No more MTG luncheon, only cocktail party

[Cruisemeister2002]

6 hours ago, billco said:

If it wasn't worth the time, why would they be standing room only?

Perhaps they were playing musical chairs or a Trip to Jerusalem as apparently our friends across the pond call it ? 

[dweeb]

58 minutes ago, memoak said:

Where on the Majestic was a cocktail party for 40 people held. I cannot recall a small enough area except for what used to be bar next to the casino which I believe is now used for slot machines 

Majestic had a luncheon held in the Harmony Dining area.  The Discovery had a cocktail party held in Take 5 bar/lounge area next to the casino.  No slot machines currently placed in the Take 5 lounge area.

[memoak]

2 minutes ago, dweeb said:

Majestic had a luncheon held in the Harmony Dining area.  The Discovery had a cocktail party held in Take 5 bar/lounge area next to the casino.  No slot machines currently placed in the Take 5 lounge area.

That makes sense however while the cocktail party was going on did servers still come in and out from the casino for drink orders ?

[JimmyVWine]

2 hours ago, memoak said:

Packages would have nothing to do with the MTG lunch for 40 people on only one day of a cruise. Please explain your reasoning   We always take plus package and there is nothing in that package that has anything to do with the luncheon 

Unless I miss my guess, the point that is being made is that in the past, Princess had to go out of pocket in order to hold these events.  The food and alcohol was provided gratis, which meant that Princess ate the cost.  By moving away from a luncheon to a cocktail party, they no longer have to foot the bill for the food.  Only the drinks.  But now, with packages, if most of the guests have already pre-paid for drinks, Princess is not going out of pocket for the alcohol as that cost has already been absorbed into the fare.  In other words, the servers are passing out drinks that the guests, not Princess, has already paid for. The old saying: "Give the people what they want" has been transformed into "Give the people things that they have already paid for, but make it look like a gift."

Edited August 26 by JimmyVWine

[voljeep]

7 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

Unless I miss my guess, the point that is being made is that in the past, Princess had to go out of pocket in order to hold these events.  The food and alcohol was provided gratis, which meant that Princess ate the cost.  By moving away from a luncheon to a cocktail party, they no longer have to foot the bill for the food.  Only the drinks.  But now, with packages, if most of the guests have already pre-paid for drinks, Princess is not going out of pocket for the alcohol as that cost has already been absorbed into the fare.  In other words, the servers are passing out drinks that the guests, not Princess, has already paid for. The old saying: "Give the people what they want" has been transformed into "Give the people things that they have already paid for, but make it look like a gift."

yes, but those 'free drinks' will not be charged against the 15 or unlimited, right?

[Cruisemeister2002]

7 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

Unless I miss my guess, the point that is being made is that in the past, Princess had to go out of pocket in order to hold these events.  The food and alcohol was provided gratis, which meant that Princess ate the cost.  By moving away from a luncheon to a cocktail party, they no longer have to foot the bill for the food.  Only the drinks.  But now, with packages, if most of the guests have already pre-paid for drinks, Princess is not going out of pocket for the alcohol as that cost has already been absorbed into the fare.  In other words, the servers are passing out drinks that the guests, not Princess, has already paid for. The old saying: "Give the people what they want" has been transformed into "Give the people things that they have already paid for, but make it look like a gift."

That's food for thought. or maybe just drink for thought now.

[memoak]

5 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

Unless I miss my guess, the point that is being made is that in the past, Princess had to go out of pocket in order to hold these events.  The food and alcohol was provided gratis, which meant that Princess ate the cost.  By moving away from a luncheon to a cocktail party, they no longer have to foot the bill for the food.  Only the drinks.  But now, with packages, if most of the guests have already pre-paid for drinks, Princess is not going out of pocket for the alcohol as that cost has already been absorbed into the fare.  In other words, the servers are passing out drinks that the guests, not Princess, has already paid for. The old saying: "Give the people what they want" has been transformed into "Give the people things that they have already paid for, but make it look like a gift."

However I have already paid for my lunch in the MDR as well   I will not drink less cocktails around the ship because I had a couple at a party.    Also many of the people I know with 800+ days do not buy packages   Not all drink like we do. If memory serves on the cocktail parties for MTG that I have been to in the past there were fairly heavy snacks served along with drinks. I believe these decisions are made by the captain and not corporate. On Grand class ships without Adagio’s there really isn’t anywhere to host an intimate cocktail party. They are not going to shut down Wheelhouse or Crooners

 

[voljeep]

11 minutes ago, memoak said:

However I have already paid for my lunch in the MDR as well   I will not drink less cocktails around the ship because I had a couple at a party.    Also many of the people I know with 800+ days do not buy packages   Not all drink like we do. If memory serves on the cocktail parties for MTG that I have been to in the past there were fairly heavy snacks served along with drinks. I believe these decisions are made by the captain and not corporate. On Grand class ships without Adagio’s there really isn’t anywhere to host an intimate cocktail party. They are not going to shut down Wheelhouse or Crooners

 

who does the Captain answer to then?

[memoak]

6 minutes ago, voljeep said:

who does the Captain answer to then?

His wife according to her. If it was one size fits all then there would not have been a combination of cocktail parties and lunches over the years. Still haven’t figured out what venue on Grand Class ships without Adagio’s you could close off the have such an event

[JimmyVWine]

18 minutes ago, memoak said:

However I have already paid for my lunch in the MDR as well   I will not drink less cocktails around the ship because I had a couple at a party.    Also many of the people I know with 800+ days do not buy packages   Not all drink like we do.

You can fight against the reasoning all you want.  But the fact is that the decision was economic.  All decisions are.  Princess ran the numbers and concluded that it can save "X" amount of money by not hosting 600 or so luncheons every year and instead serve cocktails, many to people who already have them included in their package.  Is it every person?  Of course not.  But they know the numbers.  It is not essential that there be 100% package participation for the economics to break in Princess's favor.  In actuality, if even one person out of 40 has a package, the numbers break in their favor.  If is 2, the economic benefit doubles. And so on.    

[TRLD]

32 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

Unless I miss my guess, the point that is being made is that in the past, Princess had to go out of pocket in order to hold these events.  The food and alcohol was provided gratis, which meant that Princess ate the cost.  By moving away from a luncheon to a cocktail party, they no longer have to foot the bill for the food.  Only the drinks.  But now, with packages, if most of the guests have already pre-paid for drinks, Princess is not going out of pocket for the alcohol as that cost has already been absorbed into the fare.  In other words, the servers are passing out drinks that the guests, not Princess, has already paid for. The old saying: "Give the people what they want" has been transformed into "Give the people things that they have already paid for, but make it look like a gift."

To put things in perspective cruiselines on average pay $15 -18 per passenger per day on food, including for the crew. The actual cost of putting on the luncheon is not that much. A cocktail party might cost them more than the luncheon. 

 

 

[JimmyVWine]

26 minutes ago, voljeep said:

yes, but those 'free drinks' will not be charged against the 15 or unlimited, right?

I would assume not.  But let's not forget that those numbers (15 and "unlimited") are illusory.  The number of people hitting those marks is too small to care about.  If someone with a limit of 15 jumps up to 17 for that one day, it isn't going to move the meter. 

[cr8tiv1]

22 minutes ago, memoak said:

They are not going to shut down Wheelhouse or Crooners

 

They DID shut down the Wheelhouse on the CB for the MTG cocktail party.  The officers were quite visible during the cruise and the captain very personable.  If it were his choice, I would have guessed he would have selected a luncheon.  But I don't know his frame of mind/or corporate.  The officers mingled about the group.

[JimmyVWine]

1 minute ago, TRLD said:

To put things in perspective cruiselines on average pay $15 -18 per passenger per day on food, including for the crew. The actual cost of putting on the luncheon is not that much. A cocktail party might cost them more than the luncheon. 

 

 

Not a chance.  The luncheon is not a typical cruise ship meal.  Why would they go this route if it were going to cause angst AND cost more money?  NO rational decision maker would ever pick that option under any rule of Game Theory.

Edited August 26 by JimmyVWine

[TRLD]

Just now, JimmyVWine said:

Not a chance.  The luncheon is not a typical cruise ship meal.  

Not a typical meal. However from the cruise lines point of view the costs are pretty low. The labor costs are the same if the have the luncheon or not. The food comes from the stores purchased for the cruise.

 

Its not like they were taking everyone to an outside dining venue for a hundred a head.

 

Do not confuse what the cruise lines charge for the specialty dining venues with how little the food actually costs them.  

 

The food at the luncheons are very good preparations, but it is not like they are adding 40 special meals just for the luncheons. They are using the same cuts of meat, fish, etc that is used elsewhere on the ship only prepared a bit better.

 

The cost in a alcohol party, may be higher than the cost of food/wine in the luncheons. In either case the cost to the cruise line is small. 

 

More of a question if it is worth the time of the officers and staff. The more junior officers seem to like to attend when it is their time to attend. Not so sure about some of the senior officers that go more often.

[PescadoAmarillo]

1 hour ago, Bemidji Ty said:

I recall the ship's officer at our table asking, "So, where's your next cruise? and What's been your favorite cruise?"  This set the topic of the table conversation.  Maybe we were lucky, but we had well-mannered table-mates and it was nice hear their experiences and plans.

 

Cheers

That’s mostly been our experience, too, with the exceptions far too few to mention. Of course, if talk involves travel (a natural topic, one would think, on a cruise),  you’ll hear others here complaining that people are bragging about how much they’ve traveled. Personally, I’d rather talk about travel than a lot of other potential topics. But, really, how hard is it to direct the conversation in a different direction if the current topic displeases you?  If one person monopolizes a conversation, the others have only themselves to blame. 

[Z0nker]

18 hours ago, memoak said:

And as I mentioned it is really up to the captain some enjoy the luncheon some do not. Captain Lewis on the Grabd says he loves the conversation at the luncheon 

Captain Lewis is on the Grand Princess now? Awesome. Hope he's still there in March.

[JimmyVWine]

13 minutes ago, TRLD said:

Do not confuse what the cruise lines charge for the specialty dining venues with how little the food actually costs them.  

 

13 minutes ago, TRLD said:

More of a question if it is worth the time of the officers and staff. The more junior officers seem to like to attend when it is their time to attend. Not so sure about some of the senior officers that go more often.

I'm not confusing anything. The decision making follows a simple paradigm: 

 

Strategy 1:  The chosen action produces excitement and saves me money. Win-Win

Strategy 2:  The chosen action produces excitement but costs me money. Win (other)-Lose (me)

Strategy 3:  The chosen action produces angst and saves me money. Lose (other)-Win (me)

Strategy 4:  The chosen action produces angst and costs me money. Lose-Lose

 

In the real world, Strategy 1 rarely exists, and it does not seem to exist here.  Few, if any people are truly excited about this change, and Princess could never have predicted that it would have had that result.

 

Strategy 4 is a loser's gambit.  No rational person would want to cause angst while at the same time removing money from their pocket.

 

That leaves Strategies 2 and 3.  Either is realistic, and the one that gets chosen is mostly a matter of achieving subjectively desired outcome.  Based on the reactions in this thread, it simply does not seem realistic that Strategy 2 has been chosen.  So that leaves Strategy 3.  Not complicated.

 

As for the theory that this probably has more to do with the officers.  I discount that.  The world didn't change all of a sudden.  These events are no more numerous or taxing now than they were 20 years ago.  What would have changed to make them so burdensome?  And let's not forget that the Officers answer to their employer.  If HQ says "go to the party", then they go to the party.  Hardly the most difficult thing that they have to do that day.  Easier than the Champagne Tower. 

 

Edited August 26 by JimmyVWine

[dweeb]

1 hour ago, memoak said:

That makes sense however while the cocktail party was going on did servers still come in and out from the casino for drink orders ?

I really didn't pay attention to the other servers.   There were servers available for our drinks, and that was all I cared about.  

[TRLD]

9 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

 

I'm not confusing anything. The decision making follows a simple paradigm: 

 

Strategy 1:  The chosen action produces excitement and saves me money. Win-Win

Strategy 2:  The chosen action produces excitement but costs me money. Win (other)-Lose (me)

Strategy 3:  The chosen action produces angst and saves me money. Lose (other)-Win (me)

Strategy 4:  The chosen action produces angst and costs me money. Lose-Lose

 

In the real world, Strategy 1 rarely exists, and it does not seem to exist here.  Few, if any people are truly excited about this change, and Princess could never have predicted that it would have had that result.

 

Strategy 4 is a loser's gambit.  No rational person would want to cause angst while at the same time removing money from their pocket.

 

That leaves Strategies 2 and 3.  Either is realistic, and the one that gets chosen is mostly a matter of achieving subjectively desired outcome.  Based on the reactions in this thread, it simply does not seem realistic that Strategy 2 has been chosen.  So that leaves Strategy 3.  Not complicated.

 

As for the theory that this probably has more to do with the officers.  I discount that.  The world didn't change all of a sudden.  These events are no more numerous or taxing now than they were 20 years ago.  What would have changed to make them so burdensome?  And let's not forget that the Officers answer to their employer.  If HQ says "go to the party", then they go to the party.  Hardly the most difficult thing that they have to do that day.  Easier than the Champagne Tower. 

 

What does that have to do with the cost of luncheon. Which is pretty minimal. The cost of alcohol at a cocktail party might actual cost more.

 

The biggest difference is time. My experience is that the cocktail events tend to be much shorter than the luncheon. The biggest impact of the change is time spent by the officers.

 

The other major change is that since they are more fluid, the person hosting the party from future cruise sales can mix more, making it more valuable to them.

 

Suspect any corporate level change is due to ONE and future cruise sales than corporate finance concerned about food costs. Since they now run the on ship Captains Circle functions. They would be the ones feeding back to Corporate if they see value is either.

 

 

 

 

[555]

32 minutes ago, TRLD said:

They are using the same cuts of meat, fish, etc that is used elsewhere on the ship only prepared a bit better.

I can't agree with part of your statement.

If they served the same quality beef at the luncheons as in the buffet or DR, half the people wouldn't bother attending.

[dreams_of_travel]

25 minutes ago, Z0nker said:

Captain Lewis is on the Grand Princess now? Awesome. Hope he's still there in March.

I don't recall all the specifics he mentioned, but I do remember he had been asked to come over to Grand Princess from Emerald, and stay for the Alaska season. He and his family were lovely during my cruise in August.  He also talked about requesting a special dessert from the pastry chef or some higher up in the kitchen.  It was a chocolate caramel dessert, and was delicious. 

Edited August 26 by dreams_of_travel
hit post before I was done.

[memoak]

1 hour ago, TRLD said:

To put things in perspective cruiselines on average pay $15 -18 per passenger per day on food, including for the crew. The actual cost of putting on the luncheon is not that much. A cocktail party might cost them more than the luncheon. 

 

 

I agree a bunch of cocktails costs way more than a couple of glasses of so so wine you get at the lunch

[memoak]

43 minutes ago, Z0nker said:

Captain Lewis is on the Grand Princess now? Awesome. Hope he's still there in March.

He will be off before then   He said he was tentatively to return to the Emerald but hoped for the Grand. We sail the Grand again in January and again in May

[memoak]

21 minutes ago, dreams_of_travel said:

I don't recall all the specifics he mentioned, but I do remember he had been asked to come over to Grand Princess from Emerald, and stay for the Alaska season. He and his family were lovely during my cruise in August.  He also talked about requesting a special dessert from the pastry chef or some higher up in the kitchen.  It was a chocolate caramel dessert, and was delicious. 

Did we bump into each other on the Grand. We were at 2 MTG luncheons