NCL stop the 15% gratuity on drinks, please

[SeaShark]

I would like to disagree with you, but sadly its a point well made that NCL could still screw its staff.:( But would you look at NCL in the same way if you found out it had increased its prices but stiffed its staff.

 

You are going off on a tangent with this. Your question PRESUMES that somehow NCL is screwing its staff when there is NO EVIDENCE what-so-ever on exactly what these people are paid...only assumptions and heresay.

 

Let's just stick to the "should there be an auto-gratuity topic".

[sparks1093]

I prefer the good ol' days of cruising when you tipped separately for services rendered.

 

Yep, but too many people walked away without leaving any tip at all, so now we have auto-gratuities.

 

DW used to work as a waitress and she told me one night a large party of 8 or 10 people were seated in her area. She busted her tail for that party and the total bill was just over $200 (this was of course many years ago). They left her 20 cents. It wasn't long after that the restaurant instituted a mandatory gratuity policy for large parties.

 

I, for one, will never, ever begrude a tipped employee their due.

[roger001]

Additional fees in many industries are becoming the norm, their use helping the "advertised" charge for the service or product to be reflected as lower. Airlines, having been previously mentioned, now have the baggage fee, ther priority boarding fee, the hand carried baggage fee, the food fee, etc. This all keeps the advertised "cruise/flying" listed price as low as possible. However, I always factor in these extra fees before I purchase the product or service in order to realize what the actual cost is going to be. You must do the same when computing the cost of a cruise, whether it's the DSC, mandatory bar tip, or whatever. One that really aggravates me (and many others) in the US is an auto dealer's "documentary" fee, which is basically up to $300 or so for a file clerk's 15 minutes of time to prepare the sale paperwork and mail it. I just tell them, no doc fee. Just figure the dealer requiered profit and give me that total number. So really, hidden, or even obvious additional fees are very common and everywhere. But....I don't have to cruise..or drink (oh...yes I do). Just factor all of these whatevers into your total cost when figuring the price of the cruise. And if you can then still accept the bottom line as a good value, you"ll be a happy camper...uh...cruiser.

[Newleno]

How do you figure?

 

The price of the drinks would simply be raised 15% to cover the lost tips. The consumer would still pay the same amount they paid before. NOT an increased amount.

 

Since the price of drinks would be raised, ONLY the guest purchasing drinks would be paying the increase. NOT all passengers.

 

This "no tipping" policy would help no one. $1.15 for an item or $1 plus $0.15 for the item is still the SAME THING.

 

In the world of mathematics, this is known as "=" :rolleyes:

 

Your scenario is vastly different from the one I represented, you changed the argument. then became sarcastic, which is fine, but please do not attribute your argument to mine. As a lurker I know what occurs here, I will not post on this thread again. Let it be said, let it be written.

[ROSEBASKETS]

PLEASE NO - May I point you in the direction of a company called P&O who do not charge an additional 15% on their drinks prices, They don't charge gratiuties and tipping is completely optional. The charge for a fornights Caribbean Cruise including flights from London included starts from £700 per person ($1120 per person)

 

A bottle of Bud / glass of wine costs £2.60 (approx $4) though I don't know how this compares with the charges on American ships

 

They pay their staff a decent living wage and I believe standard drinks prices are generally significantly less than on NCL, RCI or Cunard. The only downside is that they serve English portions and measures and very few of our American cousins sail with them, so you'll have to put up with the moaners :D

Edited February 14, 2011 by ROSEBASKETS

[PleaseNo]

If you want the staff to get a fair wage without it coming out of tips, you can plan on your cruise fare doubling or tripling.

 

Gratuities are a large part of the reason that labor is so cheap on cruiselines, which keeps your base fare low.

 

The other reason that labor is cheap on cruiselines is that the lines recruit from impoverished countries where job opportunities are exceptionally limited. When you make flippant comments like, "If they don't like it, they can move on," you're showing a stunning lack of understanding of how the rest of the world lives.

 

Actually im not.

 

Myself, you and everybody else who is going to cruise is allowing this to happen. I know for every member of staff who 'moves on' there will be a dozen waiting for the opportunity to take his or her place. And yet you seem to find the use of cheap labour as acceptable (the assumption being if your on this forum then you cruise or will be). Is it possible to assume then that actually you are helping them out in their impoverished lives/countries by abusing their cheap labour ?

 

Actually im sure you dont, but its easy to twist your point like you did with mine.

[sparks1093]

How do you figure?

 

The price of the drinks would simply be raised 15% to cover the lost tips. The consumer would still pay the same amount they paid before. NOT an increased amount.

 

Since the price of drinks would be raised, ONLY the guest purchasing drinks would be paying the increase. NOT all passengers.

 

This "no tipping" policy would help no one. $1.15 for an item or $1 plus $0.15 for the item is still the SAME THING.

 

In the world of mathematics, this is known as "=" :rolleyes:

 

We'll meet for a drink on the Sun and gladly pay the 15%:). But I think the price of each drink would actually raise higher than 15%. If you go up to one of the bars and order a drink and you are the only one that orders a drink that shift the bartender gets the 15% gratuity. Without the auto-grat NCL would still have to pay the bartender's wage for working a shift in the bar with no customers, so they would have to increase prices to account for the "dead" times.

 

I know its a very simplified example.

[SeaShark]

We'll meet for a drink on the Sun and gladly pay the 15%:). But I think the price of each drink would actually raise higher than 15%. If you go up to one of the bars and order a drink and you are the only one that orders a drink that shift the bartender gets the 15% gratuity. Without the auto-grat NCL would still have to pay the bartender's wage for working a shift in the bar with no customers, so they would have to increase prices to account for the "dead" times.

 

I know its a very simplified example.

 

Yeah right...since you're a Navy vet (assumption based on the haze grey comment in your sig), I'll buy your drink! :D

[PleaseNo]

I think the NCL tipping is 17 or 20 percent and not 15.

 

You can really tell the Euros from the Americans on this one. I was just on the Epic and the staff (many from Europe) dreaded the fact the ship was going to Europe in May. REASON: Euros dont tip and the staff knows they wont make the money.

I am not trying to start a fight or debate with anyone. I have been in Europe and know how it is. It is not pratical to leave 15-20 % after a meal or drink. But in the USA, it is expected.

 

I have another one that will drive the OP wild. We even tipped the hostess a few times for getting us a table. OH LORD! What will those people think of next? ;) ;)

 

Made me smile, actually though i agree with you on this!! You tipped because you asked for something extra (I assume it was busy or some such)

 

Its just not in our normal day to day lives, its not that i will not tip. Indeed i will. But it is a shame that staff are going to feel that way coming over to Europe.

[PleaseNo]

It woud benefit the person that bought drinks, if tipping was not allowed and salaries were increased (to that of being tipped) than that cost would be distributed over all cruise passengers whether they ordered a drink or not. So this policy of no tipping would help the person who ordered drinks, it would be a detriment to those that dont drink.

 

I'm sorry but i disagree. It is incredible easy to increase drink prices to pay for the bar staff and not charge others who do not use this service. NCL put up a job advert for bar staff with an increased wage of $XXX. How difficult was that.

[sparks1093]

Yeah right...since you're a Navy vet (assumption based on the haze grey comment in your sig), I'll buy your drink! :D

 

Yep, your assumption is correct. I'm so salty I can season my food by rubbing my hands together;).

[PleaseNo]

I feel that wait staff dealing with people who are drinking deserve 15% more than wait staff scooping ice cream. ;)

 

WHAT !!! I have to pay that on my beloved ice cream.:D I am joking btw just in case the red mist has descended on some.

[terrymtex01]

OP.. I say if you feel strongly about something, make a stand.. and when a company has enough of it's customers feeling that way, they will change to conform. However I do have two things I want to comment on what you posted. You said let them raise the basic cost of the beverage and only those who purchase it will be paying for it.. well.. that's who is paying it now. And the second thing is that the auto tip is included for a reason. With their pricing in place now it is expected that you will tip for certain services. They must have had a reason to place it as an auto tip rather than letting folks tip on their own. Could it be that they were getting "stiffed" all too often?

 

I am sure once the base of customers change to be a majority of non-Americans, you will stand a better chance of getting it removed. However, in the end, you will pay it one way or the other. As long as it is going to end up costing you the same, I don't understand why it is a big deal if you pay it in the cost of the item or as a tip. The same amount of money is out of your pocket and for me, that's what I look at.

[mbisson]

Jeeze-maybe they should just raise the price of the drinks 15%, 17%, 20% (whatever) and pay that extra to the btenders, make no mention of drink tips and make this type of discussion moot :). to me, it's all the same

Edited February 14, 2011 by mbisson

[PleaseNo]

PLEASE NO - May I point you in the direction of a company called P&O who do not charge an additional 15% on their drinks prices, They don't charge gratiuties and tipping is completely optional. The charge for a fornights Caribbean Cruise including flights from London included starts from £700 per person ($1120 per person)

 

A bottle of Bud / glass of wine costs £2.60 (approx $4) though I don't know how this compares with the charges on American ships

 

They pay their staff a decent living wage and I believe standard drinks prices are generally significantly less than on NCL, RCI or Cunard. The only downside is that they serve English portions and measures and very few of our American cousins sail with them, so you'll have to put up with the moaners :D

 

Thank you. I was speaking to a work colleague the other day on this subject and he mentioned P&O.

 

Is it possible P&O are like this becasue they had their roots in Europe? Or do i just imagine this.

[thejuliet]

I worked as a server bartender at a high-end restaurant up until recently. During functions such as weddings and private Christmas parties that had an open bar the host was charged a 17% gratuity on his/her final bill. My take home from one of these events was anywhere from $250.00 - $400.00 plus my minimum wage for a 10 hour shift. I would put a tip cup up on the bar and because the drinks were free sometimes I could make an extra loonie or twonie. The customers that tipped I would free pour the ones that didn't got a measured pour ;)

[david_sobe]

Made me smile, actually though i agree with you on this!! You tipped because you asked for something extra (I assume it was busy or some such)

 

Its just not in our normal day to day lives, its not that i will not tip. Indeed i will. But it is a shame that staff are going to feel that way coming over to Europe.

Glad you took my post with a grain of salt :)

But NO, tipping is not always for something "extra."

Yes if someone goes the extra mile, it is a nice reward. But in the service industry on ships and in the USA, it is how people make a living. Those employees only make a few dollars per hour so tipping is a HUGE part of their income.

But we are raised in different countries so I understand the confusion. I once had a bartender in Germany give me back a 20% tip because he said it was too much and not called for.

Go figure.

[PleaseNo]

Yep, but too many people walked away without leaving any tip at all, so now we have auto-gratuities.

 

DW used to work as a waitress and she told me one night a large party of 8 or 10 people were seated in her area. She busted her tail for that party and the total bill was just over $200 (this was of course many years ago). They left her 20 cents. It wasn't long after that the restaurant instituted a mandatory gratuity policy for large parties.

 

I, for one, will never, ever begrude a tipped employee their due.

 

I am sorry to hear that. Although i have never waited tables i have worked as a barman in the UK. Not a well paid job back then, indeed it was done to supplement my normal day to day job.

 

But its that sort of experience that i was looking for to maybe get an understanding of why there is an auto tip culture on NCL.

[daffodiliaz]

The $8 drink isn't the problem, the $1.20 gratuity is?

Edited February 14, 2011 by AWENINAZ

[ROSEBASKETS]

Glad you took my post with a grain of salt :)

But NO, tipping is not always for something "extra."

Yes if someone goes the extra mile, it is a nice reward. But in the service industry on ships and in the USA, it is how people make a living. Those employees only make a few dollars per hour so tipping is a HUGE part of their income.

But we are raised in different countries so I understand the confusion. I once had a bartender in Germany give me back a 20% tip because he said it was too much and not called for.

Go figure.

 

It's an insult to tip in Italy in a restaurant or cafe (as the service charge is added to the bill) and in Japan if you leave money on a table the waiter is honour bound to return the money.:eek:

[njhorseman]

I am sorry to hear that. Although i have never waited tables i have worked as a barman in the UK. Not a well paid job back then, indeed it was done to supplement my normal day to day job.

 

But its that sort of experience that i was looking for to maybe get an understanding of why there is an auto tip culture on NCL.

 

It's the same on every cruise line that primarily caters to passengers from North America. I don't understand why you're singling out NCL.

[johnql]

But its that sort of experience that i was looking for to maybe get an understanding of why there is an auto tip culture on NCL.

I just wanted to make sure we're all on the same page - it's not just NCL. It's all mainstream cruise lines that cater primarily to Americans. The why has already been covered by others but, to reiterate, it's a matter of culture and convention. I honestly don't know why certain service positions get tipped and others don't (for instance, fast food service people don't get tipped whereas cab drivers do) but that's how it has developed over the years. Convention dictates that you tip. Should it be changed? Perhaps, although, as others have pointed out, you'll end up paying the added cost of wages somehow.

 

Frankly, I think you're tilting at windmills here, with little or no positive outcome even if you win.

[roger001]

I hate to tose this out, but I have liked all the NCL employees/bar servers so much, have admired their efforts so much, enjoyed their conversations, their friendship, that I additionally give a buck or so for each round of drinks served. I just do it because I like to. I feel so fortunate to be able to sit there and pay $4 to $9 a drink and be sitting in a cruise ship while I do that. I didn't really do anything in my life to deserve that ability more than I'm sure these hard working folks serving me, except be fortunate in my birth, right time, right place. Just my reasons for not having a problem with it.

[johnql]

It's an insult to tip in Italy in a restaurant or cafe (as the service charge is added to the bill) and in Japan if you leave money on a table the waiter is honour bound to return the money.:eek:

This is exactly why it is the obligation of any traveler to research one's travels properly and respectfully observe the customs of every country that he visits. Sorry, but the cliche "When in Rome..." does apply and it certainly applies to cruising, too.

[dockrocker]

The $8 drink isn't the problem, the $1.20 gratuity is?

 

It's all about priorities -- and whether we have the ability to put ourselves in others' shoes. ;)