HAL's Tipping Policy

[Jim Gallup]

Rita,

 

Your opinions are very logical and well-thought out.

I agree with you completely. Many of these processes and traditions don't entirely make sense.

 

The 100 year old tradition of forcing total strangers to eat dinner together at the same table every night on a cruise ship is one of those traditions that just doesn't make sense. If a restaurant owner tried the same thing on land, he would be out of business in a week. But many ships still do it, and many of us (myself included) are quite happy that they continue to go thorough this illogical procedure.

 

Serving Hot Bullion every morning at sea on the North Atlantic was a great idea. But several cruise lines do it in the tropics as well! Where is the sense in taking people outside on a hot humid day and feeding them hot soup? Yet, there are long queues of passengers out on the decks, waiting for the soup every cruise.

 

So many people want to have dinner with the ship's captain. Why? He is just the driver, isn't he? Do they also want to have dinner with the pilot who flew them to the port, or the bus driver who drove them from the airport? Maybe the taxi driver too? I'm sure that all of them would have great stories to tell.

 

There are thousands more examples of traditional behaviour that just doesn't make sense. The cruise ships force the passengers to directly pay the salaries of the ship's crew. This is definitely not logical and many complain about it. But most Hotels and Restaurants in North America do the same thing. Very few complain about that. Why? Isn't it pretty much the same thing?

 

Thre is a very strong (and very logical ) movement to force the 250 cruise ships on this planet to be operated in an environmentally correct way. That's a wonderful thing. But guess who is policing them? The worst marine polluter in the world. The US Navy. They have THOUSANDS of ships with no pollution controls of any kind. They dump every bit of nuclear, petroleum, sewage, food, plastic and every other kind of waste straight into our oceans. And nobody can force them to stop. Is this logical? Does it make any sense?

 

The National Restaurant Association estimates that it costs an American restaurant around $1.50 to serve a glass of ice water. Yet they always serve it free. But if they add $.03 worth of chemicals and artificial flavoring to it, they charge $2.00. Why? Does that make sense?

 

Does anyone really believe that a Starbucks Coffee is worth $5?

 

Why would anyone put a set of salt and pepper shakers, each holding a three year supply of salt and pepper on a table in a public restaurant? The contents will surely get stale, tasteless, contaminated with who knows what sort of bacteria and germs. Every day or so a waiter comes by and "tops them off". In many restaurants the contents are probably 10 years old. Sure a few places clean them out every now and then, but many others do not.

This is insanity. But it goes on and on.

 

These are all strange behaviours that have been going on for a very long time. They are well established traditions that most everyone is quite comfortable with. Do you think that you or I will ever be able to say or do anything that will force them to change?

[newmexicoNita]

If they're paying taxes to the U.S. tips must be reported as income too, unless they cheat.

Not so; only a portion are reported. NMNita

[kakalina]

Rita,

 

Your opinions are very logical and well-thought out.

I agree with you completely. Many of these processes and traditions don't entirely make sense.

 

The 100 year old tradition of forcing total strangers to eat dinner together at the same table every night on a cruise ship is one of those traditions that just doesn't make sense. If a restaurant owner tried the same thing on land, he would be out of business in a week. But many ships still do it, and many of us (myself included) are quite happy that they continue to go thorough this illogical procedure.

 

Serving Hot Bullion every morning at sea on the North Atlantic was a great idea. But several cruise lines do it in the tropics as well! Where is the sense in taking people outside on a hot humid day and feeding them hot soup? Yet, there are long queues of passengers out on the decks, waiting for the soup every cruise.

 

So many people want to have dinner with the ship's captain. Why? He is just the driver, isn't he? Do they also want to have dinner with the pilot who flew them to the port, or the bus driver who drove them from the airport? Maybe the taxi driver too? I'm sure that all of them would have great stories to tell.

 

There are thousands more examples of traditional behaviour that just doesn't make sense. The cruise ships force the passengers to directly pay the salaries of the ship's crew. This is definitely not logical and many complain about it. But most Hotels and Restaurants in North America do the same thing. Very few complain about that. Why? Isn't it pretty much the same thing?

 

Thre is a very strong (and very logical ) movement to force the 250 cruise ships on this planet to be operated in an environmentally correct way. That's a wonderful thing. But guess who is policing them? The worst marine polluter in the world. The US Navy. They have THOUSANDS of ships with no pollution controls of any kind. They dump every bit of nuclear, petroleum, sewage, food, plastic and every other kind of waste straight into our oceans. And nobody can force them to stop. Is this logical? Does it make any sense?

 

The National Restaurant Association estimates that it costs an American restaurant around $1.50 to serve a glass of ice water. Yet they always serve it free. But if they add $.03 worth of chemicals and artificial flavoring to it, they charge $2.00. Why? Does that make sense?

 

Does anyone really believe that a Starbucks Coffee is worth $5?

 

Why would anyone put a set of salt and pepper shakers, each holding a three year supply of salt and pepper on a table in a public restaurant? The contents will surely get stale, tasteless, contaminated with who knows what sort of bacteria and germs. Every day or so a waiter comes by and "tops them off". In many restaurants the contents are probably 10 years old. Sure a few places clean them out every now and then, but many others do not.

This is insanity. But it goes on and on.

 

These are all strange behaviours that have been going on for a very long time. They are well established traditions that most everyone is quite comfortable with. Do you think that you or I will ever be able to say or do anything that will force them to change?

 

The examples you use are so different from the subject I can't understand where the apples and oranges are coming from.

 

Rita makes several valid points and I for one agree with her. I've several friends on the housekeeping staff and they have informed me that they make way less in tips now than they did under the old policy. They don't like it, many of us don't like it, but that is the way it is. They have told me that now the vast majority of the people that leave the auto tip in place feel that they have tipped and nothing more is or should be expected. In the long run this cuts down on their total income.

[Jim Gallup]

Kakalina,

 

The apples and oranges rationale stems from the fact that many cruisers object to:

 

1) Pooled Tips

2) Cruise Lines forcing passengers to directly pay the crew salaries

 

These are age-old traditions that don't seem to make sense to many cruisers. Logically speaking (at least to someone on the outside looking in), they don't make a lot of sense. If we had the power to change things right now, we could probably come up with a system today that might work a lot better. But that is not about to happen. These are time-tested, etched in stone, traditional behaviours that - although they may not be the most efficient, logical, or even cost effective methods - work most of the time for most of the parties involved.

Rita, I, and many others can rant, rave, kick our feet, pout, cry, beg, threaten, and do just about anything else that we want. But the same old show will continue so long as the majority of those involved are satisfied with the results. There are usually extremely good reasons why traditions become traditions. It takes an enormous reason to change them.

 

You know several housekeeping staff who claim they are making less money with the new tipping system. I am assuming that they are telling you the truth - rather than telling the usual story they use to get a few more dollars out of your pocket. I know several THOUSAND housekeepers on several different cruise lines who tell me they are making far more money with the new system. They could be fibbing as well, however.

 

So let's look at reliable numbers rather than speculation or stories from a few people we know. We need to realize that one of the major reasons for putting this auto-tipping system in place on all the mass market cruise lines was reducing staff turnover due to reduced tip income. The entire cruise industry is rapidly approaching a point where people from developing countries are no longer entirely thrilled to be working 18 hours a day for 12 months with no days off, far away from home and family, earning about half of what they did for the same job 20 years ago, and sometimes taking major personal abuse from North American cruisers, as a desirable profession. Current projections show a shortfall of nearly 200,000 cruise industry service workers over the next decade. Several cruise line presidents are sweating bullets right now over what they can do to not only keep existing trained workers, but also attract new ones. It doesn't look so promising right now.

The first step in solving this major challenge is continuing this age-old tradition of the passengers directly paying the salaries of the crew. Don't ask me to defend this practice. I don't make the decisions. All the mass market lines have decided to stick with a program that they know, and are comfortable with. Most of th ecrew and passengers are comfortable with it as well after 100 years of practice.

The second step in solving this employment problem is slowly (with minimum fuss, pain, notice, or aggravation) coercing cruisers to pay a bit more to the onboard service staff. The auto-tipping system has increased the overall onboard tipping pool by about 30% for nearly all the mass market lines, by making it more difficult and slightly uncomfortable for those who easily declined to tip anything in the past.

 

How do we know - or think we know - that this is working?

1) Over the past 5 years, with the auto-tipping nearly everywhere, turnover of ship's service staff on most mass market lines has declined quite dramatically. The overall increase in tips appears to be the reason for this. We can find no other reason.

2) Whenever we query the crew on their opinion of the new system, many tell us they prefer it, a few have no comment. But rarely do we hear anyone tell us they do not like it. While you might assume that they are shy or afraid to talk, you should also be aware that these same people are hardly shy about complaining about a crew messroom menu item, an extended contract, or the fact that a girlfriend has been assigned to another ship. When it comes to something as important as money, you can be sure that we would hear about it very loudly and suddenly if their earnings fell based on a new program or procedure.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Jim Gallup, you won't believe this:) but I really appreciate your input on this subject that has been stomped to death here on more than one occasion and as you say it probably will be again.

 

Personally, I'm not crazy about the current system. We like to go to the people we feel gave us extra service, give them our tip and know that it will rest in their hands forever.

 

But you're right. It's sort of like giving a gift. When we give a gift it's not up to us to decide what the receiver does with that gift. They can keep it and use it, give it to a friend, or throw it away. The gift is in the giving.

 

I do hope sincerely that the decision about whether the tips we give directly (over and above the auto-tip) to our Stewards are pooled is made by the Stewards and not the people they report to.

 

That would be the only issue for me at this point in time.

 

Thank you again, Jim, for your posts about this. Sure wish it would put it to rest, but it won't;) .

[kryos]

You know several housekeeping staff who claim they are making less money with the new tipping system. I am assuming that they are telling you the truth - rather than telling the usual story they use to get a few more dollars out of your pocket. I know several THOUSAND housekeepers on several different cruise lines who tell me they are making far more money with the new system. They could be fibbing as well, however.

I would imagine whether they are making more or less money would depend on several factors ... and two housekeeping staff members could report differently, with both of them being honest.

 

If a cabin steward is working a station in the lower cabin decks, I would imagine he probably is making more under the new system. Previous to the auto-tip he very well may have gotten stiffed by a lot of his passengers, either because they were simply too cheap, or because they honestly couldn't understand the need to tip more than they would in a budget hotel ... a dollar or two per day. These people honestly don't know what an "appropriate" tip on a cruise ship would be, and can only compare with what they would leave the housekeeper at the end of their stay in a budget hotel in Orlando. Many of these people have never cruised before, so their ignorance would be understandable. Under the auto-tip, the cruise line is finally telling these people what is truly appropriate ... $10 a day per person will adequately cover all of your service people. Those passengers may grumble a bit about it ... but generally they will leave the auto-tip alone rather than have to face the staff at the purser's desk when they remove it. So, in this case, the cabin stewards are probably getting more money today than they did in the past. I don't doubt it.

 

Contrast this, though, with a cabin steward working a station on the upper decks ... the more expensive accommodations. Chances are he has a more "monied" cruiser in those accommodations ... i.e., a more "saavy" cruiser. These people are willing to tip well if they receive top notch service. They are used to tipping well and since they are well-traveled, they know what an appropriate tip would be and have no problem leaving it. The cabin steward working these cabins, I have no doubt, is making less today than he did in the past. That's because if he gets an extra cash tip from these people, which he likely will, he has to turn it over into the pool for distribution to everyone ... even those stewards on the lower decks struggling to maintain 18 or so cabins every day. In the past, that cash tip would be his ... maybe only shareable with his assistant and maybe a small percentage of "behind the scenes" people ... say 20% to the assistant and 10% pooled. Since I would imagine the cabin stewards working in the luxury suites have less suites to take care of, they are able to provide top notch service, and their tips would generally be more at the end of the week. The ones working in the more "budget" accommodations would be caring for a lot more cabins and thus not be able to provide much more than basic service. Their tips would be much lower, and in some cases they would be stiffed. Now, things are being evened out. All of the stewards are making pretty much the same money ... and that means some are getting more than they used to, while others are getting less ... in some cases far less.

 

Waitstaff would be in the same boat. Some are very good, while some are so-so. The very good waiters, who maybe had primarily suite passengers at their stations are probably getting less today with the auto-tip than they did in years past. Again, they are spreading the money evenly among all of their fellow waiters ... since they now have to share their tips with the "pool."

 

So I don't think any of these people are "fibbing" when they compare their earnings pre-autotip and post-autotip. Some of them ARE making more, while others are making less.

 

And, lest you think I am exaggerating when I say some people ... either because they are simply cheap, or else because they honestly don't know ... will "stiff" their service people ... just think back pre-autotip to how dining was handled on the last night of the cruise. I am sure you will recall that HAL had to close all alternative dining venues, and I assume room service, on the last night of the cruise in order to force people to go to the dining room if they wanted to eat. Why was that? Obviously, because given the choice many people would have opted to just eat in the Lido that night rather than have to be shamed into handing a tip envelope to their waitstaff. I'm sure the experienced cruiser ... the person who has the money to travel frequently and book the better accommodations ... had no problem tipping his wait staff. But the majority of passengers on your typical mass market line cruise ship are not experienced cruisers, and are certainly not "monied." They are on a budget and if they can avoid something like tipping, they certainly will. Hence, they had to be forced into the dining room on that last night, though forcing them to hand a tip envelope to their waiter or cabin steward certainly didn't guarantee the amount contained within would be anywhere near adequate. So, as you can see ... even with waiters ... their experience pre and post-autotip could be different.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Jim Gallup]

Rita,

 

Excellent point. And very often the case.

[hammybee]

If a cabin steward is working a station in the lower cabin decks, I would imagine he probably is making more under the new system. Previous to the auto-tip he very well may have gotten stiffed by a lot of his passengers, either because they were simply too cheap, or because they honestly couldn't understand the need to tip more than they would in a budget hotel ... a dollar or two per day. These people honestly don't know what an "appropriate" tip on a cruise ship would be, and can only compare with what they would leave the housekeeper at the end of their stay in a budget hotel in Orlando. Many of these people have never cruised before, so their ignorance would be understandable.

 

Contrast this, though, with a cabin steward working a station on the upper decks ... the more expensive accommodations. Chances are he has a more "monied" cruiser in those accommodations ... i.e., a more "saavy" cruiser. These people are willing to tip well if they receive top notch service. They are used to tipping well and since they are well-traveled, they know what an appropriate tip would be and have no problem leaving it.

Blue skies ...--rita

 

I am overwhelmed with some of the generalizations within this posting.

Is there an underlying assumption that those who sail in lower priced cabins are more likely to stay in budget motels and therefore not understand protocol? Or that those staying in more expensive accommodations are monied and therefore knowledgable, savvy?

 

Some of the most seasoned cruisers I know, on this board and in real life, choose less costly cabin accommodations and they are highly knowledgable.

 

Conversely,sailing in a higher priced cabin has nothing to do with experience, value systems or knowledge and the perception of money does not make a cruiser savvy. The credit card is the great equalizer in our economy.

[jtl513]

Rita re: #48 - AAAAmen! My feelings exactly! And there's a mess of land job holders that currently expect tips that I feel needn't be tipped either. Why should I tip any person who does nothing for me that exceeds the job that s/he's being paid for? Of course if there was some above-and-beyond done that you want to show your appreciation for that's a different story.

[Jim Gallup]

hammybee,

 

When a new cabin steward comes to a ship, he is assigned a section in an area with the lowest cabin categories (lowest as in least desirable and least expensive). The cruise lines know that the occupants of these cabins are usually (not always) more demanding but actually (not always) less discerning, generally (not always) complain far more often than those in better cabins, and generally (not always) tip far less. They also tend to rate the ship, services, and staff lower than the better cabins do. As the cabin steward "pays his dues" and hopefully survives his stay in purgatory, he is rewarded for his work and dedication by moving him up to better cabins. There he can have an easier time, with higher ratings (very important), and more money (even more important)in his pockets. The conventional thinking on this subject is that if he can perform well under trying conditions "down below", he will be that much better when his working challenges are reduced "upstairs".

[hammybee]

hammybee,.

 

You dance well :)

[kryos]

I am overwhelmed with some of the generalizations within this posting.

Is there an underlying assumption that those who sail in lower priced cabins are more likely to stay in budget motels and therefore not understand protocol? Or that those staying in more expensive accommodations are monied and therefore knowledgable, savvy?

The person who has more money obviously can travel more and thus is more "saavy" as far as items such as tipping. Of course, there are generalizations in my post. There are certainly exceptions to every rule. But I still say that those who stay in budget motels on land generally are those for whom their travel dollar is limited ... and believe me, I include myself in this group. I am not rich. If I can get a break on a hotel stay, by staying in a budget motel, I will certainly do it. The only reason I am more "saavy" that many other "budget" cruisers is because I read this board. I would never have known what an appropriate tip was without it ... especially in pre-autotip days.

 

Yes, credit cards are a great equalizer ... however, credit cards have limits, and people on more limited incomes (again, like myself) tend to be careful of those limits ... and make every dollar charged count.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

Rita re: #48 - AAAAmen! My feelings exactly! And there's a mess of land job holders that currently expect tips that I feel needn't be tipped either. Why should I tip any person who does nothing for me that exceeds the job that s/he's being paid for? Of course if there was some above-and-beyond done that you want to show your appreciation for that's a different story.

I've said this before, and I'll say it again. If I go into a restaurant and get something take-out ... i.e., I do not receive tableside service ... then I don't tip ... period. And I don't care if they've got that little cup at the register labeled tips. I won't put anything into it. Frankly, I'd sooner take my loose change and give it to a homeless person. But, then ... that's just me.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[jtl513]

And I don't care if they've got that little cup at the register labeled tips. I won't put anything into it. --rita

 

Right! And often in take-out food places you don't even get service deserving of a "thank you", never mind a tip! But before somebody jumps all over me (or us) about "waiters are underpaid, yadda yadda ..." I should say I'm talking about jobs where the base wage, before tips, is adequate and fair. Or small shops where the server is the owner who primarily sets the prices!

[kryos]

But before somebody jumps all over me (or us) about "waiters are underpaid, yadda yadda ..." I should say I'm talking about jobs where the base wage, before tips, is adequate and fair. Or small shops where the server is the owner who primarily sets the prices!

Exactly. In places like Dunkin Donuts, 7-Eleven, etc., the owners are required to pay the cashiers at least minimum wage because tips are ordinarily not a part of their income. So those people are being compensated.

 

You know what's hysterical? At least at the one main Dunkin Donuts I go to, the owner IS one of the cashiers. And, he's got that tip cup right in front of the register. In fact, I think it's pretty much a family-run operation ... with the family (owners) splitting the tips.

 

I rarely see much money in that cup. But it is obvious that some people do tip. Not me, though. I'm spending $3.09 on a regular basis there for one extra large and one small coffee ... even more if dad wants a donut. I think that's more than adequate for what I am getting, and all the cashier is doing is pouring it for me and ringing it up. Why tip?

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[AAAAmerican]

Exactly. In places like Dunkin Donuts, 7-Eleven, etc., the owners are required to pay the cashiers at least minimum wage because tips are ordinarily not a part of their income. So those people are being compensated.

 

You know what's hysterical? At least at the one main Dunkin Donuts I go to, the owner IS one of the cashiers. And, he's got that tip cup right in front of the register. In fact, I think it's pretty much a family-run operation ... with the family (owners) splitting the tips.

 

I rarely see much money in that cup. But it is obvious that some people do tip. Not me, though. I'm spending $3.09 on a regular basis there for one extra large and one small coffee ... even more if dad wants a donut. I think that's more than adequate for what I am getting, and all the cashier is doing is pouring it for me and ringing it up. Why tip?

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

 

Dunkin Donuts is all around in supermarkets even here too. My FIL (91) has never had a Dunkin Donut. The coffee brewed is a very good quality ..usually Arabica.. and I have seen the Tip Jars.. i do put in spare change in the Animal Charity Cans...

 

HAve you ever taken a paid for trip.. MotorCoach and the Driver demands a $5.00 USD tip from every rider?

 

That driver,too me, has Gaul.

 

But again it is still personal choice.. to Tip or Not to Tip is the question...((\?/))

:eek:

[kryos]

Dunkin Donuts is all around in supermarkets even here too. My FIL (91) has never had a Dunkin Donut. The coffee brewed is a very good quality ..usually Arabica.. and I have seen the Tip Jars.. i do put in spare change in the Animal Charity Cans...

 

HAve you ever taken a paid for trip.. MotorCoach and the Driver demands a $5.00 USD tip from every rider?

 

That driver,too me, has Gaul.

 

But again it is still personal choice.. to Tip or Not to Tip is the question...((\?/))

:eek:

Any driver, waiter, or whatever type of service person who "demands" a tip from me gets zilch ... even if I had otherwise intended to leave a tip.

 

Dunkin Donuts coffee is the greatest as far as I'm concerned. Dad loves it too. That's why we make sure to stop there for coffee a couple of times a week, even though the cost is rather high for what you get. Interestingly enough, though, I don't particularly care for their donuts, though dad enjoys some of them.

 

And yes, I will sometimes toss my spare change into one of the cans set up there at the register for charity. I'd sooner put my change in there than carry it around. But I have to admit that I often wonder if those "charity cans" really get back to the charity they are supposed to be helping. :(

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[AAAAmerican]

Any driver, waiter, or whatever type of service person who "demands" a tip from me gets zilch ... even if I had otherwise intended to leave a tip.

 

Dunkin Donuts coffee is the greatest as far as I'm concerned. Dad loves it too. That's why we make sure to stop there for coffee a couple of times a week, even though the cost is rather high for what you get. Interestingly enough, though, I don't particularly care for their donuts, though dad enjoys some of them.

 

And yes, I will sometimes toss my spare change into one of the cans set up there at the register for charity. I'd sooner put my change in there than carry it around. But I have to admit that I often wonder if those "charity cans" really get back to the charity they are supposed to be helping. :(

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

 

Well my favorite coffe is grown in..you guessed it only one place in the USA.. Hawaii. KONA is to me the very best. Kona here is about 20 a pound not the blend...

 

I so agree with you on the demand for tips.. is an attrocious act (IMHO) it is like begging..if I want to tip and I do then let me do so..

 

When a demand is made that to me is a form of hijacking.

 

Did you hear yesterday that Coffee at 5 cups a day helps and/or prevents alzheimers now in tests?

 

 

On the charity cans , yes I do know the animals ones ASPCA Humane Society .etcc.. do as each one is logged on to show where they are placed..

I am taking one of our dogs to a Physical ReHab center tommorrow night to bring some delight there.. Thearpy dogs help a lot of smiles carry on and laughs emerge...

 

Even in Churches poor Boxes are riffled in sometimes by desperate people which do need help in another way..

 

 

I do keep a meal guest reciept on my desk that a waitress had the Gaul to put in

(Sug gratuity $27.80)

 

Did you ever think if we were guests in a place why do you have to pay for the meal and a tip too?

 

But this explains it better than my spelling shall ever do..

 

<pre>

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition.

guest (gst) Pronunciation Key Audio pronunciation of "guest" [P]

n.

 

1. One who is a recipient of hospitality at the home or table of another.

2. One to whom entertainment or hospitality has been extended by another in the role of host or hostess, as at a party.

3. One who pays for meals or accommodations at a restaurant, hotel, or other establishment; a patron.

4. A distinguished visitor to whom the hospitality of an institution, city, or government is extended.

5. A visiting performer, speaker, or contestant, as on a radio or television program.

6. Zoology. A commensal organism, especially an insect that lives in the nest or burrow of another species.

 

<\pre>

[RoseM]

I have a question for anyone..........If I gave a long distance calling card, say like MCI. (which can be purchased at Sams Club or Costco) for various amounts, could I give this to the waiter or room stewart, without there having to put it in the tip pool?? :confused: :confused:

[michmike]

I really take exception to the generalizations regarding those of us who don't opt for the suite life. While we certainly don't qualify as frequent cruisers we generally go once a year and are booked for cruise #7 in 2 weeks. We did research the whole crusing thing before our first one and understood the common expectations re tipping and have always tipped appropriately and even generously to those who provide service that is above and beyond.

 

We all set our own priorities re how we spend our money. Some of us are perfectly content with an 1800 sq ft home and others who feel the need for McMansions, others of us who see a car as transportation and others who see it as a status symbol, etc.

 

We simply don't see the value in a balcony by and large and certainly don't see the value in a suite. On most sailings on HAL esp on R and S class, a balcony is roughly $600 more (for the 2 of us) than an outside cabin. That is roughly what my ship board tab is for a week. Could I afford the balcony? Sure.. but at the same time, that $600 will buy me a nice getaway weekend in Chicago later in the year. As for the suite, well that IS out of my price range.. at least in terms of our priorities.. but that doesn't mean I begrudge those who see it as important.

 

But please... there are plenty of us in steerage who are there by choice and we really won't show up in coveralls w/ holes in the knees and we have learned not to eat with our fingers or with our elbows on the table.. and we do understand the need to compensate service personnel properly in spite of the generalizations being tossed around here.

[michmike]

Actually it's not as bad as it would seem re the bus driver and the waitress as they are actually only getting a third of the money in question..

 

since, as we all know, Gaul is divided in 3 parts..

[HeatherInFlorida]

I have a question for anyone..........If I gave a long distance calling card, say like MCI. (which can be purchased at Sams Club or Costco) for various amounts, could I give this to the waiter or room stewart, without there having to put it in the tip pool?? :confused: :confused:

 

This question was raised before on one of a thousand tipping threads and I'm pretty sure someone advised us that the calling cards cannot be used all over the world so the gift may not be usable by the Stewards. Maybe someone else can shed light on that.

[HeatherInFlorida]

I really take exception to the generalizations regarding those of us who don't opt for the suite life. ..................

 

Michmike, I share your feelings concerning this. In fact I might suggest it goes a bit further than that, but I don't want to nitpick about it.

 

But I would suggest that if you notice it's a relative few here her do that. And most certainly it would be ridiculous for anyone to suggest that our choice of accommodations has anything whatsoever to do with our tipping habits.

 

It could even be said that there are people securing suite accommodations who have to eliminate tips because they used up all their $$$ on themselves;) ....... I'm kidding, folks!!!:D

 

Seriously, I always remember a wise woman who shall remain nameless telling me that how much money a person spends on anything has little to do with their financial status. She always used to tell me .... "Look for the woman in the ratty tweed coat".

 

So what is important to some is not to others. Where we spend our money is our business and no one else's.

 

But whether or not a person is fair or generous in tipping has nothing to do with the deck they're on.

[kryos]

Well my favorite coffe is grown in..you guessed it only one place in the USA.. Hawaii. KONA is to me the very best. Kona here is about 20 a pound not the blend...

I tried Kona coffee in, you guessed it, Kona ... in January. Sadly, I did not enjoy it. I can't even stand Starbucks coffee ... too rich. In fact, I can't drink Starbucks ... it, ahhhhhh, how can I say this delicately? ... gives me the runs. :)

 

Did you hear yesterday that Coffee at 5 cups a day helps and/or prevents alzheimers now in tests?

I don't doubt it. My dad drinks a lot of coffee. He is 92 and sharp as a tack ... both mentally and physically. With the exception of a bum knee ... which is a replacement knee from years ago ... he gets around better than I do. He wasn't stupid enough to bang himself up parachuting like I did. :( Dad lives with me and takes care of the whole house. Puts me to shame sometimes.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

I really take exception to the generalizations regarding those of us who don't opt for the suite life. While we certainly don't qualify as frequent cruisers we generally go once a year and are booked for cruise #7 in 2 weeks. We did research the whole crusing thing before our first one and understood the common expectations re tipping and have always tipped appropriately and even generously to those who provide service that is above and beyond.

When I made my "generalizations," I did not say necessarily people who reside in suites. I said the "upper level" accommodations. For some, "upper level" could be an outside cabin for one person (single supplement) on an upper deck. For a couple, it could be a suite ...

 

What I am "generalizing" about is the budget traveler who up to this point has never cruised. They take a trip and they stay in budget motels. They may not even be USED to tipping anything beyond a few dollars left with the check at the local IHOP. They like to stretch their travel dollar, and they don't see a need to dine in fancy restaurants in order to have a good time. There are those of us ... myself included ... who feel that way. Give me Denny's and I'm happy. I can't see the sense of dropping a hundred bucks or more for a meal in a "fine" restaurant. Yet, I will spend over $500 bucks to take an aerobatics airplane flight. It's all a matter of what we prefer ... how we can justify spending our hard-earned dollars.

 

All I am saying is that the budget traveler often is ignorant as to what is an appropriate tip on a cruise ship and what is not. They may have booked this first time cruise through a large travel agency, where they didn't get much personal counseling about the experience. Maybe this was a walk-in agency, and they dealt with a new agent who really didn't know a whole heck of a lot about cruising. She may have told them ... "yeah, they will add $10 per day for each one of you as tips ... but you are certainly under no obligation to let that stand. Just go down to the purser's desk on the last day of the cruise ... and tell them you want it removed." This "budget traveler" has no problem with that advice. After all, maybe she's traveling with children and $40 per day in tipping does seem a bit over the top to her.

 

I've told the story before on these boards about my first cruise ... a writer's conference on the Rotterdam. I roomed with a very young girl who had never been on a cruise ship in her life. She only took the cruise to be a part of the conference, and she was on a really, really tight budget. When the time came to tip (again, this was pre-autotip days), she asked me if I wanted to go in with her on the cabin steward's tip and put it in the same envelope. I said sure, and asked what she had in mind. She pulled out $20 and said here's my share. This was a ten-day cruise. I tried gently telling her that I think we needed to tip a bit more than that, and she told me under no uncertain terms that that is the most she could afford ... that and another $20 for her waiter ... and he would either take that or get nothing. She simply had no more to give. Others could say that maybe she shouldn't have taken the cruise then if she couldn't afford to tip. But did her travel agent counsel her in that manner? He may have said leave what you can afford ... so that's exactly what she was doing. I'm pretty sure she wasn't just being cheap ... she really appeared to be on a tight budget. She only did one shore excursion ... a group thing in Costa Rica ... and at the rest of the ports, she just got off the boat to walk around. I think she may have gone kayaking in one port ... but only then because she found someone to share a two-person kayak with and thus reduce her costs.

 

You did your research. But not everyone is as conscientious as you. We both read these boards, and because of that we are in the "know" about certain cruising traditions ... no babies in the pool, how much to tip, what to wear, etc. But how many first time cruisers do you think ever heard of Cruise Critic? I never heard of it before my first cruise, but I was lucky. I had a good travel agent who took a half an hour to explain things to me ... appropriate tipping (this was before the auto-tip), what kind of dress would be acceptable on formal nights, etc. Many first time cruisers don't have that. They go on the boat, hear about this $10 per day/per person thing ... say "Oh, my God! I didn't budget for that! That's $40 a day just for tips!" And, I can well understand and sympathize with them.

 

So, please understand ... I am not criticizing people or ridiculing the "budget traveler." After all, why would I? I am one. But, luckily, as a result of being a member of the Cruise Critic community, I'm not an uneducated budget traveler, and neither are you. Not everyone else is as lucky.

 

Now ... I just got home from work, so I'm gonna go take a nap. Dad and I are going out for another one of our fine dining experiences at Denny's in a few hours ... so I want to be ready. :)

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita