Suggestion to End Formal Night Bickering

[Tom O.]

I am very apprehensive about starting a thread on this subject, but I was tired of reading about the Crown list.

Before I go into it, I should tell you that my wife and I like formal night, it provides us a rare opportunity to dress formal, and it just seems so cool to be part of this tradition.

 

Anyway, I thought of a possible solution that I think would satisfy both sides of the formal night dillema. It would require compromises from both sides of the argument, which is only fair.

My plan would do away with formal night in the regular dining rooms. Instead, the specialty restaurants (extra cost) would have a formal wear requirement every night. And, I would make the formal requirement in these specialty restaurants "black tie" (tuxedo required). This would eliminate some strange things I have seen in the dining room on formal nights trying to pass as a suit.

 

People who don't want to bother with formal wear, will not be bannished to the buffet, and people like me, can still have their formal night out.

 

True, us formals will have to pay extra for that experience, but most people try these specialty cruises at least once on a cruise.

 

Non-formal types will miss out on the specialty restaurants - like I said each side has to compromise.

 

Since formal wear will only be required in these restaurants, the shows, bars, etc. will always be casual.

 

Since the specialty restaurants will be formal every night, there will be plenty of opportunities for everybody to dress up. Each of us will be able to choose which nights are formal.

 

The only problem with this idea, as far as I can see is that I don't think Princess would like it. I don't think they would like the idea of restrictions on who would go to a restaurant where they charge extra for.

 

Anyway there it is, I don't recall ever seeing this suggestion here before, but with so many threads of formal wear, who could ever find it in a search?

 

I hope this doesn't start the age old argument again. I was just trying to think of some way to appease both sides.

[ldoc31]

We don't always go to the specialty restaurants when we cruise, therefore we would miss the formal night.

[TolleranzaDelDio]

It would be amazing if somehow they would take a survey at the beginning, and then maybe do something like depending on the results make one floor formal and another floor casual...I'm not sure I've never cruised before and am looking forward to formal nights...I finally get to wear the dress I wore for my best friend's wedding as MOH!

[Tom O.]

We don't always go to the specialty restaurants when we cruise, therefore we would miss the formal night.

 

I usually don't either, but I would go in order to have my formal night. Or perhaps Princess could have a dining room that is not extra cost always be formal.

[SingerEsq]

People may gripe and moan about the monkey suits, etc., but on my 2 Princess cruises (Alaska and Hawaii, probably 2 of the most casual locales) all formal nights filled the atrium and the regular dining rooms to capacity. (We had 3 in Hawaii). So, at least from my limited experience, they seem overwhelmingly popular to me.

 

Maybe the CB will be different but I'm packin' tux.

[Desert Cruisers]

Would there be sufficient capacity in the specialty dining restaurants to handle everyone who would like to dress formal? If only a relatively small number of passengers could be accomodated, wouldn't this create a nightmare for Princess?:)

[LARGIN]

While the idea sound good, one problem that I see is that in the casino, bars and other common areas, you will have a mixture of tuxedos and shorts in the evening. That in itself will wreck the ambiance of the night for those that enjoy the true formal experience. One way to satisfy all is to return to the old "Class" system where certain areas will be off limits to those that do not wish to adhere to the dress code. I often thought that the cruise lines under the Carnival umbrella could be distinctly different. For instance, put all of the large capacity ships under Carnival, smaller ships under the rest of the fleet like Princess and HAL.. Carnival can be a upscale casual and Princess/HAL can be more formal where the dress code is strictly enforced. People will know upfront what the rules are.

[Roses2]

For us the idea has no merit since the specialty restaurants do not cater to vegetarians who also may enjoy formal nights.

 

Why not just leave things as they are?

 

There will always be differences of opinion about formal nights--viva l'difference

[bdjam]

I think it makes for a nice formal evening when everyone is dressed and the activities on board have a notch more quality than the Not So Newlywed Game. So the night is one of the more special of the cruise. Diluting that atmosphere with formal/non-formal as you like on the same evening would ruin the ambience.

Besides, you can get that on NCL when they have their “optional” formal evenings in certain restaurants.

[Tom O.]

Would there be sufficient capacity in the specialty dining restaurants to handle everyone who would like to dress formal? If only a relatively small number of passengers could be accomodated, wouldn't this create a nightmare for Princess?:)

 

I think that they could handle it, since every night is formal demand would be spread out for the whole cruise. But who know, they would have to try it and resize the specialty restaurants if the demand was there.

I think it would be no worse a nightmare that they have now, trying to deal with improperly dressed people in the dining room and all the complaints of people who are offended.

[gelton]

I think people are too concern what everyone else is doing. I can't drive to work without rubber neckers trying to see the wreck off the shoulder or the car being worked on or whatever. And people are too concerned what the other person is wearing on the cruiseship. You want to wear your tux, then great. Wear it every night of the cruise if you want to, it doesn't effect me in the least. For me personally I think what was said has a little merit. The specialty resturants should have a higher dress code than the main dining on any given night. In fact on HAL and Norwegein cruises I have been on they do (or at least everyone was wearing what I call formal attire). And I think it is nice to have a formal theme throughout the ship a night or 2, but it doesn't hurt my feeling in the least if the 20 something's want to wear a sport jacket over a t-shirt..aka Miami Vice (the TV show). And it doesn't effect my formal pictures, it doesn't effect the taste of my food, it doesn't bother me in the least and it shouldn't bother you either.

Life is too short too worry about what everyone else is doing. It is your cruise and your cruise will be what you make of it. And if you spend the whole cruise worrying about what eveyone else is going to wear on formal night then I expect you will not enjoy the cruise.

Personally I dress in dark and very formal one night and the other formal night I wear what I would to a meeting at work (light coat, oxford shirt w/tie, and casual slacks) and anyone that don't like it can kiss my...well you get the idea.

[mississauga]

We don't always go to the specialty restaurants when we cruise, therefore we would miss the formal night.

 

Exactly, why should those of us who like formal nights have to pay extra just to have a formal night? I think most people like formal nights.

 

 

I often thought that the cruise lines under the Carnival umbrella could be distinctly different. For instance, put all of the large capacity ships under Carnival, smaller ships under the rest of the fleet like Princess and HAL.. Carnival can be a upscale casual and Princess/HAL can be more formal where the dress code is strictly enforced. People will know upfront what the rules are.

People already know upfront what the rules are and still some don't adhere to it. What makes you think everyone who books on Princess/HAL would dress formal when the occasion arises?

 

I think it makes for a nice formal evening when everyone is dressed and the activities on board have a notch more quality than the Not So Newlywed Game. So the night is one of the more special of the cruise. Diluting that atmosphere with formal/non-formal as you like on the same evening would ruin the ambience

 

Exactly, maybe it is up to the cruiselines to come up with the incentives to make people want to dress up for a complete formal experience.

[Cruisin' Chick]

One advantage to this idea: the lines to take formal portraits will become shorter as now you can pick from several nights.

[rob.potter]

I am sorry, but this is a hot button for me. I agree with Largin (for a change). People already know the rules. If you don't want to dress formal 2 nights on a 7 or 10 day cruise you have options including NCL.

 

I also have problems with people who think that they only have to dress formal for dinner. The Patter says "evening attire" not dinner attire. It is the evening "atmosphere" that makes formal nights special. The evening is ruined when we walk into the princess theatre after traditional late dinner, order an after dinner cordial and have some idiot in jeans shorts and a tank top sit down in front of us with his Miller Light beer can.

 

And then go to the casino and have to stand next to the same idiot at the craps table.

 

 

 

FORMAL NIGHT IS FORMAL NIGHT. If they don't want to participate, send them to STEARAGE.

 

JMHO

 

Rob

[pollyanno]

requiring tuxedos disregards the formalwear of other cultures..

 

I'm a really un-fancy person. I can and do, on rare occasions dress up but I'm still going to be wearing pants.. and there's not going to be any sequins. I'll be wearing luxury fibers and I'll be feeling very fancy and formal, I will have even put a good bit of time into trying to tame my hair, although it's not likely to be evident :(.. humidity hates me.. but people in floor length sparkly dresses will probably not think I'm as fancy as I feel. I don't sparkle. ever. my personality now.. that sparkles. :) talk to me. you'll see. :)

 

but if I need to be excluded from formal night.. that's OK. I will be semi-formal. with the personal choice format they could quite easily require absolutely formal in traditional dining.. traditional people probably are big on tradition.. and formal is traditional. :) and there's 2 PC dining rooms on the big ships, they could also make one absolutey formal that night and the other one semi-formal and anybody who can't be bothered to get dressed more than usual can do the buffet that night. they could have a fancier than normal buffet that night too and everybody would be happy, I bet.

 

but.. to a lot of people.. men people, formalwear is not a tuxedo. you can exclude me as fancy as I get and I won't cry as long as I still get the opportunity to enjoy being way fancier than ever even if it's not as fancy as you.. and as long as I get fancy dinner for dressing up! :) but you don't want to exclude people in their cultural fancy dress from formal night.. penalize me because I won't wear sequins.. or a dress.. that's my choice and I'll live with the consequences but don't exclude the people in their cultural fanciest..

 

anno

[dolphin8497]

Just to add to this chaos...my boyfriend and I are taking our 4th cruise in three years, we have always done formal night but this time we are not. the pictures look the same since neither of us has changed much in three years and honestly on vacation I want to be comfortable...we dress for work each day, I don't want to have to dress for dinner...besides last year I almost broke an ankle in those damn heels because the boat was rocking. This vacation is pure relaxation so on the 8/12 caribbean there will be at least 2 people in the buffet on formal night. sorry if that ticks people off but like someone said...it is our vacation and we want to be comfortable...by the way it is recommended dress...not required dress.

[bjboothman]

The evening is ruined when we walk into the princess theatre after traditional late dinner, order an after dinner cordial and have some idiot in jeans shorts and a tank top sit down in front of us with his Miller Light beer can.

 

 

Well, what if that idiot ate at the Horizon Court or pizza buffet for dinner? Thought those were options for those not wanting to dress formally to dine in the traditional dining rooms? You want him to put a tux on to play slots? Just being the devil's advocate here, as I always dress up for formal night - and have never considered the evening RUINED when someone else does not.

[fti]

Unfortunately this will end up being another "formal wear" thread. They are certainly fun to read!

 

On our Diamond Princess cruise the cruise director asked everyone in the atrium one night about formal/informal and I was somewhat surprised that the applause for no formal nights was quite a bit more than for having formal nights. Not that such an "informal" poll (no pun intended) will change anything. But honestly, I think Princess will have to rethink their formal nights sometime in the foreseeable future if well more than half of their customers would prefer to do without it.

 

I see no reason in allowing those who want it to dress formally and those who don't, to not. I dressed up and certainly enjoyed it on our cruise. But apparently some of those who really want to keep formal nights are offended if everyone else in their dining room is also not so dressed.

 

And for those not interested in formal nights to just cruise a different line is not always an option - some cruise lines have specific itineraries that some people prefer.

 

Let the arguments continue. :)

[fti]

I am sorry, but this is a hot button for me.

 

The evening is ruined when we walk into the princess theatre after traditional late dinner, order an after dinner cordial and have some idiot in jeans shorts and a tank top sit down in front of us with his Miller Light beer can.

 

And then go to the casino and have to stand next to the same idiot at the craps table.

 

Obviously it is a hot button and you have strong opinions :D :D

 

It is unfortunate that an entire evening of your cruise can be ruined in such a small way. Fortunately I am not quite as sensitive.

[rob.potter]

requiring tuxedos disregards the formalwear of other cultures..

 

I'm a really un-fancy person. I can and do, on rare occasions dress up but I'm still going to be wearing pants.. and there's not going to be any sequins. I'll be wearing luxury fibers and I'll be feeling very fancy and formal, I will have even put a good bit of time into trying to tame my hair, although it's not likely to be evident :(.. humidity hates me.. but people in floor length sparkly dresses will probably not think I'm as fancy as I feel. I don't sparkle. ever. my personality now.. that sparkles. :) talk to me. you'll see. :)

 

but if I need to be excluded from formal night.. that's OK. I will be semi-formal. with the personal choice format they could quite easily require absolutely formal in traditional dining.. traditional people probably are big on tradition.. and formal is traditional. :) and there's 2 PC dining rooms on the big ships, they could also make one absolutey formal that night and the other one semi-formal and anybody who can't be bothered to get dressed more than usual can do the buffet that night. they could have a fancier than normal buffet that night too and everybody would be happy, I bet.

 

but.. to a lot of people.. men people, formalwear is not a tuxedo. you can exclude me as fancy as I get and I won't cry as long as I still get the opportunity to enjoy being way fancier than ever even if it's not as fancy as you.. and as long as I get fancy dinner for dressing up! :) but you don't want to exclude people in their cultural fancy dress from formal night.. penalize me because I won't wear sequins.. or a dress.. that's my choice and I'll live with the consequences but don't exclude the people in their cultural fanciest..

 

anno

 

I would respectfully disagree. If you don't want to dress formally as defined by Princess (EVENING GOWNS FOR WOMEN, TUXEDO OR DARK SUIT FOR MEN), then consider other options. NCL has cruises with NO formal nights. You know these recommendations prior to boarding the ship, why should there be any questions about what to wear on FORMAL EVENING other than the color of the GOWN.

 

Rob

[rob.potter]

Obviously it is a hot button and you have strong opinions :D :D

 

It is unfortunate that an entire evening of your cruise can be ruined in such a small way. Fortunately I am not quite as sensitive.

 

Yes, I conceed times have changed and I haven't. I know as time goes on, I become the minority and may need to select a different cruise line to maintain my formal evening preference.

 

If Princess is not going to enforce the evening attire suggested dress, then why print it.

 

JMHO

 

Rob

[Tom O.]

Well so far my idea doesn't sound very popular. It seems that all the criticism is coming from people who really like formal night, as I do.

As a fromal night person I really don't want to make any changes either. But, the way I see it, so many people ignore the dress code, and Princess and maybe other cruise lines as well, are lax in enforcing it, that formal night will just whither away and disappear. Remember when you had to dress nice to go to a nice landbased restaurant? If varies with location, but if I wear a suit to a nice restaurant in California, I will be the only one dressed that way. Yes there will be lots of jeans and even shorts there.

I am afraid that Princess and other lines as well, will someday just give up on it and say that formal night is optional.

At least with my plan there will still be a formal dining experience, and if it was instigated, there would be no plan to make formal wear optional.

As for the rest of the ship being mixed casual and formal. It is that way already. You can cringe all you want at someone sitting next to you in shorts in the theater. They are there, they are not going away, and Princess is not going to do anything about them.

It is us formal folks that are endangered. When the cruise lines makes formal wear voluntary, we will disappear like we did in landbased restaurants.

At least with my plan there will be a place where we can still meet and enjoy a fine tradition.

[pollyanno]

I would respectfully disagree. If you don't want to dress formally as defined by Princess (EVENING GOWNS FOR WOMEN, TUXEDO OR DARK SUIT FOR MEN), then consider other options. NCL has cruises with NO formal nights. You know these recommendations prior to boarding the ship, why should there be any questions about what to wear on FORMAL EVENING other than the color of the GOWN.

 

Rob

 

you don't think kilts for the scots and barongs for the filipinos and.. whatever other formal dress in other cultures are named.. I'm sorry, those are the only male ones come to mind this late at night.. but you don't think that qualifies as formal? not fancy dress by your standards?

 

ok..

 

they can dine with me then. :) I can understand ME not living up to your standards of formal (although I will be pretty fancy and it won't much bother me, at that point, that you're offended) but I think whatever attire is the most formal of formal in anyone's personal culture should be substitutable for a tuxedo in any formal situation. It would at any international political gala..

 

anno

[rob.potter]

Well, what if that idiot ate at the Horizon Court or pizza buffet for dinner? Thought those were options for those not wanting to dress formally to dine in the traditional dining rooms? You want him to put a tux on to play slots? Just being the devil's advocate here, as I always dress up for formal night - and have never considered the evening RUINED when someone else does not.

 

Excelent point bjboothman. I guess this is where I am in the minority big time. The patter says "suggested evening attire". It does not say "only if you go to traditional dining room" or "except if you go to horizon court or pizzaria". I have always interpreted this as the "entire evening" and in " all public areas of the ship".

 

I am sure I will get flamed for that interpretation. LOL

 

Rob

[bdjam]

I would respectfully disagree. If you don't want to dress formally as defined by Princess (EVENING GOWNS FOR WOMEN, TUXEDO OR DARK SUIT FOR MEN), then consider other options. NCL has cruises with NO formal nights. You know these recommendations prior to boarding the ship, why should there be any questions about what to wear on FORMAL EVENING other than the color of the GOWN.

 

Rob

Rob – I’ll send you a pair of my asbestos britches - you can throw 'em on when the flaming starts. :)

But, the way I see it, so many people ignore the dress code, and Princess and maybe other cruise lines as well, are lax in enforcing it, that formal night will just whither away and disappear.

I don’t think so many people ignore the dress code. I think the majority of passengers do dress and I think the majority who don’t aren’t hanging out with the rest of us. I see very few people who are not dressed for the majority of formal nights on my cruises.

 

I think the anti-formal sentiment is loud on Cruise Critic – so much so that it seems to be bigger than it really is.