Tipping....yes, again

[BlerkOne]

1 minute ago, ChinaShrek said:

They (whoever they are) have reduced service since Covid, however.

Have they really? Enhanced cleaning protocols are still in effect. Passengers generate the same amount of garbage whether it is emptied once or twice a day. Fresh towels are provided, if needed - how many showers a day do most passengers take? Etc.

[Rdclfamily]

7 hours ago, jiggs said:

maybe I'm in the minority, but I just add them to the cruise fare when booking and consider it part of the expense of the trip.  I have to fly to my embarkation point so when I think of flights, meals, hotel, transportation, the cruise, excursions, and everything else it seems worrying about reducing tips is a stretch.  Yes service is not what it once was, but I can say that about so many things in the hospitality industry.  Not sure punishing those in the lowest ranks is the answer.

I'm confident I didn't "punish" anyone with our $800-1000+ gratuity this past week.  Do you pay $150-200 per day in gratuity for other vacations? And if you do, what is the quality of the food + room + how much are you actually staying there versus going off to visit other locations?  This is a post about the changes in the industry and how that has affected gratuity and how the system may need an overhaul.  It isn't about not paying people a fair gratuity. 

[ChinaShrek]

3 minutes ago, Rdclfamily said:

This isn't about whether or not I can afford it.  It's about whether or not I can justify it.  $800-$1000+ for a week in gratuity is steep for the type of vacation we took i.e. not super desirable ports, just "okay" food, being off the boat three out of 7 days and tipping the staff off the boat, and an interior room for four people that left us having to stage when we get ready.   I might imagine we would pay this type of gratuity at a much fancier location or for a longer vacation.  It's just off base. I love cruising, I just think with the changes the cruise ships are making we might have to change the way we approach things.  I believe that everyone deserves fair gratuity, but I don't believe we are responsible for the entire pyramid top to bottom.  Carnival has a responsibility to evolve with the changes they are making.  Perhaps they can provide a bill in the MDR, and state how much the gratuity is based on how much the food would have cost us.  

The reality is the service charge is used to pay the worker's salaries. It has nothing to do with how much or how little service you receive on the ship unfortunately. That's one of the problems I have with calling them gratuities or tips. If I (the customer) really paid people on the basis of their worth on a cruise, the amount I give would vary immensely from cruise to cruise and worker to worker. I suggest you adjust the gratuity amount as you please.

[ChinaShrek]

2 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Have they really? Enhanced cleaning protocols are still in effect. Passengers generate the same amount of garbage whether it is emptied once or twice a day. Fresh towels are provided, if needed - how many showers a day do most passengers take? Etc.

I haven't seen any enhanced cleaning protocols since the masks came off.  They used to happily provide room cleaning twice a day - a full cleaning and now it is done begrudgingly once a day. They used to have wine stewards that knew about wine and now the waiter has to deal with the wine, That's reduction of service. They used to put napkins on my lap and unfold them as I sat down. Now, they do not. The list goes on and on. I see less work being done.

[Rdclfamily]

7 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Have they really? Enhanced cleaning protocols are still in effect. Passengers generate the same amount of garbage whether it is emptied once or twice a day. Fresh towels are provided, if needed - how many showers a day do most passengers take? Etc.

This isn't about the quality of service to me.  I received excellent service. This is about changes in how we are paying for service on other parts of the ship, versus a gratuity that used to cover everything besides drinking.  I want to make that very clear.  Our service was excellent and we deserve everyone deserves to be paid fairly. Perhaps the reason why this conversation doesn't evolve is because there are those who still cruise the old fashioned way, only eating in the MDR, stealing their low fare deals, etc.  As a modern family, we are cruising in a very choice-driven way and enjoying the variety.  

[geovet]

I recall that you could make adjustments to any part of the tips at cs.

[BlerkOne]

1 minute ago, ChinaShrek said:

 They used to have wine stewards that knew about wine and now the waiter has to deal with the wine,

This century?

 

I have gone to my cabin when boarding only to have the steward request that I come back later since they hadn't sanitized the room yet. I do appreciate that they no long dump off reams of Diamonds International garbage. When the paper Funtimes returned, they drop those off. You can get ice twice a day, no problem. Etc.

[Rdclfamily]

Just now, geovet said:

I recall that you could make adjustments to any part of the tips at cs.

That was the original point of the post.  I was trying to determine if that would be warranted now since Carnival has made so many changes without adjusting the way they do things. I decided to leave the gratuity as is this time, but do believe I overpaid in gratuity this time around. If we continue to cruise, I will likely make more thoughtful choices right from the beginning and pay as we go to everyone. 

[BlerkOne]

3 minutes ago, Rdclfamily said:

This isn't about the quality of service to me.  I received excellent service. This is about changes in how we are paying for service on other parts of the ship, versus a gratuity that used to cover everything besides drinking.  I want to make that very clear.  Our service was excellent and we deserve everyone deserves to be paid fairly. Perhaps the reason why this conversation doesn't evolve is because there are those who still cruise the old fashioned way, only eating in the MDR, stealing their low fare deals, etc.  As a modern family, we are cruising in a very choice-driven way and enjoying the variety.  

So you have no issue with the cabin steward gratuity.

 

As for eating in other parts of the ship, those are alternative services and are part of the tip pool. The people who served you breakfast in the MDR were likely still working there at night. or somewhere else. The staff is there to serve you whether you utilize them or not.

 

It is always a team effort. The people you see and the many more you don't.

 

Choice is good. There are a variety of vacation choices available for those who want burger king vacations (have it your way).

[mz-s]

1 hour ago, Rdclfamily said:

That was the original point of the post.  I was trying to determine if that would be warranted now since Carnival has made so many changes without adjusting the way they do things. I decided to leave the gratuity as is this time, but do believe I overpaid in gratuity this time around. If we continue to cruise, I will likely make more thoughtful choices right from the beginning and pay as we go to everyone. 

 

It is true that Carnival has made a lot of changes to their level of service, while asking us to pay more and more in gratuities. Why is the change only a one-way street, the only change allowed is the change that saves Carnival money?

[BlerkOne]

6 minutes ago, mz-s said:

 

It is true that Carnival has made a lot of changes to their level of service, while asking us to pay more and more in gratuities. Why is the change only a one-way street, the only change allowed is the change that saves Carnival money?

It isn't a one way street. The off ramp is to speak with your wallet and leave. It is Carnival's cruise line and their rules.

[mz-s]

1 minute ago, BlerkOne said:

It isn't a one way street. The off ramp is to speak with your wallet and leave. It is Carnival's cruise line and their rules.

 

Obviously. I think part of me is sad that I appear to have outgrown Carnival, but in many ways they don't want me anymore and I just have to come to terms with that I suppose.

[BlerkOne]

Just now, mz-s said:

 

Obviously. I think part of me is sad that I appear to have outgrown Carnival, but in many ways they don't want me anymore and I just have to come to terms with that I suppose.

It's nothing personal and certainly not limited to Carnival or for that matter, cruising. All cruise lines have cut back and increased prices. I see it on other lines, too.

[mz-s]

5 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

It's nothing personal and certainly not limited to Carnival or for that matter, cruising. All cruise lines have cut back and increased prices. I see it on other lines, too.

 

Of course, it's everywhere and it just comes to a point where all of us have to decide when we've had enough. I have only eaten at a "sit down" restaurant maybe 6 times since the onset of COVID for example - the poor service and high prices just aren't worth it anymore.

[Elaine5715]

11 hours ago, mz-s said:

 

Some time ago they used to break down how much each individual got did they not. I recall the maitre'd got $1.50 a day or something. Was that Carnival or some other line, or was I dreaming that?

Maitre'ds were removed from the tip pools years ago

[lazydayz]

This is difficult for me as well.  In almost all cases, the cabin stewards we have had have gone above and beyond, and earn an extra tip from us. When I dine in a paid restaurant and the service is exceptional, I leave a tip, even if it is already included.  When someone brings me a drink, I tip them even though our package includes gratuities. Heck, we have even tipped the omelet and pizza makers.  
 

I don’t want to tip back of the house workers I never see.  When I dine at a land restaurant, I am not expected to tip the host, the cook and the dishwasher.  At a hotel, I am not expected to tip the laundry or maintenance team.  Yet on a cruise, they are allocating a large percentage of tips to people I never see.  I know their jobs are important, but it is the employer’s job to pay them.

 

So next cruise, I might try an experiment and tip as I go, which would include the people serving me at Guys, the deli and the pizza place.  It will be interesting to see if I then feel obligated to leave some or all of the auto gratuities in place.  My feeling is if Carnival wants to raise gratuities, then they better deliver excellent service.  And unfortunately, there has been a definite decline in service post-pandemic.  I was understanding of it for a while, but now the pandemic excuses are just that, excuses.

[jerseygirlinAZ]

1 hour ago, lazydayz said:

I don’t want to tip back of the house workers I never see.  When I dine at a land restaurant, I am not expected to tip the host, the cook and the dishwasher.  At a hotel, I am not expected to tip the laundry or maintenance team.  Yet on a cruise, they are allocating a large percentage of tips to people I never see.  I know their jobs are important, but it is the employer’s job to pay them.

 

 

Actually, as a former server (albeit years ago), I had to "tip out" a percentage of my tips to the bussers and the host.  

[jerseygirlinAZ]

On 12/2/2023 at 6:55 PM, Rdclfamily said:

They also only service the room once a day compared to two.  

 

Land hotels don't even service rooms once a day anymore.  Stay three days?  No service.  We still tip because someone had to set up our room and will have to set it up for the next group.

 

Personally I don't need a steward to come by twice a day on a cruise, but I get people are used to that.

 

We also don't eat in the MDR often on cruises as we prefer specialty dining.  We tip both and a lot of places elsewhere.  We just consider it part of our vacation cost.  

[lazydayz]

17 minutes ago, jerseygirlinAZ said:

 

Actually, as a former server (albeit years ago), I had to "tip out" a percentage of my tips to the bussers and the host. 

 

That is different.  As part of your job, you tipped them out. Your customers were not expected to tip them.  
 

The cruise lines are asking us to tip the servers, the bussers, the dishwashers, the laundry crew, etc.  

[ldubs]

<deleted>. Oops.   

Edited December 4, 2023 by ldubs

[dlphn501]

I leave the auto gratuities, and I tip extra as I see fit.  I tend to tip heavy in the beginning for bar service.  If the room steward brings me ice as I ask, s/he will get extra at the end of the cruise.  I tip the wait staff in the MDR a few bucks on the days we are eating in there, so if we eat on Lido, then there's no extra.  Those that work in tipped positions do not make much base pay.

[Elaine5715]

34 minutes ago, jerseygirlinAZ said:

 

Actually, as a former server (albeit years ago), I had to "tip out" a percentage of my tips to the bussers and the host.  

People who never worked in the service industry neither understand the tip out  and/or when they heard about it, assume you cheat the co-workers.

[jerseygirlinAZ]

31 minutes ago, lazydayz said:

 

That is different.  As part of your job, you tipped them out. Your customers were not expected to tip them.  
 

The cruise lines are asking us to tip the servers, the bussers, the dishwashers, the laundry crew, etc.  

I only brought this up because another poster asked about tipping on a cruise ship versus a land vacation. This is common practice 

[ldubs]

2 hours ago, lazydayz said:

  

I don’t want to tip back of the house workers I never see.  When I dine at a land restaurant, I am not expected to tip the host, the cook and the dishwasher.  At a hotel, I am not expected to tip the laundry or maintenance team.  Yet on a cruise, they are allocating a large percentage of tips to people I never see.  I know their jobs are important, but it is the employer’s job to pay them.

 

 

In a restaurant a part of any tip you leave may be allocated to others.  No real difference.  You pay the daily grat. They will allocate it appropriately.    

 

[lazydayz]

6 minutes ago, ldubs said:

 

In a restaurant a part of any tip you leave may be allocated to others.  No real difference.  You pay the daily grat. They will allocate it appropriately.    

 

it could be I am tired of paying the daily rate and tipping extra.  My choice whether I continue to do both or opt out of one or the other.  There is no right answer, other than the cruise lines making tips mandatory or adding them to the base rate.  If Carnival won’t make the hard choice, that leaves it up to me.