Carnival sued over St. Thomas death

[hubofhockey]

Plaintiff's grounds for lawsuit is that Carnival should not be including St Thomas on an itinerary because they should have known that violent acts are likely to occur. This is quite a stretch. Cruise lines continue to port at St Thomas and passengers always need to be aware of risks at any port.

[cowgirlamy]

Your right it does ot say what their motivation is and I don't care. It is wrong because this had nothing to do with Carnival!!! If it had then it would be different. Lashing out in grief? Then sue St. Thomas police force. Why sue Carnival?? Because they are a big company with lots of money.

 

 

I didn't say they were lashing out in grief that is why I put a question mark after. The point is "I" don't know what their reasons are and neither do you. We agree Carnival had nothing to do with this. We also don't know who all they sued. You have no idea who all or why they are suing so let's try to stick to facts.

[Trailhed1]

Only in America Stupid Lawsuits The Real American Dream.

 

St. Thomas is like the wild wild west minus any Sheriff's that is. I lived in the USVI for 5 yrs. Many tourists have No Clue how dangerous many of these Ports really are. That said this suit is just crazy. I just feel that like someone else said earlier on here, they know they will probably get a settlement, so they said why not.(after the american lawyers) convinced them to file.

 

I believe they were from Puerto Rico this family, my point being unless they lived under a rock in Puerto Rico they certainly knew of issues of Violence on the neighboring Island of st Thomas. Does not mean they knew something tragic would happen to them, but that other incidents happen ALOT. More then someone who does not live in the Caribbean.

 

It was Tragic what happened to this family no doubt, unfortunately it goes on frequently. Just not always a cruise ship passenger as a victim. Things will never change there in the USVI. Sad but true.

[oldstuffshirt]

It does not matter if it was a ccl tour

What does matter if ccl was culpable

Was ccl aware of an increase of crime on the island they choose to bring people to?

Where there any cases in the last 12 months of crimes against ccl pax

Was there any discussion at ccl addressing issues mentioned above?

They will get all appropriate info

Perhaps they were not at fault at all

However if any of those things I mentioned exsisted

Then they are a bit of jam

Let's wait to see want develops

[pe4all]

Sure they can. I am not talking about eliminating crime but from what I heard, St. Thomas officials "stepped up" fighting crime after this incident when several cruise lines openly discussed dropping this port.

 

This is a huge money maker for these islands/destinations. They lose tourists they lose their way of life. NYC famously cracked down on crime to improve tourism and it worked. These cruise lines can do wonders with helping clean up these ports if they pressured them.

You just don't see the crime publicized as much - it is definitely there. As I am sure it is everyplace. Our local weekly newspaper has a "local crime" section. Lists muggings, robberies, break-ins, etc. I consider my area very safe - but I am also shocked when I read what happened that week in my area that I never was aware of! I think people just need to be aware of their surroundings, keep their eyes open, and be careful - whether in the U.S. or another country.

[bougiet]

I didn't say they were lashing out in grief that is why I put a question mark after. The point is "I" don't know what their reasons are and neither do you. We agree Carnival had nothing to do with this. We also don't know who all they sued. You have no idea who all or why they are suing so let's try to stick to facts.

 

OK. Fact, they ARE suing Carnival......Carnival had nothing to do with it. That is the FACT. I don't agree with it that is a fact. Who else could they be suing and who is responsible. Last time I checked it would be the person who shot the gun.

[kroozers]

Plaintiff's grounds for lawsuit is that Carnival should not be including St Thomas on an itinerary because they should have known that violent acts are likely to occur. This is quite a stretch. Cruise lines continue to port at St Thomas and passengers always need to be aware of risks at any port.

 

If Carnival could be held liable for stopping in St. Thomas...they should be prevented from docking anywhere violence could possibly occur. That would have to include...every port in the world, including Miami, Galveston, New York, LA...get the point?

[marshhawk]

I think this depends on whether this was a cruise line excursion, then yes they assume some responsibility. If it were a private excursion organized by the family then no there is no liability on the part of Carnival.

That's my question too. I do not think that any cruise line puts it's travelers in harms way on purpose. If these people were on their own then absolutely not should they try to sue. If Carnival had been in charge of the excursion, and if they knew of violence on a daily basis on a beach and still took people there, then shame on them.

[cowgirlamy]

OK. Fact, they ARE suing Carnival......Carnival had nothing to do with it. That is the FACT. I don't agree with it that is a fact. Who else could they be suing and who is responsible. Last time I checked it would be the person who shot the gun.

 

 

I am glad you can at least stick to that fact. The other stuff you said is pure speculation. It is our OPINION Carnival is not responsible. I agree but it is our opinion. We do NOT know ALL the facts.

[jenwales]

It does not matter if it was a ccl tour

What does matter if ccl was culpable

Was ccl aware of an increase of crime on the island they choose to bring people to?

Where there any cases in the last 12 months of crimes against ccl pax

Was there any discussion at ccl addressing issues mentioned above?

They will get all appropriate info

Perhaps they were not at fault at all

However if any of those things I mentioned exsisted

Then they are a bit of jam

Let's wait to see want develops

 

I hope you are kidding with this. Do you believe that no one has any personal responsibility to ensure their own safety?

[bougiet]

I am glad you can at least stick to that fact. The other stuff you said is pure speculation. It is our OPINION Carnival is not responsible. I agree but it is our opinion. We do NOT know ALL the facts.

 

Ok, then explain to me how in the world Carnival could be responsible? How? It was not a Carnival excursion, Carnival did not shoot the gun. So how pray tell, can Carnival even take any liability?

[smallworldtraveller]

I going to put a spin on this .... It is the USA legal system that has allowed this.... your legal system allows you to sue for anything even if you are wrong.... I know .... was in a legal lawsuit with someone who ran a stop sign and was suing us for 10 million. Reason they could sue apparently we had no rights just driving on a road that gave us the right of way. That hung over our heads for 6 1/2 years... they won .... 38 thousand and had to cover thier legal bills with that... My legal bill 1/4 of a million to fight it. But again it is the legal system that is in place in the USA the right to sue for anything. Our insurance kept telling us to settle and we would not sign off. It was the point of the matter. They were wrong.

 

So if you can sue and get any gains, gives anyone a reason to try for it. Ambulance chasing lawyer, insurance companies that would rather pay off as it is cheaper that paying a lawyer, the right of any citizen to sue for anything.... makes a very bad mix.. The system sucks in parts and in parts it is good, but if there is a $ sign attached everyone is going to look for the easy life.

[cowgirlamy]

Ok, then explain to me how in the world Carnival could be responsible? How? It was not a Carnival excursion, Carnival did not shoot the gun. So how pray tell, can Carnival even take any liability?

 

 

I have no clue. But neither do you. There are thousands of ways Carnival could possibly be liable but I believe they are not in any way but it IS possible. We'll have to wait for the FACTS to come out.

[Trailhed1]

I going to put a spin on this .... It is the USA legal system that has allowed this.... your legal system allows you to sue for anything even if you are wrong.... I know .... was in a legal lawsuit with someone who ran a stop sign and was suing us for 10 million. Reason they could sue apparently we had no rights just driving on a road that gave us the right of way. That hung over our heads for 6 1/2 years... they won .... 38 thousand and had to cover thier legal bills with that... My legal bill 1/4 of a million to fight it. But again it is the legal system that is in place in the USA the right to sue for anything. Our insurance kept telling us to settle and we would not sign off. It was the point of the matter. They were wrong.

 

So if you can sue and get any gains, gives anyone a reason to try for it. Ambulance chasing lawyer, insurance companies that would rather pay off as it is cheaper that paying a lawyer, the right of any citizen to sue for anything.... makes a very bad mix.. The system sucks in parts and in parts it is good, but if there is a $ sign attached everyone is going to look for the easy life.

 

Like i said The Real American Dream. lawsuits

[H82seaUgo]

Plaintiff's grounds for lawsuit is that Carnival should not be including St Thomas on an itinerary because they should have known that violent acts are likely to occur. This is quite a stretch. Cruise lines continue to port at St Thomas and passengers always need to be aware of risks at any port.

 

well, they dropped st. croix because it got so bad.

[Trailhed1]

well, they dropped st. croix because it got so bad.

 

Very true took years to get Ships to come back there. Got them now again but very few each month compared to St Thomas.

 

They will never leave the port of St Thomas, can not compare with St Croix.

No ships in St Thomas would collapse the Virgin Islands Gov't. They could not survive that.

[boo214]

I have no clue. But neither do you. There are thousands of ways Carnival could possibly be liable but I believe they are not in any way but it IS possible. We'll have to wait for the FACTS to come out.

ok name one.

[H82seaUgo]

Very true took years to get Ships to come back there. Got them now again but very few each month compared to St Thomas.

 

They will never leave the port of St Thomas, can not compare with St Croix.

No ships in St Thomas would collapse the Virgin Islands Gov't. They could not survive that.

 

well, then that's our trump card. tell them "if they don't do something to protect us, "we're" going to tortola".

 

i get off st thomas as quick as i can anyway, to go over to st john.

[MissDiva1]

It does not matter if it was a ccl tour

What does matter if ccl was culpable

Was ccl aware of an increase of crime on the island they choose to bring people to?

Where there any cases in the last 12 months of crimes against ccl pax

Was there any discussion at ccl addressing issues mentioned above?

They will get all appropriate info

Perhaps they were not at fault at all

However if any of those things I mentioned exsisted

Then they are a bit of jam

Let's wait to see want develops

 

Yes indeed!

 

Personally I don't have an opinion one way or another because I don't know all the facts of the lawsuit. And honestly if I were in their shoes and if there was even an inkling that the cruiselines had issues with related crimes in this area that were kept under wraps......I would have no problem with the lawsuit......so until then......no opinion whatsoever..

[oldstuffshirt]

ok name one.

 

Ok

So a bunch of ccl corp

People / risk management are reviews claims that had to do with some crime to a pax in st Thomas

They kept it quiet setteled with pax

Or it was brought up in a board meeting about rising crime in st Thomas

They even wrote or contacted the port or authorities with a concern

Could that have happened ?

Flash foward some lie life kills a pax

Nothing to do with ccl

But there was some discussion previous to the incident

So mr and mrs jury

Here is ccl. They knew about the problems

But sided with the economics of not changing ports

Not saying thus is the case at all

I am saying wait for the facts

[Nanaimobound]

I believe I remember reading it was a private excursion this family was on.

 

Although I feel for this loss the family is going through, in no way do I think this is the cruise lines fault. As a pp said it could have happened anywhere.

 

That is the way I remember it also. Very tragic but any place on earth has a potential for senseless violence. I doubt they will get very far with the lawsuit.

Travel is at your own risk. That is why research matters. We have to be responsible for things we choose to do. And even with research, you could walk down your own street and have something equally as tragic happen.

[dst]

It doesn't matter if the excursion was sponsored by Carnival at all. Only if Carnival was shown to be negligent would they be liable - like the driver was a convicted felon and he did the shooting. In that case it could be argued that Carnival was negligent for hiring a dangerous individual. If I get in a cab and the driver drops me off and I am shot, the cab driver showed no negligence and thus is not liable.

 

Carnival could not reasonably have expected gang activity to be taking place that day at Coki Beach. There are legal principles at work here.

 

 

I respectfully have to disagree - if Carnival knew of threats or violence in a specific area yet continued to make money off of excursions; then they assume liability.

 

This is why Carnival (and other lines) have pulled out of some of the Mexico ports; because there is the immediate threat of violence and their liability to the guests is first

 

This is really a moot point as we have discovered that it was not a Carnival excursion so the liability does not fall on carnival. I do believe however, that they family will be offered a sum of money to close the issue. It is cheaper in the long run for companies to settle than spend exorbitant amounts of money/resources on fighting a claim

 

Whether we agree with that or not, it is the way of business

[friedshrimp]

http://travel.usatoday.com/cruises/post/2011/05/carnival-cruise-ship-passenger-killing-st-thomas-lawsuit/172139/1

 

Sry if this has already been posted. I didn't see anything.

 

 

This is stupid. How would the family feel if the cops showed up and arrested the parents for taking their child into a dangerous area?? Cops...."They should have known there could be violence so that's child endangerment....".

[MissDiva1]

I respectfully have to disagree - if Carnival knew of threats or violence in a specific area yet continued to make money off of excursions; then they assume liability.

 

This is why Carnival (and other lines) have pulled out of some of the Mexico ports; because there is the immediate threat of violence and their liability to the guests is first

 

This is really a moot point as we have discovered that it was not a Carnival excursion so the liability does not fall on carnival. I do believe however, that they family will be offered a sum of money to close the issue. It is cheaper in the long run for companies to settle than spend exorbitant amounts of money/resources on fighting a claim

 

Whether we agree with that or not, it is the way of business

 

The Mexican ports have not had anything even remotely comparable to what happened in St. Thomas, Jamaica or Costa Rica to cruise passsengers. Yet they pull away from the Mexican ports. What a joke:rolleyes:

[steveNcindy]

Maybe NYTraveller can shed some light on this, she is a lawyer I believe.

 

Once she see this, maybe she will have some insight.