Joy revitalization speculation

[Mandalay5]

14 minutes ago, BirdTravels said:

They Joy has way too many Haven rooms for the facility since they reclassified the regular suites to Haven. 

I totally agree with you-it will be interesting to see what changes with the update

[Pitzel]

Adding studio rooms would be a good add, but I don’t think they are going to do that with balcony space. More likely, these will go back to being suites, though perhaps not Haven suites. It gives NCL an opportunity for premium revenue for the bigger, nicer rooms without having to provide too many additional perks. 

[hallux]

29 minutes ago, Pitzel said:

Adding studio rooms would be a good add, but I don’t think they are going to do that with balcony space

They wouldn't, but maybe move the family cabins that in the space the Studios occupy on other ships into that space (making them balcony rooms) and then build studio cabins in the inside space.

[Destaw71835]

20 hours ago, unionhall said:

We were just on the Joy and had dinner with an officer. Some of the changes they told us were The Galaxy arcade is going to be a thermal spa and they are adding 24 cabins to part of the observation lounge. I really liked all the space that was in the lounge but I guess they need to up the revenue. They also talked about the changes the Joy went through when it came back from sailing in China. There used to be a lot of high end stores on it, three casinos, the Social was a casino and there was real Bermuda grass on the pool deck and a live tree in the middle of the deck. The brew house was a tea room.Another really interesting story was none of the cabins end with the number 4 because in Asia it is considered unlucky. Even in the theater the seat numbers skip over 4. 

This ship already feels overcrowded and now NCL is planning to take space away from the Observation Lounge. Shame.

[ChiefMateJRK]

On 6/2/2023 at 8:07 PM, unionhall said:

We were just on the Joy and had dinner with an officer. Some of the changes they told us were The Galaxy arcade is going to be a thermal spa and they are adding 24 cabins to part of the observation lounge. I really liked all the space that was in the lounge but I guess they need to up the revenue.

I find this report highly suspect.  No officer in their right mind would share this type of information over the table at a dinner with officers.

[scooter6139]

While it doesn't appear to be as long as the last 2019 remodel, 24 days is plenty of time to redo a lot on that ship.  I would hate to lose any space in the OL, but NCL does need the money it would generate.  BUT I can see them getting rid of that stupid waste of space called Galaxy Pavilion.

 

"Work began on the ship's transformation in March 2019, as the ship sailed from China to Singapore for a 21-day dry dock,^[30] continued through the transpacific crossing,^[31] and ended in late-April 2019 after a five-day wet dock upon arriving in Seattle"

[Pens fan]

I really hope the rumor of taking away part of the OL for additional cabins is not true.  We sailed on the Joy in October and the ship was only about 60% capacity.  Yet the OL was often packed.  Our cabin was just around the corner from it and we got into the habit of stopping in for a coffee after a day in port.  We always just took it back to our cabin balcony as there were very few seats available.  I can only imagine what it would have been like on a completely full ship. 

 

Reducing the size of the OL seems very short  sighted to me.

[Pitzel]

10 hours ago, Pens fan said:

I really hope the rumor of taking away part of the OL for additional cabins is not true.  We sailed on the Joy in October and the ship was only about 60% capacity.  Yet the OL was often packed.  Our cabin was just around the corner from it and we got into the habit of stopping in for a coffee after a day in port.  We always just took it back to our cabin balcony as there were very few seats available.  I can only imagine what it would have been like on a completely full ship. 

 

Reducing the size of the OL seems very short  sighted to me.

Originally, the OL was the “Concierge Lounge” and was only for Concierge Class suites. I wonder if they would limit access to it again if it becomes smaller (perhaps for the non-Haven suites). 

[Sigyn]

On 6/9/2023 at 12:00 AM, ChiefMateJRK said:

I find this report highly suspect.  No officer in their right mind would share this type of information over the table at a dinner with officers.

Yes, they would. There's always a chatty person in any group that says things they shouldn't, not realizing it might be shared on a community cruise group. I spent over two decades as a reporter and you wouldn't believe the things people told me that they shouldn't. Even knowing I was a reporter with an audience of millions. 

[CWMixer]

FWIW: this is a deck plan showing for a mock booking on a 2025 sailing: no new rooms in the current OL area.  If they're actually investing in new rooms it seems odd they'd not be trying to sell them already.

 

[JandC_Cruising]

On 6/9/2023 at 12:02 PM, scooter6139 said:

While it doesn't appear to be as long as the last 2019 remodel, 24 days is plenty of time to redo a lot on that ship.  I would hate to lose any space in the OL, but NCL does need the money it would generate.  BUT I can see them getting rid of that stupid waste of space called Galaxy Pavilion.

Put us in the camp of CHEERING for the idea of closing down Galaxy Pavilion and building out a Thermal Suite.   The lack of a Thermal Suite is the one shortcoming of the Joy.  I would think that the revenue generated through that feature would be greater than that of the Galaxy Pavilion, but obviously that's just a guess.  I would expect they re-classify a bunch of cabins to be "Spa Cabins" without any modifications to those cabins.

The flip side is that the cost of operation of the Thermal Suite is likely greater than that of GP.. 

[ChiefMateJRK]

3 hours ago, Sigyn said:

Yes, they would. There's always a chatty person in any group that says things they shouldn't, not realizing it might be shared on a community cruise group. I spent over two decades as a reporter and you wouldn't believe the things people told me that they shouldn't. Even knowing I was a reporter with an audience of millions. 

Yes, but this is a ship's officer, not the FNG.

[dexddd]

On 6/9/2023 at 12:33 PM, Pens fan said:

I really hope the rumor of taking away part of the OL for additional cabins is not true.  We sailed on the Joy in October and the ship was only about 60% capacity.  Yet the OL was often packed.  Our cabin was just around the corner from it and we got into the habit of stopping in for a coffee after a day in port.  We always just took it back to our cabin balcony as there were very few seats available.  I can only imagine what it would have been like on a completely full ship. 

 

Reducing the size of the OL seems very short  sighted to me.

Maybe maybe not.  Sensitive subject.  They did that to Dawn and Star around 2011.  Never saw them too busy before change but the newer ships seem more popular.  

 

Yes, lost public space but added forward facing and side suites plus inside rooms.  For the line, much more revenue from rooms than folks sleeping or reading in there.

[ChiefMateJRK]

27 minutes ago, dexddd said:

Yes, lost public space but added forward facing and side suites plus inside rooms.  For the line, much more revenue from rooms than folks sleeping or reading in there.

Not necessarily.  I won't book a ship without a nice OL.  That's less revenue, not more.

[mking8288]

2 hours ago, dexddd said:

Maybe maybe not.  Sensitive subject ... did that to Dawn and Star around 2011.  Never saw them too busy before change but the newer ships seem more popular.  (Shrinking) public space but add  ... side suites plus inside rooms ... more revenue from rooms than folks sleeping or reading in there.

Here, edited & fixed it with my nickel's worth, for your thoughts (not convenience, LOL.)  Too bad, NCL doesn't believe in the notion of inviting focus groups aside from their own ... still shaking my head on the reported PWA attempted takeover of the Prima's OL.  Validated our reasons to twice cancelled our 2 rooms sailing on her earlier this year, despite the rest of the gangs going and not-so-positive feedback from them about the small & poor use of limited public space, dining, etc.  

 

Depending on where NCL is going to seasonally homeport the Joy in 2025 & beyond, especially in colder climate, the complete loss of the OL would not be good, but she was originally designed differently for their hopeful China market, which bottomed up poorly, very badly as I called them 5+ years ago, without a good market analysis ( ... Shanghai's shipyard just launched their own mega 140,000 ton Adora Magic City ship, state of the art tech innovation while NCL is still frozen in time, sadly)  Was just looking at MSC this morning about their cabin design with the basics, impressed ... one of these days. 

 

We're on the Joy twice in 2022 and had a good look at the balconies and the Family 2 BR (inside) "suite" which we saw lost opportunities ... and the latest round of staffing cutback aren't going to reverse it, despite the increased fees & charges.  Compare to NCL mega ship's atrium lobbies, the OL still remained not "that" crowded as a whole - and we spend a good deal of time on Deck 15, not far from the OL, our favorite hangout and the place for afternoon snacks & "tea" - but for the evenings, clearly under-utilized with the action elsewhere with dining & shows.  IMHO, restoring a # of "suites" with clearly defined perks & (non-Haven ??) perks could be a good selling basis when the plumbing, electricals and sectional structure capped but in place ... give the contractors a good 4 to 8 weeks, can be done.  Studio cabins is another possibility, not just plain "Insides" ... or, perhaps - add some "accessible family cabins" - I see possibilities, speaking strictly with the "corporate" hats on, not as a "critic" per se.  Will go with the notion of getting rid of the Galaxy P. in consideration of a thermal suite ... maybe, reclassify some of the nearby cabins as spa balconies too = $$$ 

 

There are lots of Haven designations on this ship already, adding more isn't necessary a good thing, unless they can reformulate and balance out the expected high level of services for those premium bookings, or else, will have to resort to discounting and playing the bidding games.  They can preserve the bulk of the OL, add some cabins, relocate the "entrances" into the lounge and even section it as a multi-function venues for the "public"   There are other "public" space that NCL can re-consider, including the vast & wasted real estate dedicated to shopping & duty-free (true also on the Epic) and maybe that's where they can share/allocate exhibition space to Park West to promote over-priced duty-free artwork, etc.  FDR is gone and at most, collecting his consulting fees - Harry and company should, and, need to think outside the box to map the corporate strategy ahead, and figure things ... fully booked ships sailing at 105% double occupancies are great if they can manage to keep most campers happy. 

 

Lately, it's not easy to see clear examples of NCL crews and officers going above & beyond ... I know, the biased audience here on CC is just the 5 percentile.  BTW, there is nothing to stop NCL from starting the pre dry-dock work while a ship is reposition doing the pond crossings - that'll easily give them another 10+ days as thing get underway, easily done by blocking out some cabins (and, do that early enough to not seriously annoy and piss off cruisers that planned their trips way ahead)   

Edited June 11, 2023 by mking8288

[uneamie]

12 hours ago, Sigyn said:

Yes, they would. There's always a chatty person in any group that says things they shouldn't, not realizing it might be shared on a community cruise group. I spent over two decades as a reporter and you wouldn't believe the things people told me that they shouldn't. Even knowing I was a reporter with an audience of millions. 

Hmm....so what would be the "good reason" not to share this information. I can't come up with one. 

[uneamie]

6 hours ago, mking8288 said:

Here, edited & fixed it with my nickel's worth, for your thoughts (not convenience, LOL.)  Too bad, NCL doesn't believe in the notion of inviting focus groups aside from their own ... still shaking my head on the reported PWA attempted takeover of the Prima's OL.  Validated our reasons to twice cancelled our 2 rooms sailing on her earlier this year, despite the rest of the gangs going and not-so-positive feedback from them about the small & poor use of limited public space, dining, etc.  

 

Depending on where NCL is going to seasonally homeport the Joy in 2025 & beyond, especially in colder climate, the complete loss of the OL would not be good, but she was originally designed differently for their hopeful China market, which bottomed up poorly, very badly as I called them 5+ years ago, without a good market analysis ( ... Shanghai's shipyard just launched their own mega 140,000 ton Adora Magic City ship, state of the art tech innovation while NCL is still frozen in time, sadly)  Was just looking at MSC this morning about their cabin design with the basics, impressed ... one of these days. 

 

We're on the Joy twice in 2022 and had a good look at the balconies and the Family 2 BR (inside) "suite" which we saw lost opportunities ... and the latest round of staffing cutback aren't going to reverse it, despite the increased fees & charges.  Compare to NCL mega ship's atrium lobbies, the OL still remained not "that" crowded as a whole - and we spend a good deal of time on Deck 15, not far from the OL, our favorite hangout and the place for afternoon snacks & "tea" - but for the evenings, clearly under-utilized with the action elsewhere with dining & shows.  IMHO, restoring a # of "suites" with clearly defined perks & (non-Haven ??) perks could be a good selling basis when the plumbing, electricals and sectional structure capped but in place ... give the contractors a good 4 to 8 weeks, can be done.  Studio cabins is another possibility, not just plain "Insides" ... or, perhaps - add some "accessible family cabins" - I see possibilities, speaking strictly with the "corporate" hats on, not as a "critic" per se.  Will go with the notion of getting rid of the Galaxy P. in consideration of a thermal suite ... maybe, reclassify some of the nearby cabins as spa balconies too = $$$ 

 

There are lots of Haven designations on this ship already, adding more isn't necessary a good thing, unless they can reformulate and balance out the expected high level of services for those premium bookings, or else, will have to resort to discounting and playing the bidding games.  They can preserve the bulk of the OL, add some cabins, relocate the "entrances" into the lounge and even section it as a multi-function venues for the "public"   There are other "public" space that NCL can re-consider, including the vast & wasted real estate dedicated to shopping & duty-free (true also on the Epic) and maybe that's where they can share/allocate exhibition space to Park West to promote over-priced duty-free artwork, etc.  FDR is gone and at most, collecting his consulting fees - Harry and company should, and, need to think outside the box to map the corporate strategy ahead, and figure things ... fully booked ships sailing at 105% double occupancies are great if they can manage to keep most campers happy. 

 

Lately, it's not easy to see clear examples of NCL crews and officers going above & beyond ... I know, the biased audience here on CC is just the 5 percentile.  BTW, there is nothing to stop NCL from starting the pre dry-dock work while a ship is reposition doing the pond crossings - that'll easily give them another 10+ days as thing get underway, easily done by blocking out some cabins (and, do that early enough to not seriously annoy and piss off cruisers that planned their trips way ahead)   

Since we are booked for June 2 2024 in a Penthouse Suite and booked it before we knew that all the concierge amenities and perks have been taken away.....we'd love to see them put more of these cabin in and add back some of the perks to attract customers and to justify the hefy price for a Penthouse that currantly is without perks.....that's my hope. 

[bjtravelnews]

Sailing on the Joy in June of 2024.  What are the chances the transformations will be completed by that time?  Really love this ship!  I hope they don't take too much space from the Observation Lounge.  Was on the Prima and that OL is way too small!   I was very disappointed in the space there.

 

[hallux]

10 minutes ago, bjtravelnews said:

Really love this ship!  I hope they don't take too much space from the Observation Lounge

No space reallocation is definitive.  The first post says the drydock is in January/February so the chances are excellent that any changes will be complete by the time you sail.

[Sigyn]

On 6/11/2023 at 1:01 PM, ChiefMateJRK said:

Yes, but this is a ship's officer, not the FNG.

I've interviewed everyone from a ship's officer and a cruise line CEO to a US First Lady, John F. Kennedy Jr., John Travolta and Margaret Thatcher. Many people say a few extra things without realizing it. Margaret Thatcher didn't, of course. But then Scotland Yard was standing next to us. 

[ChiefMateJRK]

13 minutes ago, Sigyn said:

I've interviewed everyone from a ship's officer and a cruise line CEO to a US First Lady, John F. Kennedy Jr., John Travolta and Margaret Thatcher. Many people say a few extra things without realizing it. Margaret Thatcher didn't, of course. But then Scotland Yard was standing next to us. 

Well, I guess we'll know a year from now when the Joy either does or doesn't have a shrunken OL.😎

[unionhall]

Chief Mate JRK why do you find my post  highly suspect? I had just sailed the Joy when I read the post about the refurbishment question. Before the dinner I had no idea the ship was going into dry dock. The topic was bought up by the officer. She has been on the ship since it went into service. Two days after the dinner we were invited to a party in the Brew House attended by a lot of the senior officers. We had another conversation with a different officer about the changes coming after drydock. He said the same thing about cabins being put back in part of the OL. Interestingly CWMixer the deck plan you showed doesn’t have the two bathrooms that are currently at the front of  the  OL entrance.

[ChiefMateJRK]

10 minutes ago, unionhall said:

Chief Mate JRK why do you find my post  highly suspect?

Because the Joy only has 21 days between cruising, and I just don't believe that they can demo and install 24 cabins in that time frame (regardless of availability of previous electric/plumbing/HVAC infrastructure).  I also can't imagine why ship's officers would be sharing this kind of strategic planning information with passengers if it hadn't previously been publicly reported.  I don't believe that we've seen any such reports.

15 minutes ago, unionhall said:

We had another conversation with a different officer about the changes coming after drydock. He said the same thing about cabins being put back in part of the OL.

Thanks for sharing more of the story.  I really hope that those officers were misinformed (we know that internal communication at NCL is at times spotty), but I'll be following along closely.  I currently have a pair of B2B's booked on the Joy in 2024 and 2025 and might very well cancel both if they screw up the OL.  Both are in cooler weather and I really don't want to fight crowds in a mini-OL.  Fortunately, the Joy has the forward facing buffet and the Brew House to provide some mitigation.  We sailed the Joy to Canada last October and despite the ship sailing at less than full capacity, the OL was often at or near full capacity.

[uneamie]

2 hours ago, unionhall said:

Chief Mate JRK why do you find my post  highly suspect? I had just sailed the Joy when I read the post about the refurbishment question. Before the dinner I had no idea the ship was going into dry dock. The topic was bought up by the officer. She has been on the ship since it went into service. Two days after the dinner we were invited to a party in the Brew House attended by a lot of the senior officers. We had another conversation with a different officer about the changes coming after drydock. He said the same thing about cabins being put back in part of the OL. Interestingly CWMixer the deck plan you showed doesn’t have the two bathrooms that are currently at the front of  the  OL entrance.

Apparently that person needs to see it or hear it first hand to believe it. I passed on your information about your conversations with the officers as well as a few sites that mentioned the dry dock... and I was rudely dismissed and scolded for posting unproven rumors saying it was absurd. I come here to gain information and exchange it. I won't be engaging with that person from here on out. Thank you for sharing what you experienced. I don't think your post was highly suspect. I believe you.     

[ChiefMateJRK]

20 minutes ago, uneamie said:

Apparently that person needs to see it or hear it first hand to believe it.

Wise people don't change plans because of a single, unconfirmed internet report.  I believe at last count we are still up to one report.

23 minutes ago, uneamie said:

I don't think your post was highly suspect. I believe you.     

To clarify, I find the information reported to be highly suspect.  If/when we have more credible information (e.g. a press release from NCL or formal reports to shareholders) then I will be much more accepting of it as "fact."