Craps Players Step Inside!

[Yo Eleven]

HELLO! I'm the female part of OCruisers! In land casinos I am always a wrong bettor! :D

 

I bet the Don't Pass ... then do two "Don't Come" bets ...naturally backing them up.

 

You are right about on cruise ships! Somehow, I have a hard time (and would not enjoy) betting against fellow passengers. :rolleyes:

Well hello there, female part. LOL I know that was wrong but I am a wrong better, right? Haha I got you marked down as another female don't pass player. Where are you ladies when I am at the tables? I need a crew to help out!

[teeredi2cruise]

Heh heh! That was a joke!! :D

 

The odds of rolling a 7 are 1/6 = 16.6667%. I don't keep track of my own personal rolling percentage, but just have no reason to believe it deviates from the average.

Nancy

 

LOL, did you hear the air go over my head on that one..... Wow sorry

[teeredi2cruise]

Well hello there, female part. LOL I know that was wrong but I am a wrong better, right? Haha I got you marked down as another female don't pass player. Where are you ladies when I am at the tables? I need a crew to help out!

 

Hey Yo,

 

(Hehe) We are taking over. I am excited to see so many knowledgeable ladies on the board. That's exciting. Any others?????

[Yo Eleven]

Hey Yo,

 

(Hehe) We are taking over. I am excited to see so many knowledgeable ladies on the board. That's exciting. Any others?????

I'm all for it. Come on out casino ladies. :)

[cruzincurt]

And to add further.....

 

Certainly like the fact that the ships (at least the ones I've been on) are still paying 3/2 on BJ.

 

Hope the 'Vegas 6/5 garbage doesn't spread to the sea !!!

 

I've been on ships recently (HAL I think) where the single deck blackjack was 6/5, the others still 3/2. And there were big betters at the single deck table.:confused: I saw single deck being offered so I sat down and played a hand before I realized the table was 6/5 and promptly got back up.

Edited July 12, 2009 by cruzincurt

[AndyTheK]

I've been on ships recently (HAL I think) where the single deck blackjack was 6/5, the others still 3/2. And there were big betters at the single deck table.:confused: I saw single deck being offered so I sat down and played a hand before I realized the table was 6/5 and promptly got back up.

 

A day that will live in infamy!!!

 

That's the point. I guess the big betters (cruise ship flavor) have heard that "Single deck is better" so they flock there without even thinking about what else is going on.

[AndyTheK]

Welcome to all the new posters on this board. Please forgive my delay in saying "hi" to you, but it will be another week or so that both sets of Grandkids are in the country visiting, and much of my time is taken up elsewhere LOL.

 

I stay away from all arguments about right/wrong play. My younger brother is a confirmed wrong player, and I learned a long time ago that to keep family harmony, we just don't discuss craps strategies. Last year we met up in Vegas (with an old high school buddy as well) and the three of us never played at the same table. My bud's DW played slots, my DB and SIL did horse book and craps, and my DW and I did blackjack.

 

PS - was first time I'd been to Vegas since the mid 1970's amd I am NOT IMPRESSED. Glitz? yes! Size? absolutely! Expensive? you bet your life! But I long for the days of the Sands, the Desert Inn, the Frontier.... with real SHOWS (Red Skelton, Dean Martin, Englebert... you name it they were there and we saw them). Sigh.

[Yo Eleven]

I stay away from all arguments about right/wrong play.

Now what fun is that? hehe :D

[jetwet1]

Yes you pretty much got it. These were at one time very popular in Vegas years ago. It was actually a 1/2 a craps table with stools around it. It was like having a private game as there were very few players at each table. They have all but vanished and finding them these days is rare. But the game is essentially exactly the same except you are playing half a table. Hope this helps.

 

 

Firstly I am using my phone to post, so I may be all over the place in my reply, sorry.

 

Ok, it's called a tub game, honestly it is fun for the player, but not much fun for the dealer.

 

In any pit I have run anyone being aggresive to another player gets a quick talking to, it just shouldn't happen, sure some fun ribing, but nothing to strong.

 

One thing to remember about dice dealers on the ships, for many of them the first time they have dealt the game is on a ship, the vast majority are learning as they go. They are taught the very basics and that's it.

 

Now IMHO the floor are not much better, there are off course exceptions.

 

Now any casino in the world will tell it's dealers rule # 1, don't listen to the player, this is due to the fact that if the player is wrong the dealer has nothing to fall back on as an excuse, however I have found the dice crews more inclinded to listen and I have even given a couple of lessons with the ok of the CM.

 

Btw, just a quick way to see as a player what you are dealing with, place a minimum of $20 a number ask to buy the 4,10 and 5,9 and see what they say. A lot of new dealers and heck players don't know you can buy the 5,9

[ZiggyKeys]

Firstly I am using my phone to post, so I may be all over the place in my reply, sorry.

 

Ok, it's called a tub game, honestly it is fun for the player, but not much fun for the dealer.

 

In any pit I have run anyone being aggresive to another player gets a quick talking to, it just shouldn't happen, sure some fun ribing, but nothing to strong.

 

One thing to remember about dice dealers on the ships, for many of them the first time they have dealt the game is on a ship, the vast majority are learning as they go. They are taught the very basics and that's it.

 

Now IMHO the floor are not much better, there are off course exceptions.

 

Now any casino in the world will tell it's dealers rule # 1, don't listen to the player, this is due to the fact that if the player is wrong the dealer has nothing to fall back on as an excuse, however I have found the dice crews more inclinded to listen and I have even given a couple of lessons with the ok of the CM.

 

Btw, just a quick way to see as a player what you are dealing with, place a minimum of $20 a number ask to buy the 4,10 and 5,9 and see what they say. A lot of new dealers and heck players don't know you can buy the 5,9

 

 

Buying the 4 & 10 on a $20 place bet.....

If the casino wants a buck up front then a buck after the number hits - NO, not a good wager

 

If it's buying the 4 or 10 for a Quarter - that's OK, but even better if you only pay the juice after the hit.

 

Zig (my 2 cents worth)

Edited July 15, 2009 by ZIGGYKEYS

[jetwet1]

Buying the 4 & 10 on a $20 place bet.....

If the casino wants a buck up front then a buck after the number hits - NO, not a good wager

 

If it's buying the 4 or 10 for a Quarter - that's OK, but even better if you only pay the juice after the hit.

 

Zig (my 2 cents worth)

 

Ok, $20 4 or 10, you have a choice, have it pay $36 or pay the buck up front, get paid $40, pay another buck to leave it up there, now I know where your coming from, the problem is, there are not many places that are now letting you pay the vig after the win, now :(

[RANTHEMAN]

Ok, $20 4 or 10, you have a choice, have it pay $36 or pay the buck up front, get paid $40, pay another buck to leave it up there, now I know where your coming from, the problem is, there are not many places that are now letting you pay the vig after the win, now :(

 

Reading you guys is exactly why I am reticent to even step up to a craps table. You are speaking Greek and I have no idea what you are saying.

I will stick to Bj's(cards and otherwise):D.Maybe not as exciting but at least I feel that I have a small idea what is going on.

 

Cheers to all!

Edited July 15, 2009 by RANTHEMAN

[NancyNM]

Ok, $20 4 or 10, you have a choice, have it pay $36 or pay the buck up front, get paid $40, pay another buck to leave it up there, now I know where your coming from, the problem is, there are not many places that are now letting you pay the vig after the win, now :(

 

An indian casino near me has (or at least did have last time I was there, and for many months before that) free buy on the 4 and 10, with no special minimum (i.e. you didn't need to buy it with $20, you could buy it with $5). This was printed right into the felt on the table layout, not some special short-term thing.

 

So, I could place $5 on the 4 and 10 and get paid $10 when it hits. Zero edge for the house. An amazing bet, and yet I was generally the only one taking advantage of it (other than people who were placing lots of numbers anyway). Naturally I modified my normal play style to include always placing those number! In fact the smartest thing would just be to sit there and only places those numbers, but that would be too boring.

 

The fact that so few people were taking advantage makes me ponder how willing people are to bet at a game they really don't understand at all....

Nancy

[NancyNM]

Reading you guys is exactly why I am reticent to even step up to a craps table. You are speaking Greek and I have no idea what you are saying.

I will stick to Bj's(cards and otherwise):D.Maybe not as exciting but at least I feel that I have a small idea what is going on.

 

Cheers to all!

 

Well, the nice thing about Craps is you can just ignore a lot of what's going on at the table and still play your game.

 

The Buy bets they were discussing are a pretty advanced thing that probably 90% of players don't have a clue about. And there is a lot of jargon that players use that may make it seem extra confusing...

 

It's not really a difficult game if you read a book about it and then just focus on making a few of the bets (preferably the ones with the lowest house edge, like pass/don't pass and come/don't come and placing/laying odds). And just ignore all the bets in the middle of the table and you are doing well.

 

Unfortunately I think a lot of novices gravitate towards the easy to understand bets, like the Field bet, big 6/8, hardways, etc. Unfortunately those bets all have huge house edges on them.... When I say huge I mean up to 15-20% house edge when normal passline is worst case 1.4% house edge (and gets lower the more odds you bet).

 

And if you play the game enough, you'll pick up knowledge about all the other bets you shouldn't be making, even if you never make them!

 

Here is a nice table I found by googling ("craps house edge"):

 

• 
  
• Pass/Come 1.41%
  
• Don't Pass/Don't Come 1.40%
  
• Pass + 1 x Odds 0.85%
  
• Pass + 2 x Odds 0.61%
  
• Pass + 5 x Odds 0.32%
  
• Pass + 10 x Odds 0.18%
  
• Pass + 100 x Odds 0.02%
  
• Field (2:1 on 12) 5.56%
  
• Field (3:1 on 12) 2.78%
  
• Any Craps 11.11%
  
• Big 6,8 9.09%
  
• Hard 4,10 11.11%
  
• Hard 6,8 9.09%
  
• Place (to win) 6,8 1.52%
  
• Place (to win) 5,9 4.00%
  
• Place (to Win) 4,10 6.67%
  
• Place (to lose) 6,8 1.82%
  
• Place (to lose) 5,9 2.50%
  
• Place (to lose) 4,10 3.03%
  
• Proposition 2,12 13.89%
  
• Proposition 3,11 11.11%
  
• Proposition 7 16.67%
  

The worst bet (from house edge POV) I will ever make is placing the 6/8 (1.52% house edge). Playing pass/come with 2x odds gets you ~0.6%.

 

On the other hand, people who bet "Big Red" (Proposition 7 -- a one roll bet that the 7 will roll. Odds are 6-to-1 and it pays 4-to-1) are giving the house a whopping 16.67% edge! Popular bets like "any craps", "yo/11" and "hard ways" have ~10% house edge. No thanks for me!

 

So if you want to learn craps, focus on pass/come or don't pass/don't come (all with odds) and you will find the game much easier to understand, and also will be playing it to your best advantage!

 

Start by just understanding the passline bet with odds, because come bets work exactly the same way, just starting from a different die roll.

Nancy

[jetwet1]

Nancy, if the casino is letting you buy the 4,10 then pay the vig after, you would be a fool not to take advantage.

[NancyNM]

Nancy, if the casino is letting you buy the 4,10 then pay the vig after, you would be a fool not to take advantage.

 

No, there is NO VIG! They have a buy (place) bet, minimum $5 that pays off at true odds. I bet $5, I win $10 -- that's it!

 

Yes, it's crazy, but true!

 

Nancy

[jetwet1]

No, there is NO VIG! They have a buy (place) bet, minimum $5 that pays off at true odds. I bet $5, I win $10 -- that's it!

 

Yes, it's crazy, but true!

 

Nancy

 

Oh wow, well hell though it's not such a good bet, you kind of have to.

[ZiggyKeys]

Damn, these injuns are blowing some money. Just wait their bean counters let thme know what it's costing them. It'll probably change.

[jetwet1]

Damn, these injuns are blowing some money. Just wait their bean counters let thme know what it's costing them. It'll probably change.

 

A mutual hatred for bean counters

[ETski]

Yo Eleven,

I have been usuing your on line craps.com site in an attempt to learn the ways of the dark side. I want to add to my understanding of the game not that I would ever have the b@!!$ to do it on the table as I am to new at this. Any way to my question. I put my bet on the don't pass then take double the odds when the point is made. Then just sat there and waited till a seven was rolled or the point was made. rather boring. What other bets can be made (if there are any) to increase my bank roll. I still have to figure out the pay offs so as not to be cheated by the dealer.

Maybe it would be easier if you just explained what you do when you come to the table. Don't have to give away any secrets just the basics.

Sorry for the long winded post.

ed :D

[Yo Eleven]

Yo Eleven,

I have been usuing your on line craps.com site in an attempt to learn the ways of the dark side. I want to add to my understanding of the game not that I would ever have the b@!!$ to do it on the table as I am to new at this. Any way to my question. I put my bet on the don't pass then take double the odds when the point is made. Then just sat there and waited till a seven was rolled or the point was made. rather boring. What other bets can be made (if there are any) to increase my bank roll. I still have to figure out the pay offs so as not to be cheated by the dealer.

Maybe it would be easier if you just explained what you do when you come to the table. Don't have to give away any secrets just the basics.

Sorry for the long winded post.

 

ed :D

Hey ed!!!!!

Let me see if I can provide some info to answer your question and give you some insight on what I do so I don't reveal any of my secrets. :D

Even if I posted exactly what I do, it won't make sense anyway. You would actually have to watch me so I can explain word for word. But let me try it like this.

Well for starters, the computer game can get boring mostly because it isn't for REAL money. Play it at the craps table and when you get paid I will guarantee you won't be bored.

Now it appears you played very basic strategy, here. That being playing the don't and backing the point with double odds and waiting for the big seven.

Now what you can do to add a little excitement to the table and maybe get the dealers to like you and when you feel the time is right on the COME OUT ROLL, put your don't pass bet and toss a couple of dollars onto the YO ELEVEN! If the eleven rolls out you lose your don't pass but WIN 15:1 on the YO. So if you had 15 dollars on the don't pass, and a dollar on the YO. You would have hedged your bet and not lose any money on the roll. Of course if the point is rolled, you lose the dollar on the YO. But so what. You have the advantage now as it is more probably a seven will be rolled before the point. Now, if you wanna make the dealers smile, throw two dollars on the YO on the come out roll and say, "2 Dollar Yo-One for me and one for you" This means you are better a dollar for yourself and one for the dealers. If it hits you win your 15 dollars and the dealers end up with a nice tip of 16 dollars total on that one roll. They will be your best friend. But don't do it all the time as remember a YO doesn't come out often enough to make betting on it profitable.

 

Now once you get your don't pass point. Go ahead and try to obtain a Don't Come Point. After the initial point is rolled. Place your double odds in the back of the don't pass bet and place a new bet in the small box called "Don't Come." If you want toss out a YO ELEVEN here if you wish. The Don't Come bet is SEPARATE from the don't pass but acts exactly like a brand new Come Out roll. So if a 2, 3 is rolled it wins. A seven or eleven you lose. Pushes on a 12. But if you have the YO out you would win 15 to 1 for the same reasons I described for the Don't Pass bet you had.

Now let's say now another point is rolled. Now you have a don't pass point and and don't come point. You want that seven to be rolled now and you will be PAID on BOTH numbers. Now if you have balls of steel. You can try to get another don't come point and have three don't numbers in total. And if a seven is rolled before any of those numbers, then BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE!!!!!

I would be careful doing that until you understand the concept. If you wish to take it easy then get your don't pass point. And leave it at that. What you can do though, to pass the time is place bet the 6 and 8 if the point ends up being a number other than 6 or 8. Maybe but six dollars on each one. While you are waiting for the seven before the point and the 6 and the 8 hit, YOU WIN. I wouldn't press the bets though. Take your profit and wait for the SEVEN. That should add some excitement to the game. I hope I didn't confuse you. Good luck! :D

[NancyNM]

Damn, these injuns are blowing some money. Just wait their bean counters let thme know what it's costing them. It'll probably change.

 

I just went there today -- first time in about a year I think. They still have the "Free Buy" on 4 and 10, so they've had it for at least a year and a half. It is printed right on the layout. I was playing $5 places bets on them and getting paid $10.

 

As usual, I seemed to be the only one at the table taking advantage of the bet. Others might have been betting it as part of placing all the numbers, but it didn't seem like they were altering their play style to take it into account or anything.

 

So really, I doubt the casino is losing much on this at all, since not many were really betting it. And because they have that bet, I choose it over the other casinos I might go to, so they are getting my business for it!

 

I think if a casino in Vegas had that bet people would sure take advantage of it, but maybe in an obscure indian casino near Albuquerque, it's not such a big deal...

 

Anyway, I'm not complaining! (well, except I had a losing session today, despite that bet -- I can complain about that! :(

 

Nancy

P.S. Just to be clear what this bet means, the house has 0 edge on it. It pays out exactly at the true odds. So, if somebody chose to stand there and play only the 4 and 10 (boring...), then in the long run (on average, etc.), the casino would not make a dime from them!

[Yo Eleven]

Hey Bases5:

 

What is up with not reporting in how you did at the craps table on your cruise? :confused:

[unklez]

I just went there today -- first time in about a year I think. They still have the "Free Buy" on 4 and 10, so they've had it for at least a year and a half......

 

Where is there?

[ETski]

Hey ed!!!!!

Let me see if I can provide some info to answer your question and give you some insight on what I do so I don't reveal any of my secrets. :D

Even if I posted exactly what I do, it won't make sense anyway. You would actually have to watch me so I can explain word for word. I would love to see you in action maybe we run into each other on a cruise. But let me try it like this.

Well for starters, the computer game can get boring mostly because it isn't for REAL money. + I don't believe it act like a real game being aa computer. Play it at the craps table and when you get paid I will guarantee you won't be bored.

Now it appears you played very basic strategy, here. That being playing the don't and backing the point with double odds and waiting for the big seven.

Now what you can do to add a little excitement to the table and maybe get the dealers to like you and when you feel the time is right on the COME OUT ROLL, put your don't pass bet and toss a couple of dollars onto the YO ELEVEN! If the eleven rolls out you lose your don't pass but WIN 15:1 on the YO. So if you had 15 dollars on the don't pass, and a dollar on the YO. You would have hedged your bet and not lose any money on the roll. Of course if the point is rolled, you lose the dollar on the YO. I tried this and it worked a couple of times. But so what. You have the advantage now as it is more probably a seven will be rolled before the point. Now, if you wanna make the dealers smile, throw two dollars on the YO on the come out roll and say, "2 Dollar Yo-One for me and one for you" This means you are better a dollar for yourself and one for the dealers. If it hits you win your 15 dollars and the dealers end up with a nice tip of 16 dollars total on that one roll. They will be your best friend. But don't do it all the time as remember a YO doesn't come out often enough to make betting on it profitable.

 

Now once you get your don't pass point. Go ahead and try to obtain a Don't Come Point. After the initial point is rolled. Place your double odds in the back of the don't pass bet and place a new bet in the small box called "Don't Come." If you want toss out a YO ELEVEN here if you wish. This was interesting. I tried it also. The Don't Come bet is SEPARATE from the don't pass but acts exactly like a brand new Come Out roll. So if a 2, 3 is rolled it wins. A seven or eleven you lose. Pushes on a 12. But if you have the YO out you would win 15 to 1 for the same reasons I described for the Don't Pass bet you had.

Now let's say now another point is rolled. Now you have a don't pass point and and don't come point. You want that seven to be rolled now and you will be PAID on BOTH numbers. Now if you have balls of steel. No problem here as it not for real money.You can try to get another don't come point and have three don't numbers in total. And if a seven is rolled before any of those numbers, then BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE!!!!! Ya that happened a couple of times. but again it wasn't real money.

I would be careful doing that until you understand the concept. If you wish to take it easy then get your don't pass point. And leave it at that. What you can do though, to pass the time is place bet the 6 and 8 if the point ends up being a number other than 6 or 8. Maybe but six dollars on each one. While you are waiting for the seven before the point and the 6 and the 8 hit, YOU WIN. I wouldn't press the bets though. Take your profit and wait for the SEVEN. That should add some excitement to the game. I hope I didn't confuse you. Good luck! :D

Thanks for the advice and I agree I have to take it easy till I learn the ins and out. it's different. On my next cruise my BIL will be with me and he has never played. So I will use him as an excuse to play the dark side. Explain it as a teaching aid. So he can learn both ways lol lol

ed :D

 

Yo,