prefer booking their own air? 

[KBs mum]

1 hour ago, duquephart said:

 

What about those who prefer booking their own air? 

Ask for a quote without air, or specify which flights or upgrade required and pay the difference. We don't have Viking air, or Viking Air +

Edited May 21, 2023 by KBs mum

[KBs mum]

3 hours ago, Mackdogmolly said:

I wonder why?

All inclusive is a negative in the UK, also we aren't generally a nation keen on cruises. They are generally associated with Carnival mass market and similar. 

[Mrs Miggins]

I have only used Viking in the Mediterranean but posters on this board in the past have said that the credit offered is minimal and therefore they have used the offered short haul flights.

Friends did the Transatlantic from San Juan to Barcelona using Viking arranged flights a couple of months ago.   There were problems in the transit airport of Madrid where the aircraft went technical.  There were only a group of about 12 from the UK.  The party included a Viking Speaker and his partner who managed to herd the group together and get them through the local chaos to an hotel then back to the airport next day.  Viking Emergency telephone number proved to be no help at all.

[Mrs Miggins]

20 minutes ago, KBs mum said:

All inclusive is a negative in the UK, also we aren't generally a nation keen on cruises. They are generally associated with Carnival mass market and similar. 

I don't agree with the above in relation to cruises.  Most of the 'premium' cruise lines are all inclusive.

I do not think Carnival would not be high on the list of popular cruise lines for those in the UK.  

 

[Mrs Miggins]

26 minutes ago, Mrs Miggins said:

I don't agree with the above in relation to cruises.  Most of the 'premium' cruise lines are all inclusive.

I do not think Carnival would not be high on the list of popular cruise lines for those in the UK.  

 

Sorry for the double negative !

[KBs mum]

22 minutes ago, Mrs Miggins said:

I don't agree with the above in relation to cruises.  Most of the 'premium' cruise lines are all inclusive.

I do not think Carnival would not be high on the list of popular cruise lines for those in the UK.  

 

The premium cruise lines are not considered to be superior for most (for those who are neutral about cruising) if the choice is a cruise or independent. 

When we mention cruising as a holiday most mention mass market big ship type things as a reason to avoid cruises at all costs

[zalusky]

I don't object to tips although I think they should be billed up front.   I don't like giving tips directly to people.  I much prefer they receive anonymously and not know from whom they received them.