Maleth confirms end of P&O partnership

[Geoff1964]

1 hour ago, yorkshirephil said:

Usually the hold luggage is specified by the cruise line with a reference to the flight companies for carry on as most charter flights do not carry the same ratio of cargo so more baggage weight is available. You usually see the luggage allowance if you log onto your P&O account and look under flights, however this is what Maleath say:

Its 23kg hold and 10kg hand baggage.

 

I also had confirmed that additioal baggeage is charged as follows:

 

5KG- £23 each way

 

10KG- £37 each way

 

23KG- £70 each way

Thank you.

interestingly ‘my cruise’ info says baggage allowance is dictated by the airline and they should be contacted direct!!!!

[yorkshirephil]

1 minute ago, Geoff1964 said:

Thank you.

interestingly ‘my cruise’ info says baggage allowance is dictated by the airline and they should be contacted direct!!!!

Maybe because it is a new airline and P&O don't want the hassle, I have not come across that statement before as usually when an aircraft is chartered the baggage allowance is negotiable, or used to be. To be fair 33kg overall is not too bad.

[Interestedcruisefan]

58 minutes ago, Geoff1964 said:

On the Arvia. Sailed on her sister ship Iona, to Norway in June and this was such good value (as a solo traveler I couldn’t resist).

We did Iona to Norway in May

 

Did Arvia last February. Booked again this February exact same cruise 

 

You can't possibly get a better value Caribbean holiday in our opinion

 

If you enjoyed Iona in Norway I'm sure you will enjoy Arvia in caribbean

[Supersun]

On 9/29/2023 at 8:51 PM, jeanlyon said:

You see I believe P&O are in the right here.  They never agree carriers, indeed how were they to know that they would have to use a different airline.  So you forfeit your deposit.  That's obvious.

Jean, that is not true as I have a recording and clearly confirms BA flight on PE.

[Supersun]

On 9/29/2023 at 3:18 PM, Thaumas said:

Here is my dilemma: 

My wife and I have cruised with P & O in the Caribbean on many occasions in the past - we are Mediterranean level Peninsular Club members. We’ve always elected to pay for Premium Economy as I view this as the minimum level of discomfort that I’m willing to put up with. Other people have different feelings about this - I’m only stating my preference here. 

Last March, I booked the Arvia repositioning cruise for next March. I booked directly with P & O over the phone, and I made it clear that the booking was conditional on PE flight seats being available. I was informed that they were indeed available, and paid the extra £200 per person premium.

We were, in fact, on the Arcadia when I received the infamous email regarding the change to Maleth Aero, cattle class only. This is simply not acceptable to us, but when I complained to P & O, I got the inevitable raspberry - nothing in our Ts & Cs specifies flight carriers etc etc. - if you want to cancel you’ll forfeit your deposit etc.

It seems to me that P & O are riding roughshod over basic contract law, and hiding behind their Ts & Cs. This is why I believe someone should stand up to them. The offer of PE was there (although who knows whether the person I was talking to knew about the forthcoming changes of carrier). I accepted their offer and paid the extra. This seems to me more than enough evidence to make a Section 75 chargeback claim as I used a credit card to make the booking. Additionally, I have made a Data Subject Access Request to P & O - requesting them to supply a recording of the booking phone call. They are legally obligated to provide this within one month. I believe this will be sufficient evidence to confirm that the booking was conditional on PE flight seats being available.

Will we be sailing with P & O again? Guesses on a postcard please!

We have had similar issues. I booked in February 2023 to travel on 27 October 2023 for 3 weeks. Our return flight was on PE and agent confirmed the same. No flight details were sent till late September 2023 which was on Charter flight Mareth Aero standard seats. They refunded me the extra pain without letting me know. I was unable to contact P&O and there was no reply to my emails. I managed to get through just before the start of the cruise and I was told no refund and I will loose all my money (over £5000). Further, received an standard email stating the same. Referred us to T&C. We are now on Arvia. I will take it further once we return. They have supplied recordings (though not all very cleverly) as I also asked for subject access. P&O staff are trained to deceit their old / regular passengers for new cruisers. Majority on Arvia and first time cruisers. Loyalty is out of the window plus service overall is extremely poor. We have been cruising since 2011 on P&O and celebrity. This will be our last P&O cruise. 

 

I hope my reply is not deleted as Carnival / P&O have a lot of clout.

[Cumbrian1]

We disembarked Arvia on schedule at 1300 Friday 10th November in an orderly manner and were bussed to Grantley Adam's International Airport where security was well organised without any delays and were soon seated near gate 15.

The incoming flight from Manchester DB1975 on Maleth Aero A330-202 wing registration 9H-MFS had been delayed on take off for1hr 50min due to a security concern where the vehicle delivering the catering had been broken into and a replacement meal service had to be sourced.

 

The flight landed at GAIA about 1630 local directly in front of the departure gate and was disembarked promptly amidst a rain shower. It was cleaned, re-fuelled and re-catered in a prompt fashion. The scheduled departure time of 1730, as expected, came and went. Boarding was announced at about 1830 and proceeded steadily by checking through the gate by walking across the tarmac to the access steps.

 

Once inside the aircraft which was clean and tidy we took our seats 7K and 7J which in the 3-3-3 configuration were situate in the forward section, starboard side window and adjacent seat.

 

The initial impression of the aircraft appearance was slightly dated due to the decor and fittings without any 'modern' paraphernalia such as in flight entertainment, power points wi-fi. Being the 3-3-3 configuration the seats seemed narrow. I didn't have a tape measure to check the width or pitch of the seats but I am 6'4" and they were quite snug. I could find very little movement to make myself more comfortable  especially with the armrests down but this was no different from any other economy seat in any aircraft I have flown in.

Once boarded, a headcount was conducted and it was announced that some passengers were missing. It was about this time that a previously perceived Anti Maleth Aero sentiment started to materialise with shouts of "Can't you clowns count" and "This flight is Sh**e" were heard. A second headcount was conducted with similar disparaging remarks. The Captain then announced that the missing passengers had mobility issues and that the reason for the delay was to arrange an Ambulift. There was a feel of hostility amongst some of the boarded passengers with chants of 'why are we waiting' etc.

 

When the late boarding passengers were eventually boarded, there was open hostility towards them with shouts of 'Where have you been?' etc.

 

Throughout the delay in the departure, the Captain kept us informed with developments and reassuringly kept saying"we are not leaving without them"

 

We eventually took off at 2025 local, just short of 3 hours late. As soon as we had levelled of, the cabin crew, who had managed to maintain a dignified smile during the boarding problems, served complimentary drinks. This was followed shortly by a meal of roast chicken and chips with a pasta salad, cheese and biscuits, chocolate mousse and a bun. This was followed by a service of tea or coffee. 

 

The lights were dimmed and quiet time ensued. I, as usual, struggled to get comfortable, and spent quite a bit of time in the area by the loading doors between the forward and mid sections where the cabin crew jump seats were I did standing exercises with an occasional sit down in the quite comfortable jump seats where I could stretch out my legs.

 

Breakfast of warm sausage(or egg) rolls were served with yogurt, orange juice, fresh fruit, muffin and tea or coffee a out 6 hours after take off.

 

Soon after breakfast, the engine note changed and descent was started. We were rewarded with a lovely sunrise as we passed over Ireland. We landed without incident at 0805.

 

Throughout the flight both my wife and I felt safe and secure and no different from any other flight we have used.

 

If any criticism can be levelled at all it would be at the flight organisation by P&O.

 

I understand that the logistical organisation of this must be enormous and that they have to be commended on this, from leaving the hold cases outside our cabin door to recovering them from the carousel at MAN, the buses to the airport etc. My only slight criticism is that in my view, anyone who had prebooked seats on the original flight would have done so for a reason... in our case for extra legroom.

P&O simply reassigned seat numbers purely on being the same (or as close as possible to) the original numbers without looking at the different seat configurations.

Ironically, one of the equivalent seats that we had originally booked for extra legroom, was occupied by a child whose feet didn't even touch the floor!

 

In conclusion, I would say that both my wife and I were perfectly happy with the flight. The crew were of a happy disposition, the service was just as expected for economy seats on any airline. My disappointment was with the attitude of a minority of the other passengers on the flight.

 

 

[mrsgoggins]

Don't you just despair at the behaviour of some passengers?  Very poor indeed.

 

Thanks @Cumbrian1 for a good, detailed account of your return flight.  It's because we are tall (and not slim either!) folk that I would never risk a cruise with P&O in the Caribbean.  We need to know we could get PE seats on booking our flights - and without sitting up until the wee small hours to get 2 by a window!

 

 

 

[Interestedcruisefan]

1 hour ago, Cumbrian1 said:

We disembarked Arvia on schedule at 1300 Friday 10th November in an orderly manner and were bussed to Grantley Adam's International Airport where security was well organised without any delays and were soon seated near gate 15.

The incoming flight from Manchester DB1975 on Maleth Aero A330-202 wing registration 9H-MFS had been delayed on take off for1hr 50min due to a security concern where the vehicle delivering the catering had been broken into and a replacement meal service had to be sourced.

 

The flight landed at GAIA about 1630 local directly in front of the departure gate and was disembarked promptly amidst a rain shower. It was cleaned, re-fuelled and re-catered in a prompt fashion. The scheduled departure time of 1730, as expected, came and went. Boarding was announced at about 1830 and proceeded steadily by checking through the gate by walking across the tarmac to the access steps.

 

Once inside the aircraft which was clean and tidy we took our seats 7K and 7J which in the 3-3-3 configuration were situate in the forward section, starboard side window and adjacent seat.

 

The initial impression of the aircraft appearance was slightly dated due to the decor and fittings without any 'modern' paraphernalia such as in flight entertainment, power points wi-fi. Being the 3-3-3 configuration the seats seemed narrow. I didn't have a tape measure to check the width or pitch of the seats but I am 6'4" and they were quite snug. I could find very little movement to make myself more comfortable  especially with the armrests down but this was no different from any other economy seat in any aircraft I have flown in.

Once boarded, a headcount was conducted and it was announced that some passengers were missing. It was about this time that a previously perceived Anti Maleth Aero sentiment started to materialise with shouts of "Can't you clowns count" and "This flight is Sh**e" were heard. A second headcount was conducted with similar disparaging remarks. The Captain then announced that the missing passengers had mobility issues and that the reason for the delay was to arrange an Ambulift. There was a feel of hostility amongst some of the boarded passengers with chants of 'why are we waiting' etc.

 

When the late boarding passengers were eventually boarded, there was open hostility towards them with shouts of 'Where have you been?' etc.

 

Throughout the delay in the departure, the Captain kept us informed with developments and reassuringly kept saying"we are not leaving without them"

 

We eventually took off at 2025 local, just short of 3 hours late. As soon as we had levelled of, the cabin crew, who had managed to maintain a dignified smile during the boarding problems, served complimentary drinks. This was followed shortly by a meal of roast chicken and chips with a pasta salad, cheese and biscuits, chocolate mousse and a bun. This was followed by a service of tea or coffee. 

 

The lights were dimmed and quiet time ensued. I, as usual, struggled to get comfortable, and spent quite a bit of time in the area by the loading doors between the forward and mid sections where the cabin crew jump seats were I did standing exercises with an occasional sit down in the quite comfortable jump seats where I could stretch out my legs.

 

Breakfast of warm sausage(or egg) rolls were served with yogurt, orange juice, fresh fruit, muffin and tea or coffee a out 6 hours after take off.

 

Soon after breakfast, the engine note changed and descent was started. We were rewarded with a lovely sunrise as we passed over Ireland. We landed without incident at 0805.

 

Throughout the flight both my wife and I felt safe and secure and no different from any other flight we have used.

 

If any criticism can be levelled at all it would be at the flight organisation by P&O.

 

I understand that the logistical organisation of this must be enormous and that they have to be commended on this, from leaving the hold cases outside our cabin door to recovering them from the carousel at MAN, the buses to the airport etc. My only slight criticism is that in my view, anyone who had prebooked seats on the original flight would have done so for a reason... in our case for extra legroom.

P&O simply reassigned seat numbers purely on being the same (or as close as possible to) the original numbers without looking at the different seat configurations.

Ironically, one of the equivalent seats that we had originally booked for extra legroom, was occupied by a child whose feet didn't even touch the floor!

 

In conclusion, I would say that both my wife and I were perfectly happy with the flight. The crew were of a happy disposition, the service was just as expected for economy seats on any airline. My disappointment was with the attitude of a minority of the other passengers on the flight.

 

 

Food looks decent

 

Glad I'm not 6ft4!!!

[Thaumas]

On 9/29/2023 at 3:27 PM, Megabear2 said:

You booked in March 2023 for March 2024 or was it March 2022 for March 2024?

 

17 hours ago, Supersun said:

We have had similar issues. I booked in February 2023 to travel on 27 October 2023 for 3 weeks. Our return flight was on PE and agent confirmed the same. No flight details were sent till late September 2023 which was on Charter flight Mareth Aero standard seats. They refunded me the extra pain without letting me know. I was unable to contact P&O and there was no reply to my emails. I managed to get through just before the start of the cruise and I was told no refund and I will loose all my money (over £5000). Further, received an standard email stating the same. Referred us to T&C. We are now on Arvia. I will take it further once we return. They have supplied recordings (though not all very cleverly) as I also asked for subject access. P&O staff are trained to deceit their old / regular passengers for new cruisers. Majority on Arvia and first time cruisers. Loyalty is out of the window plus service overall is extremely poor. We have been cruising since 2011 on P&O and celebrity. This will be our last P&O cruise. 

 

I hope my reply is not deleted as Carnival / P&O have a lot of clout.

I have told the P & O Guest Support Representatives that P & O should have offered full refunds to those people affected by this. I hope that someone, somewhere, will be prepared to take them to court. I understand that it will hinge on whether the removal of PE flight option is a “significant change” to the booking - this can only be determined by a judge apparently.

As for my situation, my wife and I have decided to go ahead with the booking on the basis that we are prepared to put up with the discomfort for the sake of the cruise (it’s a transatlantic, so no return flight). Unfortunately the recordings of my booking phone calls with P & O did not make it crystal clear that the booking was conditional on the availability of PE flight seats. I am still angry at the way P & O have treated their loyal customers, and won’t be cruising with them again.

You say you are now on Arvia but will take it further when you return - I wish you the best of luck!

[Beachlover62]

I've booked from Birmingham to ensure I fly with Tui. I think Maleth is a cut too far

[Megabear2]

13 minutes ago, Beachlover62 said:

I've booked from Birmingham to ensure I fly with Tui. I think Maleth is a cut too far

There isn't any guarantee that anyone will fly with any specific airline.  TUI can and do swap in other airline's planes if one of their own isn't available for any reason. I hope you are lucky.

[Snow Hill]

3 hours ago, Thaumas said:

 

I have told the P & O Guest Support Representatives that P & O should have offered full refunds to those people affected by this. I hope that someone, somewhere, will be prepared to take them to court. I understand that it will hinge on whether the removal of PE flight option is a “significant change” to the booking - this can only be determined by a judge apparently.

As for my situation, my wife and I have decided to go ahead with the booking on the basis that we are prepared to put up with the discomfort for the sake of the cruise (it’s a transatlantic, so no return flight). Unfortunately the recordings of my booking phone calls with P & O did not make it crystal clear that the booking was conditional on the availability of PE flight seats. I am still angry at the way P & O have treated their loyal customers, and won’t be cruising with them again.

You say you are now on Arvia but will take it further when you return - I wish you the best of luck!

If I am booking anything of significant cost I record the calls on my mobile, I then have my own copy in case the one of the “supplier” mysteriously vanished. I also ensure by a series of confirmation questions that I get confirmation of everything agreed. I destroy the recordings once the purchase has been satisfactory, I also advise I am also recording the call, especially if they are recording mine. 

Edited November 12, 2023 by Snow Hill

[molecrochip]

Has anyone on here bought the Premium Economy or Business Class upgrades with BA or Virgin?

 

Could you share the prices you paid for the flight upgrade and when your holiday was please. 
 

I’m specifically looking for a real world example rather than just asking the call centre/flight team. Don’t need any personal/identifiable details.

[Megabear2]

15 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

Has anyone on here bought the Premium Economy or Business Class upgrades with BA or Virgin?

 

Could you share the prices you paid for the flight upgrade and when your holiday was please. 
 

I’m specifically looking for a real world example rather than just asking the call centre/flight team. Don’t need any personal/identifiable details.

Do you mean on a purchased flight or one provided by P&O last year?

[Megabear2]

You jogged my memory.  This link from last year has a lot of prices offered on Virgin Antigua flights last year.  

 

https://boards.cruisecritic.co.uk/topic/2893762-arvia-antigua-flights-–-the-wait-continues/?do=findComment&comment=64303447

[elmsliebev]

13 hours ago, molecrochip said:

Has anyone on here bought the Premium Economy or Business Class upgrades with BA or Virgin?

 

Could you share the prices you paid for the flight upgrade and when your holiday was please. 
 

I’m specifically looking for a real world example rather than just asking the call centre/flight team. Don’t need any personal/identifiable details.

we upgraded to BA Premium Economy for a cruise with Cunard. We flew Manchester-LHR in normal class then LHR to Vancouver PE. The return was Miami to LHR in PE. BA kindly cancelled our LHR-Man flight on the day of a rail strike but that's a whole different tale. Our TA got us the upgrade when BA had a sale on and I think it was about £350pp. 

[Thejuggler]

3-3-3 is all economy layout and fine for a hop to the Med but not longhaul.  2-4-2 was the lower density option for the A330 and much more appealing.

 
Monarch had the same 3-3-3 on their A300s and it was purgatory on Goa flights, especially when coupled with a 28 inch pitch.

 

The only bonus was they had to refuel in the Middle East so you did get a break after 7 hours or so! 

 

[snaefell]

I remember flying Manchester to Orlando with Monarch on a 757,with a single aisle & either the drinks trolley,the food trolley or the duty free trolley blocking the aisle getting around was fun...not!

[Interestedcruisefan]

17 minutes ago, Thejuggler said:

3-3-3 is all economy layout and fine for a hop to the Med but not longhaul.  2-4-2 was the lower density option for the A330 and much more appealing.

 
Monarch had the same 3-3-3 on their A300s and it was purgatory on Goa flights, especially when coupled with a 28 inch pitch.

 

The only bonus was they had to refuel in the Middle East so you did get a break after 7 hours or so! 

 

Have to say we flew to Montego bay and back on dreamliners last month with tui. In economy.

 

Although Ive always loved these planes

 

The legroom was worse than I've ever remembered and I've realised how bad it is now when people recline their seats in front of you. It's really intrusive. I'm only 5ft11 ish.

 

I don't think we should be allowed to recline the seats on dreamliners tbh

 

Both the outward and return flight I couldn't get really comfortable even on the dreamliner 

 

I don't know if anything  has changed on them?

 

This was 3-3-3 configuration by the way

 

So maybe that's changed from 2-4-2 from other dreamliners I've been on before?

 

 

[Interestedcruisefan]

I'm sure I've read that Maleth have 30 or 31 inch pitch in economy?

Edited November 13, 2023 by Interestedcruisefan

[Megabear2]

1 minute ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Have to say we flew to Montego bay and back on dreamliners last month with tui. In economy.

 

Although Ive always loved these planes

 

The legroom was worse than I've ever remembered and I've realised how bad it is now when people recline their seats in front of you. It's really intrusive. I'm only 5ft11 ish.

 

I don't think we should be allowed to recline the seats on dreamliners tbh

 

Both the outward and return flight I couldn't get really comfortable even on the dreamliner 

 

I don't know if anything  has changed on them?

 

This was 3-3-3 configuration by the way

 

So maybe that's changed from 2-4-2 from other dreamliners I've been on before?

 

 

No all TUI dreamliners are 3-3-3 in economy. It's premium economy that is 2-3-2.  TUI were very proudly the recipient of the first 787 Dreamliner and apart from the newer planes having 9 rows of PE rather than 7 the seat pitch etc remains the same.  

 

Actually in fairness they are something of a market leader in legroom believe it or not!

[Interestedcruisefan]

2 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

No all TUI dreamliners are 3-3-3 in economy. It's premium economy that is 2-3-2.  TUI were very proudly the recipient of the first 787 Dreamliner and apart from the newer planes having 9 rows of PE rather than 7 the seat pitch etc remains the same.  

 

Actually in fairness they are something of a market leader in legroom believe it or not!

Thanks 

 

Just seemed less pleasant than normal to me

 

From seat comfort point of view only

 

The staff and food and drink service were  very  good. And  in flight entertainment very good as normal

Edited November 13, 2023 by Interestedcruisefan

[Megabear2]

4 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Thanks 

 

Just seemed less pleasant than normal to me

I sympathise. Perhaps you understand a bit better why we guys pay for the PE seats, particularly with the seat reclining situation.  Long haul economy on most airlines is sadly cramped and uncomfortable, ironically the older planes may well have more padded, wider seats.

Edited November 13, 2023 by Megabear2

[snaefell]

7 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Have to say we flew to Montego bay and back on dreamliners last month with tui. In economy.

 

Although Ive always loved these planes

 

The legroom was worse than I've ever remembered and I've realised how bad it is now when people recline their seats in front of you. It's really intrusive. I'm only 5ft11 ish.

 

I don't think we should be allowed to recline the seats on dreamliners tbh

 

Both the outward and return flight I couldn't get really comfortable even on the dreamliner 

 

I don't know if anything  has changed on them?

 

This was 3-3-3 configuration by the way

 

So maybe that's changed from 2-4-2 from other dreamliners I've been on before?

 

 

On the Etihad Dreamliner we flew to Bejing in economy in 2019 my 6' 4" meant that my knees were up against the back of the seat in front of me meaning she couldn't recline her seat. ..not a happy bunny!😕😕

[Megabear2]

6 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Thanks 

 

Just seemed less pleasant than normal to me

You might be interested in this, it's very informative and enlightening

 

https://www.alternativeairlines.com/best-flights-tall-leg-room