Finally The Truth on Crown Missing Bonaire -Jan 23rd

[Toto2Kansas]

WOW !

 

Let's see--Princess canceled Bonaire at least a week before arrival. So I would say that wind and weather were not the issue, or at least they were not used in the decision making process.

 

Our friends on the Summit informed us the next day in Aruba that the port was not congested. They were the only ship in port. We we scheduled to arrive at 11am and Summit at 1pm. They said that there was an empty berth in front of them.

 

On February 6th (the next time the Crown was scheduled in Bonaire), they docked with the Summit. See the attached picture.

 

February 20th (today), Crown and Summit were again in Bonaire together.

 

My opinion is very simple. Did they have a right to skip Bonaire for any reason per contract --YES. Did they have a right to charge us extra for the privilege of going to Isla Margarita (a much less desirable port) as per contract. YES.

 

Were we lied to by the Captain ---Yes, yes, yes.

 

In addition, speaking with several crew (who were in a position to know) indicated that they did not believe the Captain either.

 

I do have a question about all of this, as it has gone on and on and on. What would you like Princess to do for you to make up the missed port? I mean, there has to be a reason you continue to complain about missing Bonaire and I for one would like to know what you think Princess should do for YOU about this? Just curious!

[heartofamerica]

I do have a question about all of this, as it has gone on and on and on. What would you like Princess to do for you to make up the missed port? I mean, there has to be a reason you continue to complain about missing Bonaire and I for one would like to know what you think Princess should do for YOU about this? Just curious!

 

They should refund the $3.50 port charge. But that might tick him off more.

 

Given the information I found, I'd like to ask Dawg if he'b be willing to try to parallel park a $50,000 Escalade in a spot with less than 2 inches to spare. Because judging from what I found about the North Pier, I would imagine maneuvering a 910 foot cruise ship into a berth that has a recommended maximum length of 745 feet, with another cruise ship plus any other port traffic in the area, would be a lot like parking that Caddy in that small parking space. And yes - it would be "too congested" to try it.

 

I am sure that the guy polishing the rails is also qualified to park a cruise ship. The captain is a captain for a reason...one big reason is that he doesn't dent the ship trying to fit it into too tight of an area.

[CrusinAgain]

We are due to go on this same schedule in April. The Summit is not due to be there, in fact most ships are gone out of the Caribbean and this is the Crown's last cruise for the season for the Caribbean out of San Juan.

 

I would want the Captain to be truthful but no need to go into a lengthy detail as to why not. Princess hired him and he would have to have the credentials to sail that spendy precious ship with so many lives on it that Princess is taking responsibility for. As long as the Captain was expressing in the best terms he thought his passengers would understand then there should not be any problems. If a port has unrest there, hey just tell me, I can accept it and be thankful Princess is watching out for everyone's best interest. If something could happen to the ship at a port that isn't made for the ship and could end up doing harm to the ship and cause all sorts of mayhem to follow, I can accept it. The truth in simple terms is all I ask.

[wa.mama]

 

 

After confirming with the Harbor Master, we can confirm to you that the Crown Princess decided to change port due to the Captain of the vessel opting not to dock at the North pier. Instead Princess Cruise Lines decided to switch ports and visit Margarita on that day.

 

That's fine, he's the captain, he can do that, but....

 

It was announced on board the ship that we were canceled by the Port Authorities of Bonaire.

 

If the captain cancelled the port, then please, he should be upstanding and take the heat. Don't point the finger at someone else to avoid passenger complaints. A true captain would take responsibility for his actions.

 

BTW, Salty Dog, I'd be disappointed also. I'm a person who cruises to see the ports, vs a person who cruises just to cruise. Everyone makes such a big deal about choosing a cruise due to the "great itinerary"; I think if you choose this cruise because you wanted to visit Bonaire then it must have been a real letdown for you.

[Pam in CA]

If the captain cancelled the port, then please, he should be upstanding and take the heat. Don't point the finger at someone else to avoid passenger complaints. A true captain would take responsibility for his actions.

What should he take the heat for? The OP claims that the Captain lied but didn't show or provide anything that in any way indicate that the situation was anything other than what the captain said it was. Yes, there was probably more to it than "congestion" but the Captain isn't obliged to go into details. The OP is splitting hairs and has determined that "congestion" is only defined by the number of ships in port that day and that was the only reason. He hasn't provided ANY other information other than the emails he posted and those are so inconclusive and have absolutely nothing in them to indicate that the reason was anything but congestion.

 

I'm going to leave this thread alone. The OP doesn't seem to like the questions being asked or having to provide more detailed information. He's not going to be persuaded by facts or possibilities to explain "congestion."

[pinco]

i must admit that i like this debate and i must say that sometime there are reason that the passenger are not needed to know.

you are there to enjoy the cruise that is right but u need to relax because peoples on the bridge are working for you to guarantee your safety and not to show how good they are in getting a monster like the crown alongside. then just with 6ft under the keel it start to become a bit problematic to maneuver such beast.

so please before talking and jugging people get informed or get a full license and then we start talking.

[Shogun]

Hi Folks,

 

The captain of any large cruise ship is at the top end of captains as they have the lifes of thousands of people to deal with.

 

To that end I trust cruise ship captains., OK there may be a few bad ones out there some place, but when the captain has told me, that the sea is to rough, the wind to strong the tide not right I except with out question his call.

 

We have been late into ports a few times and have had to go to other ports , so what this is part cruising.

 

yours Shogun

[Ethel5]

I do have a question about all of this, as it has gone on and on and on. What would you like Princess to do for you to make up the missed port? I mean, there has to be a reason you continue to complain about missing Bonaire and I for one would like to know what you think Princess should do for YOU about this? Just curious!

 

I have to agree on this. WHAT is the OP trying to get from all this? To actually write to Bonaire to find out the exact reason for not docking there is a bit excessive IMHO. To call the Captain and cruise line liars is also over the top. I also find it hard to believe that crew members would tell a passenger that they didn't believe the Captain either!

 

It's time for the OP to cut his losses and move on.

[BruceMuzz]

Let me see if I understand this completely.

 

Someone is accusing the Captain of fabricating a story so he could skip a port - for whatever reasons - thereby burning an additional $50,000 or so of fuel to go to a more distant port, cancelling and refunding about $75,000 worth of shore tours, and being unable to re-schedule those tours in a port they never visit, upsetting 3,000+ passengers and causing them to rate his ship lower.

So his annual bonus, based on fuel consumption, financial performance of his ship, and overall passenger rating of his ship will now be lower.

 

Makes perfect sense to me.................................................if the Captain is completely insane.

 

To paraphrase Groucho Marx, "It's too bad that the people who really know how to run a a cruise line are so busy cutting hair, driving taxicabs - and posting on the internet".

[CruiseAholic]

Well, there were 2 ships scheduled at Bonaire that day, the other one being the Celebrity Summit. If it was at the pier that the Crown usually uses (probably paid higher port fees or someone messed up scheduling pierside), I believe that the depth of the North Pier is not as deep, why risk it?

 

I don't believe that Princess or the Captain lied.

[Sanibel*Gal]

I wonder what Captain Gisueppe Romano thinks of this.......:confused:

After all he is the Commodore of the company's 16-ship fleet!!!

[azdmelani]

I was also on this sailing. Was I upset I missed Bonaire? Yes, absolutely. Am I still harping on it a month later? No.

[Colo Cruiser]

i must admit that i like this debate and i must say that sometime there are reason that the passenger are not needed to know.

 

 

Great point. I agree. :)

[Salty Dawg]

The question was asked as to what I want Princess to do for me for their decision to cancel Bonaire.

 

The answer is there is nothing Princess can do about it for me. I don't want them to do anything for me.

 

What I want is a reply to my letter to them, indicating that they apologize for their not being forthcoming to their passengers about the incident, and that they have instructed their Captains to present as many details as necessary to the passengers regarding these type of incidents.

 

We have missed ports on other Princess ships, and other cruise lines, but those were for weather, mechanical issues, etc. We have found that some Princess Captains are very forthcoming with the passengers about these type of issues, but others hide behind obscure phrases like "port congestion".

 

So, we just want an apology from Princess and a promise to instruct and insist their Captains be forthcoming with the passengers.

 

Do we expect that to happen? No we don't. if and when we get a reply to the letter we sent to Princess, we will post it here.

[Toto2Kansas]

SD-They will send you an apology 'of sorts' but they will never, underline that word NEVER, tell you that their captains will from now on fully explain why ships miss port stops. So, I am sure you will not receive the satisfaction that you are looking for with this issue, sorry! :(

[Salty Dawg]

Toto--

 

I know that. I really don't expect that in their reply.

 

I'm the type of person that does not like liars. I will call anyone to task on that issue, whether it be a large company like Princess, or a friend, or salesman, etc.

 

It took me a while to gather what I felt was the necessary proof of the deception. This included obtaining verification from the port as to the reason for skipping it, pictures of the both ships in port on 2-6 and again on 2-20. This is why the post was not done right after returning from the trip.

 

Do I have "proof" beyond are reasonable doubt--probably not.

Do I have "proof" based on the preponderance of evidence. I believe I do without question.

[Toto2Kansas]

SD-Honestly, even with so called PROOF, it isn't going to do you one bit of good with the Cruise Lines. Missed ports, at their discression, is totally covered in the cruise contract. That is why I can't seem to understand why you can't let this go. They cover themselves completely when it comes to this issue. All you seem to be doing is frustrating yourself over and over again about something that all of the cruise lines do now, no matter which one you choose to sail with.

I agree, a liar ticks me off bigtime, I can handle everything in this world but two things, a liar or a thief, but this isn't lieing.

 

Port congestion means that the pier your ship was supposed to go to was full in the minds of the captain, and the captain didn't want to chance the smaller pier or attempt to pull in with the other ship already at the pier you were to actually dock at. This is PORT CONGESTION, even with only one other ship there. So, in fact, there was no lie. If the condtions of the ocean (even though looking great from your view) weren't what the captain wanted, he has that right.

 

Time to let it go. As my DH taught me long ago, why worry about something you have no control over and can not change? All you do is to frustrate yourself and loose sleep over it.

 

I really hope you just get over this instead of writing letters and expecting things you will not receive (a promise that in the future, the captain will be more 'honest' with the passengers), which will upset you even more when you don't get it.

[woodofpine]

If one doesn't like liars then one shouldn't throw the word around so easily or you may be accused of being one!

 

The pier that was satisfactory from a naval engineering standpoint for this ship was full; the master was offered a pier whose specifications were very pointedly unsuitable for the ship. (Aren't we glad the Master knew this rather than taking the port fee charging harbor master's word for it!). In failing to offer a SUITABLE pier, the Bonaire harbor authorities effectively cancelled Crown's call; all suitable piers were full.

 

The Captain's summary characterization of the situation as - island authority cancellation due to congestion - is NOT inaccurate. (The island authority offered no suitable pier; they were full.)

[Salty Dawg]

Toto--

 

I respect your opinion. I do realize not to expect much from today's cruise lines, as it is all about the money, not customer satisfaction. Whether it's Princess, RCL, Holland, or any other major mainstream cruise line. The bean counters rule, and customer satisfaction goes out the window.

 

My wife and I enjoy cruising, and this one missed port is not going to change that. I, like you, do not like a liar or a thief either. To you, it may not have been a lie, just not telling the complete truth. To me, not telling the complete truth is still a lie. But I guess I'm just old school. The world of today is all about the bottom line, not about the truth.

 

This will be my last post on the issue, unless Princess decides to answer my letter with something other than their usual "canned" response. I would share that response with the CC board.

[rjg41]

Slaty Dawg is barking up the wrong tree!

[Ethel5]

 

This will be my last post on the issue, unless Princess decides to answer my letter with something other than their usual "canned" response. I would share that response with the CC board.

 

Salty Dawg,

 

You have taken some heat and varied differences of opinions, including mine. I want to say "Thank You" for remaining a gentleman.:)

[M&MCruisin]

From reading this, I have come to this conclusion. First, we could argue that the Port Authorities are lying about what happened. Whose to say they are telling the truth and the captain isnt. Maybe they lied to the OP. In any case, I think it is entirely possible that the Port Authorities, for whatever reason, denied the ship to dock at the scheduled pier on this day. So many reaons could come in to play. I believe the Port Authorities then offered for the captain to park the ship at another pier or to anchor and tendor the people in. Being that the captain was not allowed to dock at the scheduled destination and the other options were not suitable in the captains eyes, then the captain decided to cancel Bonaire.

 

I definitely dont think the captain would cause such a huge expense to Princess if it wasnt absolutely necessary. I think its possible that the ones who are lying would be the ones that got hurt (financially) by this and that is the Port Authorities.

 

Hope the OP gets the letter he is looking for, but he should remember that if every time someone ticks us off or lies to us, we expect a written apology, the mail man is going to be super busy! Just my two cents worth.

[B40 Tha Cruisa]

To call the captain "a chicken" is a little rediculous. Because he did not want to risk injury to a 500 Million dollar ship. You cant just say, "Lets give this a try, I might only have 6 feet below me to spare, but hey its only a 500 Million dollar ship!"

[woodofpine]

To call the captain "a chicken" is a little rediculous. Because he did not want to risk injury to a 500 Million dollar ship. You cant just say, "Lets give this a try, I might only have 6 feet below me to spare, but hey its only a 500 Million dollar ship!"

 

I suspect that conforming to the coverage provisions of insurance policy covering Crown's hull was a 'little' bit higher priority to the Captain than getting salty Dog into the water diving (I supose he could've grounded the ship; that would proved he's not 'chicken' [insane maybe, but not 'chicken']).

 

If Crown had been damaged by the Captain 'attempting to dock at a pier that was fully known to the captain at the time to be substantially undersized and materially inadequate' for his ship, not only could HQ anticipate a notice of 'non-coverage' due to intentional wrongdoing from their insurer, one can just imagine the chorus of boos from all the cc salty dogs whose cruise was impacted...

[daveco58]

Your inability or unwillingness to understand or accept the statement made by the Captain, does not make the Capt's statement a lie. It merely makes the Capt's statement something you are unable or unwilling to understand or accept.

 

There is a huge difference in those two things. So far, your evidence that the Captain lied is based on statements from employees who are obviously not suited to Captain a ship - or they would be on the bridge, not talking to you, and statements from the Harbor Master who has as much motive as the Captain for engaging in deception.

 

So, what we have here is "the Captain says vs. the Harbor Master says vs. (who really gives a ....what some bobo chipping paint says)"

 

Simply not enough to accuse any of them of "lying".

 

In the meantime, even if they lied, and even if Princess writes you a letter and cops to a lie, and even if they instruct their Captains to refrain in the future from lying, EVEN IF all this occurs - are you any better off than you are today? Is it so important to you to be "right", and to bend everyone to your will, that you will actually materially improve your life if all this occurs? I don't think so.

 

All this is what me and my friends refer to as "milking a mouse" - A lot of effort for very little return