Has Holland America offshored its personal cruise consultants?

[Pylon]

Following up on an email I received from the account of my personal cruise consultant, which had the word "inactive" by her name, I tried to telephone her extension and was diverted to Manilla.

 

After waiting on the line for several minutes while the person who took the call sought to speak to a supervisor, the supervisor assigned me a new personal cruise consultant also in the Philippines who seemed very young. That and the noise in the background suggested to me Holland America is going down market in the services it provides its customers.

 

Further, we normally sail Princess Cruises and as of earlier this week, while we still have our personal cruise consultant in California, I am worried about that given he is also under the whim of the executives at Carnival.

 

Can others who have a personal cruise consultant with Holland America comment of this matter? My old consultant, a very experienced and knowledgeable older woman at Holland America, is out the door with an incoming young woman offshore?

 

I am not very happy about this development (Princess Cruises has already offshored its regular representatives when booking) and I thought that was very short sighted driven from the top at Carnival. But are they planning to go after their personal cruise consultants in North America? They could destroy their Holland America and Princess brands in pursuit of lower costs.

 

[sailawayward]

Considering HAL literally cruises around the entire globe, it's difficult to understand what an "offshore" PCC is.

[KAKcruiser]

I consider "offshore" representatives to be people who work in call centers.  They usually stick to a script and can't answer any questions or address any problems without putting you on hold for a long time while they check with their supervisor.  And, then usually the answer to any question is "no."

[Cruising-along]

Yikes.  Our current PCC is still in Seattle...

[triiip42]

@Pylon,    yesterday my Seattle based PCC was out of office. I needed some info so was directed to call the PCC number and get the PCC that answered.

It was answered by a nice young sounding PCC in the Philippines(I know cuz I asked). She was definitely newer and had to put me on hold several times to ask her supervisor questions. It was definitely a call center as I could clearly hear 2 to 3 other people talking to other customers about their cruises. She worked hard but eventually we all agreed that I should wait till today to discuss with my more experienced Seattle based PCC.

I know someday my experienced Seattle based PCC will be gone and have no idea where my next PCC will be based.

Not looking forward to starting over with a new PCC, no matter where they are located.

[Mandalay1903]

1 hour ago, triiip42 said:

I know someday my experienced Seattle based PCC will be gone and have no idea where my next PCC will be based.

My highly-experienced PCC retired, and my newly assigned PCC is also Seattle-based. The new one is doing fine, but needs to gain the experience that can only be learned on the job.

[oaktreerb]

I wouldn’t be surprised if HAL transferred some of the booking tasks to the Philippines.  Once the reps are trained, the reps should be competent, as long as they speak clear and concise English it shouldn’t be a problem.  HAL would save on wages and commissions.  My very competent PCC is still available but I suspect he works from home in the Seattle area.  These days people work from home in a lot of different industries.

[Caribbean Chris]

DH and I wasted a lot of time a few months ago trying to work with someone at the toll-free number provided for the pre/post hotel packages. Her English was barely understandable and she did not understand DH, either. When you have to spell “Charlotte” airport more than once while providing flight information, you start to worry.

 

There had been a message with the option to stay on the line and provide feedback, which we tried to do, but no format ever appeared to do this.

[POA1]

Most of HAL's PCCs are in the US. They are not all in Seattle though.

 

You'll see the 206 area code when one calls you because of the way the phone system works. (This should not be a surprise to anyone today. When we travel, anyone looking at my cell phone number sees a Fort Lauderdale number. It doesn't matter if I'm visiting our friends from when we lived in Maine or traveling outside the US.)

 

If we're not happy with anyone we're dealing with, and this goes for anyone from TA to PCC to car salesperson to doctors even, we ask for someone else.

 

I'd simply ask for a supervisor (or tell them my name Karen and I need to speak to the manager.) I just say that I don't "click" with the person assigned to me, or that I simply want someone different or more seasoned or whatever. (I would not personally mention location or accent. Folks today might just assume racism. Not "clicking" is hard to classify.)

 

Our original TA went to high school with my dad. I'm 60. Our TA decided to retire. We didn't click with the next two assigned to us. But the agency didn't want to lose a 25 year customer, so they reassigned us - happily. Sadly we were not a good fit with any of the new TAs. (Not being a "Good fit" is another excellent reason.) Now we book direct.

 

Maybe I should just start asking for "old farts" or geezers. 👴👵

Edited October 5, 2023 by POA1

[baggal]

38 minutes ago, POA1 said:

Most of HAL's PCCs are in the US. They are not all in Seattle though.

 

You'll see the 206 area code when one calls you because of the way the phone system works. (This should not be a surprise to anyone today. When we travel, anyone looking at my cell phone number sees a Fort Lauderdale number. It doesn't matter if I'm visiting our friends from when we lived in Maine or traveling outside the US.)

 

If we're not happy with anyone we're dealing with, and this goes for anyone from TA to PCC to car salesperson to doctors even, we ask for someone else.

 

I'd simply ask for a supervisor (or tell them my name Karen and I need to speak to the manager.) I just say that I don't "click" with the person assigned to me, or that I simply want someone different or more seasoned or whatever. (I would not personally mention location or accent. Folks today might just assume racism. Not "clicking" is hard to classify.)

 

Our original TA went to high school with my dad. I'm 60. Our TA decided to retire. We didn't click with the next two assigned to us. But the agency didn't want to lose a 25 year customer, so they reassigned us - happily. Sadly we were not a good fit with any of the new TAs. (Not being a "Good fit" is another excellent reason.) Now we book direct.

 

Maybe I should just start asking for "old farts" or geezers. 👴👵

When I go into the Apple Store with a question about my devices I ask for someone who is comfortable working with Senior Citizens.  Very often a bright, young person that still has a lot of patience is brought over to assist me.  

[foodsvcmgr]

I would rather see HAL save some money with offshore PCC’s than cut something else onboard ship.

[510picker]

Thanksfully my PCC is still in Seattle, but recent experience with Ship Services has been routed to a call center in the Phillipines. I was trying to book a Family Cabana in the Retreat. It was quite the fiasco!

[Reagan0712]

I ditched my HAL PCC several years ago. Could never get him on the phone. Even when he gave me a specific time to call it went to voicemail. That ended it.

Anyhow, regarding the call center…it is one of the worst.  No matter the question, I get put on hold while the person checks with a supervisor and, without fail, the answer they provide does not remotely answer my question. This is in addition to not being able to understand half of these new reps. I prefer booking directly but this is quite frustrating.  

I sent an email asking if there were any representatives still working who were not in the call center and it appeared to also be forwarded to some sort of off-shore email center as the response did not in the least bit address my concerns, and, they added an old booking number as if I was questioning a previous cruise.

[Fouremco]

 

16 hours ago, Pylon said:

They could destroy their Holland America and Princess brands in pursuit of lower costs.

A great number of major global and US companies (Amazon, Amex, AT&T...) have outsourced call centres, now a proven business strategy, and the Philippines is a preferred location. I wouldn't worry about HAL or Princess being destroyed. There will always be minor startup issues as the new employees adjust to their new role and acquire the necessary knowledge, just as new Filipino wait staff members in the MDR take time to get up to speed.  

 

[Pylon]

3 hours ago, Fouremco said:

 

A great number of major global and US companies (Amazon, Amex, AT&T...) have outsourced call centres, now a proven business strategy, and the Philippines is a preferred location. I wouldn't worry about HAL or Princess being destroyed. There will always be minor startup issues as the new employees adjust to their new role and acquire the necessary knowledge, just as new Filipino wait staff members in the MDR take time to get up to speed.  

 

Fouremco,

 

I am not convinced this so-called "proven" strategy has in fact proven to be successful if one looks beyond it being about cost reductions. For companies, it all depends on the particular product or service including its overall quality and whether the service satisfies customer expectations and experiences.  

 

Perhaps Canadians are different from Americans on this issue because I note you list American companies only. In Canada, you should know that the two major telecoms (Rogers and Bell) take the opposite approach to this issue.

 

Rogers staff (and advertise that) its representatives are located in Canada, and they are easy to reach in a timely manner and know what they are talking about. I would add that many are immigrants (based on their names) who speak excellent English.  Bell on the other hand frequently direct incoming calls overseas to be handled. I find the contact service provided by Rogers (which has other customer relation issues) to be significantly better than that of Bell Canada, and we use both services.

 

Every time I telephoned the major Banks I deal with in Canada during the last year or so the rep has been located in Canada except for the Bank of Nova Scotia which also has representatives in Mexico who speak excellent English. You can bet all callers who speak French are handled in Canada. This was not always the case because I recall getting diverted by some of the banks overseas which no longer seems to be the case. The banks took a lot of heat about offshoring jobs including in the national media and they seemed to have gotten the message at least in terms of handling retail callers. 

 

The major Canadian airlines do not divert customers overseas either.

 

Even that major American big box grocery, goods and travel company (with its Canadian headquarters in Ottawa) staffs its representatives in Canada although if one calls the travel division after 6:00 or 7:00 p.m. at night you seem to be diverted to Seattle, but not overseas. 

 

When the accountants take over the corporate suite, the result tends to be a micro detail downward spiral in quality across the brand assuming it began as a quality service or product. So, what is the brand about and does it continue to meet the expectations of its clients quality wise?

 

I think we can all agree that is for customers to decide and each will make their own decision.  For me, it seems that the major cruise brands are overly focused on squeezing costs out of their product at every turn after a very hard two to three years and hoping they don't break something in the process. Kinda like central bankers raising interest rates very quickly after inflation took hold (after they flooded the economy with newly printed money to deal with the pandemic) to squeeze high inflation rates down and they are now hoping they don't break something significant. 

 

Finally, it is possible that the widespread offshoring of jobs by large corporations can result in significant adverse political implications for a country.  

[jaywoods678]

I just heard that Celebrity has too.  😔

[jaywoods678]

21 hours ago, KAKcruiser said:

I consider "offshore" representatives to be people who work in call centers.  They usually stick to a script and can't answer any questions or address any problems without putting you on hold for a long time while they check with their supervisor.  And, then usually the answer to any question is "no."

And they don't listen and will just continue repeating the script over and over. It's very frustrating.

[DaveOKC]

21 hours ago, triiip42 said:

@Pylon,    yesterday my Seattle based PCC was out of office. I needed some info so was directed to call the PCC number and get the PCC that answered.

It was answered by a nice young sounding PCC in the Philippines(I know cuz I asked). She was definitely newer and had to put me on hold several times to ask her supervisor questions. It was definitely a call center as I could clearly hear 2 to 3 other people talking to other customers about their cruises. She worked hard but eventually we all agreed that I should wait till today to discuss with my more experienced Seattle based PCC.

I know someday my experienced Seattle based PCC will be gone and have no idea where my next PCC will be based.

Not looking forward to starting over with a new PCC, no matter where they are located.

Had a similar situation two weeks ago when my PCC was out.  Got a new, Philippines based PCC who knows very little.  He tried to B.S. me with a stupid answer, and when I called him on it he transferred me up the chain to a specialist.  I was not happy with this situation and it took my PCC getting back to resolve the situation.

 

I sure hope HAL reads these posts and stop this new approach!  

Edited October 5, 2023 by DaveOKC

[hobo1937]

Hopefully they won’t have the situation like at Princess, where they are either working from home or the call center is on a farm, as you can hear dogs, cows and children in the background.

[ChinaShrek]

I wonder what percentage of people even call a TA or the cruise line (PCC, for example) with questions or concerns after they book a cruise. I agree that I hate getting people who don't know what they are doing when I call customer service but lots of people retired or changed jobs during Covid. It's a fact of life. Furthermore, I think most Gen Z and Millennials hate making phone calls and talking to real people and that frankly is their future market. Personally, I also wish most things were automated. I do not like calling customer service at all for anything. I hate phone trees, call backs, etc. I would suggest the cruise lines would solve a lot of their problems if they allowed us to "fix" or adjust everything online much like the airlines do.

[cwd79]

I've had to call several times into Holland over the past few weeks as I booked online and needed the Welcome Back OBC promo added to my booking. I had asked my PCC but she always tells me to call reservations. The three or four times I've called I am directed to a call center with rep's that try but you can tell they are new or just don't seem to understand what you're asking. I am polite as can be and bring my patience. A simple call that normally should take no more than five minutes usually takes about 30 min. 

[AV8rix]

My beloved PCC of 13 years(!!) still works from his home in Seattle.  Don't know what I'd do without him.  He always knows the way I like things and my preferences so our calls are short.  I need to tell him very little but which cruise I wish to book, and then my credit card number.

 

Umm, when I said "our calls are short", I meant the business part.  He always has time to chat.  And if I need further assistance later on, he always returns my call or email the same day!

[maryandmarge]

2 hours ago, AV8rix said:

My beloved PCC of 13 years(!!) still works from his home in Seattle.  Don't know what I'd do without him.  He always knows the way I like things and my preferences so our calls are short.  I need to tell him very little but which cruise I wish to book, and then my credit card number.

 

Umm, when I said "our calls are short", I meant the business part.  He always has time to chat.  And if I need further assistance later on, he always returns my call or email the same day!

I have the same experience with my PCC who is in Seattle and hope I never lose him.   He always has time to answer my questions and I never feel rushed when on the phone with him.   I can either call or email him and have always gotten a response quickly.     I wish every one had the same experience with the PCC as we do. 

[foodsvcmgr]

Agreed China Shrek - I’m a boomer and rather conduct business online than via phone anytime. 
Can’t stand being on hold and no patience to wait for callbacks.

Plus I like the accuracy of typing everything out myself and reviewing it.

My business with my PCC is exclusively by email when contact is needed.

[Fouremco]

4 hours ago, Pylon said:

Fouremco,

 

I am not convinced this so-called "proven" strategy has in fact proven to be successful if one looks beyond it being about cost reductions. For companies, it all depends on the particular product or service including its overall quality and whether the service satisfies customer expectations and experiences.  

 

Perhaps Canadians are different from Americans on this issue because I note you list American companies only. In Canada, you should know that the two major telecoms (Rogers and Bell) take the opposite approach to this issue.

 

Rogers staff (and advertise that) its representatives are located in Canada, and they are easy to reach in a timely manner and know what they are talking about. I would add that many are immigrants (based on their names) who speak excellent English.  Bell on the other hand frequently direct incoming calls overseas to be handled. I find the contact service provided by Rogers (which has other customer relation issues) to be significantly better than that of Bell Canada, and we use both services.

 

Every time I telephoned the major Banks I deal with in Canada during the last year or so the rep has been located in Canada except for the Bank of Nova Scotia which also has representatives in Mexico who speak excellent English. You can bet all callers who speak French are handled in Canada. This was not always the case because I recall getting diverted by some of the banks overseas which no longer seems to be the case. The banks took a lot of heat about offshoring jobs including in the national media and they seemed to have gotten the message at least in terms of handling retail callers. 

 

The major Canadian airlines do not divert customers overseas either.

 

Even that major American big box grocery, goods and travel company (with its Canadian headquarters in Ottawa) staffs its representatives in Canada although if one calls the travel division after 6:00 or 7:00 p.m. at night you seem to be diverted to Seattle, but not overseas. 

 

When the accountants take over the corporate suite, the result tends to be a micro detail downward spiral in quality across the brand assuming it began as a quality service or product. So, what is the brand about and does it continue to meet the expectations of its clients quality wise?

 

I think we can all agree that is for customers to decide and each will make their own decision.  For me, it seems that the major cruise brands are overly focused on squeezing costs out of their product at every turn after a very hard two to three years and hoping they don't break something in the process. Kinda like central bankers raising interest rates very quickly after inflation took hold (after they flooded the economy with newly printed money to deal with the pandemic) to squeeze high inflation rates down and they are now hoping they don't break something significant. 

 

Finally, it is possible that the widespread offshoring of jobs by large corporations can result in significant adverse political implications for a country.  

I used those US companies as examples for two primary reasons. First, because they are very familiar to the majority of readers here, which might not have been the case had I cited  Canadian companies. Secondly because they have not been destroyed by having offshore call centres as you feared might be the case for HAL or Princess.

 

You say that you are "not convinced this so-called "proven" strategy has in fact proven to be successful if one looks beyond it being about cost reductions." I'd suggest that cost reduction is in fact the prime motivator for most outsourcing, and that companies using this strategy have a very sound idea of the savings to be achieved. I'd also suggest that companies do a thorough risk assessment that would include potential customer dissatisfaction and even the possible loss of customers. Given the huge number companies globally that have decided to proceed, I'd think that their analysis indicated  conclusively that there were greater gains to be realized than losses to be incurred.